Could someone help me please?

[savanahsboi]

Hi, i signed up to this forum just so i could ask this question, and if able, i need a malleable answer quickly.

I am running a campaign in my home, and we have made it an overpowered campaign, in other words, this is what i did: for my players first 6 levels i gave them 1 stat point to each ability score, after that to level 10 it was 1 ability point per level, and then i stopped that and put them at 1 every four levels like normal. so over all they have an extra 41 ability points and are only level 14 right now, so anyway, with this in mind the point of my campaign is pre-apocalyptic and it is 3.5e.

so with this in mind, could anyone help me come up with the first horseman, (they will fight at level 18, so up one ability point) who can be a great challenge to such overpowered characters, who are also to add more power, homebrew classes and races.

and if possible i need help with all of these as well:

War the first horseman for them at level 18 on his White Horse
Famine the second, for them to fight at level 33 on his red horse
Pestilence the third, for them at level 49 on his black horse
Death the fourth and last for them at level 76 on his pale horse.



if someone can help with AC scores (they can all break around 50 right now) stats, and attacks for them all, i would deeply appreciate it, thank you very much....




Sincerely, The Completely Lost, and probably dumb for running such an OP campaign, DM

[Averis Vol]

what is your parties make up? classes, races, templates, gear etc. i could throw out suggestions all day but if they have a direct counter they'll make war look like a punk, and lets be honest he's kinda badass.

[Titanium Fox]

Honestly, what I generally do is fudge it in scenarios like this. I run for a few rounds, making them miss on average and below average rolls, and as they attack, whittle down the AC to an actual number. For example.

Rogue: I roll a 10, got a... 45 to hit.
DM: That misses. "So that means it has higher than 45 AC..."
Fighter: Alright, I rolled a 19, so I have a 60 to hit.
DM: That hits. "Between 45 and 60 somewhere..."

Etc, etc, using the bounds the players themselves create as the new AC boundaries. As I get a feel for the average Attack Roll of the party as a whole, it'll get into a smaller and smaller boundary, it'll be rather ensured to be a fight at the challenge you're looking for.

I do the same with HP too. If the party can on average blast something that's CR 10 their superior down to 0 in one or two rounds, I just remove the health maximum, and when 'I feel like that should do it', I say they killed the creature.

I also have a very lax and player oriented style of DMing, so that probably has something to do with the fact that the system works for me.

[savanahsboi]

what is your parties make up? classes, races, templates, gear etc. i could throw out suggestions all day but if they have a direct counter they'll make war look like a punk, and lets be honest he's kinda badass.

their is a party of 7.

1. Aurica, Human, Reyvateil Homebrew, 91 hp, overpowered songstress, specialized graphnode crystals given by me the DM
2. Goku, Saiyan, Saiyan Warrior class, 287 HP, way overpowered monk basically, specialized gloves for close combat given by me, to do added electric damage upon impact.
3. Krory, Half-Orc Barbarian/Fighter, 311 HP, str mod of 14, specialized colossal war axe given by me, deals elemental earth and fire dmg.
4. NeNe, Ambico Homebrew race, Shadowrogue homebrew class, 140 HP, specialized wristbands that add dark damage and chance to blind to her shadow strike attacks.
5. Lyner, Human, Revateil Guardian Homebrew class, 276 HP, overpowered, defense based paladin pretty much, given a specialized bastard sword that does 2d10 of dmg + 1d6 of wind dmg.
6. Mizore, Succubi homebrew race, Anime Girl/Shinigami Homebrew classes, 199 HP, specialized hammer from DM's treasure trove does 2d8 of dmg plus 1d6 of gravity and 1d6 water damage.
7. Sookie, Elf, Animal Leader Custom Class, 193 hp, summoner of animals, may use quicken spell to summon more then one, and they still get an atk as soon as summoned, she also has 3 weapons made out of her affinity animals body parts, a whip of tigertail, a tigertongue sword, a tigerfang lance, and a tiger claw bow, all do varying dmg, but eac h has it's own elemental dmg of 1d6 wind dmg.



is that enough info? if not feel free to tell me what else you may need.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

their is a party of 7.

