Adamantrue
2012-04-17, 11:32 AM
Our current game is winding down (or fizzling out, depending on your point of view), and we've been discussing options for a new one. A lot of us have actually expressed an interest in playing a more mundane-centric game, where Spellcasting as most D&D games think of it is a rare, ancient, and lost knowledge.
One of the main problems brought up by one of my players is that Magic Items are a very important part of the game, especially including PC Item Creation. His main point was as to where all the Magic Item come from, and the suspension of disbelief involved by making them as frequent as they normally are in a world without spellcasters. He also specifically noted that the party wouldn't have any direct control without even a Warlock or spellcasting Paladin (yeah, the premise nerfs Paladins).
Me and a buddy were talking about it last night, and I was trying to sell him on the idea of using a Rogue for the role of a "Wizard" (we've had playful debates about whether Gandalf was a Rogue or a Wizard). He asked if there was any way to let them create Magic Items, to really capitalize on UMD, and it got my mind going...
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The premise is that there is NO spellcasting available in the game (and Warlocks are not an option either). You can take levels in a spellcasting class if you wish, but you do not gain any spell slots. We're working on a ToB modification for Rangers and Paladins, which would also disallow ToB Classes.
There are Incantations that mimic some key spells available, able to be performed by some organizations (for example, some Churches can perform minor miracles such as a Resurrection). It is fairly rare, however, a secret knowledge in remote locations.
Beings referred to as Mages or Wizards are in actuality the sagely Esoteric Rogues, having studied in greater detail the world around them. They halve their Sneak Attack progression (+1d6 starting at 3rd level, topping off at +5d6 at 19th), and in exchange gain the following: Class Skills: Esoteric Rogues add all Knowledge skills, as well as Spellcraft, to their Class Skill List.
Detect Magic (Su): Starting at 1st level, an Esoteric Rogue may use Detect Magic, as the spell, at will.
Special Ability Name Here: An Esoteric Rogue may select Imbue Item (as the Warlock Class Feature) as one of his Special Abilities at 10th, 13th, 16th, or 19th. Once he selects this ability, he qualifies for Item Creation Feats as a spellcaster equal to his Class Level.
In addition, he gains Scribe Scroll as a bonus Feat. In game, an Esoteric Rogue would focus on Magic Items & UMD, with a likely dependency on Scrolls and low-charge Wands in the early game. Their normal abilities would be dressed up verbally, with Hide being referred to as Invisibility, Diplomacy checks as Charms, etc.
But really, this is all concept. I'm not really sure how this would work out in the long run. Do these changes overpower the Rogue, or underpower...or is it comparable? Are there other changes or tweaks needed to make this work?
One of the main problems brought up by one of my players is that Magic Items are a very important part of the game, especially including PC Item Creation. His main point was as to where all the Magic Item come from, and the suspension of disbelief involved by making them as frequent as they normally are in a world without spellcasters. He also specifically noted that the party wouldn't have any direct control without even a Warlock or spellcasting Paladin (yeah, the premise nerfs Paladins).
Me and a buddy were talking about it last night, and I was trying to sell him on the idea of using a Rogue for the role of a "Wizard" (we've had playful debates about whether Gandalf was a Rogue or a Wizard). He asked if there was any way to let them create Magic Items, to really capitalize on UMD, and it got my mind going...
*
The premise is that there is NO spellcasting available in the game (and Warlocks are not an option either). You can take levels in a spellcasting class if you wish, but you do not gain any spell slots. We're working on a ToB modification for Rangers and Paladins, which would also disallow ToB Classes.
There are Incantations that mimic some key spells available, able to be performed by some organizations (for example, some Churches can perform minor miracles such as a Resurrection). It is fairly rare, however, a secret knowledge in remote locations.
Beings referred to as Mages or Wizards are in actuality the sagely Esoteric Rogues, having studied in greater detail the world around them. They halve their Sneak Attack progression (+1d6 starting at 3rd level, topping off at +5d6 at 19th), and in exchange gain the following: Class Skills: Esoteric Rogues add all Knowledge skills, as well as Spellcraft, to their Class Skill List.
Detect Magic (Su): Starting at 1st level, an Esoteric Rogue may use Detect Magic, as the spell, at will.
Special Ability Name Here: An Esoteric Rogue may select Imbue Item (as the Warlock Class Feature) as one of his Special Abilities at 10th, 13th, 16th, or 19th. Once he selects this ability, he qualifies for Item Creation Feats as a spellcaster equal to his Class Level.
In addition, he gains Scribe Scroll as a bonus Feat. In game, an Esoteric Rogue would focus on Magic Items & UMD, with a likely dependency on Scrolls and low-charge Wands in the early game. Their normal abilities would be dressed up verbally, with Hide being referred to as Invisibility, Diplomacy checks as Charms, etc.
But really, this is all concept. I'm not really sure how this would work out in the long run. Do these changes overpower the Rogue, or underpower...or is it comparable? Are there other changes or tweaks needed to make this work?