Spiderblood Assassin [3.5e Class][PEACH] [Archive]

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Milo v3

2012-04-17, 10:00 PM

Spider Blood Assassin
http://www.dandwiki.com/w/images/9/96/Assassination.jpg
Do not struggle or it will only kill you faster - A Spider Blood Assassin to his latest victim.

Poison is commonly used by assassin’s whether a toxic gas, put into the food, or dripped upon his blade. But some are gifted with the ways of the spider and are masters with toxins of all kinds. But this is only one of their several gifts; they can climb walls and traverse webs. And with enough skill you can call those of the web to your aid.
The Spider Blood Assassins are granted these gifts by a pact with a spider goddess, whether knowingly or not. And they use these gifts with great finesse.

Strangely despite the classes name, one doesn't have to be an assassin nor ever kill anyone and several Spider Blood Assassin simply use their skills to be master thieves.

Role: A Spider Blood Assassin is like a rogue using stealth and guile to attack its foes from the shadows, also with their use of poison even if the foe survives it will be weaker for the rest of the group to kill. They are also very skilled individuals being able to use their wits to ruin traps, and pick locks.

Alignment: A Spider Blood Assassin can be of any alignment.

Hit Die: d8.

Starting Gold: As rogue.

Class Skills
The Spider Blood Assassin's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Acrobatics (Dex), Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disable Device (Dex), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (dungeoneering) (Int), Knowledge (Local), Knowledge (nature), Knowledge (nobility), Perception (Wis) , Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Stealth (Dex), Swim (Str), and Use Magic Device (Cha).

Skill Points at First Level: (6 + Int modifier)

Spider Blood Assassin
{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|
+0|
+2|
+2|
+0|Poison Use, Sneak Attack +1d6

2nd|
+1|
+3|
+3|
+0|Assassin Techniques, Trapfinding

3rd|
+2|
+3|
+3|
+1|Evasion, Spider Blood +1, Spider Tongue

4th|
+3|
+4|
+4|
+1|Assassin Techniques, Sneak Attack +2d6, Uncanny Dodge

5th|
+3|
+4|
+4|
+1| Spider Blood +2, Trapsense +1, Weapon Finesse

6th|
+4|
+5|
+5|
+2|Assassin Techniques, Spider Empathy

7th|
+5|
+5|
+5|
+2| Spider Blood +3, Hidden Weapons

8th|
+6/+1|
+6|
+6|
+2|Assassin Techniques, Improved Uncanny Dodge, Sneak Attack +3d6

9th|
+6/+1|
+6|
+6|
+3| Spider Blood +4

10th|
+7/+2|
+7|
+7|
+3|Advanced Techniques, Assassin Techniques, Trapsense +2, Weapon Subtly

11th|
+8/+3|
+7|
+7|
+3| Spider Blood +5

12th|
+9/+4|
+8|
+8|
+4|Assassin Techniques, Sneak Attack +4d6, Whispers of the Web

13th|
+9/+4|
+8|
+8|
+4| Spider Blood +6

14th|
+10/+5|
+9|
+9|
+4|Assassin Techniques

15th|
+11/+6/+1|
+9|
+9|
+5| Nest of Fangs, Spider Blood +7, Trapsense +3

16th|
+12/+7/+2|
+10|
+10|
+5|Assassin Techniques, Sneak Attack +5d6

17th|
+12/+7/+2|
+10|
+10|
+5| Spider Blood +8

18th|
+13/+8/+3|
+11|
+11|
+6|Assassin Techniques

19th|
+14/+9/+4|
+11|
+11|
+6| Spider Blood +9

20th|
+15/+10/+5|
+12|
+12|
+6|Assassin Techniques, A Thousand Eyes, Sneak Attack +6d6, Spider Thrall, Trapsense +4[/table]

Class Features
All of the following are class features of the Spider Blood Assassin.

Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: Spider Blood Assassins are proficient with all simple weapons, in addition to hand crossbow, rapier, sap, shortbow (normal and composite), short sword, webbed claw (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=13096028#post13096028), webbed fang (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=13096028#post13096028), and whip. Spider Blood Assassins are proficient with light armor but not with shields.