1. Aurica, Human, Reyvateil Homebrew, 91 hp, overpowered songstress, specialized graphnode crystals given by me the DM
2. Goku, Saiyan, Saiyan Warrior class, 287 HP, way overpowered monk basically, specialized gloves for close combat given by me, to do added electric damage upon impact.
3. Krory, Half-Orc Barbarian/Fighter, 311 HP, str mod of 14, specialized colossal war axe given by me, deals elemental earth and fire dmg.
4. NeNe, Ambico Homebrew race, Shadowrogue homebrew class, 140 HP, specialized wristbands that add dark damage and chance to blind to her shadow strike attacks.
5. Lyner, Human, Revateil Guardian Homebrew class, 276 HP, overpowered, defense based paladin pretty much, given a specialized bastard sword that does 2d10 of dmg + 1d6 of wind dmg.
6. Mizore, Succubi homebrew race, Anime Girl/Shinigami Homebrew classes, 199 HP, specialized hammer from DM's treasure trove does 2d8 of dmg plus 1d6 of gravity and 1d6 water damage.
7. Sookie, Elf, Animal Leader Custom Class, 193 hp, summoner of animals, may use quicken spell to summon more then one, and they still get an atk as soon as summoned, she also has 3 weapons made out of her affinity animals body parts, a whip of tigertail, a tigertongue sword, a tigerfang lance, and a tiger claw bow, all do varying dmg, but eac h has it's own elemental dmg of 1d6 wind dmg.



is that enough info? if not feel free to tell me what else you may need.


Since so much is homebrew, this effectively tells us nothing about the characters except for rough ideas of abilities (but not how those work), and HP. We don't know AC, to-hit bonuses, actual ability mechanics, or anything that would really be needed to craft a viable threat.

[Namfuak]

For the horses, you could use a souped up nightmare:
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/nightmare.htm

Just say that they are the color you want, and change the flaming hooves/mane to something more appropriate, like a poison for pestilence.

[Telonius]

What books are available? I don't know of many of the specifics, but apparently there are a few powerful Crusader builds that work well with mounted combat. (I'd suggest this for War). I've heard Valorous weapons (from Unapproachable East, doubles weapon damage on a charge) mentioned quite a bit. Standard Shock Trooper builds would do a ridiculous amount of damage.

For the other three, you're talking really high Epic combat. After level 21 or so (and certainly when you get into the 30s) the whole game kind of goes nuts. At that point it's more of an exercise in "Who's the bigger caster" than any amount of builds or feat combinations.

[danzibr]

2. Goku, Saiyan, Saiyan Warrior class, 287 HP, way overpowered monk basically, specialized gloves for close combat given by me, to do added electric damage upon impact.
Man, I want you to be my DM. Sounds awesome.

As far as being helpful goes, I would do what Titanium Fox suggests, but that's only for survivability. For offense and abilities and whatnot, I would look at the party's AC's and hp and what kind of situations they can handle.

Also, as far as epic (not literally) battles go, the boss totally needs to have more than one form (from WoW I'm reminded of fighting War, then Ruin, then War on Ruin).

Also, with so much homebrew, you can pretty much give War whatever the smurf you want. I'd suggest going to youtube and watching some cool things involving War, then make abilities that'd line up with what looks like is happening.

For example, War is supposed to make people start fighting each other (at least, someone told me this once). I'd probably make a Will save which gets harder every round, and if they fail they berserk for one round, getting a buff to Strength but attack something at random (maybe War, maybe someone else).

[denthor]

Your game is broken start over. They got to have fun playing god type characters now play with only the core rules.

[Particle_Man]

For fun you might slap on the epic version of the pseudonatural template on whatever you use:

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/pseudonaturalCreature.htm

Depends how you want to flavour your 4 horsemen though.

