Pathfinder Getsalt (Monk/Rogue)

[ExemplarofAvg]

So, in one weeks time I'm going to take part in something that may or may not ruin my groups friendship, :P

Pathfinder Getsalt. There will be Three Players (That I know of)
Currently this is what I know

Thomas
Warforged (We've moved them over, have you?)
Paladin/Cleric
Melee Tank Healer

Nathan
Something Elf
Magus/? (possibly Ninja, seriously that is so him I'm expecting it)
Nova, seriously, he spends hours finding ways to go nova, (and they almost always work)

Me
Human
Monk/Rogue
This is where you guys get to see something that they haven't figured out. They think I'm going to have my character dress in black and run around shouting ("Nin, nin") But I'm not doing that. Technically I'm going:

Martial Artist (Monk)/Rake and Scout (Rogue)
I plan to rush in feint the opponent and once there's an opening they are going to beat the living (expletive) out of them. Rake gets rid of the trap finding and sense that I doubt I'm going to be using anyways and it gives the personality trait I was going to go for, as well as a minor bonus to Bluff. Scout gives me another condition for getting sneak attack off.

That being said I'm looking for some minor advice in what rogue talents should I select. The only recommended rogue talent shared between Rake and Scout is Skill Mastery (which ALL of the archetypes recommend)

My current thoughts (in no particular order are)
Resiliency (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/rogue/rogue-talents/paizo---rogue-talents/resiliency-ex) Not dying is always a great skill to have.
Offensive Defense (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/rogue/rogue-talents/paizo---rogue-talents/offensive-defense-ex) Not being hit is always a great skill.
Bleeding Attack (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/rogue/rogue-talents/paizo---rogue-talents/bleeding-attack-ex) Not letting your opponent live long is a great skill.
Fast Stealth (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/rogue/rogue-talents/paizo---rogue-talents/fast-stealth-ex) No being slowed down is a great skill.
Positioning Attack (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/rogue/rogue-talents/paizo---rogue-talents/positioning-attack-ex) Yeah, nothing witty for this one, I just think it might be useful.
I could always get my Ki Pool (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/rogue/rogue-talents/paizo---rogue-talents/ki-pool-ex) back as well. (Not sure why, but I can :smalltongue:)

Those are just my thoughts for this character, If something completely sucks let me know. The only ones my heart is set on are Resiliency, Offensive Defence, Bleeding Attack and Fast Stealth.

Some character quotes would be
"Here I come" (Charging Stunning Fist)
"Here's an Oppening" (Feint to Sneak Attack)
"This is my 100%" (Flurrying Sneak Attack) Yeah, the entire build came from this idea.

Oh, also any feats you think I should take (Beyond Improved Feint, as that is the only thing I can think that I need) feel free to post that as well.

[grarrrg]

Martial Artist (Monk)/Rake and Scout (Rogue)
I plan to rush in feint the opponent and once there's an opening they are going to beat the living (expletive) out of them. Rake gets rid of the trap finding and sense that I doubt I'm going to be using anyways and it gives the personality trait I was going to go for, as well as a minor bonus to Bluff. Scout gives me another condition for getting sneak attack off.
k)

You don't want Martial Artist. You want Flowing Monk (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/monk/archetypes/paizo---monk-archetypes/flowing-monk). Here's why:


At 2nd level, a flowing monk’s attacks of opportunity render a struck creature flat-footed until the end of the flowing monk’s next turn (Reflex DC 10 + 1/2 the monk’s level + Wisdom modifier negates).

