Improving a ranger's will save

[Talakeal]

Quick question, is there any way to make a 3.5 ranger who has a good will saving throw progression?

Are there any other effective ways for a ranger to boost her will save?

I am trying to make a ranger who is strong willed but not terribly wise, both for RP purposes and because I don't want to have access to spell casting.

Thanks!

[tyckspoon]

The Steadfast Determination feat would probably be the best route for that; it lets you use your Con mod in place of your Wisdom mod for your Will saves. Has Endurance as a prereq, but you get that as a ranger bonus, so that's alright.

[Coidzor]

Quick question, is there any way to make a 3.5 ranger who has a good will saving throw progression?

Are there any other effective ways for a ranger to boost her will save?

I am trying to make a ranger who is strong willed but not terribly wise, both for RP purposes and because I don't want to have access to spell casting.

Thanks!
There should be two spell-less ranger ACFs. One trading it for fighter bonus feats every 4 or 5 levels and the other trading it (and the AC?) for some specific SLAs.

Even better, use one of the Sublime Way Ranger homebrews to make the ranger into a martial adept.

[Manateee]

I played one really niche Ranger build that used the Combat Focus feat tree. But I wouldn't do that without a spellcasting emphasis to back it up.

A Ranger/Barbarian/Deepwarden build with Steadfast Determination would be a powerhouse for non-casting, non-ToB melee, and would have a huge Will without a Wisdom requirement. But that depends on you using a Dwarf.

And for a non-casting Ranger, I'd second Coidzor's suggestion for a Sublime Way Ranger. Radical Taoist made one (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19519074) that was pretty widely accepted for a while, whose mechanics embrace the Ranger and its niches. I can't find its original archery discipline, but there's no (http://wiki.faxcelestis.net/index.php?title=Falling_Star_Discipline) shortage (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19528582/New_Tome_of_Battle_Discipline:_Raging_Storm?pg=1) of (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8103297&postcount=1) alternatives. (http://sorcererstudios.com/showthread.php?83-Solar-Wind-%28BETA-COMPLETE%29)

[Urpriest]

Steadfast Determination, as mentioned, is a good way to have a high will save without high Wis. But really, the relevant method will probably be determined by what sort of character you're making. You've told us it's a ranger, but not what sort of combat it does or what sort of multiclassing you're planning. What does your ranger do?

[Talakeal]

Steadfast Determination, as mentioned, is a good way to have a high will save without high Wis. But really, the relevant method will probably be determined by what sort of character you're making. You've told us it's a ranger, but not what sort of combat it does or what sort of multicasting you're planning. What does your ranger do?

I am trying not to multi class, and haven't thought far enough ahead for prestige class yet.

NG, Human, Ranger

Will be using the strong arm (two handed weapon) fighting style. First favored enemy human.

High dex, int, and str, middling con and cha, low wisdom. (Not sure of exact numbers yet)

Feats I am looking at probably Nymph's Kiss and Born under a rising sun, then Iron Will and Indomitable Soul at 3 and 6. Then either steadfast determination or force of personality. After than weapon focus great sword and skill focus heal (I know neither are great mechanically) then combat reflexes and the spring attack chain.

All in all I am going for a pretty basic character and would like to avoid spell casting or imitating.

On a side not, can someone with a copy of Races of Destiny tell me what "able learner" actually does? The summary I can find online implies it gives you all skills as class skills, but that can't be right.

[tyckspoon]

On a side not, can someone with a copy of Races of Destiny tell me what "able learner" actually does? The summary I can find online implies it gives you all skills as class skills, but that can't be right.

It removes the extra cost for buying cross-class ranks in skills. You are still limited to the cross-class cap of ranks you can have, but you buy them at 1 skill point: 1 rank instead of at 2:1.

[Coidzor]

Can't Otyugh Hole away Iron Will, eh? That's a shame.

[FMArthur]

You can probably get the best Will save by simply taking the Martial Study feat buying a 3,000gp Ring of the Diamond Mind for the first-level diamond mind maneuver Moment of Perfect Mind. It will let you make a Concentration check in place of a Will save once per encounter. With max Concentration ranks, this will be about 1 plus 1/2 your character level higher than a strong-progression will save assuming equal Con and Wis (a poor assumption), so it will give you pretty noticeable improvements on your success rate. And since it's a skill check, you don't auto-fail on a 1.

[Talakeal]

Can't Otyugh Hole away Iron Will, eh? That's a shame.

Otyugh hole? Not sure I understand the term.


You can probably get the best Will save by simply taking the Martial Study feat buying a 3,000gp Ring of the Diamond Mind for the first-level diamond mind maneuver Moment of Perfect Mind. It will let you make a Concentration check in place of a Will save once per encounter. With max Concentration ranks, this will be about 1 plus 1/2 your character level higher than a strong-progression will save assuming equal Con and Wis (a poor assumption), so it will give you pretty noticeable improvements on your success rate. And since it's a skill check, you don't auto-fail on a 1.

That's a good idea, but I am not sure I like depending on a magic item or only being able to call upon it once per encounter. Still, at only 3k that is a good backup, the question is whether or not the skill point expenditure is worth it, for a ranger concentration seems all but worthless.

[Urpriest]

Otyugh hole? Not sure I understand the term.


The Otyugh Hole is a magical location in Complete Scoundrel. If you stay in it for a set length of time and survive you get the Iron Will feat.

[Talakeal]

The Otyugh Hole is a magical location in Complete Scoundrel. If you stay in it for a set length of time and survive you get the Iron Will feat.

Complete Scoundral came out after I stopped buying 3.5 books, so that explains why I hadn't heard of it. I will look it up, thanks for the info.

[Curmudgeon]

If you've got a friendly party Cleric, either Greater Resistance (+4 to all saves) or Superior Resistance (+6 to all saves) would be an excellent 24-hour buff spell to receive.