[Titanium Fox]

Your game is broken start over. They got to have fun playing god type characters now play with only the core rules.

...No. If this is what he and his players want to play, they have every right and reason to do so. Just because something is astronomical in power level doesn't mean it's not fun, or possible to stat even.

Also "play with only the core rules"? The other splashbooks were created for a reason. He can use splashbooks, or homebrew if he wants to.

[danzibr]

Your game is broken start over. They got to have fun playing god type characters now play with only the core rules.
Yeah, this comment is uncalled for (and the thread is called "Could someone help me please?" Not whatever you're doing).

...No. If this is what he and his players want to play, they have every right and reason to do so. Just because something is astronomical in power level doesn't mean it's not fun, or possible to stat even.

Also "play with only the core rules"? The other splashbooks were created for a reason. He can use splashbooks, or homebrew if he wants to.
Agreed again. D&D is a game, and hence about fun. If people like having really high stats and can still enjoy the game, by all means.

[Particle_Man]

Other things you can mine for useful high-powered bad guys:

Epic Level Handbook (most monsters are in the SRD but there are a few ungodly powerful Slaadi that are not).

Elder Evils (usually for "end of the world" stuff, but can be useful for ideas: "Something just ate the sun. Roll for initiative."

[Yorrin]

Since you're so comfortable with homebrew on your PCs why not have it on your BBEGs?

War could be something relatively simple, methinks, compared to the others. Attack rolls high enough that he hits your most heavily armored PC 75% of the time, AC so that your average party member hits 50% of the time. Toss in some damage reduction (DR 20/-, for example). Gage how much damage your party puts out on him (after accounting for party accuracy and his DR) and calculate his HP off of how long you want the fight to last. Mount=Wartrained Pegasus with advanced HD and huge HP regen.

Vampire. Grapple mod through the roof and a custom ability to use his blood drain ability as a free action after a successful grapple check. Also make this restore a lot more HP than a normal blood drain. Toss in a huge amount of natural armor, DR, and a decent amount of hp regen. Add some blend-into-shadows thing (like a shadow mastiff) and the ability to go incorporeal during movement and not provoke AOs for movement (like that phase spider soulmeld), and just generally make him hard to hit- jumping/flying around the battlefield, sticking to the shadows. Attacking only when he has clear advantage. Mount will be some sort of Feindish Dire Wolf or Dire Bat with a fire breath attack and a bunch of HP that will "tank" for him, draw aggro, distract the party, etc. while he does his dodgy shadows thing.

Pestilence: Fun with diseases! There's a couple of ways to go here, but a powerful debuff aura is a good starting place. Something that lowers PC saving throws to garbage levels. Toss in a bunch of minions with attacks that have rider effects/poison, including exploding upon death to inflict some terrible disease. I'll leave the details up to your imagination. Mount would be a Monstrous Centipede/Scorpion, of course advanced and templated into oblivion.

Ah Death. This is a tough one. You'll want him to have a massive list of immunities, obviously. And lots of HP regen. Seeing as how this is obviously going to be a "final fight," having regen that can only be overcome be a specific artifact(s) has a classic feel to it. In terms of offensive capabilities, something along the lines of a heightened "finger of death" spell (without the [Death] tag so as to avoid immunities) is a good place to start. Make it a touch attack, and give it a recharge time like a dragon's breath weapon, so as to limit the carnage. Besides this, I'd say either a souped-up hand to hand combat or the classic scythe wielding for between death attacks. Keep it simple and classy, as death should be. As for his mount- nothing says "death" like a dragon. Make it skeletal, massively advanced, and with a breath weapon that makes the PCs more susceptible to the death touch of his rider, in addition to some sort of powerful disabling (blinded + deafened is always a fun combo, and add in that wile under these effects PCs take some damage every round, if you must). Then have some incorporeal minions rising from the ground each round (several on the first round, only one or two each round thereafter, adjusting as needed to keep the PCs occupied).


