Pet focused druid, build help [3.5]

[kulosle]

I like playing druids but my DM doesn't like game breaking, so I thought I'd go with a pet focused druid. The pet is the only thing I care about so feel free to suggest things that gimp other areas of being a druid. So my gm has ruled that you can add the horrid template onto an animal but you take it -3 levels of the original. So fun times with a horrid flashraker dinosaur. The druids handbook was surprisingly unhelpful on this front.

Our group plays with rather high optimization, but nothing game breaking is allowed. I'm suppose to fill the fighter role. This is what I know about the rest of the so far: a binder who's going to be a skill monkey, a music focused bard as the parties face, an eldritch theurge focusing on damage and battle field control, and a cleric who hasn't quite decided whats she's doing. 32 point buy, two flaws, any non third party material is allowed, including dragon mag and online enhancements.

I really just want to see how strong I can get my pet to be, my DM is okay with this because if the pet is too strong he'll just have monsters come after me instead. What prestige classes up levels for your animal companion, the beast master prestige class seems like a bad idea, or should I just go 20 druid? Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

[Mystify]

First, take 1 level of beastmaster to get a +3 to your level for the animal companion. No further levels are helpful.

DR347 has a variant that sacrifices your wildshape for a +2 to your level for animal companions. Bad trade off, but you say you care about the companion, not you actual effectiveness.It also lets you talk with your companion.

As for feats, there are several that are helpful:
companion spellbound from PH2 will let you share spells from 30' away, and cast touch spells on hit from close range. Very useful for sending it into the fray while you hang back and cast buffs/heals on it.

exalted companion from BoED can give you a magical beast instead of an animal for your companion. However, they aren't very impressive, you are better off with a dire bear or something.

Natural bond adds 3 to your effective druid level for determining its bonsues, capped at your character level. Useful if you find cause to multiclass, but I can't think of any offhand.

Focus your spells on buffing. Animal growth is great for your companion, Bite of the X works wonders, nature's avatar is brutal. Keep in mind you can share personal spells with it. Heal animal companion is a 5th level spell, compared to a normal 6th level spell for clerics, or 7th for druids. With the above feat, you can cast it on him from close range. enrage animal(rage bonuses, without the drawbacks!), enlarge animal(lots of extra size, and other bonuses), nature's avatar(9th level buff spell of smackdown. +10 to attack rolls. Thats just 1 part of it. And its a swift action to cast), nature's favor(a luck bonus. Can't argue with a luck bonus, and its significant), and travelers mount(by wording of the spell, its ability to fight is only hampered if you are riding it. If you aren't , it is a long-duration speed boost for a 1st level spell) are all powerful buffs that only work on animals. several Greater magic fang spells will last all day and cna boost all if its attacks.
Share husk can be used to see through its senses.
Really, this is where you elevate your companion from a grumpy bear to an avatar of destruction.

Also remember that you can buy it equipment. Put your wealth on the companion, and it can be beastly.

Also consider spells like womb of the land(coupled with still spell) to protect yourself while doing this.

[kulosle]

Also consider spells like womb of the land(coupled with still spell) to protect yourself while doing this.

Where is this? Google couldn't find it and I am unfamiliar with it.

Yeah I don't know who would trade wildshape for a mere plus two bonus in most cases, but for this it works marvelously.

I've looked at the exalted companions and they all pail in comparison to a horrid fleshraker.

I never thought about just taking one level dip into beast master thanks for the tip.

Is it worth it at all to permanency a few spells on to my animal companion oe do I have enough spells that I don't have to worry about that?

[Mystify]

Where is this? Google couldn't find it and I am unfamiliar with it.

sorry, its Land womb (http://dndtools.eu/spells/magic-of-faerun--20/land-womb--1584/), I got the name mixed up. I'm sure you can find other spells to keeo yourself safe as well, that one just came to mind.


I've looked at the exalted companions and they all pail in comparison to a horrid fleshraker.

Yeah,I agree. They are very underwhelming.


I never thought about just taking one level dip into beast master thanks for the tip.

Yeah, that is a solid choice. The subsequent companions are at piddly levels, and not worthwhile. The first boost is great.


