Its time for a cleric! [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

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Whisper rider

2012-03-19, 12:40 AM

So.. My charcter died, in the abyss... I got different ideas for a new one, my new stats, are good, but kind of hard to work them around versatile characters... The stats are 17 17 15 12 8 8 (+1/ lvl 4)
I builded a scout/fighter/dervish..
I got some ideas, for a illusonist/master specialist/ nightmare spinner, and for an unseen seer...
I really like clerics, i've never played one, got any ideas on how to build one?? O have read anout the DMM but not sure abpu it.. Any ideas on how to build one... Feats etc.. Will be appreciated... It will be a lvl 4.. Long run campaing to lvl 16-18
Thxs!

Marlowe

2012-03-19, 01:45 AM

Your 2 most important stats are Wis and Con. Stick the 17s on those.

Clerics without the Celerity Domain can generally get away with dumping Dex. Stick an 8 into that.

I don't advise dumping strength as a Cleric. Its not an absolutely vital stat, but you are going to be in armour all the time and encumbrance isn't fun. Remember that Clerics get Bull's strength (STR+4)at level 3 and Divine Power (STR+6) at level 7, so allocate your stats under the assumption that one of these will probably be your default battle buff. Put the 12 or the 15 in here. I would actually be inclined to go with the 15 to improve your armour options. I have had a STR 8 DEX 7 Cleric, it could have been worse but it still wasn't much fun.

The choice is between sticking the remaining 8 into your CHR or your INT. CHR for Clerics mainly works to modify your turning ability (both in determining your attempts per day and as a modifier to turning damage). INT is of value largely to get you more skill points which Clerics do need.

If you have 8 CHR, make sure you have Extra Turning and 5 ranks Knowledge religion to (over)compensate for the stat penalty. If you have INT 8, I recommend you be Human for the extra skill point/level. Remember that depending on your domains, you may be able to turn things other than Undead, and that there are uses for turning checks aside from turning.

I'll leave a discussion of Domains and Dieties for now...one little point is WEAPONRY. The usual optimum weapon for a non-War Domain Cleric is Morningstar+heavy shield (Maces are more classic, but a Morningstar is lighter and cheaper than a mace for the same effect). However, going by RAW, if you have a heavy shield+a weapon drawn then you can't cast spells. This rule seems to be very commonly fudged or forgotten. If this rule does get remembered you'll be better off with Spear/Longspear+buckler.

[SLIGHLY SURREAL EDIT: Needed to let someone else use 'puter] In fact, I'd take Longspear as the best of the simple weapons anyway. Especially if you have or can get a bonus to strength.

One feat you should get is Scribe Scroll. The Cleric's great strength is his ability to know every spell he can cast....but he can't have all of those prepared all the time. Therefore being able to make and carry an arsenal of scrolls for those spells that it's SOMETIMES good to have (but which aren't worth preparing every day) is a huge boost.

Don't bother with brew potion. Potions cost you more to make than scrolls and their only advantage is that anyone can use them. With scrolls, the party still needs you or some other divine magic user around to use them. I'm not saying that some of your fellow PCs might be less than concerned with your welfare and survival for other than selfish reasons, but no reason to make yourself look expendable.

I'm going to assume you're a positive energy Cleric (a Healer/Turner). That's probably the easiest and best option. Note that a grey or dark Cleric (a wounder/rebuker) is significantly more deadly in combat if he wants to be, but relatively lacks flexibility. Being able to command undead rather than destroy them is SOMETIMES handy.

I said I wouldn't go into Deities and Domains (this is because everyone starts talking about "devotion feats" at this point. I have absolutely no idea what these are.), but in general it seems that the neutral gods in core get all the cool stuff. Probably the best option for a divine patron is Fharlanghen, god of travellers. He suits the adventurer lifestyle, is True Neutral, and comes with the much-envied Travel Domain (one of the few ways Clerics can get Fly and Teleport) and Luck (also very handy). His other domains are pretty cool as well, though you won't be getting much use out of Celerity with a DEX of 8, and Weather suffers from editing issues (to summarise: The final official weather domain is actually the 3.0 Deities and Demigods version. The 3.5 Complete Divine Version got renamed Windstorm).

The only Good god who gets the travel domain, off the top of my head, is Lydia, Goddess of Woman's Empowerment, who isn't listed in 3.5 materials as far as I can tell.

I now call upon the rest of the forum to tell me where I got everything wrong.