If you dont want to make up stats so much, or even if you're just looking for some inspiration, I'd check out BoVD. War=Disciple of Dispater, Pestilence=Thrall of Jubilex etc. Also, I've written this assuming a relatively low-mid level of optimization (by this board's standards. High stats is by no stretch optimized). If your players are playing the equivalent of batman wizards, CoDzilla, and the Mailman then feed them their own medicine. War=Sorcerer, Famine=Cleric, Pestilence=Druid, Death=Wizard, optimized to flavor.

Just for kicks, I'll toss in my build for death in my campaign world. He's a gestalt Fighter 60|Spellcasting Swordsage 60 with Divine Rank 16. Skeletal human who wears a blood red tuxedo and bowler hat. Wields a scythe in combat for style, though his +1200ish to hit (always vs touch AC) and his ~5k damage (with a rider Fort DC=damage dealt vs utter destruction) makes this his default "no brains required" tactic until he faces worthy foes. As it's all RAW. The Fighter levels are actually primarily there for the bonus Epic Feats, since the spellcasting swordsage levels cover all of what he actually needs to be doing in combat. It should be noted that my players are mostly on the low end of mid optimization, so he has proven more than insurmountable to them thus far (thought they admittedly only faced him once and were level 24 at the time. But not being able to land a hit, much less being able to survive one, was a pretty clear indication).

[savanahsboi]

Since so much is homebrew, this effectively tells us nothing about the characters except for rough ideas of abilities (but not how those work), and HP. We don't know AC, to-hit bonuses, actual ability mechanics, or anything that would really be needed to craft a viable threat.

okay, i gathered up their sheets to give you more info.

1. Aurica. The Reyvateil. She has to maintain distance from enemies to use her songs which are spell like abilities, she has a song for every type of elemental damage, plus healing spells, it takes a swift action to store a song, and a standard action to release it at first level with base effects and dmg. AC = 12 feats include armored casting, improved initiative, greater initiative, look harmless(adds to bluff) fortunes favor(once a day may reroll one roll) movement of 40, also has hymns to protect against Thunder, Flame, and cold dmg. max heal on the heal song right now is 36 hp. gives a +2 to all of the reyvateil guardian's stats, as long as he is within 10 ft. element is Light (does holy dmg with touch atks) mods are str - 1 dex - 6 con - 1 int - 9 wis - 8 cha - 11

2. Lyner, The Reyvateil guardian. Made to protect and serve the reyvateil, has no element in my campaign. is always within 10 ft of Aurica unless not able to, AC = 24 mods are str - 8 dex - 6 con - 8 int - 4 wis - 6 cha- 6 has guard abilities for the reyvateil, may take half dmg for her, later on he learns to take full dmg for her, and right now, whenever anything would atk her, he gets an atk of opportunity against it if within 15 ft of her, movement of 30, and he can take up a defensive stance by her, any atks on her must break his AC instead of hers, and he takes half dmg. feats include shield bash, improved shield bash and other palaidn/barbarian type of feats.

3. NeNe. The Shadow Rogue, a souped up rogue, with amazing abilities while hidden. mods are str - 7 dex - 12 con -5 int - 4 wis - 3 cha - 6 AC of 22, has the shadow strike ability, at long range (30 ft) she may atk from the shadows with a blade of light, counts as a sneak atk if hidden, deals 5d8, or shadow claw, which is the close range version if that atk, deals 5d8 as well, both have 7 uses a day. she has shadow step, and improved shadow step, shadow step lets her use a full round action to jump into someones shadow, and if they move, she's stuck in the shadow and follows them, improved shadowstep it takes only a move action to jump to a shadow, for this i have her roll a hide check, but no move silently check as it counts as a teleportation move, movement speed of 45, feats include weapon finesse, dash, great speed, s wpn fighting, improved 2 wpn fighting, mobility, spring atk, point blank shot, precise shot, and rapid shot. she is very sneaky, and almost never seen during combat, unless she fails a hide check, (which i've been having to raise the DC on because her hide is 19 before rolling. 7 ranks and 12 dex mod. so killing her is hard, simply put, lol. her and the saiyan, goku, are going to be the hardest to kill next to aurica, but aurica only because of her advanced protection. she has my dark element. and can cause blind on her hits, based on a percentile roll.