I'd recommend High Dex, Weapon Finesse, and a weapon with the Agile (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/magic-weapons#TOC-Agile) enchantment, and the Trip property (preferably Reach as well, but not necessary)

Combine with:
Combat Reflexes.
Improved (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/improved-trip-combat---final)/Greater (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/greater-trip-combat---final) Trip: Greater lets you make an AoO if your Trip was successful.
Vicious Stomp (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/vicious-stomp-combat): If an Opponent falls prone, you can make an Unarmed AoO (now why would they fall prone?...)
Fury's Fall (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/fury-s-fall-combat): Add Dex to CMB attempts
(Rogue Talent's can be used to get some of these feats)

Sample combat:
Start You standing next to Opponent.
Start a Full Attack.
In place of first attack, use the Trip Maneuver.
If trip succeeds, you get to make 2 AoO's, 1 Unarmed, 1 any (Greater Trip & Vicious Stomp).
Opponent must make TWO Reflex saves, or become Flat-Footed until the end of your next turn (Flowing Monk 2).
Finish your Full Attack by delivering a righteous beatdown upon them (Opponent is Prone and Flat-Footed, Prone > -4 AC vs Melee, Flat-Footed > Sneak Attack damage is applied).

On opponent's turn, they can either:
Stay Prone, with -4 AC vs. Melee.
Or they can attempt to stand up, which provokes an AoO.
Or they can attempt to move/crawl away, which provokes an AoO.
Regardless, the Opponent is still considered Flat-Footed.

On your turn:
If Opponent stood up, repeat Round 1.
Otherwise initiate Full Attack beatdown.

Repeat as necessary.

[ExemplarofAvg]

You don't want Martial Artist.

Martial Artist is what I want, it's not supposed to be optimized, I know trip builds, I didn't want one. I wanted a Martial Artist in the real world sense, I chose the Martial Artist because

Exploit Weakness:
10+Hardness or CR vs. d20+wis+Monk Level.
So 15+ vs. d20+3+5 (Like my odds)
Benefit: +2 attack rolls, ignores Hardness and DR
Or gain a scaling bonus to Sense Motive (I bluff them, they can't bluff back) Reflex Saves and AC (in the form of a dodge bonus, Nice synergy with Offensive Defence)

Extreme Endurance: Scaling immunities
Physical Resistance: Less effect from ability damage.
Defensive Roll: If taking the rogue talent could have multiple uses
I doubt our game will get much higher.
There represent realistic effects of training to see openings, to be less tired from physical exertion, to endure more. To avoid the most lethal of blows.

I chose Martial Artist because that is what I wanted to use.

[Waker]

The Flowing Monk archetype is a good idea for the points mentioned. Another good one is the Master of Many Styles.

I'll make suggestions based on the assumption you are going to be running over the battlefield annoying everyone.

Style Feats:
Dragon Style- Excellent due to ignoring difficult terrain and doubling strength damage on the first attack, good for charging. The ability to induce Shaken isn't horrible either.
Janni Style- Another excellent choice for the skirmisher. Bonuses to bullrush and trip attempts and increasing damage for a jump attack.
Panther Style- Every time you provoke an AoO for moving through a threatened square, you get to make an AoO yourself. Especially funny to use Panther Parry combined with Trip or Punishing Kick and deny the opponents their AoO.
Snake Style-Nice for the ability to use Sense Motive in place of AC or Attack rolls, since you can't critically fail a skill check. Dealing piercing damage and gaining extra attacks ain't so horrible either.

Rogue Talents:
Fast Getaway- Deal sneak attack damage and get to make a withdraw action as a move action, meaning you don't provoke AoOs from leaving a threatened area.
Hard to Fool- Very nice if you went the Snake Style route.
Ledge Walker- Full speed and not flatfooted while balancing is decent.
Ninja Trick- I'd suggest Pressure Points or Wall Climber.
Slow Reactions- Denying AoOs is never a bad thing.

My idea for a funny skirmisher would be taking the Scout/Many Style archetypes. As a Human Monk you would have three starting feats, choosing Combat Reflexes and Panther Style, plus Panther Claw as your bonus 1st level feat. At second level you would then take Panther Parry as your bonus feat. At 4th level take Slow Reactions. When you run by an enemy you provoke an AoO, triggering Panther Parry, if you hit them, your Sneak Attack Damage triggers Slow Reactions, which denies the enemy from making AoOs for 1 round, allowing you to run by unimpeded. Of course some DMs wouldn't allow that interpretation, so I suggest instead using Trip or Punishing Kick to to them in a position where they can't effectively counterattack, being prone or potentially out of reach respectively.