Sneak Attack (Ex): If a Spider Blood Assassin can catch an opponent when he is unable to defend himself effectively from his attack, his hunter instincts kick in and he can strike a vital spot for extra damage.
The Spider Blood Assassin’s attack deals extra damage anytime his target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when the Spider Blood Assassin flanks his target. This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, 2d6 at 4th level, and increases by 1d6 every four Spider Blood Assassin levels thereafter. Should the Spider Blood Assassin score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied. Ranged attacks can count as sneak attacks only if the target is within 30 feet.
With a weapon that deals nonlethal damage (like a sap, whip, or an unarmed strike), a Spider Blood Assassin can make a sneak attack that deals nonlethal damage instead of lethal damage. He cannot use a weapon that deals lethal damage to deal nonlethal damage in a sneak attack, not even with the usual –4 penalty.
The Spider Blood Assassin must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. A Spider Blood Assassin cannot sneak attack while striking a creature with concealment.

Poison Use: Spider Blood Assassins innately understand how to handle poison and cannot accidentally poison themselves when applying poison to a weapon.

Assassin Techniques: As a Spider Blood Assassin gains experience, his pacts grant him several gifts and boons. Starting at 2nd level, a Spider Blood Assassin gains one assassin technique. He gains an additional assassin techniques for every 2 levels of Spider Blood Assassin attained after 2nd level. A Spider Blood Assassin cannot select an individual technique more than once.
Techniques marked with an asterisk add effects to a Spider Blood Assassin’s sneak attack. Only one of these talents can be applied to an individual attack and the decision must be made before the attack roll is made.

List of Techniques

Araneae Hand (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin with this Technique can launch a web at an object and pull the target towards you. As a standard action you can make a touch attack on an object within 30 feet that you have a line of sight to.
If it hits an object which is unattended you can pull that object into your hands as an immediate action. If it hits an object which is being held by an creature you can make a disarm check and if successful you can you can pull that object into your hand.

This ability only works on unattended objects that you could hold in one hand and weapons which are one handed for a creature of the Spider Blood Assassin's size. To use this ability you must have one hand free.

To select this technique you must have the Silk Weaver Technique.

Araneae Shell (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin with this Technique's flesh warps into a hard exoskeleton, but strangely looks exactly like and is as flexible as his normal flesh. This grants natural armor equal to half Spider Blood Assassin Level. This doesn't stack with any other form of natural armor.

Bleeding Attack* (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin with this ability can cause living opponents to bleed by hitting them with a sneak attack. This attack causes the target to take 1 additional point of damage each round for each die of the Spider Blood Assassin’s sneak attack (e.g., 4d6 equals 4 points of bleed). Bleeding creatures take that amount of damage every round at the start of each of their turns. The bleeding can be stopped by a DC 15 Heal check or the application of any effect that heals hit point damage. Bleeding damage from this ability does not stack with itself. Bleeding damage bypasses any damage reduction the creature might possess.

Camouflage (Su): A Spider Blood Assassin with this ability can change the color of their bodies allowing them to disappear in the wilderness. A Spider Blood Assassin with this ability can use the Stealth skill in any sort of natural terrain, even if the terrain doesn’t grant cover or concealment.
To select this Assassin Technique you must have at least 9 Ranks in the Stealth skill.

Child of Araneae (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin generally hunts alone, but by using their instincts they can form a close bond with a giant spider. This spider is a loyal companion that accompanies the Spider Blood Assassin on his adventures as appropriate for its kind.
This ability functions like the druid vermin companion ability from Ultimate Magic, except that the Spider Blood Assassin's effective druid level is equal to his Spider Blood Assassin level – 5. The animal companion possesses half its master's sneak attack dice as well
To select this Assassin Technique you must have at least 6 ranks in Knowledge (Nature).

Also upon reaching tenth level, you can have your giant spider grow to the large size category but your effective druid level is equal to your Spider Blood Assassin level -7. In all other ways the large giant spider acts as a Child of Araneae

Combat Trick: A Spider Blood Assassin that selects this Technique gains a bonus combat feat.

Drain the Fluids (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin that selects this technique gains one of the macabre gifts of the spider. As a full round action, as Spider Blood Assassin with this ability can drink the fluids from a corpse that has died within the last 10 minutes (or 100 rounds). This heals 1d8 points of health per HD of the drained creature. This ability can only be used a number of times per day equal to your Spider Blood Assassin level + Constitution Modifier.

This ability can only be used on the corpse of a creature with the following types: Aberration, Animal, Dragon, Fey, Humanoid, Magical Beast, Monstrous Humanoid, Outsider without the Elemental Subtype, and Vermin. Once this ability is used on a corpse it cannot be used again on that specific corpse.
To select this Assassin Technique you must have a constitution score of 10 or higher.