4. Sookie, The animal leader. at level one she had to pick an animal to have an affinity with, she piocked sivberian tiger, so she can have a siberian tiger travel with her at all times, and enter combat riding it, and use mounted combat, and she is unaffected by the increase to spell level of her first metamagic feat, so we gave her quicken spell, so she can summon 2 animals to fight by her side each turn, as a full round action. all of these summoned animals atk on her turn, along with her and her mount able to atk as well, right now her max of summons at one time is 6. mods are str - 7 dex - 7 con - 7 int - 5 wis - 6 cha - 6. she can take a round action to shift into her affinite animal as well, and fight as that giving her strength and dex bonuses as a tiger, but cannot be mounted to do so, AC = 22 feats are quicken spell, augment summoning, spell focus(conjuration) combat reflexes, mounted combat, ride-by attack, leadership, spirited charge, and 2hndd wpn proficiency. she is the numbers in their combat, for when they go to war against the armies of the four horsemen in my story. she has my wind element in my campaign.

5. Goku, the saiyan warrior. basically an Overpowered monk, he has fury of blows, can do 3 melee atks per standard action because of BAB, AC=24 mods are str - 10 dex - 8 con - 8 wis - 5 int - 5 cha - 6 can go super saiyan, adds +4 mod to each strength and dex, and plus 20 base speed, base speed is 100, can fly flight speed is 120. kai volley takes up 2 ki points (he has about 250 points) does 4d6 of dmg, has the electric element in my campaign, kamehamea wave ranged touch atk, 1d20 plus 1d10 dmg, and if charged for a turn, also adds a d12 of dmg, feats are toughness &improved toughness. ying yang, he cant remember what that does though, evasion(reflex saves for 0 dmg instead of 1/2) spirit bomb ( charge for 1d4 of rounds 50 percent chance of killing, other 50 percent will cut life in half. not happening against bosses)

6. Mizore, the anime girl shinigami water and gravity element, she is a succubi and can fly, stats r str - 7 dex - 5 con - 4 wis - 1 int - 7 cha - 9. AC = 22
movement spd 60 in air - 30. feats are quick draw, special abilities include energy drain, cosplay (can change characters) wouldn't hurt a girl (shows some skin, and enemys are less likely to attempt an atk on him) hammerspace (same as bag of holding) detect good, detect sin, megaton punch (hit with hammer and knock opponents back) spirit form (can exit body and fight as a spirit, body becomes prone, and unable to do anything) charm monster.

7. krory the barbarian fighter, mods are str - 12 dex - 5 con - 9 wis -4 int - 1 cha - 6 has all the good stuff of barbarians, and can fight with no weapons from his one level in fighter, has two ahnded weapon and improved two handed weapon, has toughness and improved toughness, he is the largest tank in the group, he is also the largest creature there being a half orc, or ogre, whatever this says here, lol. his abilities are that of a level 13 barbarian. has the fire element

okay, that's them. keep in mind, i don't want to kill them, i want to challenge them ,because when they fight 7 wyrmling red dragons at 115 hp a piece, and win in 3 or 4 rounds, i go crazy lol, but they really like their characters and have ALOT of fun, and that's what counts, but they have mentioned wanting an actual challenge in combat, and not to just be challenged by my puzzles in this dungeon, which are nightmares, and i'm running out of ideas for puzzles as well lol, if anyone has any ideas, it's one of their fav parts of the campaign is a challenging puzzle every now and again so i'd like to keep giving them that, so far their puzzles have involved the riddle of the sphinx, and a few word puzzles where the words were scrambled and they had to correct them, and say the phrase, or figure out which element to use at which times and stuff like that....

anyways, if this enough (i hope so lol) i'd like to fight war, and his horse tomorrows session. thank you all for your help. i deeply appreciate it as a confused DM lol.