[YET ANOTHER EDIT] One important rule everyone seems to forget: A Cleric can meditate for an hour at any time of the day to replace previously prepared unused spells with others of the same level. As long as he's not threatened or whatever. This means if you need a certain spell you haven't prepared (a stone shape to get through a wall, a remove curse on a belt of gender change, a lesser restoration on someone who's been poisoned) and the party is prepared to wait around a bit, you CAN sort this out on the day. You don't need to wait a whole extra day get the job done.

Honestly, everytime I play a Cleric I find myself wondering why anyone plays anything else.

Marlowe

2012-03-19, 05:02 AM

As long as nobody else is responding, here's a quick build, assuming regular WBL:

Beige McClericington

Human Cleric of Fhalanghen 4. TN Healer/Turner
STR 15
DEX 8
CON 17
INT 12
WIS 18 (level increase)
CHR 8
Saves: Fort +7, Ref +0, Will +8
HP: 34
BAB +3 ((+2 STR, -1 Bkl, +1Mstwrk weapon)+5 total bonus)
Domains: Travel, Luck.

Equipment: Handy Haversack, darkwood longspear, darkwood buckler, Holy symbol, Masterwork Full plate. (all other gear, including your back-up club, mace, morningstar or whatever, goes in the haversack). 63.5 pounds carried for light encumbrance. -5 ACP

AC 19, FF 19, Touch 10

feats: Extra turning, Scribe scroll + one other.

28 skill points. Survival is a bonus class skill. Make sure you have max concentration (7 ranks) and 5 points in Knowledge (religion).

Travel domain power-Immune to magic effects impeding movement (such as web, entangle, grease but not mundane grappling) for 4 rounds per day (automatic ability)
Luck domain power-one reroll (any sort of roll) a day. Must choose to reroll before the DM has called success or failure.

Spells per day: 6 level 0, 4 level 1+1 level 1 domain spell (longstrider), 3 level 2 + 1 level 2 domain spell (Aid).

Golden Ladybug

2012-03-19, 06:17 AM

Another thing related to Domains and Deities; you don't actually need to be devoted to a Deity. The SRD doesn't list the Greyhawk Pantheon, much less any of the Faerun or Eberron, so if that is your main source of play material, making a choice on which god to follow is a hard one.

However, there is always the option of playing a Cleric of a Cause or Ideal, in which case your character concept isn't dictated by which God you follow. This way, you can take domains that fit the character you want to build, regardless of whether any printed God carries that combination.

Devotions Feats, which Marlowe mention, are listed in Complete Champion, and are most notable by being feats you can get by either selecting them as normal, or by trading in one or more of your Domains (Maximum number of Devotion Feats you can take is two for a cleric, one for everyone else). Most of them aren't very good, but some, such as the Travel, Knowledge and Trickery Devotion feats, are very good, and are worth the trade, for the most part.

If you're planning on using the Devotion trade, I suggest using a Cloistered Cleric, a variant from Unearthed Arcana which you can find on the SRD, that gains Knowledge Devotion and extra skills in exchange for poor BAB progression (which can be ignored by use of Divine Power once you reach level 7) and proficiency with only Light Armor, rather than all. The Knowledge Domain gives you all Knowledge skills as class skills while you have it, so you can use it to become the Monster Identifier, and then trade it away for Insight Bonuses to attack/damage based on those Knowledge Checks (Knowledge Devotion is a very good feat) at a later date.

Anyway, good luck and happy Cleric-ing :smallwink:

Garwain

2012-03-19, 07:23 AM

Snowbluff

2012-03-19, 12:41 PM

Very popular for clerics is indeed the Divine Metamagic, especially paired with the Quicken or Persistent metamagic feat. If you choose to be the cleric type that is concentrating on spellcasting more than weapons, then consider a cloistered cleric.

Human cloistered cleric (domains: knowledge, planning, undead)
knowledge domain -> trade for knowledge devotion (CC)
planning domain -> get extend metamagic for free
undead domain -W get extra turning for free

H1: persistent metamagic feat
lvl1: divine metamagic feat

Tada: you can now have a spell cast with a duration of 24 hours. Go read the spells and imaging how cool it might be if they'd lasted the whole day instead of 1 round.

Seconded.

My personal setup nowaday is a Bow Cleric.

Zen Archery, Rapid Shot for feats. DMM: Persist, some Extra Turning.
Sacred Transformation, Greater Magic Weapon on your Arrows, Divine Power, Righteous Might, Righteous Wrath of the Faithful for Spells.
Raptor Arrows, and a +1 Splitting Collision Composite Longbow with either A) variable strength pull or B) Str rating to match your buffed Str.