Entropic Disciple (Su): While Spiders come in many sizes a Spider Blood Assassin's companion is generally restricted, but some Spider Blood Assassins can use magic to warp their minions size. A Spider Blood Assassin with this technique can change the size of his Child of Araneae a number of times per day equal to 1/2 your Spider Blood Assassin level (Rounding Down).

A use of this ability can change the Child of Araneae's size up to two steps smaller. If used on his Child of Araneae when it is already affected by this ability, it returns to its natural size.

To select this Technique you must have the Child of Araneae Technique. If you have the Disciple of Araneae Advanced Technique then you can use this ability to make the Child of Araneae grow one step larger.

Fast Stealth (Ex): This ability allows a Spider Blood Assassin to move at full speed using the Stealth skill without penalty.

Grip of the Spider (Ex): Using tiny invisible barbs on his flesh a Spider Blood Assassin who has selected this technique can can climb and travel on vertical surfaces or even traverse ceilings as well as a spider does.
The affected creature doesn’t need his hands free to climb in this manner and can use his feet if he is barefoot. The subject gains a climb speed equal to his land speed; furthermore, it need not make Climb checks to traverse a vertical or horizontal surface (even upside down), or a slope. A creature with this ability retains its Dexterity bonus to Armor Class (if any) while climbing, and opponents get no special bonus to their attacks against it.

Ledge Walker (Ex): This ability allows a Spider Blood Assassin to move along narrow surfaces at full speed using the Acrobatics skill without penalty. In addition, a Spider Blood Assassin with this technique is not flat-footed when using Acrobatics to move along narrow surfaces.

Major Mimicry (Sp): Some spiders can disguise themselves to appear as other arthropods, with this technique you can disguise yourself as similiar creatures. A Spider Blood Assassin with this technique cast Alter Self (as the spell) a number of times per day equal to Spider Blood Assassin level + Charisma Bonus (if you have one).
Your caster level for the purpose of this ability is equal to your Spider Blood Assassin Level.
This Technique does not replace Minor Mimicry.

Minor Mimicry (Sp): Spiders have mastered the art of using slight appearance differences to help survive, and now you can master it to. A Spider Blood Assassin with this technique cast Disguise Self (as the spell) a number of times per day equal to Spider Blood Assassin level + Charisma Bonus (if you have one).
Your caster level for the purpose of this ability is equal to your Spider Blood Assassin Level.

Sense of the Hunter (Ex): This ability causes the Spider Blood Assassin to sense his prey by feeling the vibrations in the air, he gains Blindsight with a radius of 40ft.
To select this Assassin Technique you must have at least 6 ranks in the Perception skill.

Silk Weaver (Su): Spider Blood Assassin’s sometimes wait in their webs or in trees, then lower themselves silently on silk strands and leap onto prey passing beneath. A single strand is strong enough to support the Spider Blood Assassin and one creature of the same size. Creating a silk strand is a standard action and creates 30ft or less long strand of silk.

Silk Strands created this way must either be verticle or horizontal in nature. Verticle Silk must be attached to a ceiling, and each end of a horizontal silk strand must be attached to a solid verticle surface (Such as two walls).

To select this technique you must have a Dexterity score of 13 or more.

Also upon reaching fifteenth level, you are counted as also having the Araneae Hand Technique if you don't already have it.

Slow Reactions* (Ex): Opponents damaged by the Spider Blood Assassin’s sneak attack can't make attacks of opportunity for 1 round.

Spider’s Leap (Ex): You take no penalties for making an Acrobatics Skill Checks to jump without a running start, and you gain +15 racial bonus on all Acrobatics Skill Checks when jumping.

Surprise Attack (Ex): During the surprise round, opponents are always considered flat-footed to a Spider Blood Assassin with this ability, even if they have already acted.

Tarantula’s Tool (Su): A Spider Blood Assassin with this technique can warp his face and gain huge fangs similar to that of a Tarantula. As a standard action a Spider Blood Assassin with this technique can grow a bite attack. This is a primary attack that deals 1d6 damage plus 1-1/2 times the Spider Blood Assassin's Strength bonus. These fangs and bite attack be be dismissed as a free action.

Unrelenting Grip (Ex): The tiny barbs with allow you ascend walls empowered your grip with other things. A Spider Blood Assassin with this technique gains a bonus on checks made to grapple a foe and to his Combat Maneuver Defense whenever an opponent tries to grapple him equal to a quarter of his Spider Blood Assassin level.
In addition you can never be disarmed.

To select this technique you must have the Grip of the Spider ability.

