Animal that Represents A Paladin?

[USS Sorceror]

People in my campaign please don't read.

Hey Playground. So one of my players was wanting to take levels in the Bear Warrior prestige class, which allows him to assume the shape of a bear while raging. My only problem with this is that there is no precedent for him using a bear as a totem animal or learning how to transform into a bear. I'm allowing it, but only after he meets someone who can teach him how to get in touch with his inner bear.

This got me to thinking: I don't want the other party members to be left out while he's undergoing this training, so the person who trains him could look into them and see what animals might represent their abilities/personalities. I've got ideas for most of them, but the one I'm having most trouble with is my paladin of Heironeous. What animal do you think would represent someone who craves justice (and in the case of this character, personal vengeance) against wrongdoers?

[navar100]

phoenix
lion
eagle
griffon
horse

[Otomodachi]

I would suggest a dog or an elephant.

[INoKnowNames]

I think I'd probably second the Noble Lion... so long as you don't remember the horrible things Lions do...

[Answerer]

Lion in general was my thought, that or a Stallion.

[Flickerdart]

I'd go with Hound.

[Prime32]

To go an alternate route...
Turning into a bear makes him bigger and stronger, and gives him claws. No reason you have to actually describe it as turning into a bear. Maybe he's surrounded by an aura which he can extend into blades. Maybe he enters a warp spasm. Maybe he taps into demonic heritage. Could be anything.

[Ravens_cry]

I'd go with Hound.
Indeed, the hound was my thought as well.
Steadfast, faithful, loyal.
Sounds about right (http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs51/f/2009/298/9/6/Hound_Archon_for_Paizo_by_MichaelJaecks.jpg).

[doko239]

Alternatively, you could seize the opportunity for some comedy and say he's an Ostrich or something... :smallamused:


Seriously though, I'd say either Lion, Phoenix, Mouse or Swan

[Epsilon Rose]

I'd go with a Unicorn (that horn is meant for goring and it would be unusual) or perhaps a dragon (little says "Be ware wrongdoers!" quite like an angry golden dragon, besides, dragons are fun).

[Zale]

A Flamingo.

I mean, Charisma To All Saves man! :smallwink:

[deuxhero]

I don't know about Paladins, but the animal that best represents a wizard is the Human, the world's most dangerous animal.

[wadledo]

I would second some sort of Eagle.

Also, I have a preference to Bulls.

[Darth Stabber]

I'd go with a Unicorn (that horn is meant for goring and it would be unusual) or perhaps a dragon (little says "Be ware wrongdoers!" quite like an angry golden dragon, besides, dragons are fun).

Unicorns are Chaotic Good.

After a quick look through the SRD for LG critters that are not Dragons nor Outsiders.
Blink Dogs are LG, as are Lammasu. And as far as animals go, werebears are LG, just some food for thought from the SRD.

This leads me to believe that some form of canid would be ideal, given that LG has both blinkdogs and hound archons, and dogs are known through out literature and folk lore as obedient, dedicated, loyal, and self sacrificing, which are values that any LG character should aspire too.

[lothlirial]

I agree on an eagle. Things like lions are seen as vicious predators as often as noble creatures, but eagles are always very noble, but certainly not wimpy. Think of Tolkein's eagles. Nobody can contest with that :smallwink:

[navar100]

I agree on an eagle. Things like lions are seen as vicious predators as often as noble creatures, but eagles are always very noble, but certainly not wimpy. Think of Tolkein's eagles. Nobody can contest with that :smallwink:

Compromise.

Griffon

:smallcool:

[Darth Stabber]

Compromise.

Griffon

:smallcool:

Griffons are smart enough to have a non-neutral alignment, and yet they don't.

[Azernak0]

Hmm, I actually going to say "Bear" for a Paladin.

Why? Because Lycanthropes embody the alignment of the animal they are and Werebears are "Always Lawful Good."

From a "Not everyone uses DnD Logic" point of view, I'm going to go with what everyone has already said; the lion. There is just so much lion iconography in fantasy and the world that is usually used to show steadfastness and honor.

