[PF] Magus and weapon enchantments.

[Doorhandle]

So we all know and possibly love the magus: the archetypical gish-in-a-box, right?

Well, one of the class's lesser-known class-features is the ability to enchant it's weapons by spending arcane-pool points, up to a maximum of 5 at level 20+: 15+ total assuming a 10+ weapon.

So, what kind of enchantments should a magus use on his scimitar? Since almost all magi are crit-fishers due to the way spell-strike works, I think using all the elemental bursts (corrosive, freezing, flaming and shocking burst) and thundering might not be a bad idea, and even better with a kensai who is capable of increasing the crit multiplier of his weapons: 8d10+2d8 damage is not to be sniffed at for things without resistance: although it’s a little expensive at 2 pool-points a pop, so it’s still unoptimised if extremely awesome.

A better idea would be to take the necessary magus arcarnas in order to add the holy/unholy/whatever and bane qualities to your weapon: if you use this as the magus portion of the enhancement, you can adapt it to your foe, and if used with the vicious enchantment you add a total of 6d6 to each attack, which is not oo shabby if you can heal though vicious backlash.

I’ve also heard good things about spell-storing, which basically allows you to spellstrike twice a round, and cast thrice a round if you use a quickened spell.

Another question: what is the highest effective enhancement bonus achievable? I think it can be done easily with a cleric 1-/inquisitor x: taking the rage inquisition for rage and channel smite., while the weapon has to have the furious and grey-flame qualities. Simply use the inquisitor’s bane or greater bane ability, rage, and then channel smite: furious gives 2+ enhancement while ranging, bane gives 2+ enhancement against the right sort of target while grayflame gives another 1+ bonus, for a total enhancement bonus of 9+ assuming the weapon is 5+ nomally, and still leaving 3+ for use in other enchantments like holy and vicious: this combo offering total of 9d6 extra damage on each attack, assuming the inquisitor is using greater bane and ius fighting the right sort of opponent (that poor pit lord.)(which is obscenely hilarious, in my opinion, although an inquisitor needs TWF for more attacks.)

TL:DR: what enchantments should a magus use?
And/or
What is the maximum effective enhancement bonus achievable in pathfinder?

[Keneth]

although it’s a little expensive at 2 pool-points a pop The magus's ability to enchant his weapon only takes 1 arcane point for the entire combination of abilities, so you can get 2 bursts and the keen ability for 1 arcane pool point. The exception are arcanas which require you to expend extra points for additional abilities (such as bane).

Bane + a bunch of bursts (if sporting a high crit range) is probably the way to go if you're gonna focus on damage. But it's not like a magus would desperately need more damage, especially at the point where he can have a +15 weapon.

[Saph]

I usually go for keen as the first enchantment, then dump everything else into enhancement bonus - the reasoning being that the vast majority of the damage on a hit is going to come from the channelled spell (assuming shocking grasp, that's anything from 5d6 basic to 20d6 for an intensified crit) so boosting your to-hit and critical percentage is the most important thing.

I've only played my magus at relatively low levels, though, so the maths might change a bit once you get into the higher-power bands.

[Doorhandle]

The magus's ability to enchant his weapon only takes 1 arcane point for the entire combination of abilities, so you can get 2 bursts and the keen ability for 1 arcane pool point. The exception are arcanas which require you to expend extra points for additional abilities (such as bane).

Bane + a bunch of bursts (if sporting a high crit range) is probably the way to go if you're gonna focus on damage. But it's not like a magus would desperately need more damage, especially at the point where he can have a +15 weapon.

I meant for the crit-maxismising ablity for kensai. And also, moar damage is allways good.

That being said, any other smart buys?

[Keneth]

I've seen some nice mileage from a brilliant energy weapon but it was a city campaign and it's extremely expensive. Holy weapons are always nice when up against a mostly-evil array of enemies. Some of the runeforged weapons are also pretty cool. If you just want cheap extra damage, there's also merciful and vicious.