Weapon of the Web (Ex): By weaving web together you can create a weapon. A Spider Blood Assassin with this technique can create a Whip as a Full-Round action.

Also upon reaching fifth level, you can decide to create a Webbed Fang (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=13096028#post13096028) by using this ability and losing a non-magical dagger or a Webbed Claw (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=13096028#post13096028) by using this ability and losing a non-magical shortsword.

To select this technique you must have the Silk Weaver Technique.

Weapon Training: A Spider Blood Assassin that selects this technique gains Weapon Focus as a bonus feat.

At 10th level the Spider Blood Assassin gains Greater Weapon Focus as a bonus feat.

Web Sling (Ex): As a move-action a Spider Blood Assassin with this technique can launch a strand of web and use it for travel. As part of this action he may move up to 50' in a straight line (as viewed from above).
If he is at ground level he must first jump at least 5 feet off the ground (DC 20 or higher, see the Acrobatics skill description). This may be done as part of the same move action used to swing but the movement consumes part of the 50'.
Each time he uses this ability he must anchor the strand to an object at least 10 feet above him (at least 15' off the ground) and halfway between his current position and new position (as viewed from above). After this movement he ends his turn the same height above the ground. On his next turn he may release the thread as a free action to jump, sling again or to perform some other action.

These threads last for 2 hours before decaying.

This Technique requires Silk Weaver, and a Dexterity score of 15 or more.

Widow’s Toxin: A Spider Blood Assassin with this ability have a venomous toxin in their saliva. As such whenever he uses a bite attack the target is affected by the venom. Also as a full-round action he can coat his weapon in this venom.
The poison can affect a target via injury or being ingested (this can be done with a kiss). The poison has the following statistics: save Fort DC 10 + 1/2 Spider Blood Assassin Level + Constitution Bonus; frequency 1/round for 4 rounds; effect 1d4 Strength damage; cure 1 save.

Trapfinding: At level two a Spider Blood Assassin adds 1/2 his level to Perception skill checks made to locate traps and to Disable Device skill checks (minimum +1). A Spider Blood Assassin of second level or above can use Disable Device to disarm magic traps.

Evasion (Ex): At 3rd level and higher, a Spider Blood Assassin can avoid even magical and unusual attacks with great agility. If he makes a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, he instead takes no damage. Evasion can be used only if the Spider Blood Assassin is wearing light armor or no armor. A helpless Spider Blood Assassin does not gain the benefit of evasion.

Spider Blood: At 3rd level, the Spider Blood Assassin has innate knowledge on poisons and his body his naturally resistant to them. A Spider Blood Assassin gains a +1 saving throw bonus against poisons of all kinds (Even those that are magical or supernatural in nature).
In addition any poison he creates via Craft (Alchemy) has its Fort DC increased by +1.
These bonuses increase by +1 every two levels.

Spider Tongue (Ex): At 3rd level, the Spider Blood Assassin gains a +5 insight bonus to Handle Animal checks involving spider or spider-like creatures.

Uncanny Dodge (Ex): Starting at 4th level, a Spider Blood Assassin can react to danger before his senses would normally allow him to do so. He cannot be caught flat-footed, nor does she lose her Dex bonus to AC if the attacker is invisible. He still loses his Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. A Spider Blood Assassin with this ability can still lose his Dexterity bonus to AC if an opponent successfully uses the feint action (see Combat) against him.

Trap Sense (Ex): At 5th level, a Spider Blood Assassin gains an intuitive sense that alerts him to danger from traps, giving her a +1 bonus on Reflex saves made to avoid traps and a +1 dodge bonus to AC against attacks made by traps. These bonuses rise to +2 when the Spider Blood Assassin reaches 10th level, to +3 when he reaches 15th level, and to +4 when he reaches 20th level.

Trap sense bonuses gained from multiple classes stack.

Weapon Finesse: Once a Spider Blood Assassin attains 5th level he gains Weapon Finesse as a bonus feat if he doesn't already have it. In addition its normal effects it also affects the web attacks created by a Spider Blood Assassin with the Web Hunter Advanced Assassin Technique.

If the Spider Blood Assassin already possessed the Weapon Finesse bonus feat, then he gains a Assassin Technique instead.

Spider Empathy (Ex): As of Sixth level a Spider Blood Assassin can improve the initial attitude of a spider or spider-like creature (Ask your DM).
This ability functions just like a Diplomacy check to improve the attitude of a person (see Using Skills). The Spider Blood Assassin rolls 1d20 and adds half his Spider Blood Assassin level and his Knowledge (Nature) bonus to determine the wild empathy check result.
To use spider empathy, the Spider Blood Assassin and the Spider must be within 30 feet of one another under normal visibility conditions. Generally, influencing an Spider in this way takes 1 minute, but, as with influencing people, it might take more or less time.

