Belkar's Death

[lio45]

Rich has called it years in advance. He knows it's a big deal. And we know he's a great storyteller.

So, it's got to be a "satisfying" death, right?

Belkar could die in a very pathetic way, and, being the malevolent little bastard he is, it could be played right... and many would probably like it if it happened that way...

Or he could die in a glorious way... his fans would, I assume, love it...?



The thing is, I'm not sure Rich can satisfy everyone (actually, I'm sure he can't, obviously).

So, do we think that it's a safe bet that Rich will pick a way to go for him that would satisfy both the Belkar haters and the Belkar fans?

And if so, would that mean a glorious death in battle?

I'm curious to see if the forum can use Rich's acute sense of good storytelling to narrow it down re: Belkar's death and reach some kind of consensus forecast. Assuming that exercice has not already been done to death. (I missed it, in this case.)

[toapat]

People hate Belkar?

otherwise, what i dont understand is while we know Belkar is at least a Ranger 9/Barbarian 1, we have NEVER seen him use rage, like how Thog turns giant, green, and his underwear turns purple when he rages.

yes, i know that Belkar stops being angry when he gets magical granted wisdom, but i dont buy that he is in perma rage, expecially considering how happy he is with sugestions like bait the wurm with me, or that he was able to fake anger

[Forikroder]

a glorious death would apease everyone, his haters dont hate him so much that they jsut want him out of the series no matter what so ahving an epic Z vs V style battle or a Roy VS Thog battle but with Belkar VS someone and Belkar dieing would apease everyone

the haters would just like the epic battle (and maybe his painful death) and his fans would love the epic battle

from what weve seen from Thog, Raging isnt something that you can jsut turn on and off like in 3.5 but something that jsut anturally happens when you jsut get that angry (a good indicator is Thogs rage started only after he lost his tusk despite him starting to lose and really needing that extra strength and it started to fade but got extended when he saw the dog get owned)

like if Belkar watched Scruffy die hed rage

[Gift Jeraff]

If I remember correctly, even Miko and Tsukiko (probably the most hated characters alongside Celia) had people go "Rich, why'd you make me feel bad for this person I hated so much? :smallfrown::smallfrown:" I think Belkar's death will have a similar effect, but more in an awesome way, not tragic.

Although I wouldn't be too surprised if he goes down anticlimactically, but then does something badass against the IFCC in the afterlife.

[martianmister]

Probably something anticlimactic. :smallamused:

[Jay R]

a glorious death would apease everyone, ...

I don't need to be appeased. I actually enjoy the strip.

[KillianHawkeye]

I can predict exactly two things about Belkar's death:

1. It will be dramatic.

This means that there will be a story to it. It will have impact. It will make people feel things. Belkar won't be killed by some mook or suddenly have a heart attack. Rather, it will probably occur during some climactic encounter.

2. It will be important.

Belkar's death, however it happens, will be a big deal. It will mean something for the story. It will change things in some way. Somehow, his death or his later absence will prove to be either a boon or a misfortune for the OOTS.



As for the whys and hows, I'll leave that as an exercise for the reader.

[Nark Mage]

At first, when I began reading OOTS I hated Belkar. He is chaotic evil (I am by nature, in real life, chaotic good), and he just kept killing innocents and never seemed to say anything that wasn't murder or sex related. But when he was on his litte trip during the activation of the MOJ, and he suddenly decided to pretend to be helpful, he got character development that he needed.

I will be sad to see Belkar go

[toapat]

a glorious death would apease everyone, his haters dont hate him so much that they jsut want him out of the series no matter what so ahving an epic Z vs V style battle or a Roy VS Thog battle but with Belkar VS someone and Belkar dieing would apease everyone

the haters would just like the epic battle (and maybe his painful death) and his fans would love the epic battle

from what weve seen from Thog, Raging isnt something that you can jsut turn on and off like in 3.5 but something that jsut anturally happens when you jsut get that angry (a good indicator is Thogs rage started only after he lost his tusk despite him starting to lose and really needing that extra strength and it started to fade but got extended when he saw the dog get owned)

like if Belkar watched Scruffy die hed rage

except that Thog's inability to rage can also be explained as being too stupid to know that he becomes so powerful when in a rage. Belkar comparatively is vastly more intelegent then Thog, because he is smart enough to lie, and use capitalization.

