Attack rolls vs. AC

[SlashRunner]

Hello Playground,

I commonly hear that attack bonuses outpace AC bonuses in D&D. Could someone suggest an easy way of rectifying this? This is for a homebrew/houserule, but since I don't actually have any homebrew/houserules on hand I just decided to ask the question here.

[Toofey]

I've removed the AC cap and allowed the ACs to follow their natural progression and it has worked like a charm. Also really helps to keep the fighter class important at higher levels.

[share and enjoy]

I was considering this just the other day, I was playing with the idea of taking the dex to ac and changing it to reflex to ac makes the classes which are dodgy more dodgy and gives a little bump to other classes too. the only problems being you then would have to play with the max dex on armour and even then it may not be that big a bump I guess.

[sonofzeal]

Hello Playground,

I commonly hear that attack bonuses outpace AC bonuses in D&D. Could someone suggest an easy way of rectifying this? This is for a homebrew/houserule, but since I don't actually have any homebrew/houserules on hand I just decided to ask the question here.
Eh.... it's "Common Wisdom" but that doesn't mean it's correct. It's also campaign-dependent and varies a lot depending on what you're fighting, particularly if you're fighting a lot of Humanoids.

I've played dozens of campaigns, and while most have been low levels, every game I've played above lvl 10 has had AC be a relevant figure. The boss monsters might be able to hit on a 5 or less, but I could easily get ACs that the average opponent struggled to hit.

Heck, even if things can hit you reliably, AC still limits their ability to Power Attack. And "Common Wisdom" is that Power Attack is the primary source of damage.

But I've seen no evidence that attack bonus outpaces AC before at least lvl 12-13, and even after that an AC-focused build can usually outpace most attack bonuses you'll see.



A CR 13 Iron Golem has +23 to attack

A CR 16 Hound Hero Archon has +25 to attack

CR 17: Frost Giant Jarl, +30 to attack... or a Marilith with a bunch of attacks at +25.

CR 20: Balor, +33 to attack.



All of these can be vastly outpaced by AC. A 50% chance of being hit is easily attainable, and a 25% or lower chance is quite possible for a character who's actually trying.

There's a few exceptions - the Tarrasque and Greater Stone Golem come to mind - but for the majority of creatures, attack bonuses remain well inside the range that AC can matter for without undue effort.

[Averis Vol]

attack bonuses grow naturally whereas you have to pay some significant gold to get your AC respectable and still be able to function. honestly, i don't have the slightest clue how to balance out the two as i'm not a homebrewer (not a good one at least) or an optimizer. sorry i cant help more, guess you just need to deal with getting hit :smallyuk:

[JadePhoenix]

I've removed the AC cap and allowed the ACs to follow their natural progression and it has worked like a charm. Also really helps to keep the fighter class important at higher levels.

...AC cap? Wtf?

[sonofzeal]

...AC cap? Wtf?
I think they mean how you can only have +5 enhancement bonus on armor and shields pre-epic.

[Averis Vol]

i figured that was only there because you couldn't afford epic enchants before epic. :smallconfused:

[KillianHawkeye]

i figured that was only there because you couldn't afford epic enchants before epic. :smallconfused:

But that's only because of the arbitrary price increase.

Anyway, remember that the epic rulebook was written after the 3.0 rules had been out for a while, so it's not incorrect to say that the bonus of a magic item did have a cap.

[ericgrau]

Hello Playground,

I commonly hear that attack bonuses outpace AC bonuses in D&D. Could someone suggest an easy way of rectifying this? This is for a homebrew/houserule, but since I don't actually have any homebrew/houserules on hand I just decided to ask the question here.

What sonofzeal said, it doesn't. It's easy to keep up without even focusing on it.

What I can say is that AC is heavily dependent on items. Do give out proper treasure to the PCs that includes armor, rings of protection and amulets of natural armor rather than focusing on any single source. There's also the dusty rose prism ioun stone and shields. Giving out low wealth or all kinds of "exciting" custom treasure that doesn't include any passive items are common culprits.

If players believe the myth and you want to encourage AC (or anything else), all you have to do is give a +2 to make it nice or a +4 to make it incredible. Whether you apply that to everyone's AC, to shields, to heavier armors or split it between X and Y is up to you. It also helps to point out when, for example, "half the monster's attacks miss" since players might not notice how good their defenses are otherwise and may be more inclined to dump them. If they realize that means getting hit twice as often, they'll be less inclined to dump them.