Games like Shining Force?

[danzibr]

If anyone's played Shining Force (or Shining Force II, and I hear Shining Force III plays similarly), hopefully you remember it fondly. I've picked up games since then such as Final Fantasy Tactics and Disgaea, which are great games and all, but does anyone know of games more like Shining Force? Something nice and simple.

In particular, how about iOS games? I did notice Shining Force itself is now available on the iPhone and iPad.

Or, ya know, feel free to discuss the games themselves. I guess I'll start.

While I prefer the art and plot of Shining Force I, Shining Force II did have some nice features such as different promotions, mythril and exploring the world map. I remember building Bleu up and man, he was a beast. I hear Adam also got really buff but I never bothered leveling him.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I would recommend you find yourself a decent emulator and give Langrisser 2 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langrisser_II) (also known as warsong 2) a try. I still prefer Shining Force 2 for its characters, but Langrisser 2 has a combination of characters + disposable troops that I've never found anywhere else and gives a wonderful strategic and realistic value to the whole exercise.

Then there is, of course, the Fire Emblem games. Wonderful games, very much like Shining Force in style and tactics.

Apart from those two... Ogre Battle, I suppose. Although I never found it that interesting - I found out how to create the best troop in the game in the first battle (maybe second), and the game became boring after that.

Grey Wolf

[Tengu_temp]

Are you looking for tactical RPGs that are simple or ones that are easy?

The Fire Emblem series is pretty simple, but it's far from easy - they can get pretty unforgiving, losing a character in a battle means it's gone forever (and all of them have unique names, faces and personality), and a mistake during a scenario means you have to replace the whole map from the beginning due to how the save system works (though it's different for some titles).

The Super Robot Wars series is more complex, but most of its newer titles are pretty easy. The only officially translated titles are Original Generation 1 and 2 on the GBA, but you can get fan translations for a few more, and it's not hard to play it in Japanese.

Bahamut Lagoon on the SNES is a great title you'd probably like a lot. You need to find a fan translation, though, it was never officially released in the west.

[Anteros]

Fire Emblem is probably the closest thing to Shining Force out there. I'd recommend Tactics Ogre if you liked FFT, but it's a lot more complex.

[Phexar]

There's also FEDA: The Emblem of Justice (SNES and Saturn) which was only released in Japan, but has a translation. The artwork was created by the same character designer as Shining Force too. Quite a similar game to be sure, complete with exploring towns/etc, more info below:

http://hardcoregaming101.net/feda/feda.htm

[danzibr]

Thanks for the responses all. It's good to see some love for the ol' Shining Force.

I actually started the Ogre game (I forget the exact title, probably the Tactics Ogre) before, but... I didn't like it. All the card stuff at the beginning to determine your character, and attacking characters of lower level was dishonorable and you lost experience? Hrm.

Anyways, I'll have to look into the mentioned games. I've heard good things of Fire Emblem.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I actually started the Ogre game (I forget the exact title, probably the Tactics Ogre) before, but... I didn't like it. All the card stuff at the beginning to determine your character, and attacking characters of lower level was dishonorable and you lost experience? Hrm.

The cards thing is a little silly, but that is hardly the only game that does it. I go to gamefaqs and pick and choose the answers I want. As to the dishonor thing, I don't remember that - there was a morality scale: killing good creatures made you evil, killing evil creatures made you good, so you had to keep troops from both sides: send the angels to kill undead, and vampires to kill the unicorns. It was fun, if rather shallow in the end; more the bother of needing specific ranges of morality to upgrade troops that was the problem.


Anyways, I'll have to look into the mentioned games. I've heard good things of Fire Emblem.

I find that playing fire emblem in an emulator makes it easier (since you can save wherever you want) and thus, much less challenging. YMMV, just be aware that the "real" experience should be without in-battle saves. I don't bother with that myself, but you should be aware of the distinction so you can make a conscious choice.

Also, let me insist again on Langrisser 2. I'll be checking FEDA myself, but I still think that between shinning force, fire emblem and langrisser, the later has the better combat mechanics. You should be allowed to make sacrifices in battle, not just be expected to have perfect wins every single time, as in fire emblem and, to a lesser point, Shining force.

Grey Wolf

[maglag]

You should be allowed to make sacrifices in battle, not just be expected to have perfect wins every single time, as in fire emblem and, to a lesser point, Shining force.