[savanahsboi]

Since you're so comfortable with homebrew on your PCs why not have it on your BBEGs?

War could be something relatively simple, methinks, compared to the others. Attack rolls high enough that he hits your most heavily armored PC 75% of the time, AC so that your average party member hits 50% of the time. Toss in some damage reduction (DR 20/-, for example). Gage how much damage your party puts out on him (after accounting for party accuracy and his DR) and calculate his HP off of how long you want the fight to last. Mount=Wartrained Pegasus with advanced HD and huge HP regen.

Vampire. Grapple mod through the roof and a custom ability to use his blood drain ability as a free action after a successful grapple check. Also make this restore a lot more HP than a normal blood drain. Toss in a huge amount of natural armor, DR, and a decent amount of hp regen. Add some blend-into-shadows thing (like a shadow mastiff) and the ability to go incorporeal during movement and not provoke AOs for movement (like that phase spider soulmeld), and just generally make him hard to hit- jumping/flying around the battlefield, sticking to the shadows. Attacking only when he has clear advantage. Mount will be some sort of Feindish Dire Wolf or Dire Bat with a fire breath attack and a bunch of HP that will "tank" for him, draw aggro, distract the party, etc. while he does his dodgy shadows thing.

Pestilence: Fun with diseases! There's a couple of ways to go here, but a powerful debuff aura is a good starting place. Something that lowers PC saving throws to garbage levels. Toss in a bunch of minions with attacks that have rider effects/poison, including exploding upon death to inflict some terrible disease. I'll leave the details up to your imagination. Mount would be a Monstrous Centipede/Scorpion, of course advanced and templated into oblivion.

Ah Death. This is a tough one. You'll want him to have a massive list of immunities, obviously. And lots of HP regen. Seeing as how this is obviously going to be a "final fight," having regen that can only be overcome be a specific artifact(s) has a classic feel to it. In terms of offensive capabilities, something along the lines of a heightened "finger of death" spell (without the [Death] tag so as to avoid immunities) is a good place to start. Make it a touch attack, and give it a recharge time like a dragon's breath weapon, so as to limit the carnage. Besides this, I'd say either a souped-up hand to hand combat or the classic scythe wielding for between death attacks. Keep it simple and classy, as death should be. As for his mount- nothing says "death" like a dragon. Make it skeletal, massively advanced, and with a breath weapon that makes the PCs more susceptible to the death touch of his rider, in addition to some sort of powerful disabling (blinded + deafened is always a fun combo, and add in that wile under these effects PCs take some damage every round, if you must). Then have some incorporeal minions rising from the ground each round (several on the first round, only one or two each round thereafter, adjusting as needed to keep the PCs occupied).


If you dont want to make up stats so much, or even if you're just looking for some inspiration, I'd check out BoVD. War=Disciple of Dispater, Pestilence=Thrall of Jubilex etc. Also, I've written this assuming a relatively low-mid level of optimization (by this board's standards. High stats is by no stretch optimized). If your players are playing the equivalent of batman wizards, CoDzilla, and the Mailman then feed them their own medicine. War=Sorcerer, Famine=Cleric, Pestilence=Druid, Death=Wizard, optimized to flavor.

Just for kicks, I'll toss in my build for death in my campaign world. He's a gestalt Fighter 60|Spellcasting Swordsage 60 with Divine Rank 16. Skeletal human who wears a blood red tuxedo and bowler hat. Wields a scythe in combat for style, though his +1200ish to hit (always vs touch AC) and his ~5k damage (with a rider Fort DC=damage dealt vs utter destruction) makes this his default "no brains required" tactic until he faces worthy foes. As it's all RAW. The Fighter levels are actually primarily there for the bonus Epic Feats, since the spellcasting swordsage levels cover all of what he actually needs to be doing in combat. It should be noted that my players are mostly on the low end of mid optimization, so he has proven more than insurmountable to them thus far (thought they admittedly only faced him once and were level 24 at the time. But not being able to land a hit, much less being able to survive one, was a pretty clear indication).