[The-Mage-King]

To go an alternate route...
Turning into a bear makes him bigger and stronger, and gives him claws. No reason you have to actually describe it as turning into a bear. Maybe he's surrounded by an aura which he can extend into blades. Maybe he enters a warp spasm. Maybe he taps into demonic heritage. Could be anything.


I approve of the bolded idea. It makes sense. *nod, nod*


If you must go with the totem animal thing, I'd suggest something... Well, typical. Noble lion would work. Or hound.

[Particle_Man]

If you don't mind a "non-animal" animal choice, how about the bee? They are willing to die for their Queen, even! :)

[Eisenfavl]

Bear, again.
Afterall, were-bears are Lawful Good.

[Bhaakon]

The noble zebra, for, like a paladin, it only sees only black and white in all its companions.

[gomipile]

Celestial Badger :smallbiggrin:

[Red_Dog]

Griffons are smart enough to have a non-neutral alignment, and yet they don't.

This quote is a great start for my day. Thank you sir ^^

On topic=> Entirely depends on what kind of paladin you are. Even if you are lawful good, you might be a gray guard which changes things a lot.

I really can't even suggest anything, because "association games" are heavily rooted in psychological stuff and therefore highly personal thing.

A hound is a good one for a generic paladin or even gray guard[loyalty to the cause/master].

For gray guard exclusively I would go with something very loyal until death. A lot of mammals fit this description when it comes to their offsprings. Perhaps start there?0_o

Or an animal akin to do dirty work, because that's what you have to do? a Work horse as opposed to warhorse for example. Perhaps a bull?

[Dusk Eclipse]

Unicorns are Chaotic Good.

After a quick look through the SRD for LG critters that are not Dragons nor Outsiders.
Blink Dogs are LG, as are Lammasu. And as far as animals go, werebears are LG, just some food for thought from the SRD.

This leads me to believe that some form of canid would be ideal, given that LG has both blinkdogs and hound archons, and dogs are known through out literature and folk lore as obedient, dedicated, loyal, and self sacrificing, which are values that any LG character should aspire too.

Yet were wolves are CE, and with the pack mentality associated with wolves, one could argue for Lawfulness at least ( I am not implying that chaos can't work well in groups; but I tend to think about is as a more Lawful thing)

[endoperez]

This got me to thinking: I don't want the other party members to be left out while he's undergoing this training, so the person who trains him could look into them and see what animals might represent their abilities/personalities. I've got ideas for most of them, but the one I'm having most trouble with is my paladin of Heironeous. What animal do you think would represent someone who craves justice (and in the case of this character, personal vengeance) against wrongdoers?

I looked from some inspiration in heraldric symbolism, from here (http://www.scottish-wedding-dreams.com/heraldic-animals.html) and wikipedia.

Dogs have already been suggested, but what about a hunting dog, specifically?
Talbot [hunting dog of quick pursuit and eager pursuit] ~ courage, vigilance and loyal fidelity.

That could work rather well.

"The wolf was also considered a noble and courageous animal, and frequently appeared on the Arms and crests of numerous noble families. It typically symbolised the rewards of perseverance in long sieges or hard industry."

Noble and courageous. If his goals of justice are long-term goals, perseverance also fits.

Bear is "interpreted as symbolizing strength, cunning and ferocity in the protection of one's kindred." Might work.

[USS Sorceror]

Wow this got a lot more responses than I thought it would.

Thanks to everyone so far, though a few minor things that I didn't mention before because I hadn't thought of them yet.

No fantastic animals (though I think dragon might be acceptable). I was thinking of having the trainer be heavily influenced by the whole "vision quest" thing of Native Americans, so I'd like any suggestions of nonmagical creatures.

Dog and lion both seem to be very good suggestions (and a brief discussion with the player, who didn't know what I was getting at when I asked what animal would his paladin be revealed he too thinks dog). Thanks to everyone.

I suppose I could ask what other animals my party would be, as I am having difficulty with them. I have a couple, as I said, and I'd like to know what you think.