Nobody ever said you're expected to have perfect wins in Fire Emblem. You only need to keep the lords alive all the time. Everybody else can die, that's why the game keeps throwing you extra replacements basically every mission. They just happen to be named cannon fodder with a backstory and you can grow attached to them, but still perfectly expendeable. Does losing the guy you trained for 10 missions sucks? Yes. But that's part of war.

[Tengu_temp]

The cards thing is a little silly, but that is hardly the only game that does it. I go to gamefaqs and pick and choose the answers I want. As to the dishonor thing, I don't remember that - there was a morality scale: killing good creatures made you evil, killing evil creatures made you good, so you had to keep troops from both sides: send the angels to kill undead, and vampires to kill the unicorns. It was fun, if rather shallow in the end; more the bother of needing specific ranges of morality to upgrade troops that was the problem.

Killing chaotic enemies make you lawful and killing lawful enemies makes you chaotic, but on top of that, killing enemies who are stronger than you makes you lawful and killing enemies who are weaker than you is chaotic. At least that was the case in the SNES Ogre Battle.


Nobody ever said you're expected to have perfect wins in Fire Emblem. You only need to keep the lords alive all the time. Everybody else can die, that's why the game keeps throwing you extra replacements basically every mission. They just happen to be named cannon fodder with a backstory and you can grow attached to them, but still perfectly expendeable. Does losing the guy you trained for 10 missions sucks? Yes. But that's part of war.

Technically what you're saying is good, but in practice I don't know anyone who doesn't load/restart the scenario if they lose someone in Fire Emblem. And I think the creators quickly realized that most players indeed play this way, as the later games have much less Obvious Replacement characters.

[Mr.Moron]

Arc the Lad 2 is worth a look. It's a bit more heavy on the RPG and light on the tactical side of things, but it uses the same sort of grid based combat. It's a very solid title and one I don't see mentioned enough in general. You can skip the rest of the series though, they're all decidedly mediocre.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Technically what you're saying is good, but in practice I don't know anyone who doesn't load/restart the scenario if they lose someone in Fire Emblem. And I think the creators quickly realized that most players indeed play this way, as the later games have much less Obvious Replacement characters.

Agreed. The problem is even worse that just loosing a unique character: you also loose all the experience you poured into him. In a game with limited experience, that is a big issue. You could afford to do without the guy because you got another of the same class, but not without the 10 levels you just lost. Modern versions did solve that problem by letting you re-fight battles to a point (at least random encounters), but in the original ones, more than a couple of losses could cripple your ability to win.

Langrisser also has limited experience, and characters that if you loose, are lost forever (IIRC). But the troops hired are not unique, and in fact will be gone at the end of the battle and will need to be rehired, so you can use the classic tricks of bating, enveloping, sacrificing, etc.

Grey Wolf

[JadedDM]

Have you tried Telepath RPG: Servants of God (http://sinisterdesign.net/?page_id=267)? You can download a free demo to see if you like it, but it's pretty good, I think.

[Anteros]

Thanks for the responses all. It's good to see some love for the ol' Shining Force.

I actually started the Ogre game (I forget the exact title, probably the Tactics Ogre) before, but... I didn't like it. All the card stuff at the beginning to determine your character, and attacking characters of lower level was dishonorable and you lost experience? Hrm.

Anyways, I'll have to look into the mentioned games. I've heard good things of Fire Emblem.

That sounds like Ogre Battle. Tactics Ogre is basically the game FFT was based off of, and plays like it.

[Dublock]

I know the majority of people didn't like it (or at least seemed that way) but I really enjoyed FFT Advance and FFTA2 (not as much). I played them for the GBA and then on my DS, and I wager that the first one would be hard to find nowadays as its for the GBA. The 2nd one is for the DS.

[Wookieetank]

Arc the Lad 2 is worth a look. It's a bit more heavy on the RPG and light on the tactical side of things, but it uses the same sort of grid based combat. It's a very solid title and one I don't see mentioned enough in general. You can skip the rest of the series though, they're all decidedly mediocre.

I'd second this, but add in that Arc the Lad 1 was a lot of fun and a quick little game (that and depending on what version you end up playing of it you can import your Arc 1 characters into Arc 2). Even if you really like the first 2 though, I don't really recommend 3 and beyond, not only does the game play take a nose plunge, but you're baiscally playing the same plot over and over with different characters. You'd have more fun replaying the first 2.

[Starbuck_II]

Grotesque Tactics is pretty fun tactics game. It is on Steam though.