OMg, i love your ideas my friend, i will definitely be utilizing those ideas, thank you so much.thats almost exactly what i was looking for...

[Yorrin]

OMg, i love your ideas my friend, i will definitely be utilizing those ideas, thank you so much.thats almost exactly what i was looking for...

You're quite welcome :smallsmile: I hope you have fun!

[Averis Vol]

okay, so thats all a bit much. what i think would fit for fluff is to make him a deathknight from the MMII(?) and maybe do something like crusader/blackguard (blackguard's mostly fluff, you'de be much better off with just crusader) and don't forget that war is an amazing tactician, so have him send in his horde of minions and plunk away with a bow from atop his nightmare and occasionally charging in to hit with his greatsword. once his undead are gone have him meet the party with fly-by attacks when they are presumably weakened. one thing i am noticing, your party has very low AC so a lvl 18ish creature could hit them on a 2 easily, they might want to work on that a bit. other then that just make sure to read up on the horseman if you haven't already, because they all have a very specific niche they they fill, war's a commander and will therefore be a challenge in melee, pestillence should stay at a range and send waves of disease at them, death should be a combination of the above two, maybe using some supernatural fire or something along with his scythe, and famine should just debuff the hell out of the PC's as he was no more then the embodiment of, well, famine. make him a battle sorcerer or some such.

[danzibr]

Can you link the Goku character's homebrew? Looks interesting.

[savanahsboi]

the race is: http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Saiyans_(3.5e_Race)
the class is: http://dnd-wiki.org/wiki/Saiyan_Warrior_(3.5e_Class)

[Jodah]

Pestilence = vermin lord, maybe? You can get ridiculous casting with the hivemind and you can send tons of beasties against them - and by killing the vermin they will weaken the caster.

Only productive thought that I have, apart from the overpowered nature sounding like a ton of fun for a quick campaign to play one of these days.

[savanahsboi]

Alright guys, i finished War's creation. this is what i have, so let me know your opinions before tomorrow if possible, i think it will be an amazing fight, they are going to finally get out of the dungeon they are in, and find total warfare all around them, and War at the center of it hacking humans and dwarves, and elves, and everything else to pieces, cities burning in the background...


War's Sheet:

Race: Armageddon Demon
Class: Heavy Blade-Master Lvl 20
HD: 1d20
Class Skill Points: 214
Strength: 53/26
Dexterity: 34/12
Constitution: 39/14
Intelligence: 26/8
Wisdom: 26/8
Charisma: 26/8

The class gives a bonus to strength almost every 2 lvls as +2 I leveled him up the same way i had them lvl up, if this proves challenging enough, i'll do the same for the other 3.

HP: 609
Initiative Roll D20 + Dex + Improved Initiative Feat (+4)

Reflex: 21 (9+12)
Fortitude: 26 (12+14)
Will: 14 (6+8)

Spell resist 20
Dmg Reduct. 10

AC: 45 (15(Armor) + 12(DEX) +7(Miscellaneous)
Flatfooted: 33 (Above - DEX)
Touch ATKs: 30

Skills:
24 Balance
38 Climb
20 Craft
20 Intimidate
38 Jump
24 Ride
20 Survival
38 Swim
24 Tumble
24 Use Rope

Armor:

Custom Masterworked DragonScale Armor: +15 AC Max DEX 12 Check: -5 65% Spell Failure

B.A.B.: 20/15/10/5

Total ATK roll Mods: 46/41/36/31

Weapon: War's Great Sword: DMG: 3d10 + 4 Crit: 18-20x3 Range: 15 Ft.