Hidden Weapons (Ex): At 7th level, a Spider Blood Assassin becomes a master at hiding weapons on his body. He adds his assassin level to all Sleight of Hand skill checks made to prevent others from noticing them.

Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin of 8th level or higher can no longer be flanked.

This defense denies another Rogue or Spider Blood Assassin the ability to sneak attack the character by flanking her, unless the attacker has at least four more rogue or Spider Blood Assassin levels than the target does.

If a character already has improved uncanny dodge from another class, the levels from the classes that grant uncanny dodge stack to determine the minimum rogue or Spider Blood Assassin level required to flank the character.

Advanced Techniques: At 10th level, and every two levels thereafter, a Spider Blood Assassin can choose one of the following advanced techniques in place of a assassin technique.

List of Advanced Techniques

A Touch of Venom (Ex): You can now transmit your venom through your hands via tiny invisible barbs. If the Spider Blood Assassin successfully delivers an unarmed strike or a melee touch attack, they may use their Widow's Toxin Assassin Technique in addition to the normal effects of the attack.

To select this technique you must have the Widow's Toxin technique.

Crippling Strike* (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin with this ability can sneak attack opponents with such precision that her blows weaken and hamper them. An opponent damaged by one of her sneak attacks also takes 2 points of Strength damage.

Death Attack* (Ex): If an Spider Blood Assassin studies his victim for 3 rounds and then makes a sneak attack and successfully deals damage, the sneak attack has the additional effect of possibly either paralyzing or killing the target (user's choice). Studying the victim is a standard action. The death attack fails if the target detects the Spider Blood Assassin or recognizes the Spider Blood Assassin as an enemy (although the attack might still be a sneak attack if the target is denied his Dexterity bonus to his Armor Class or is flanked). If the victim of such a death attack fails a Fortitude save (DC 5 + the Spider Blood Assassin's class level + the Spider Blood Assassin's Int modifier) against the kill effect, she dies. If the saving throw fails against the paralysis effect, the victim is rendered helpless and unable to act for 1d6 rounds plus 1 round per level of the Spider Blood Assassin. If the victim's saving throw succeeds, the attack is just a normal sneak attack. Once the Spider Blood Assassin has completed the 3 rounds of study, he must make the death attack within the next 3 rounds.

If a death attack is attempted and fails (the victim makes her save) or if the Spider Blood Assassin does not launch the attack within 3 rounds of completing the study, 3 new rounds of study are required before he can attempt another death attack.

Defensive Roll (Ex): With this advanced technique, the Spider Blood Assassin can roll with a potentially lethal blow to take less damage from it than he otherwise would. Once per day, when he would be reduced to 0 or fewer hit points by damage in combat (from a weapon or other blow, not a spell or special ability), the Spider Blood Assassin can attempt to roll with the damage. To use this ability, the Spider Blood Assassin must attempt a Reflex saving throw (DC = damage dealt). If the save succeeds, he takes only half damage from the blow; if it fails, he takes full damage. He must be aware of the attack and able to react to it in order to execute his defensive roll—if he is denied his Dexterity bonus to AC, he can't use this ability. Since this effect would not normally allow a character to make a Reflex save for half damage, the Spider Blood Assassin's evasion ability does not apply to the defensive roll.

Disciple of Araneae (Ex): With this Technique the effective Druid Level for a medium sized Child of Araneae is equal to your Spider Blood Assassin Level. Also your effective Druid Level for a Large Sized Child Of Araneae is equal to your Spider Blood Assassin level -3.

Improved Evasion (Ex): This works like evasion, except that while the Spider Blood Assassin still takes no damage on a successful Reflex saving throw against attacks, he henceforth takes only half damage on a failed save. A helpless Spider Blood Assassin does not gain the benefit of improved evasion.

Mark of Kaine (Ex): Using the same way you walk on walls, you grasp onto your foe with amazing force and pull back, your grip ripping the flesh from their bodies. If the Spider Blood Assassin successfully delivers an unarmed strike or a melee touch attack, they may deal 1d4 constitution damage in addition to the normal effects of the attack.

To select this technique you must have the Grip of the Spider technique.