[Ninjadeadbeard]

My prediction:
A) Belkar bum rushes Xykon and they both take a tumble into a Gate.
B) Belkar gets one-shoted by Xykon or Redcloak, almost as an afterthought.
c) Belkar gets killed somehow, and has a tear-jerker speech about his life.
D) Belkar dies, the Order looks like its about to lose, and then Belkar Plane Shifts from the depths of Hell, having conquered that dark demesne and become a true Sexy Shoeless God of War. :smallamused: Then he kills everything up to and even including Rich, but hey that's Belkster for you.

[dps]

At first, when I began reading OOTS I hated Belkar. He is chaotic evil (I am by nature, in real life, chaotic good), and he just kept killing innocents and never seemed to say anything that wasn't murder or sex related. But when he was on his litte trip during the activation of the MOJ, and he suddenly decided to pretend to be helpful, he got character development that he needed.

I will be sad to see Belkar go

So you hated him because he's a sadistic, murderous jackass, but now that he's pretending to be a nice guy, you like him, even though you know that he's just pretending and is still the vicious killer you used to hate? How does that even make sense?

[MReav]

People hate Belkar?

otherwise, what i dont understand is while we know Belkar is at least a Ranger 9/Barbarian 1, we have NEVER seen him use rage

Halfling rage jumping attack! (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0176.html) Begs to differ.

[Winter]

So, it's got to be a "satisfying" death, right?

That is highly unlikely as it will lie in the eye of the beholder (lower case) if the death is "satisfying" or "good". No matter what the exact circumstances will be, some readers will love it and some will hate it and many will lie in between.

[Forikroder]

My prediction:
A) Belkar bum rushes Xykon and they both take a tumble into a Gate.
B) Belkar gets one-shoted by Xykon or Redcloak, almost as an afterthought.
c) Belkar gets killed somehow, and has a tear-jerker speech about his life.
D) Belkar dies, the Order looks like its about to lose, and then Belkar Plane Shifts from the depths of Hell, having conquered that dark demesne and become a true Sexy Shoeless God of War. :smallamused: Then he kills everything up to and even including Rich, but hey that's Belkster for you.

A is possible, but only Durokon had the sigil as far as we know or Shojo would ahve been killed if he used the headrest

B is impossible it would be very unlikely for Belkar to fail a save or die that easily and would be pretty dumb

C is also impossible Rich has said he doesnt want belkar to be a tragic hero

[KillianHawkeye]

And D is a joke 8-Bit Theater pulled like 10 years ago. No offence to 8BT, but does anybody think Rich is gonna copy one those jokes?

[Chessgeek]

Do we truly know, without a doubt, that Belkar will die as soon as the Oracle has predicted? The Oracle hasn't been a great source of helpful answers, and is quite misleading literal. In comic #329, the Oracle states that Belkar shouldn't invest in his IRA, and that he should savor his next birthday. However, this doesn't necessarily mean that he will die, although I have no idea what else it could mean.
In comic #572, the Oracle says that Belkar will draw his last breath before the end of the year, and that he is not long for this world. However, it has been more than a year since the battle of Azure City as of comic 832. Therefore, if the Oracle is correct, Belkar will have to die within a few weeks, likely far less. He will have to die in either in the current battle or one soon after it for the timeline to fit. I apologize if this argument has been done already. As you can tell, I am new to the forums.

EDIT: I no longer support this theory, but I don't think that it should be removed, since reading it and the responses is a good showing for others who thought the same thing. Just please don't be mad at me for ignoring obvious facts, since I've changed my mind and admitted that I was wrong.

[kabbor]

Do we truly know, without a doubt, that Belkar will die as soon as the Oracle has predicted?
8<snip
Am I the only one who believes in the slight hope that maybe the Oracle's predictions don't imply absolute death? I apologize if this argument has been done already. As you can tell, I am new to the forums.
Um, yes, done to death. Many people distrust the Oracle, and believe that he is being deliberately misleading.

[Chessgeek]

Well that goes almost without saying. After all, there are quite a few skeptics in any crowd, so in a fan-base as large as this one, I am not at all surprised. But have any other interpretations been spoken that are coherent in any way shape or form? I can't think of any other interpretations myself, not that that says much.