[watchwood]

Arcane Accuracy and Arcane Strike can both be handy things. Accuracy lets you spend an arcana point to add your int to your attack rolls for a round, and Arcane Strike lets gives you a bonus to your damage for a round at no cost.

[doko239]

Sort of OT, but the Dervish Dance feat seems tailor-made for a Magus; replace Str with Dex for both attack and damage rolls so long as you wield a scimitar in main hand and off hand is empty.

[eggs]

Generally, it's best to avoid the enhancements that require Standard Action activations, such as Flaming, Frost or X Burst, because their short durations foul up the action economy.

[Cieyrin]

Sort of OT, but the Dervish Dance feat seems tailor-made for a Magus; replace Str with Dex for both attack and damage rolls so long as you wield a scimitar in main hand and off hand is empty.

Notice that it requires 2 ranks of Perform(Dance), so you can't actually take it till 3rd, 2nd if you dip Fighter for it or make your first 2 levels Rogue so you can pick it up as your Talent via Combat Trick. So, not as tailor-made as you'd like to think, since you have to muddle through a level or 2 without it.

[watchwood]

Sort of OT, but the Dervish Dance feat seems tailor-made for a Magus; replace Str with Dex for both attack and damage rolls so long as you wield a scimitar in main hand and off hand is empty.

Not to mention the fact that you can save a couple of feats by taking heavy armour and a strength build.

[Cieyrin]

Not to mention the fact that you can save a couple of feats by taking heavy armour and a strength build.

I don't think that's actually any better, I'm just saying that Dervish Dance doesn't kick in as quick as one would like, especially since Weapon Finesse is useless with a Scimitar. Start with a Rapier and transition over to a Scimitar when it comes in and it would work reasonably well, methinks.

[Curious]

Not to mention the fact that you can save a couple of feats by taking heavy armour and a strength build.

Yeah, that actually isn't any better. In fact, if you want to analyze what you gain from Dervish Dance as compared to a Strength build, the Dervish build comes out quite a bit ahead, despite the feats burned.

[Doorhandle]

Can we stay on O.P?

This is about enchantments, not dancing sharp-bladed eastern things.

...That reminds me.
As a standard action, you could enchant pretty much any blade you wish with the dancing quality. Discuss.

[Keneth]

Generally, it's best to avoid the enhancements that require Standard Action activations, such as Flaming, Frost or X Burst, because their short durations foul up the action economy.
Actually, the abilities can manifest activated, since nothing says that they are deactivated by default. Any GM that wants to enforce otherwise is a Richard.


As a standard action, you could enchant pretty much any blade you wish with the dancing quality. Discuss.
Not worth it really, unless you can afford two weapons and need slightly more damage for 4 rounds per combat (you likely won't get to use it more than that).

[Cieyrin]

Actually, the abilities can manifest activated, since nothing says that they are deactivated by default. Any GM that wants to enforce otherwise is a Richard.

That doesn't change the fact that they're Command Word abilities, which by default require a Standard action to activate. Though I suppose the Magus adding the property via their Arcane Pool would probably have the property on, as it would otherwise be kinda stupid. The UM Errata doesn't say anything about it one way or another, so it's open to interpretation. Given the Arcane Pool isn't the standard way for such a thing to happen, I suppose it doesn't necessarily have to follow the same rules as the permanent stuff.


Not worth it really, unless you can afford two weapons and need slightly more damage for 4 rounds per combat (you likely won't get to use it more than that).

Indeed, especially since you can only enchant one weapon at a time via the Arcane Pool (unless there's an Arcana out there to unlock dual-wielding, which I doubt, since that would go against how Spell Combat works). It's not a noticeable increase in damage, especially since it costs you a Swift to grant the ability and a Standard to activate it, unless the above discussion about activating command word abilities being bypassed means you can get around that Standard action activate and can thus get Full Attack alongside Spell Combat. You still run into the problem of TWFers and having to enchant two weapons being cost prohibitive, not to mention I'm not sure whether the Dancing Weapon can use your feats and stats besides your BAB. So it's kind of a toss up and depends on your DM's interpretation of Dancing.