Opportunist (Ex): Once per round, the Spider Blood Assassin can make an attack of opportunity against an opponent who has just been struck for damage in melee by another character. This attack counts as an attack of opportunity for that round. Even a Spider Blood Assassin with the Combat Reflexes feat can't use the opportunist ability more than once per round.

Pounce Upon the Prey (Ex): If this Advanced Technique is selected the Spider Blood Assassin gains the ability to make a pounce attack, with the following changes: instead of it being a charge the Spider Blood Assassin can jump from a distance.

To select this advanced technique you must have the Spider Leap ability.

Weapon Mastery (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin who takes this technique gains Weapon Specialization as a bonus feat.

At 15th level the Spider Blood Assassin gains Greater Weapon Specialization as a bonus feat.

A Spider Blood Assassin must have the Weapon Training technique to select this one.

Web Hunter (Ex):: If a Spider Blood Assassin selects this technique their ability in weaving webs increases allowing them to make traps to ensare prey. They can throw a web three times a day. This is similar to an attack with a net but has a maximum range of 50 feet, with a range increment of 10 feet, and is effective against targets up to one size category larger than the Spider Blood Assassin. An entangled creature can escape with a successful Escape Artist check (DC 16) or burst it with a Strength check (DC 20). This is a standard action. The check DCs are Constitution-based. If used one a target area without a creature in it creates sticky webbing.

Spider Blood Assassins often create sheets of sticky webbing from 5 to 60 feet square. They usually position these sheets to snare flying creatures but can also try to trap prey on the ground. Approaching creatures must succeed on a DC 20 Spot check to notice a web; otherwise they stumble into it and become trapped as though by a successful web attack. Attempts to escape or burst the webbing gain a +5 bonus if the trapped creature has something to walk on or grab while pulling free. Each 5-foot section has 14 hit points, and sheet webs have a hardness of 5

A Spider Blood Assassin can move across its own web at its land speed and can pinpoint the location of any creature touching its web.

Feat: A Spider Blood Assassin may gain any feat that he qualifies for in place of an Assassin technique.

Weapon Subtly (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin of 10th level can add half of his dexterity bonus to damage rolls as long as the weapon used in the attack is an acceptable weapon for Weapon Finesse.

Whispers of the Web (Sp): As his connection the arachnids grows his can eventually learn to communicate with spiders and similar creatures.
A Spider Blood Assassin of twelfth level or higher can converse with Arachnids as if they shared a language.

Nest of Fangs (Sp): Slowly a Spider Blood Assassin amasses a number of spiders which can do his bidding.
As of 15th level a Spider Blood Assassin can cast Summon Swarm (as a spell-like ability) as a full round action. This functions as the spell except for the following:
The swarm is under the full control of the Spider Blood Assassin and can be commanded as a free action
The swarm must be a swarm of Spiders
The swarm's Hit Dice is increased to 15
The duration is changed to 24 hours.
The spell can be dismissed prematurely if the swarm is adjacent to the Spider Blood Assassin.

This ability can be used once per day per five levels of Spider Blood Assassin. You can only have one Swarm of Spiders summoned by this ability at any one time.

A Thousand Eyes (Sp): Once a Spider Blood Assassin has achieved his 20th level he can reach out and touch the minds of spiders at a distance. As a move-action he can scry (as the Greater Scrying Spell) on any of his Child of Araneae, Spider Swarms, or Spider Thralls. You can only scry on a Child of Araneae, Spider Swarm, or Spider Thrall if it is on the same plane of existance as you.

If you have the Child of Araneae Assassin Technique, you also gain a telepathic link with your Child of Araneae. This telepathy works as long as you are both on the same plane of existance.

Spider Thrall (Su): Your connection to spiders allows you to form near unbreakable bonds with spiderkind. As of level twenty a Spider Blood Assassin can undergo a ritual with a Spider or Spider-like creature (ask your DM). This ritual takes an hour to complete and a willing Spider to remain still and reach of the Spider Blood Assassin. Once this ritual is complete the spider is under your control.
This functions as the Charm Monster spell except for the following:

You can communicate telepathically with the Thrall.
The duration is permanent.
Target doesn't make a save when the ability is used, but saves are still made when trying to force the spider to do things against its will are still made.
The Spider Thrall gain +5 morale bonus on attack, armor class, and Stealth Checks.

Your caster level for the purpose of this ability is equal to your Spider Blood Assassin Level.

You can have up to your Spider Blood Assassin level in Spider Thralls.