[Xelbiuj]

I only see it happening 1 of a few ways. (Which almost certainly means I'm wrong considering Rich's writing.)

1. Belkar will sacrifice himself for the greater good, sort of redeeming himself. *This could result in him becoming undead and fighting the Order. Durkon would hesitate in killing him, ending with his death as well.*
2. Belkar will sacrifice himself on accident per the advice/command from Roy causing them to feel guilty about it. Unlike Belkar who didn't feel guilty about getting Roy killed (sort of).
3. He could always just go in like a boss and fail.
4. I don't think an anti-climatic death is really a possibility. It would be a major let down and not fit with the rest of the comic's style for major events.
If his death was to like that, I'm calling sphere of annihilation in Xykon's fortress.

[Forikroder]

I only see it happening 1 of a few ways. (Which almost certainly means I'm wrong considering Rich's writing.)

1. Belkar will sacrifice himself for the greater good, sort of redeeming himself. *This could result in him becoming undead and fighting the Order. Durkon would hesitate in killing him, ending with his death as well.*
2. Belkar will sacrifice himself on accident per the advice/command from Roy causing them to feel guilty about it. Unlike Belkar who didn't feel guilty about getting Roy killed (sort of).
3. He could always just go in like a boss and fail.
4. I don't think an anti-climatic death is really a possibility. It would be a major let down and not fit with the rest of the comic's style for major events.
If his death was to like that, I'm calling sphere of annihilation in Xykon's fortress.

Belkar will never sacrifice himself for anyone but Mr. Scruffy

his death will be after an amazing fight, possibly that fight will happen immediately after Mr. Scruffy bites it and Belkar does a Thog rage

[fergo]

Belkar's death will be awesome, but definitely not sympathetic.

It may be a tiny bit tear-jerking, maybe only in other characters' reactions to his death (although I don't know, since no-one really likes him, except perhaps Elan). If Rich goes down this route, though, I'm guessing there'll be some sort of punchline (something to do with Belkar not caring what everyone else thinks of him, maybe).

[Kish]

Do we truly know, without a doubt, that Belkar will die as soon as the Oracle has predicted? The Oracle hasn't been a great source of helpful answers, and is quite misleading.

The Oracle has been overly literal, but never misleading. Haley got her voice back by trusting "Elan." The sorcerer who killed Fyron did indeed go by Xykon. Vaarsuvius did kill the mother black dragon's son. Belkar did kill the Oracle. Vaarsuvius got ultimate arcane power by saying "I...I must succeed" to himself/herself. Xykon is going after Girard's Gate before Kraagor's Gate.

The Oracle has also been a great source of helpful information; without the Oracle, Eugene would not have known who to go after, Roy would not have known where to go after him, and the entire Order would not know to be looking for Girard's Gate rather than Kraagor's.

In comic #329, the Oracle states that Belkar shouldn't invest in his IRA, and that he should savor his next birthday. However, this doesn't necessarily mean that he will die, although I have no idea what else it could mean.
In comic #572, the Oracle says that Belkar will draw his last breath before the end of the year. Uh, yeah. I have no counter for that.

Also "not long for the world."

[Ghosty]

I'm sure it's already been stated in other threads on this subject, but re Belkar and V, I've thought the Oracle meant his comments about V as a counterpoint to all of the convoluted ways Belkar was responsible for the deaths of everyone else he'd asked about; that conversely, V would be responsible for the death of Belkar. ", "And as for the elf---[s/he kills you.]" As to why would V kill Belkar, probably it'd have to do with something V does while under IFCC control, probably relating to a Gate's control, that even Belkar, sociopathic as he is, realizes he'd have to try and stop. If V killed Scruffy---inadvertently or not---that'd probably help Belkar in his decision...

I doubt it'll happen at this Gate, anyway, though if there's one constant about the Giant's writing, it's that it constantly surprises.

[FujinAkari]

Am I the only one who believes in the slight hope that maybe the Oracle's predictions don't imply absolute death? I apologize if this argument has been done already. As you can tell, I am new to the forums.