Is it worth it at all to permanency a few spells on to my animal companion oe do I have enough spells that I don't have to worry about that?
Permanency doesn't work on any old spell, despite what people seem to think. You could permanency magic fangs on him. How well that works depends on how likely the DM is to dispell them. There are a ton of spells you can cast on them; your power will skyrocket if you have a minute or two to buff up before entering battle. Keep track of the various durations of the spells, and see which ones you can afford to keep up constantly, which ones are amiable to occasional refreshing when in dangerous places, and which ones are suitable for in-combat buffing.
You could also consider craft wonderous item, and bake the bonuses into a permanent item.

[Lyndworm]

It might be worth looking into riding your Animal Companion. As Mystify said, you should focus almost exclusively on buffing your pet, so don't plan to attack from your pet's back. However, the entry-level mounted combat feat, Mounted Combat, allows you to substitute your Ride check for the mount's AC 1/round. This makes it very, very easy to basically ignore one attack every round.

If you've not selected a race yet, it could be interesting to go with Shifter. They're not fantastic Druids (unless you pick up the Moonspeaker PrC, from Races of Eberron, which doesn't advance your AC at all), but a fun option could be to nab four levels of the Shifter Ranger substitution levels, from RoE. At 4th level they can share the benefits of their Shifting with their AC. This doesn't sound as awesome as it is, and it sounds pretty awesome. You have to find a way to get Rage (I suggest a one level Barbarian dip), but mixing in the Shifter Savagery feat, also from RoE (while Raging and Shifting, you essentially gain Improved Natural Weapon and Improved Critical for free, but it requires that your Shifter trait grant a natural attack), is awesome. The last component is Shared Fury, which grants all of the benefits of your Rage to your Animal Companion so long as you're within 5ft of it. This costs the loss of five Druid levels (three of which count against your AC development), the expenditure of two feats, and requires that you give up the ability to cast spells while in battle (because of the Raging); in return you can give your Animal Companion some significant boosts while riding it. I never claimed that it was optimized; I said that it was interesting. Some of the penalties can be offset with the Natural Bond feat, though, and if you're going Exalted anyway (for the Magical Beast Companion) the Righteous Wrath feat might let you cast while Raging (almost certainly not RaI or RaW, but the wording is fairly odd and I've seen people argue about it in the past).

Just something to think about.

[Mystify]

It might be worth looking into riding your Animal Companion. As Mystify said, you should focus almost exclusively on buffing your pet, so don't plan to attack from your pet's back. However, the entry-level mounted combat feat, Mounted Combat, allows you to substitute your Ride check for the mount's AC 1/round. This makes it very, very easy to basically ignore one attack every round.

That just means that you are next to the enemies to get mauled to death. Why would they attack the companion when the relatively squishy druid is within reach? Its one thing to protect your mount when its the squishy one, its an entirely different matter when you are the squishy one.

[ShriekingDrake]

If your DM will only allow the Horrid Template, then I guess that's your option. I think you'd be better off with a Celestial (via exalted companion), Magebred, War Beast Fleshraker.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Go something like Druid 1/ Bloodline (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/bloodlines.htm) 3/ Sorcerer 1/ Wizard 1/ Beastmaster 1, using the Animal Companion ACF (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#sorcererWizard) for Wizard and Sorcerer. Possibly even use multiple major bloodlines to get more bloodline levels.

Bloodline levels get added to every other class level for determining level-dependent class features. Let's add up your effective Druid level for your animal companion's benefits:
Druid 1 + Bloodline 3 = 4
Sorcerer 1 + Bloodline 3, but /2 = 2
Wizard 1 + Bloodline 3, but /2 = 2
Beastmaster 1+3 + Bloodline 3 = 7
Effective Druid level for Animal Companion benefits: 15

One thing to note is that Bloodline levels as-written do not increase your character level. That means you start at Druid 1, and as a 1st level character you need to gain 1,000 XP to hit 2nd level. When you've gained that 1,000 XP, you take a Bloodline level and you're still considered a 1st level character. As a 1st level character you need only gain another 1,000 XP to gain another level, and once you do you gain another Bloodline level and you're still considered a 1st level character. I think you can see where this is going: every bloodline level you gain costs you only 1,000 XP. If you'd be starting at 10th level, you can get nine bloodline levels and start at 9th level, or get seventeen bloodline levels and start at 8th level. Keep in mind that all of those bloodline levels occur before you hit character level 2, so you'll never suffer a penalty for not taking them early enough. As above, those bloodline levels all directly contribute to your animal companion's benefits per class that gets an animal companion, so you could end up with an animal companion well into the epic progression (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/classProgressions.htm#epicDruid) with a low-level character.