Ex-Spider Blood Assassin's
If you become infected with a Symbiote and fail to get rid of it within the next 1d4 days, all your class levels in Spider Blood Assassin become levels in the Tainted Scion of Venom class (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=13160906#post13160906), and you can no longer take levels in SBA, unless a spell such as Wish or Atonement is used or the Symbiote is removed.
If the Symbiote is removed then all your levels in Tainted Scion of Venom turn into Spider Blood Assassin.

Spider Blood Assassin's in Blades Of Keran
In Blades of Keran, to become a Spider Blood Assassin you must join the organisation of Spider Blood Assassins. This requires the following:

Be a Newesti.
Never had a history of being a Renegade Newesti.
Your Familiar must be a Spider or Spider-like creature.
You must swear loyalty to the Estikar Council.

If you are a Kylanth, then you need not be part of the organisation of Spider Blood Assassins as this class represents your growing spider traits.

masterstalker2

2012-04-17, 11:38 PM

I have to admit, as someone who played a Ninja as their second character, this class looks amazing.

In other news, if you were to combine Ledge Walker, Grip of the Spider, Sense of the Hunter, Silk Weaver, Spider's Leap, you would have Spiderman and you know that I am right. Now all we need is a bard...

It would work, except that once the bard starts playing the Spiderman theme song, rocks would fall on us.

Milo v3

2012-04-17, 11:48 PM

masterstalker2

2012-04-18, 01:29 AM

Milo v3

2012-04-18, 05:08 AM

How hard is it to make a homebrew class? I'm asking because I'm planning a campaign in the world of Guild Wars 2, and if I go through with it, I'll need to work on 6 of the classes, or just leave most of them out.

Depends on a lot of things. I make classes a lot faster if I have a lot of knowledge on the theme and am inspired and might take a week at most, but with a different class I'm making it has currently taken half a month.

And there is also around three classes that I have had half-made for months.

But it isn't really the difficulty that slows you down. You need a drive to make homebrew, and for me it is generally rather quick if I have the drive and slow if I don't have any.

masterstalker2

2012-04-18, 05:32 PM

Thank you for replying to my question about making a homebrew class.

I have a few thoughts on some of the abilities for the Assassin.

Whispers of the Web seems to me like it would be better if the Assassin got it at level 10, and Spider Empathy seems to me like it might be better at level 5.

Also for Whispers of the Web, I think that there should also be a low level version of it where you have to make a Linguistics check to see if they understand you, which is replaced by the normal version of Whispers of the Web when you gain it at level 10/12 (depends on whether you change it).

By the time that the Assassin gets to level 5, it's likely that he'll have already taken Weapon Finesse as a feat, so I think that either they gain it at first level (which would probably be a bad idea) or, upon reaching level five, they gain Weapon Finesse if they don't already have it, and if they do, then they can either choose another feat to get instead, or choose an Assassin Technique to learn.

About Weapon Subtly, is it that it adds half of your DEX to your damage which will already be using DEX from Weapon Finesse?

I think that the Spiderblood Assassin should have Handle Animal act as a trained skill if he is using it on a spider, and maybe a bonus to Diplomacy and Handle Animal when using them on a spider.

I would also like to see the SB Assassin raise their sneak attack damage at the same rate that rogues and ninjas do. I would also like to see the same done with the skill points per level, so that is the same as it is for Rogue and Ninja.

Also, a Technique I would like to see added is a web grenade-type technique, where the Assassin throws a ball of web that explodes upon impact, dealing no damage, but entangling everyone in a 5' radius.

I would also like to see a few of things added to Silk Weaver/Web Hunter, the ability to use web to make a sort of kite/parachute to slow down your fall and allow you to land safely, and the ability to use Silk Weaver to grab items and pull them to you or send flying away. Another use that I think should be added to Silk Weaver is the ability to use it to grapple enemies and pull them towards you or possibly pin them. I would enjoy seeing the ability to use Silk Weaver to pull yourself towards a wall at a faster speed (sending the web at a wall and using it to propel yourself to it and land safely on it if you have Grip of the Spider or next to it if you don't). Also, could Silk Weaver be used to go from wall to wall (Spiderman-style, I just had to ask this)?

If you read all of it and use some of it in the Spiderblood Assassin, then thank you, and these are just some thoughts I came up with, so use them if you like. Also, I would like to know what bonuses to my AC I would get if I used Silk Weaver to make myself light armor made of spider silk since spider silk is as strong as steel and really durable.