While you aren't the only one, you are laboring against the facts. To date the Oracle has never been wrong, nor have his prophesies come true in a unique and technical way. While sometimes the Oracle's prophesies are vague, they are never misleading. And when the oracle has stated things plainly, those things plainly came true, there was no subversion or technicality to the prophesy.

So... yeah... its pretty firm that Belkar will die and will not return to further the battle for the Gates. It is possible that some of Belkar's abyssal exploits will be shown, but is by no means a guerentee.

[Gnomish Wanderer]

I'm sure it's already been stated in other threads on this subject, but re Belkar and V, I've thought the Oracle meant his comments about V as a counterpoint to all of the convoluted ways Belkar was responsible for the deaths of everyone else he'd asked about; that conversely, V would be responsible for the death of Belkar. ", "And as for the elf---[s/he kills you.]" As to why would V kill Belkar, probably it'd have to do with something V does while under IFCC control, probably relating to a Gate's control, that even Belkar, sociopathic as he is, realizes he'd have to try and stop. If V killed Scruffy---inadvertently or not---that'd probably help Belkar in his decision...

I doubt it'll happen at this Gate, anyway, though if there's one constant about the Giant's writing, it's that it constantly surprises.

I don't see how you could read that from the orcale's comment. The oracle was explaining how exactly Belkar was connected to the deaths of the other characters, it wouldn't make sense to suddenly start talking about how V was going to kill Belkar. I think it's much more likely that Belkar's death causes V to go crazy and get killed, in yet another way the Oracle's phrophecy of how Belkar will cause the death of the other characters came true.

[Chessgeek]

Valid points, and I would like to withdraw my statement that the Oracle was misleading, as Kish and FujinAkari both pointed out. My main argument for that statement was Oracle's excuses for Belkar "causing the death" of Roy Miko and her horse, forgetting that either way that came true when Belkar killed the Oracle in comic 567.
I therefore cannot claim the Oracle to be anything except, at times, overly literal, and that means that Belkar's death is absolute, as the community had decided long before I created an account on the forum. (Unless the oracle was only telling the truth when he spoke to Roy's ghost, since technically that was the only statement made while in trance. Not only is this highly unlikely, Belkar would need a way to survive without breathing. So that argument is equally futile.)
On another note, I am grateful to have even received a response from either of the two though. I guess that just shows how thoroughly incorrect I was.

[lio45]

That is highly unlikely as it will lie in the eye of the beholder (lower case) if the death is "satisfying" or "good". No matter what the exact circumstances will be, some readers will love it and some will hate it and many will lie in between.

I disagree. Sure, it always lies in the eye of the beholder, but knowing Rich's style, I'm almost certain that most people won't "lie in between".

Look at the cases of Miko and Tsukiko, who both had very appropriate and very satisfying deaths. Some readers will disagree, sure, but I would bet a large majority of us definitely found those "satisfying". I'm betting the same for Belkar.



So, on topic, and thinking about it a little bit more,
- "Anticlimactic" is one thing that would work.
- "Redeeming himself" wouldn't, IMO. Goes way too much against the very nature of the character.

[kickassfrog]

Do we truly know, without a doubt, that Belkar will die as soon as the Oracle has predicted? The Oracle hasn't been a great source of helpful answers, and is quite misleading. In comic #329, the Oracle states that Belkar shouldn't invest in his IRA, and that he should savor his next birthday. However, this doesn't necessarily mean that he will die, although I have no idea what else it could mean.
In comic #572, the Oracle says that Belkar will draw his last breath before the end of the year. Uh, yeah. I have no counter for that. However, it has been more than a year and a half since the battle of Azure City as of comic 832. Therefore, if the Oracle is correct, Belkar will have to die within six months, likely far less. He will have to die in either in the current battle or one soon after it for the timeline to fit.
Am I the only one who believes in the slight hope that maybe the Oracle's predictions don't imply absolute death? I apologize if this argument has been done already. As you can tell, I am new to the forums.

Oracle says:
Savour next birthday cake
Don't bother funding his IRA
Last breath. Ever.
And the kicker:
Belkar is not long for this world.

Honestly, why are people so strongly against the possibility that he's going to die? Does the oracle need to write "Belkar will be permanently, irreversibly killed, forever" to get people to believe it?
Because even then, someone would come back with that bloody lich theory.