[grarrrg]

Indeed, especially since you can only enchant one weapon at a time via the Arcane Pool (unless there's an Arcana out there to unlock dual-wielding, which I doubt, since that would go against how Spell Combat works)

Spellblade (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/magus/archetypes/paizo---magus-archetypes/spellblade) archetype allows "dual weapon enchant", but you lose the Spellstrike feature (harsh...).

You can sacrifice a Spell, and get a Dagger that:

is considered a weapon the spellblade is holding for purposes of his arcane pool feature (using the pool to add abilities to a held weapon applies to the magus’s physical weapon and to the athame for no additional cost). The athame acts as a dagger, but the hand holding it is still considered free for the purpose of casting spells and delivering touch attacks.

[eggs]

Actually, the abilities can manifest activated, since nothing says that they are deactivated by default. Any GM that wants to enforce otherwise is a Richard.If Flaming flat-out granted +1d6 Fire damage which could be toggled with a standard action, you would be correct. But Flaming ability grants an enhancement whose benefit is an ability which requires a command word to activate. Until that command word is used, the weapon does standard damage.

It's stupid, and should probably be houseruled away, but without houseruling, the enhancement bonuses, Keen and Speed are the big hitters.

[Rubia]

It's stupid, and should probably be houseruled away, but without houseruling, the enhancement bonuses, Keen and Speed are the big hitters.

Well, as long as we're being particular about things, speed is kind of a terrible bonus too.

Why?

Because "speed" kicks in when you use a full-attack action. However, spell combat is a "full-round action that lets you make all of your attacks and cast a spell". These things aren't the same, even though they're functionally equivalent.

Hence, you can't use speed to win either. Basically, the whole class operates under the assumption that your (extremely) limited duration arcane pool buffs work "the way you want them to". It's a poorly-worded ability.

Rubia

[Keneth]

If Flaming flat-out granted +1d6 Fire damage which could be toggled with a standard action, you would be correct. But Flaming ability grants an enhancement whose benefit is an ability which requires a command word to activate. Until that command word is used, the weapon does standard damage. Actually no, the rules don't say anything like that. The weapon deals fire damage on command and it deals normal damage if given another command. These sentences are equivalent and their order in the description is irrelevant. The rules state nowhere whether or not the ability is active to begin with, ruling it one way or the other is both a house rule and the GM's prerogative.

[Rubia]

Actually no, the rules don't say anything like that. The weapon deals fire damage on command and it deals normal damage if given another command.

Here are the relevant quotes:


Activation: Usually a character benefits from a magic weapon in the same way a character benefits from a mundane weapon—by wielding (attacking with) it. If a weapon has a special ability that the user needs to activate, then the user usually needs to utter a command word (a standard action). A character can activate the special abilities of 50 pieces of ammunition at the same time, assuming each piece has identical abilities.



At 5th level, these bonuses can be used to add any of the following weapon properties: dancing, flaming, flaming burst, frost, icy burst, keen, shock, shocking burst, speed, or vorpal.



Upon command, a flaming weapon is sheathed in fire that deals an extra 1d6 points of fire damage on a successful hit. The fire does not harm the wielder. The effect remains until another command is given.

Given this, I'd think it's pretty clear that magic items don't start in "active" form. The reason it's not an issue normally is that there isn't a duration, so you can activate it "once" and it's on forever.

The rules are silent on whether the arcane pool brings up items in the "active" status to begin with, but it strongly suggests that it needs activation. I'd personally rule that it works the way we want it to, but that's not supported by the rules. (It may have been intended, but the rules aren't there to support it.)

Rubia

P.S. When the rules are silent on something, one can't assume that "it works". After all, the rules don't speak to whether I can craft a lightsaber, so clearly I can! :) Don't fall into that trap.