Be good-aligned. Take the feat Exalted Companion (BoED) to give it the Celestial Creature template, so it's good aligned. Your animal companion can then take Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty, and gain benefits based on its HD, which should be considerably higher than the party level. If it has over 21+ HD it can even take epic feats, including Epic Vow of Poverty (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19530250/?pg=last).

[Venusaur]

Pet druid? Definitely take Wild Cohort (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031118a). Double your animal companions at the cost of only one feat.

[Phaederkiel]

maybe of interest: some DMs allow Natural Bond to counter the -3 of your Druidlevel for getting a Fleshraker. This is quite powerful, but is quite correct by raw and even possibly Read as Intended.

[Coidzor]

^: Combine with a level of Beastmaster for counteracting a -6 to effective druid level for AC purposes. Or multiclassing fun.

What the hell does gamebreaking mean here?

Are you allowed anything (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=7414)short of the (http://coboard.wikia.com/wiki/Supermount)supermount (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19866958/Supermount!)?

Can you supermount? Are you married to druid? (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19866674/The_big_guy_is_with_me_%28psicrystal_build%29) Are you able to multiclass even after going into druid?

What about beyond supermount (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142554)?

[gkathellar]

Major Bloodline 3/Bard w/Animal Companion ACF (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#bard) 1/Druid 6/Arcane Hierophant 10. Make sure to take ACFs that avoid redundancy between bard and druid features.

Feats - Obtain Familiar - Bard, Theurgic Bond (Dragon 325).

What you're here for is the Companion Familiar class feature, which is really the best way to pull this off. Even without Theurgic Bond, you get a pet with the abilities of 23rd-level Animal Companion and a 14th-level familiar. Add Theurgic Bond, and your pet gets to 23/23.

Season to taste with Natural Bond and various other spices.

[Gavinfoxx]

Pet focused Druid:

Combine these things:
Wild Cohort
Initiate of Nature
Natural Bond (well, a permissive reading of it...)

[kulosle]

^: Combine with a level of Beastmaster for counteracting a -6 to effective druid level for AC purposes. Or multiclassing fun.

What the hell does gamebreaking mean here?

Are you allowed anything (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=7414)short of the (http://coboard.wikia.com/wiki/Supermount)supermount (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19866958/Supermount!)?

Can you supermount? Are you married to druid? (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19866674/The_big_guy_is_with_me_%28psicrystal_build%29) Are you able to multiclass even after going into druid?

What about beyond supermount (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142554)?

Game breaking means beyond super mount. Our DM doesn't let non permanent effects count towards prerequisites so beyond super mount wouldn't even work. But I can super mount.

I am interested in getting a creature that has full special mount, familiar, and companion traits, but i don't actually want to ride my mount. What happens if we get the total level at higher than 20, is there an epic progression of mount , familiar, and companion? If so does someone have a link because i don't own the epic level handbook. I've been meaning to track that book down.

I like the bloodline abuse idea. Which blood line would be most beneficial? Do blood line levels give you BAB, hit points, saves, or any of those fun things?

I'm not married to druid, but I really like it. And i'm totally okay with mutli classing, because we don't use the exp penalty for being to far apart in levels.

What/where is mage-bred and how do i get it onto my animal companion.

[Coidzor]

Fortunately, the SRD contains most of the ELH. For animal companions and special mounts it's mostly just a simple extrapolation of the existing progression.

Familiars (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/classProgressions.htm#familiarsAtEpicLevel): +1 Natural Armor and a higher base Intelligence for every 2 levels. A single spell as an SLA every 10 levels.

Druids(&Animal Companions) (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/classProgressions.htm#epicDruid): 2 HD, +2 NA, +1 Str/Dex, +1 bonus trick known for every 3 levels.

Paladins(&Special Mounts) (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/classProgressions.htm#epicPaladin): +2 HD, +1 Str/Int for every 5 levels.

Magebred is a template from the Eberron Campaign Setting book, it makes the animal easier to handle, have better ability scores, and can grant one of a selection of minor abilities. Due to being a template, it's a bit problematic to get. There's several regions where one can have a character that gets a magebred animal companion though, such as magebred tigers for rangers/druids from the Breland region. If one is outside the ECS, then the DM would have to custom decide what would be appropriate. Similar to the horrid template, really.

And just because it's a Supermount doesn't mean ya gotta ride it. :smallwink: IIRC, there's a version of the supermount that's further refined than Caelic's version without going quite to the stages that the ubermount got up to... though I can't recall where to look for it offhand. sorry. :/

The Ranger Knight of Furyondy from Dragon 317 grants Paladin Special Mount as a 5th level Paladin upon entry into the PrC, much like how Heartfire Fanner can give Bardic Music as a 5th level Bard. It'd be of potential interest, but has several feats required for it, many of which are required for PrC Paladin, IIRC. In the end, for what you want, probably not the way you'll be going.

Some further links I dug up that might (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=224403) inspire (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=210847) and/or (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5878790&postcount=13) disgust (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=198096) you.

edit: This (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=7167.0) might help you understand bloodlines.

[kulosle]

Go something like Druid 1/ Bloodline (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/bloodlines.htm) 3/ Sorcerer 1/ Wizard 1/ Beastmaster 1, using the Animal Companion ACF (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#sorcererWizard) for Wizard and Sorcerer. Possibly even use multiple major bloodlines to get more bloodline levels.

Bloodline levels get added to every other class level for determining level-dependent class features. Let's add up your effective Druid level for your animal companion's benefits:
Druid 1 + Bloodline 3 = 4
Sorcerer 1 + Bloodline 3, but /2 = 2
Wizard 1 + Bloodline 3, but /2 = 2
Beastmaster 1+3 + Bloodline 3 = 7
Effective Druid level for Animal Companion benefits: 15

One thing to note is that Bloodline levels as-written do not increase your character level. That means you start at Druid 1, and as a 1st level character you need to gain 1,000 XP to hit 2nd level. When you've gained that 1,000 XP, you take a Bloodline level and you're still considered a 1st level character. As a 1st level character you need only gain another 1,000 XP to gain another level, and once you do you gain another Bloodline level and you're still considered a 1st level character. I think you can see where this is going: every bloodline level you gain costs you only 1,000 XP. If you'd be starting at 10th level, you can get nine bloodline levels and start at 9th level, or get seventeen bloodline levels and start at 8th level. Keep in mind that all of those bloodline levels occur before you hit character level 2, so you'll never suffer a penalty for not taking them early enough. As above, those bloodline levels all directly contribute to your animal companion's benefits per class that gets an animal companion, so you could end up with an animal companion well into the epic progression (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/classProgressions.htm#epicDruid) with a low-level character.

Be good-aligned. Take the feat Exalted Companion (BoED) to give it the Celestial Creature template, so it's good aligned. Your animal companion can then take Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty, and gain benefits based on its HD, which should be considerably higher than the party level. If it has over 21+ HD it can even take epic feats, including Epic Vow of Poverty (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19530250/?pg=last).

So according to the bloodline handbook this doesn't work. But what does work is taking bloodline 3 and a class the ups, animal companion, familiar, special mount, companion familiar, familiar mount, or any other ability i can find. Then these levels that each got a +3 now combine with the use of feats. This i like.

So I think i have an idea of where i'm going with this now. Ideally I would want there to be a way for me to be a druid and take the prestigious paladin class. Is there a way to do this? Also is there a way for a wizard to be able to cast divine spells?

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

So according to the bloodline handbook this doesn't work. But what does work is taking bloodline 3 and a class the ups, animal companion, familiar, special mount, companion familiar, familiar mount, or any other ability i can find. Then these levels that each got a +3 now combine with the use of feats. This i like.

If you take a level each of Druid, Wizard, and Sorcerer, and use the (half-progression) Animal Companion ACF (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#sorcererWizard) for both Wizard and Sorcerer, your Bloodline levels add to each of those classes for determining each one's contribution to your effective level for an animal companion. Each one grants its own Animal Companion class feature, rather than advancing an ability of another class, so each one gets your Bloodline levels added to it. You still add your contributing class levels together to determine your total effective level for a single animal companion. That means going Druid 1/ Bloodline 3/ Druid 2, you get 6th level for the AC, whereas a Druid 1/ Bloodline 3/ Wizard 1/ Sorcerer 1 is counted as 8th level for the AC benefits. You should also throw in (Savage (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#bardVariantSavageBard) ) Bard 1 with the Nature ACF (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#bard), which at Bard 1/ Bloodline 3/ Druid 1/ Wizard 1/ Sorcerer 1 you'll count as 12th level for the AC benefits.