Sorry for ranting at you, but the magic Belkar will somehow survive is a bit overdone.

I also think he's going to die at serini/kraagor's gate, but I may be wrong.

[Niknokitueu]

As far as Belkar's death goes, there are three distinct possibilities.

1) He has already 'died', and the prophecy is fulfilled. Nah, I don't accept this either, but there is enough literary freedom to have his MoJ removal and accompanying paradigm shift count as his 'death'.

2) He will die in a totally awesome manner. Personal belief he will end up saving the entire storyverse (say, bull rushing one-eye into an open gate to disrupt the snarl-subjugating ritual), and he will be very pissed off at being forced to do so. For the rest of his snarl-shredded very-short life.

3) He will die in a deliberately trifling manner ('Rolled a 1'-style). Personal belief this would be a large-panel drawing with those that are busy saving the universe all busy doing so in the background.

Of the three, I would prefer option 2. Go figure...

Have Fun!
Niknokitueu

[MeanMrsMustard]

If I remember correctly, even Miko and Tsukiko (probably the most hated characters alongside Celia) had people go "Rich, why'd you make me feel bad for this person I hated so much? :smallfrown::smallfrown:" I think Belkar's death will have a similar effect, but more in an awesome way, not tragic.
Definitely. I felt exactly like that when they both died. I didn't hate Tsukiko as much as Miko (seriously, I hated Miko), but I didn't like her at all. Both of their death scenes made me cry.
(PS -- I found the spoiler stacking in your signature well worth it. :smalltongue:)

[Gift Jeraff]

I kinda wonder if you're the first to actually go through with it. :smallbiggrin:

[dtilque]

OK, I'm channeling the Oracle right now...

"Reply hazy, try again"

Oops, that was my magic 8-ball. Let's try again...

He's going to die of the vaporizing flu.

Sounds pretty conclusive. And remember, you heard it here first.

[ilcane87]

I used to think that Belkar's death would be 100% related to Mr. Scruffy's, something like the cat being killed by some powerful entity, and Belkar somehow vanquishing said entity at the cost of his life/soul.

But I'm starting to realize that would be way too predictable by OotS standards, so I'm expecting the unexpected: Mr. Scruffy will outlive Belkar.

Also, I have this gut-feeling that Belkar's death will come up around the time we meet Darth V again (at the end of the fight for the gate, presumably), since he's always been in a love/hate sort of relationship with the elf.

At that point, it could:

- lead to both characters dying permanently, maybe to be replaced by Nale and Sabine (who I expect to side with the OotS in the final stage of the battle, by the way).
- lead to Belkar's permanent death only, and that will somehow put a stop to Vaarsuvius's rampage, probably giving him a willpower boost to get rid of the soul-splices, as a mirror of what happened with his family.
- lead to Belkar's death only, but he'll somehow still be present later on... soul-bound in Mr. Scruffy maybe? Even though the Soul Bind spell can't technically do that, I can totally see him acting through his cat for the rest of the story.
(the ending of a certain videogame is influencing me way too much :smallbiggrin:)

[BaronOfHell]

Honestly, why are people so strongly against the possibility that he's going to die?
I don't think anyone is against the possibility. Rather against the certainty. The reasons for being against the certainty could range from reasonable doubt to simply not wanting the event to occour.


Does the oracle need to write "Belkar will be permanently, irreversibly killed, forever" to get people to believe it?
Because even then, someone would come back with that bloody lich theory.
I think it's missing the point anyway. The question is not the Oracle believes Belkar will perish, that's something which is very reasonable to assume and would be a bit cheap if he afterwards says that was never what he meant. The question is, if it's really gonna happen.

I believe Rich did at some point go out of his way and stated that it is indeed going to happen, not certain when or where he did that though, if I remember correct that is. Which is a much more powerful statement than that of a, so far, 100% accurate oracle. Even then the future is not set in stone and I'm certain I'll be happy with whatever Rich comes up with in the end.

[Toy Killer]

I'm just kinda concerned about the party dynamic. Putting on my TvTropes literacy hat on, He's an essential part of the five man band, he's the lancer (or the strong guy, kinda a five man band musical chairs scenario in this comic) and the only party member that would blindly state the most logical/productive thing without regards to alignment within the party.

V may have the logic part down, but will only go so far on the good/evil axis, Haley as well. It needs to be expressed to the audience that they could be total douches about means but choose to go the heroic route instead. Is V going to go all out evil and fill both roles? S/he's already lost his/her mate for pure arcane power and owes some company hours with the IFCC, but is that enough to get him to turn in his neutral card and go full-time evil? I think the party dynamic needs the token evil Teammate.


And... you know... Belkar's mentioned that he's the funniest character in this comic strip.

[Kish]

It needs to be expressed to the audience that they could be total douches about means but choose to go the heroic route instead.

Because the audience can be assumed to be, one and all, quite unable to add 1 and 1 without a member of the cast writing it out on the blackboard for them in every strip?


Is V going to go all out evil and fill both roles? S/he's already lost his/her mate for pure arcane power and owes some company hours with the IFCC, but is that enough to get him to turn in his neutral card and go full-time evil? I think the party dynamic needs the token evil Teammate.

Because?


And... you know... Belkar's mentioned that he's the funniest character in this comic strip.
That is an opinion, albeit one which I find incomprehensible in anyone but Belkar, and only comprehensible in Belkar himself because he's an egomaniacal sociopath.

[ti'esar]

Belkar's death will be awesome, but definitely not sympathetic.

It may be a tiny bit tear-jerking, maybe only in other characters' reactions to his death (although I don't know, since no-one really likes him, except perhaps Elan). If Rich goes down this route, though, I'm guessing there'll be some sort of punchline (something to do with Belkar not caring what everyone else thinks of him, maybe).

I suspect this is how things are going to turn out as well.

[Winter]

and the only party member that would blindly state the most logical/productive thing without regards to alignment within the party.

You mean "I want to kill/f***/eat/hurt it for fun!" (pick one) is the most logical and productive thing?


I think the party dynamic needs the token evil Teammate.

First, not every story needs to be a TVTropes cliche. Second, you are aware the comic is starting to move towards the end, so the "party dynamic" can change.
Third, I am unsure if any party needs some stock evil character. Actually, I very much doubt that.


And... you know... Belkar's mentioned that he's the funniest character in this comic strip.

That heavily depends on what kind of humor you like. I think Belkar has his moments, but all in all, he's just the primitive guy and a lot of his humor goes in that direction (recently topping out and Jumping the Shark (to stay in Tropes) with "Have the cat **** in someone's mouth"). Belkar appeals to the 12-year-old-male in all of us but I think that should not be the measurement for "most awesome writing" or "funniest jokes".

[KillianHawkeye]

I used to think that Belkar's death would be 100% related to Mr. Scruffy's, something like the cat being killed by some powerful entity, and Belkar somehow vanquishing said entity at the cost of his life/soul.

But I'm starting to realize that would be way too predictable by OotS standards, so I'm expecting the unexpected: Mr. Scruffy will outlive Belkar.

Hmm... maybe Mr. Scruffy will take Belkar's place in the OOTS? He can be put in charge of Order-Commoner Relations.

[Hydra Druid]

In comic #329 the Oracle says that "the halfling shouldn't bother funding his TRA." and "I'm just thinking he should savor his next birthday cake."
Then in #443 Roy Greenhilt dies.
In 498 Roy is told that he has been dead for 3 and a half months, or 103 days, 8 hours, 17 minutes, and 9 seconds.
Then in #572 the Oracle said "Belkar will draw his last breath-ever-before the end of the year." and "That's an "in-comic" year, not a real-time year, Oracle fans!"
Comic #702 says "In just six weeks, we will mark the one-year anniversary of our conquest of Azure City."
Comic #702 also says that this is late in the year 1184.
(Read the text in the books that are handed out.)

This means that it as of comic #329 Belkar is only going to eat one more birthday cake in his honor, and that it has been 6 weeks short of a year between comic #443 and #702. So Belkar SHOULD have eaten that birthday cake by now. Belkar has from "Late 1184" until Dec 31st 1184 or the day before his next birthday, whichever comes first, until he dies.

After all of this they go and meet Elan and Nale's father, General Tarquin.

So however he does it, he is going to die soon.

[Forikroder]

In comic #329 the Oracle says that "the halfling shouldn't bother funding his TRA." and "I'm just thinking he should savor his next birthday cake."
Then in #443 Roy Greenhilt dies.
In 498 Roy is told that he has been dead for 3 and a half months, or 103 days, 8 hours, 17 minutes, and 9 seconds.
Then in #572 the Oracle said "Belkar will draw his last breath-ever-before the end of the year." and "That's an "in-comic" year, not a real-time year, Oracle fans!"
Comic #702 says "In just six weeks, we will mark the one-year anniversary of our conquest of Azure City."
Comic #702 also says that this is late in the year 1184.
(Read the text in the books that are handed out.)

This means that it as of comic #329 Belkar is only going to eat one more birthday cake in his honor, and that it has been 6 weeks short of a year between comic #443 and #702. So Belkar SHOULD have eaten that birthday cake by now. Belkar has from "Late 1184" until Dec 31st 1184 or the day before his next birthday, whichever comes first, until he dies.

After all of this they go and meet Elan and Nale's father, General Tarquin.

So however he does it, he is going to die soon.

but not so soon that its easy to tell when hes going to die it could be during this arc or maybe even next arc or even conceivably the arc after

[Winter]

So however he does it, he is going to die soon.

But take note that "in comic"-soon can be five or more years out of comic pretty easily.

Let's assume the Girard arc takes another five or ten in-comic days, then a pause of five in-comic days, and then the last arc happens in another five to ten in-comic days... I could easily take like two out-of-comic years to just get past Girard's gate.

So "Belkar dieing soon" in regard to in-comic does not have to mean it'll happen out-of-comic-soon.

[Caractacus]

I kinda wonder if you're the first to actually go through with it. :smallbiggrin:

I did, too! But by definition, this means that I am not the first... :frown:

[ysath]

There's no reason for the order to not try to raise Belkar unless he turns on them. Thus, I predict that he will be unmade by the snarl.

[veti]

First, not every story needs to be a TVTropes cliche. Second, you are aware the comic is starting to move towards the end, so the "party dynamic" can change.
Third, I am unsure if any party needs some stock evil character. Actually, I very much doubt that.

You are aware that the 'evil teammate' trope predates TV by some thousands of years, right? The Aesir had Loki, the Olympians had several gods of dubious alignment (Ares, Hera, Dionysus), King David had Joab, King Arthur had Lancelot (and other figures in various stories). Heck, even Buffy had Spike. It's always one of the strongest characters, and their death invariably heralds the End, No Really, Barring Sequels This Is Absolutely It, of the story.

[Forikroder]

There's no reason for the order to not try to raise Belkar unless he turns on them. Thus, I predict that he will be unmade by the snarl.

if the mission ends, and belkar dies in some climactic way or possibly after Scruffy dies then its possible, remember Shojo died and wasnt ressed, belkar could be the same the Oracle never said its impossible for him to come back jsut that he wouldnt

[Winter]

There's no reason for the order to not try to raise Belkar .

You mean apart from the fact that both Roy and Durkon think Belkar is a horrible, evil being of which the world is a better place without?

Durkon is not going to raise Belkar unless Roy makes him. And that Roy thinks Belkar is "soon someone else's problem, someone with a black hood and a scythe" (+ the things Roy has already commented on Belkar during his trial in heavens) does not make me believe he would make Durkon do it.

[Marlowe]

I'm just kinda concerned about the party dynamic. Putting on my TvTropes literacy hat on, He's an essential part of the five man band, he's the lancer (or the strong guy, kinda a five man band musical chairs scenario in this comic) and the only party member that would blindly state the most logical/productive thing without regards to alignment within the party.




The actual entry (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/FiveManBand/Webcomics) disagrees with you. Also, both Haley and V have shown a willingness to suggest (or do) the ruthless thing without letting alignment get in the way.

[Winter]

You are aware that the 'evil teammate' trope predates TV by some thousands of years, right?

What does that matter? "Not each story does have to be a cliche", works indepentend of me dropping a certain website that some people seem to have married.


The Aesir had Loki, the Olympians had several gods of dubious alignment (Ares, Hera, Dionysus), King David had Joab, King Arthur had Lancelot (and other figures in various stories). Heck, even Buffy had Spike. It's always one of the strongest characters, and their death invariably heralds the End, No Really, Barring Sequels This Is Absolutely It, of the story.

So what? You are confusing "does exist" or even "does exist a lot" with "has to be". The "stock evil character" is not required and that is what I said.

[Forikroder]

You mean apart from the fact that both Roy and Durkon think Belkar is a horrible, evil being of which the world is a better place without?

Durkon is not going to raise Belkar unless Roy makes him. And that Roy thinks Belkar is "soon someone else's problem, someone with a black hood and a scythe" (+ the things Roy has already commented on Belkar during his trial in heavens) does not make me believe he would make Durkon do it.

ya actually Durkon will raise Belkar because hes that gullable

yes, he knows Belkar is an annoying lkittle cretin but he also knows that despite how annoying hes been Belkar has worked hard to save the world just like every other member of the aprty and has done more to ensure they succeed (even if it was by killing others) then a couple other members of the party

Durkon seems to focus more on the actions and intent then alignment or else he wouldnt be working with Belkar at all

[FujinAkari]

ya actually Durkon will raise Belkar because hes that gullable

Durkon might be gullible, but Roy isn't (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0666.html)

[Forikroder]

Durkon might be gullible, but Roy isn't (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0666.html)

they were talking about what if they cant control belkar, if belkar dies in a climactic battle with team evil and his death contributes to there cause (as in he doesnt turncoat on them) you can bet Roy will raise them, you really think hes going to go "well Belkar saved the world, and without him Xykon might have won but hes not a very nice person so lets jsut leave him dead"

when Belkar dies either something will happen that will make it impossible to ressurect him (like losing the body or something like that) something will happen to make Belkar refuse the ressurection (like Mr. Scruffy dieing or having such an epic amazing death that he doesnt want to ruin it by continue living) or hell turn traitor

if Belkar keeps doing what hes doing (following every order Roy gives and using his own initiative to further the mission) then hell get a rez 100%

although it is conceivable that this s the oracles revenge and by telling Roy belkar will die permanently he wont rez Belkar because he thinks it wouldnt be possible so he doesnt want to waste the resources (which really shows how much prophecys can mess things up)

[Hydra Druid]

Lets say that Belkar told everyone that his birthday was coming up, then everyone woke up and knew that it was his birthday, then the next day they visited the oracle.
The oracle then says that he should enjoy his next birthday cake, meaning that the next birthday he has will be his last.
Because his last birthday was the day before, we know that he will live for at least 364 more days, (1 year, subtract how long it has been since his last birthday). We also know that he will not live a full 365 days after that. (or else he would have another birthday).
So it is possible that Belkar could die on the day before his birthday. 364x2= 728 days after the oracle first said he was going to die.
Then they went on a long journey. Look at all of the things that happen in between when the oracle first predicts his death and the taking of the city.
Then some time latter we are told that the city was taken "6 weeks short of a year ago"
I think it is safe to say that at least 15 months have gone by since the oracle first said that the halfling was going to "draw his last breath ever."
Then we have the 2ed time Belkar went to see the oracle, where we learn that he will be dead by the end of the current (in-comic) year.
As I pointed out earlier, this means that he has LESS THEN 6 months to live. The books that are handed out say that the goblin city was founded in "LATE" whatever year it was (I forget right now and don't feel like looking it up. Maybe that was the year the books are being handed out, or maybe that is when they took the city (1 year - 6 weeks ago). In any case it is not "late" in the year until the year is at least halfway over. So if there are 12 months in a year then we can say that the 6th month has already passed, and the oracle said that he would be dead by the end of the current year.
As it has already been pointed out this does not mean that he CAN'T be raised, only that he WILL NOT be raised, and if he is raised then that wasn't the death that was predicted, and he will die again not to be raised before the time runs out. "His last breath -ever"
Maybe he will be eaten saving the life of the cat, or maybe he will be denigrated by a spell. It will probably be to save the day in some unexpected way, or maybe by the hands of a family member of someone that he has killed.
In any case I think that he will lose a will throw, die and then Roy will just wait until they get to the next town and then hire on a new ranger, one with a few points in search.
However Roy seems to have made it clear that the next time the halfling dies, it will be the last time if he has anything to say about it.