Motivate Charisma increases Leadership? Also, LA+1 template to turn Outsider?

[Morph Bark]

To expand on the two questions in the thread title, first off, I've heard it said once or twice that the Marshal Minor Aura "Motivate Charisma" also increases one's Leadership score by one's Charisma (thus applying it to Leadership twice).

Secondly, I'd like to know if there are LA+1 templates that change your type to Outsider. I'm going to be using Alter Self occassionally, so I'd like to get my hands on the delicious Advespa form.

[D@rK-SePHiRoTH-]

Leadership is a score, not a check. It is not increased by motivate charisma.

[Venusaur]

The neraphim from the planar handbook are +0 LA outsiders.

[Kuulvheysoon]

Ask your DM if you can treat aasimar/tiefling as templates rather than races - why should they strictly be half-human?

[sonofzeal]

Ask your DM if you can treat aasimar/tiefling as templates rather than races - why should they strictly be half-human?
Because there's a bunch of other Planetouched out there for other races, that generally work differently.

[Morph Bark]

The neraphim from the planar handbook are +0 LA outsiders.

Doesn't help, since it's not a template. :/


Because there's a bunch of other Planetouched out there for other races, that generally work differently.

Well, currently he's a human, but he's actually supposed to be a changeling. Human just worked out better for the build as is now.

[DoctorGlock]

Does it have to be a template? The otherworldly feat makes you an outsider without LA.

[Morph Bark]

Does it have to be a template? The otherworldly feat makes you an outsider without LA.

In this particular case, yes, as I'm feat-starved. I will keep it in mind for a Human Factotum build idea I have in mind though. :smallsmile:


Leadership is a score, not a check. It is not increased by motivate charisma.

I checked up on some things, and found that in Stormwrack, the Admiral's Bicorne item grants "a +5 circumstance bonus to Charisma checks (including Leadership)". Other items that grant bonuses to both mention both seperate from each other though.

Are there any other places were Leadership is shoved under Charisma checks?

[Kuulvheysoon]

Does it have to be a template? The otherworldly feat makes you an outsider without LA.

Technically, this only works for certain racial groups (Deep Imaskari, Elves (from Evermeet and Sildeyuir [star elves] only) or Spirit Folk (ashane)), and only in the Realms.

[BerronBrightaxe]

I checked up on some things, and found that in Stormwrack, the Admiral's Bicorne item grants "a +5 circumstance bonus to Charisma checks (including Leadership)". Other items that grant bonuses to both mention both seperate from each other though.

Are there any other places were Leadership is shoved under Charisma checks?

it would make sense to me that you would get the bonus on checks with your cohort or followers (think rally checks or moral checks for your followers). Like D@rk mentioned, it is a score, not a check.
An additional +5 on your leadershipscore would be pretty nice though. I don't have the books at hand, but I don't think the Admiral's Bicorne is supposed to give you a bonus on the score.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

A single level of the Half-Fiend Template Class (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20031010a) would work. You can wait forever (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20030824a) to spend more levels on gaining the rest of the template. It may be worth spending some feats later on Quicken/Maximize Spell-Like Ability for the 3/day Poison, which has a DC based on your Cha bonus and character level.

You could also adapt that to a variant half-fiend (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060630a) based on a fiend with an unusually high Cha score, so the template would grant +8 Cha. In that case, the template class would need to give you +2 Cha per level, which would probably be a more favorable bonus for that +1 LA.

[Battleship789]

To expand on the two questions in the thread title, first off, I've heard it said once or twice that the Marshal Minor Aura "Motivate Charisma" also increases one's Leadership score by one's Charisma (thus applying it to Leadership twice).

Secondly, I'd like to know if there are LA+1 templates that change your type to Outsider. I'm going to be using Alter Self occassionally, so I'd like to get my hands on the delicious Advespa form.

On the second, the template *shudder* Mulhorandi Divine Minion (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a) changes one's type to outsider, and, depending on the wild shape forms you take, is LA +1.

Here is an awesome list for all your template needs: list (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19869266/Master_Template_List).

[Morph Bark]

An additional +5 on your leadershipscore would be pretty nice though. I don't have the books at hand, but I don't think the Admiral's Bicorne is supposed to give you a bonus on the score.

It is, it specifically mentions it.


A humanoid or monstrous humanoid who dons the
admiral’s bicorne gains a +5 bonus on Profession (sailor)
checks and all Charisma-based checks (including Leadership)
as long as it is worn.

Sure, it makes it useless for me now (currently my character is a Fey due to the Unseelie Fey template), but I don't really need the boost as without it my leadership is already over 20. :smalltongue:


On the second, the template *shudder* Mulhorandi Divine Minion (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a) changes one's type to outsider, and, depending on the wild shape forms you take, is LA +1.

Here is an awesome list for all your template needs: list (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19869266/Master_Template_List).

Hm, that could work. Will have to ask my DM, since it's an unapproved source (non-setting-specific and Eberron material are approved, as are a few FR and online things).

Thanks for the list too. Will come in handy!