[3.5] Dread Commando

[Ryulin18]

Hey Giants. This is build is giving me some real trouble.

I have heard all over the interwebs that a fighter/rogue/dread commando (From heroes of battle) is a fantastic class. But I can't seem to put it all together in a decent way.

I was aiming for a 2 levels in fighter, 4 in rogue or 3 ranger then head to dread commando. Running around in full plate with full abilities unseen and unheard then stabbing a dragon in the ass sounds hilarious.

But my secondary problem is that the party will be a druid/wizard with a super pet, a beguiler, a duskblade and a master of the seven fold veils. Problem?

[Aeryr]

I understand your problem, that happened to me while playing a campaign last year, I was a swift hunter, everyone else was a caster, still using your wits and imagination you can outmanuber the casters at some points. At least you will have fun and you won't be solving everything because "a wizard did it" or "it's magic"

[Keld Denar]

Dread Commando has some party synergy, what with giving your whole group +5 initiative. That's like you casting Chained Nerveskitter on the whole group, every combat, and it stacks with an actual Nerveskitter if your group's casters want to cast one. Going first is key. You want to go first.

As far as actually being useful, I'd suggest you stick with a 2hander. You won't have quite enough damage to justify all of the feat expenditure on TWFing. Get Power Attack, at the bare minimum. You get SA/SS damage, so you can pick up Staggering Strike to force massive save DCs with your PA damage, which is handy for avoiding full attack counter attacks.

For your build, either works. I'd at least have 1 level of Rogue or something to get at least 1 SA die. SA is slightly more ubiquitous than SS, and you want to make sure that in nearly all situations, you can get your Staggering Strike off to avoid full attack counter attacks from whatever foe you are engaging (assuming your team controls/disables the rest).

Also, dip the Barb1 for pounce. You want to be able to be all COMMANDO AMBUSH and get a full attack while doing it.

[Ryulin18]

"a wizard did it" or "it's magic"

The DM knows everyone is going to be casting, so he might be gunning for them. Giving me the perfect opportunity to get my stealth on!

I know easily that I will get outclassed but I will always be the one who doesn't worry about spells or running out.

[Ryulin18]

But seriously. Do I got fighter 2/Rogue 4 or Ranger 2/rogue 4 or ranger 5?

Or something else entirely

[deuxhero]

As for entry, Ranger with Distracting Attack (PHB2 IIRC, trades your worthless ranger animal companion that is even more worthless due to multiclassing).

Blackguard is also an interesting compliment to Dread Commando, given its requirement of hide ranks actually does something if you do that (which is REALLY impressive for Blackguard) and passively helps the party (-2 to saves for the enemies is great in a party of casters) and if you don't get it from base classes alreddy, heavier armor. You get a servant that isn't useful for much (it's squishy, though it can take further passive benifit feats like Hidden Talent: Psionic Minor Creation for poison, Dragonic Aura for out of combat healing) though is based on character level. You still need two iffy feats and fails to do anything of real interest after level 4.

[Person_Man]

I don't think that Dread Commando (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20050407b&page=6) is that great of a prestige class. The pre-reqs suck. Armored Ease can be accomplished with special materials and magic items. Stealthy Movement is only useful if you've got some sort of Hide in Plain Site combo going on. And in general, it looks like everyone else in your party will be playing on tier 1 or 3, and you're going to be mucking around in Tier 4 or 5.

You might want to consider a Marshal (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20030906b) 1/Binder (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=137.20) X instead. Marshal will give you heavy armor, martial weapons, Skill Focus (Diplomacy), and the Motivate Dexterity Aura (Cha bonus to Initative, Dex checks, and Dex Skills for allies within 60 feet). Binder gives you a ton of options, including massive buffs to various Skills, at will Disguise Self, Invisibility, Sneak Attack, Sudden Strike, a magic crow whose senses you can see through, Dance of Death, etc.

If you do go with Dread Commando, you should take a look at optimizing the Elusive Target feat. It also requires the sucky Dodge and Mobility feats, and can be quite handy in a variety of circumstances.

[Fax Celestis]

Why not enter with Sneak Attack Fighter?

[Tenebris]

Why not enter with Sneak Attack Fighter?

Agree. Sneak attack fighter 3, rogue 3, dread commando 5 gives you 7d6 precision damage at lvl 11. Not amazing, but not bad. I'd also support considering some lvls binder dip to bind Malphas - some extra sudden strike plus invisibility every 5th round.

Since you are taking Dodge & Mobility feats anyway, think about Elusive Target - personally I find it really nice.

[deuxhero]

I don't think that Dread Commando (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20050407b&page=6) is that great of a prestige class. The pre-reqs suck. Armored Ease can be accomplished with special materials and magic items. Stealthy Movement is only useful if you've got some sort of Hide in Plain Site combo going on. And in general, it looks like everyone else in your party will be playing on tier 1 or 3, and you're going to be mucking around in Tier 4 or 5.

Say, what class (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/prestigeClasses/shadowdancer.htm) has overlaping requirements and is one of the most common methods of gaining Hide in Plain Sight?

You will need Combat Reflexes and some dance ranks though.

[Human Paragon 3]

Get Power Attack, at the bare minimum. You get SA/SS damage, so you can pick up Staggering Strike to force massive save DCs with your PA damage, which is handy for avoiding full attack counter attacks.


THIS!

Skip the rogue. Get in with strait ranger, and only take Fighter if you need the feats.

[gbprime]

THIS!

Skip the rogue. Get in with strait ranger, and only take Fighter if you need the feats.

No way. Armored ease is wasted on a ranger chassis. Fighter 3 (SA) / Rogue 3 is the more powerful option.

Can you take a +1 LA template to start? Dark Creature from Tome of Magic gives you Hide in Plain Sight at level 1.