Wizard-More utilitarian, likes to think his way out of problems-Coyote (traditional trickster) or Raven or Magpie (a very crafty bird)
Bard-musical buffoon (kinda like Elan but somehow less intelligent)-Ape (more specifically Chimpanzee)
Ranger/Rogue-Character's personality isn't developed much, but so far I have that she is quiet but very vocal on issues that relate to her. She is also willing to help anyone if she thinks they need it.

[USS Sorceror]

To go an alternate route...
Turning into a bear makes him bigger and stronger, and gives him claws. No reason you have to actually describe it as turning into a bear. Maybe he's surrounded by an aura which he can extend into blades. Maybe he enters a warp spasm. Maybe he taps into demonic heritage. Could be anything.

I really do like this idea, but my player likes the idea of being able to turn into a bear too much to rework the fluff.

[King Atticus]

For a Pali I think a bull is just about right on, especially if you look at it from an astrological perspective (Taurus (http://www.astrology-online.com/taurus.htm)).

I'm not generally one that buys in to star signs but quite a bit about this says Paladin to me.

[Doomboy911]

A donkey. Stubborn but hard working.

[Zale]

If you don't mind a "non-animal" animal choice, how about the bee? They are willing to die for their Queen, even! :)

I can totally see that. Of course, I doubt shapeshifting into a bee would be very impressive. Unless the BBEG is allergic.

[Flickerdart]

Shapeshifting into a swarm of bees, though?

[Zale]

Useful, but It would make wind annoying as hell.

[deuxhero]

I can totally see that. Of course, I doubt shapeshifting into a bee would be very impressive. Unless the BBEG is allergic.

Bees, my god.

[Telonius]

Dr. Benjamin Franklin: The turkey.
John Adams: The eagle is a majestic bird!
Dr. Benjamin Franklin: The eagle is a scavenger, a thief and coward. A symbol of over ten centuries of European mischief.
John Adams: [confused] The turkey?
Dr. Benjamin Franklin: A truly noble bird. Native American, a source of sustenance to our original settlers, and an incredibly brave fellow who wouldn't flinch from attacking a whole regiment of Englishmen single-handedly!

Plus, in its most delicious form, it comes with stuffing. Perfectly symbolic of a Paladin. :smallbiggrin:

[Toy Killer]

For some reason, Lion jumped out at me, but I was shocked no one said Tortoise. Bear with me here, you take a paladin as the warrior of the ideology of the holy campaign, slow, unhindered progressive movement. Paladin's take up the helm of faith, knowing they will never truly rid the world of evil, but don armor knowing they will make the slightest difference with each dawn and anything that will crack through the layers of protection they bear will only find that the spirit of the champion is still marching forward.

I say tortoise is a fine second option.

[Tvtyrant]

Lemmings!!

[deuxhero]

How about that insect that pretends to be a stick, because Paladins have...

[Dalek-K]

People in my campaign please don't read.

Hey Playground. So one of my players was wanting to take levels in the Bear Warrior prestige class, which allows him to assume the shape of a bear while raging. My only problem with this is that there is no precedent for him using a bear as a totem animal or learning how to transform into a bear. I'm allowing it, but only after he meets someone who can teach him how to get in touch with his inner bear.

This got me to thinking: I don't want the other party members to be left out while he's undergoing this training, so the person who trains him could look into them and see what animals might represent their abilities/personalities. I've got ideas for most of them, but the one I'm having most trouble with is my paladin of Heironeous. What animal do you think would represent someone who craves justice (and in the case of this character, personal vengeance) against wrongdoers?


Rhino... Seriously... Charging into the fray of battles with his weapon out in front, unstoppable and committed to the fight.

[HunterOfJello]

Gold Dragon.



~
Actually, wait. Gold dragons are really smart. Okay, a retarded gold dragon.

[Doomboy911]

I was thinking the tortoise earlier but I still recommend the donkey.