With regards to the bloodline handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=7167) and his interpretation of how bloodline levels interact with character level and XP totals:

1) Though the primary source all uses the word "before", all the examples seem to place the timing of the taking of the bloodline levels immediately before 3, 6, or 12. I counter that they meant 'immediately before' meaning that one takes the level after level 2/5/11 but before you take your normal class level at 3/6/12 after the bloodline level at 3/6/12.
His interpretation would imply that you're absolutely forced to take your Bloodline levels at a specific character level, but the wording no more implies this than while you can let your Bloodline level wait as late as possible, you can still take it early and get it out of the way. That is what I was suggesting, take all of your Bloodline levels at the earliest possible opportunity. Each Bloodline level costs you your current character level x1000 XP, so the sooner your take them the lower the cost. That their examples wait as late as possible to take their Bloodline levels is irrelevant, if you're required to take three Bloodline levels each before your 3rd, 6th, and 12th character levels, and you take them all before your 2nd character level, then you're still obeying the letter of the rules. The above quote is 100% opinion, and it places an arbitrary, unintended restriction on when you may take your Bloodline levels.

[Coidzor]

Hmm, should've bolded the word might, sorry. It's a contentious topic every time I've seen it come up. I thought that handbook went into both interpretations though, or is there a different one I was thinking of? x,x

[kulosle]

When looking around for stuff on the uber mount i found this class "Vadalis Beastkeeper" but I can't find it any where. What is it and where is it from?

[Coidzor]

When looking around for stuff on the uber mount i found this class "Vadalis Beastkeeper" but I can't find it any where. What is it and where is it from?

It's a PrC from the Eberron book "Dragonmarked." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_prestige_classes#Dragonmarked)

I believe it has an independent spell progression. (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCQQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.giantitp.com%2Fforums%2Fshowt hread.php%3Ft%3D181091&ei=HkZLT9iOCIiDtgfKuPTuAg&usg=AFQjCNHbguUEtUim42GFk88_0UysVjxVNQ)

[kulosle]

Okay so here's a fun fact: the magebred template is discussed a lot in dragonmarked, but the template itself is not there. Does anyone know where it is or did i just miss it?

Also I swear there was a way to get a wizard who could cast divine spells, but i can't seem to find that anywhere. Does anyone know what I'm talking about or did I miss read something? Basically I need to get a class that can get both arcane and divine casting and an animal companion and a familiar. This way AH will progress both the animal companion and familiar of the same class and then when i use theurgic bond it would double my companion familiars level. The wizard could do this with use of the animal companion acf and the obtain familar feat. I guess this could also be done with a ranger with the sword of the arcane order and obtain familiar feat, but seams less efficient.

[Aeryr]

The magebred is in Eberron Campaign Setting If I do remember correctly, if not it might be in player's guide to eberron. (is in one of the very basic eberron books)

When I build my supermount I always will trade a level of beastmaster for a level of algarondan griffin rider (unaprochable east) that neats a griffin as your paladin mount / animal companion, wich already is a magic beast so celestial companion is less needed and also gives you fliby attack really powerful combined with the Wild plains outrider move and full attack.

Edit: the arcane hierophant asks for druid lvls (so you have the trackless step class feature) and you can get 2nd lvl arcane spells with a feat (if you are a wizard). Also the Arcane hierophant doesn't per se ask that you have a familiar. If you want to break stuff really hard, be a bamboo spiritfolk (OA), wizard 1 with the alternative class feature for animal companion spontaneous divination (so you can grab versatile spellcaster) archivist and some feat to swap spell type from arcane to divine and the go misthic theurge till you can jump to arcane hierophant taking theurgic bond twice.

But that is not directly focused on the pet. I played that once, my companion familiar was a Dire Ape with ranks on disguise and sleight of hand while my character posed as a little girl convincing the rest of the party (and the setting) that she was the familiar, of the big guy, who had only chosen her since she could speak with other's of it kind. False theurgy, Conceal Spellcasting, Disguise Spellcasting, Subsonic Spell and some ranks in sleight of hand made her appear to be just playing around while casting spells... It was glorious.