Speed:
30, 60, 90, 120

Languages:
Common, Abyssal.

Feats:
Bigger Is Better
Toughness
Weapon Focus Great Sword
Keen (Higher chance on called shots hitting)
Dragon Grip
Uncanny Dodge
Fast Movement
Improved Weapon Focus Great Sword
Greater Weapon Specialization Great Sword
Improved Uncanny Dodge
Improved Toughness
Supreme Cleave
Mounted Combat
Ride-By Attack
Spirited Charge
Leadership

Mount: Red Nightmare. lvl 15

ATKS: +23 Melee Stomp: 2d10 20x2 crit, 10 ft rng. 2d6 fire.......... double stomp: 2d10 each hit, 20x3 crit, 15 ft. rng, 2d6 fire each hit.......... bite, 2d12 dmg, 20x3 crit, 5 ft rng, 2d6 fire.

Mods:
str: 9
dex: 13
con: 10
int: 1
wis: 3
cha: 4

HP: 300

speed:
60, 120, 180, 240


let me know A.S.A.P as the fight happens tomorrow... Thank you lots...

[Averis Vol]

look at war, then look at your partys AC, now back to war, in the time it took you to do that your parties dead. seriously he doesnt even need power attack to DESTROY your party with a reach of 15 Ft. 3d10 dmg at an 18-20/x3 crit and spirited charge. unless they have some way to protect themselves he can hit the highest AC member on a 1 with the -10 if it wasn't an auto fail.

and thats not including the mount that can hit the highest AC member on a 2, plus the fact that it looks as if your party lacks healing.

[savanahsboi]

the healing, i was wrong about, my reyvateil told me she can actually heal 110 per turn, and the animal leader can muster up a healing spell of 120...

also my plan was to have him defeat them the first time, cuz right now they're only level 14, he's 20, i wanted them to actually fight, and beat him when they reached 18... does that make it more reasonable?

[danzibr]

the healing, i was wrong about, my reyvateil told me she can actually heal 110 per turn, and the animal leader can muster up a healing spell of 120...

also my plan was to have him defeat them the first time, cuz right now they're only level 14, he's 20, i wanted them to actually fight, and beat him when they reached 18... does that make it more reasonable?
Yeah... but it should be *possible* to beat him. Unless you've already talked to your party about it. Or, well, maybe not, but I don't find scripted battles where you have to lose very fun. Hm, tough call.

EDIT: Oh, and thanks for linking the Saiyan stuff.

As for War (sorry, forgot to talk about him), are you going to do the multi-stage fight thing? Also, I think it's pretty baddonkey he has a gigantic sword with a reach of 15 feet, but that might destroy people as they move in to attack him.

EDIT EDIT: And what's the damage reduction? Just 10/-?

[savanahsboi]

yes it will be multi staged, i liked that idea, and i have one particularly trusted character (my gf) who has promised to put the thought into other players heads when they complain about the extremity that maybe they arent supposed to win, so hopefully as painless as possible for me and them, lol, cuz 3 of my characters are whiney alot lol (my gf's brother, and her uncle and my gf's sister) but anyway, and when they are actually supposed to fight him, i planned on dumping him a bit, but for now his crit is gonna be 11-20 and his hp is infinite, cuz there's a chance, as i was reminded by my gf, that they could still defeat him easily with those stats, if health weren't infinite, but so far, i'll watch my players and see what happens, and decide from there whether to upgrade him more, or downgrade him... sound like a plan?

[Averis Vol]

oh thats great, that kind of damage with relatively little healing could have been bad (unless she could do it every round without fail for the whole fight) but yea, if shes dedicated to healing then it should be fine. i second the talking to them about killing them first, if they don't know ahead of time they could be a little hurt about it.

[savanahsboi]

the battle against war the first time went very well, noone was hurt by being demolished, and a player wanted to make a new character anyway so he had the chance to ask for his character to die during the conflict, the real battle with him is coming up this saturday