[Acanous]

Whale.
Dolphins are C/G. Whales are L/G. They protect eachother, don't flinch, and are giant meat shields made of HP.

[Dancingdeath]

In 2e, Blink Dogs were popular with Paladins. Thematically and traditionally it fits. I'd go with that.

[Coventry]

I am surprised that no one has mentioned the Noble Stag:

Hunted by a king, but rescues that same king from certain death during the hunt.

(see also: Bambi's father, the Prince of the Forest).

[avr]

I suppose I could ask what other animals my party would be, as I am having difficulty with them. I have a couple, as I said, and I'd like to know what you think.

Wizard-More utilitarian, likes to think his way out of problems-Coyote (traditional trickster) or Raven or Magpie (a very crafty bird)
Bard-musical buffoon (kinda like Elan but somehow less intelligent)-Ape (more specifically Chimpanzee)
Ranger/Rogue-Character's personality isn't developed much, but so far I have that she is quiet but very vocal on issues that relate to her. She is also willing to help anyone if she thinks they need it.
Thinking your way out of problems might suggest an owl or possibly a snake. Despite being really stupid snakes have a lot of mythical links with wisdom. Magpies might be more closely associated with the bard/buffoon, I think Katherine Kerr made exactly that association in one of her books a while back.

Your ranger sounds like a perfect match for a wolf 'totem' or whatever.

[Sugashane]

Brutally strong (Barbarian, Fighter)- Bear
Strong but agile (monk) - Ape
Sneaky (Rogue)- Snake
Ranged specialist- Any bird or lard bird
Very fast (Ddex based monk)- Cheetah
Grappler - Crocodile
Paladin - White Tiger

[deuxhero]

Whale.
Dolphins are C/G. Whales are L/G. They protect eachother, don't flinch, and are giant meat shields made of HP.

I thought Dolphins were Chaotic Evil.



Wizard-More utilitarian, likes to think his way out of problems-Coyote (traditional trickster) or Raven or Magpie (a very crafty bird)
Bard-musical buffoon (kinda like Elan but somehow less intelligent)-Ape (more specifically Chimpanzee)
Ranger/Rogue-Character's personality isn't developed much, but so far I have that she is quiet but very vocal on issues that relate to her. She is also willing to help anyone if she thinks they need it.

Like i said before (and his personality works well for) Wizard would fit "Human" perfectly. Save him for last and watch the parties reactions, plus it is a clever solution he would favor.

For the Bard, Parrot (or similar "talking" bird). It speaks, but doesn't know the meaning of the words. It is also bright and colorful.

For the last one.... What's their animal companion?

[Darth Stabber]

The hound is perfect.
They have an acute sense of smell for their quarry (detect evil)
They have lots of backing in D&D lore (blink dog, hound archon)
They have lots of backing in real world literature and thought (dogs are seen as loyal, obedient, self sacrificing, and devoted)
They have the claws, teeth, and aggression to do the job, and yet they can come home and play gentle with the kids)

[Ravens_cry]

@Darth Stabber:
I like your reasoning, that really is excellent.:smallsmile:

[USS Sorceror]

I thought Dolphins were Chaotic Evil.



Like i said before (and his personality works well for) Wizard would fit "Human" perfectly. Save him for last and watch the parties reactions, plus it is a clever solution he would favor.

For the Bard, Parrot (or similar "talking" bird). It speaks, but doesn't know the meaning of the words. It is also bright and colorful.

For the last one.... What's their animal companion?

Hmm...I do like this Human=Wizard thing and I know the player would find it great. Also like the Parrot=Bard. As for the ranger, her animal companion is a riding dog, more specifically an Alaskan husky, which she can't actually use as a mount since she's medium sized....

Also, should clarify that the barbarian is the only one who will actually gain shapeshifting powers from this. I'm just doing animal totems for the rest because I think it would be interesting and the other players would have fun with it.

[Particle_Man]

I can totally see that. Of course, I doubt shapeshifting into a bee would be very impressive. Unless the BBEG is allergic.

Maybe a very big bee? :smallbiggrin: