working for the villain?

[thunderzach]

hey guys. my normal dm is looking for a break and to play a character he made forever ago. I was trying to write a campaign to provide this.

I was looking to make something where the players are working for the ultimate villain of the campaign unknowingly (they'd get subtle hints along the way). I was thinking about having the villian ask them to gather 3-ish things that was stolen from him. of course these would be pieces necessarily to create something like a portal that will allow an evil army or something to the realm. I'm good on game mechanics, not so much with storylines though.

The players tend to play like mercenaries wanting to maximize profit so motivating them to get started shouldn't be an issue. my problem lies more in the details of the story, particularly the ending.

Any suggestions? Specifics on the final villain would help too. If theres a premade campaign that follows a similar arc that i havent seen out there you could just direct me to that too.

thanks

[Starbuck_II]

hey guys. my normal dm is looking for a break and to play a character he made forever ago. I was trying to write a campaign to provide this.

I was looking to make something where the players are working for the ultimate villain of the campaign unknowingly (they'd get subtle hints along the way). I was thinking about having the villian ask them to gather 3-ish things that was stolen from him. of course these would be pieces necessarily to create something like a portal that will allow an evil army or something to the realm. I'm good on game mechanics, not so much with storylines though.

The players tend to play like mercenaries wanting to maximize profit so motivating them to get started shouldn't be an issue. my problem lies more in the details of the story, particularly the ending.

Any suggestions? Specifics on the final villain would help too. If theres a premade campaign that follows a similar arc that i havent seen out there you could just direct me to that too.

thanks

Module Way of the Wicked has a evil dude who follow, but you kind of get unsubtle hints that he is evil.

I read a D&D web comic where they also follow a evil dude (but then they are evil).
http://agc.deskslave.org/comic_viewer.html?goNumber=469

[thunderzach]

Way of the Wicked, but you kind of get unsubtle hints that he is evil.

i was more looking for something where they are good characters that unkowningly aid an evil villain but in the end realize it and have to stop him before his designs come to fruition.

[INoKnowNames]

I assume it would be a given that he could bluff up a storm and had ways to hide his allignment (or possibly his true form all together).

This kind of thing is easier with multiple factions. Good Guys competing with other Good Guys, Multiple Sets of Bad Guys all trying to clamer to the top; it's easier for someone to manipulate from the side lines in this way.

Spoiler from my recent favorite game:
Kid Icarus Uprising had 2 Villains do this kinda thing:

Pyrron the Sun God gets the Gods to fight the Aurum, convincing Pit and his side how and where to attack, so he could eventually take over the fleet and gain unlimited power (although this backfired against him).

and

Hades (was noted to be completely evil from his introduction, admitedly) manipulates the Humans into fighting, Viridi's forces of Nature into slaughtering the Humans and helping fight Palutena's Army, and actively hinder's Pit during his fight against the Aurum and the Chaos Kin, since every-single-invididual-killed makes Hades' Underworld Army even stronger.

A guy pretending to be a good guy and rallying the people to do his bidding, while convincing the heroes to help sabbotages those that might stop him, until he can amass enough power to reveal his true colors and take over all.... If I couldn't have the good guys gather all the macguffins for me, then having them help destroy everyone else who might be a threat would certainly be my next biggest objective.

[Slipperychicken]

So the players don't get tipped off by constant sense motive checks, the villain could be contacting the PCs via servant or organization. If he doesn't have an organization, a manservant or remote messaging (messenger, letters, magic) should be enough, saying the master is occupied with researching the next macguffins location or something (which BBEGs usually are anyway) so he can't speak in person right now.

[Toy Killer]

Consider, if you will, a Homeless ex-sailor, who has nothing but hundreds of stories up his sleeve. we will call him Earl.

Earl is a resident of the major campaign Hub. He doesn't have a residency there, but everyone takes equal shares of responsibility in housing him (various Inn Keepers don't mind letting him stay the night, as he tends to keep people entertained better the bards and hired hands to do so, for example). He's a simple side note in the campaign at large, just happens to be visiting the blacksmith as the players go to get their gear repaired. He's just stepping in as the players get a job across the nation.

Earl is a pleasant little note, and a great source of advice. The players may understand that Earl functions like a bard, but try to play him off as plot device and little more.

Earl, is a level 18 Bard/Mindbender. Earl, the trusty little bit of world expansion, the warm center the players know they can depend on. Earl has been behind Everything.

He 'pushed' the Thieves guild leader to sacking the temple of Palor three towns over. He hid the Blackguard's alignment from the parties Paladin. He stole the princess. He sent the players after the Cultist, the Cultist he 'rewarded' with the princess tiara. He told them the princess was in Cauldera when she was safely kept in basement of the party's favorite tavern; The Drooling Bard. He put/let the players 'Discover' the powerful artifact, and knew they would bring it back, eventually.

Earl... You Bastard.

[Kol Korran]

unless your players are new to the game, that kind of plot get easily found out. (especially if they ever played shadowrun). many players suspect their employer from the get go, especially if ANY of his/ her stories doesn't make sense, or if they get ANY "subtle" hint.

be wary.

oh, and some would work for the villain in that case anyway, especially if they can get something out of the deal. :smallannoyed:

[thunderzach]

unless your players are new to the game, that kind of plot get easily found out. (especially if they ever played shadowrun). many players suspect their employer from the get go, especially if ANY of his/ her stories doesn't make sense, or if they get ANY "subtle" hint.

be wary.

oh, and some would work for the villain in that case anyway, especially if they can get something out of the deal. :smallannoyed:

They aren't new to the game. they just tend to ignore things like that in order to get loot. I kinda want to "punish" them for not paying enough attention to the story and focusing so much on their gear. They appreciate good story, especially plot twists, but I highly doubt they'd pick up on subtle things like that. They are far more likely to miss all of them, get pissed off and try to argue how it doesn't make sense that the person they are working for is the villain. I'd like to be able to go back and point out specifics that they missed because they weren't paying attention. also aside from one of them, they tend to play with a shady morality but it always comes back to doing the right thing overall

[Slipperychicken]

\ I kinda want to "punish" them for not paying enough attention to the story and focusing so much on their gear.

I advise against in-game punishment, since this seems to be an out-of-game issue. Ask them about what kind of game they want to play (how much emphasis they want placed on loot, combats, puzzles, traps, story, roleplay) and you explain what you want out of the game, then come to some kind of agreement that makes everyone happy.

[thunderzach]

I advise against in-game punishment, since this seems to be an out-of-game issue. Ask them about what kind of game they want to play (how much emphasis they want placed on loot, combats, puzzles, traps, story, roleplay) and you explain what you want out of the game, then come to some kind of agreement that makes everyone happy.

The word punish was used for lack of a better term. I guess a better way to phrase it is that I want their decisions to matter in the grand scheme of things. Ignoring warning signs and having it cause something to be more difficult than it otherwise would have been would provide them with a twist that they would appreciate. Our typical DM has a tendency to have his stories on a rail which has led to both him and the players looking for something more and different. I was hoping to provide that for them

[Asgardian]

Im tired as heck but....

Have the villain look to be fully in the right requesting help

He could be the rightful lord of the land of Region A that was overrun by nearby Region B and taken. He needs the PCs help to get back in power.

If they check they will find out that

1. he is indeed the hereditary ruler of Region A
2. He wasn't a great leader but wasn't bad either. Taxes are high but the people weren't starving or anything

3. Region B attacked first

What they don't know is that your villain made a deal with some Storm Giants or something to attack Region B. Before the attack commenced, Region B managed to broker a better deal with the attackers and had them switch sides and join them in attacking Region A. The person that brokered the deal is now dead. The people in Region A are actually better off under the rule of Region B