I realized I made an error after the post was made, but the Slow Reactions trick wouldn't work until 8th level, as the Scout archetype requires a charge attack in order to deal Sneak Attack damage until then. Running by wouldn't be feasible til then. Though the other parts would work.
Also see if you can convince your DM to allow Martial Artist and Master of Many Styles to work together, as they only come into conflict at lvl 20.

[Blyte]

I recommend (tetori+quinggong) monk + (white haired) witch.

but

(tetori+qinggong) or (flowing+quinggong) monk + ninja is also nice.. definitely take ninja over rogue for the double ki pool.

[grarrrg]

Resiliency Not dying is always a great skill to have.
Offensive Defense Not being hit is always a great skill.
Bleeding Attack Not letting your opponent live long is a great skill.
Fast Stealth No being slowed down is a great skill.
Positioning Attack Yeah, nothing witty for this one, I just think it might be useful.

Resiliency/Positioning are both 1/day only. So I'd suggest against them.

Offensive Defense and Bleeding Attack are nice, but don't do much until you have some decent levels/Sneak Attack (you didn't mention what level you're starting at).

Fast Stealth can be nice.

Some quick suggestions:

Befuddling Strike can make you harder to hit.
Combat Trick/Weapon Training are always nice for the extra feat(s).

Ninja Trick Talent gets you a Ninja Trick! (really? no way!):
Pressure Points, when you make a Sneak Attack, deal 1 point of Str or Dex damage. BONUS: Combine with the Crippling Strike Advanced Rogue Talent and do 3 points of Str damage per Sneak Attack.
Style Master, gain a Style feat.
Wall Climber, gain a Climb speed of 20ft.
Rogue Talent, use a Rogue Talent to take a Ninja Trick to get a Rogue Talent! (and use that Rogue Talent to pick up a Ninja Trick!)

[ExemplarofAvg]

Resiliency/Positioning are both 1/day only. So I'd suggest against them.

Offensive Defense and Bleeding Attack are nice, but don't do much until you have some decent levels/Sneak Attack (you didn't mention what level you're starting at).

Fast Stealth can be nice.

Really, only 1/day each, poo, I must've been too excited to see.

Oh, Lv 6. so 3 points in each. Not great, but better than nothing.
Fast Stealth is just in case we have to move fast, my DM enjoys his stealth missions.


Some quick suggestions:

Befuddling Strike can make you harder to hit.
Combat Trick/Weapon Training are always nice for the extra feat(s).

Nothing wrong with that.
And yes, I suppose so. I sunder the door, WITH MY FIST!



Ninja Trick Talent gets you a Ninja Trick! (really? no way!):
Pressure Points, when you make a Sneak Attack, deal 1 point of Str or Dex damage. BONUS: Combine with the Crippling Strike Advanced Rogue Talent and do 3 points of Str damage per Sneak Attack.
Style Master, gain a Style feat.
Wall Climber, gain a Climb speed of 20ft.
Rogue Talent, use a Rogue Talent to take a Ninja Trick to get a Rogue Talent! (and use that Rogue Talent to pick up a Ninja Trick!)

Pressure Points, just 1 damage, awe, :smallfrown:
Style Master, Style Suggestions?
Wall Climber, yeah, this and fast stealth should make infiltration nicer.
O_O THE ULTIMATE COMBO (Might do this, just because)

[Communard]

How are you managing to be both Lawful and non-Lawful at the same time?

[NineThePuma]

How are you managing to be both Lawful and non-Lawful at the same time?

Does rogue have an alignment prerequisite?

[grarrrg]

Does rogue have an alignment prerequisite?

Not since DnD 2nd edition...
And If he does take the Martial Artist Monk archetype, it removes the alignment restriction anyway.