Milo v3

2012-04-18, 07:40 PM

Whispers of the Web seems to me like it would be better if the Assassin got it at level 10, and Spider Empathy seems to me like it might be better at level 5.I think that would add too many abilities to levels 10 and 5 (considering the scaling)

Also for Whispers of the Web, I think that there should also be a low level version of it where you have to make a Linguistics check to see if they understand you, which is replaced by the normal version of Whispers of the Web when you gain it at level 10/12 (depends on whether you change it).
Spider Empathy was designed to be a lower level version of Whispers of the Web.

By the time that the Assassin gets to level 5, it's likely that he'll have already taken Weapon Finesse as a feat, so I think that either they gain it at first level (which would probably be a bad idea) or, upon reaching level five, they gain Weapon Finesse if they don't already have it, and if they do, then they can either choose another feat to get instead, or choose an Assassin Technique to learn.
A bonus feat sounds rather overpowered as it could grant any feat. And the Assassin's balance was based on one for every two levels, so I would prefer to not give them extra Techniques. But I think I could put a bonus in.

About Weapon Subtly, is it that it adds half of your DEX to your damage which will already be using DEX from Weapon Finesse?I think you misunderstand Weapon Finesse. Weapon Finesse's bonus is only to attack rolls, while Weapon Subtly's bonus is only to damage rolls.

I think that the Spiderblood Assassin should have Handle Animal act as a trained skill if he is using it on a spider, and maybe a bonus to Diplomacy and Handle Animal when using them on a spider.
Interesting idea.

I would also like to see the SB Assassin raise their sneak attack damage at the same rate that rogues and ninjas do. I would also like to see the same done with the skill points per level, so that is the same as it is for Rogue and Ninja.
I think that would be rather overpowered.

Also, a Technique I would like to see added is a web grenade-type technique, where the Assassin throws a ball of web that explodes upon impact, dealing no damage, but entangling everyone in a 5' radius.
If I can figure out how it would work I'll put it in.

I would also like to see a few of things added to Silk Weaver/Web Hunter, the ability to use web to make a sort of kite/parachute to slow down your fall and allow you to land safely, and the ability to use Silk Weaver to grab items and pull them to you or send flying away. Another use that I think should be added to Silk Weaver is the ability to use it to grapple enemies and pull them towards you or possibly pin them. I would enjoy seeing the ability to use Silk Weaver to pull yourself towards a wall at a faster speed (sending the web at a wall and using it to propel yourself to it and land safely on it if you have Grip of the Spider or next to it if you don't). Also, could Silk Weaver be used to go from wall to wall (Spiderman-style, I just had to ask this)?Parachute wouldn't work sadly, yes to grab and pull, I don't see how you would pull yourself towards a wall, and I'll add in rules for spider-man style webswinging.

If you read all of it and use some of it in the Spiderblood Assassin, then thank you, and these are just some thoughts I came up with, so use them if you like. Also, I would like to know what bonuses to my AC I would get if I used Silk Weaver to make myself light armor made of spider silk since spider silk is as strong as steel and really durable.
Despite it being stronger than steel in some ways, it has several flaws for being made into armor.
Firstly, it would be amazingly fragile until it is made thick, it would break if you raised your arm while making it.
Second, because of its fragility it must be made onto the person directly and won't be able to be taken off without destroying the suit.
Third, if it actually protected you from anything more damaging than dust it will restrict your movement if not stop it all together.

masterstalker2

2012-04-18, 08:28 PM

Thank you again for replying to my post.

The reason that I suggested the web parachute is that some spiders do that in real life. Also, Wizards get the Fly spell at level 5, and Sorcerers get it at level 6. The web slinging allows travel through some areas better than others. By allowing the SB Assassin the ability to make a sort of kite made out of web, they can get through places like forests much easier, and can be combined with the web slinging to keep them going. Maybe you could have it so that, if you have Silk Weaving, if you reach level 5 or you get the Technique after level 5, you can use the kite to glide to help keep up with those flying wizards.

Also, how exactly would it be overpowered to have the sneak attack and skill points progress at the same rate as a ninja or rogue?

About Weapon Finesse, my group has it so that it is also used for damage.

Also, you are already giving the SB Assassin a bonus feat, you could just give them options for them to choose from where they must meet the requirements and they have to be on the list, also it would be nice to have the ability to exchange it for a Technique, not an Advanced Technique of course, just a regular one. Also, need I mention the fact that a Fighter gets 11 bonus feet, I mean sure they don't get many abilities, but it still helps make them a lot stronger if done right.

I suggest having it so that spiders start off neutral or unfriendly towards the SB Assassin if that spider is normally hostile to make it possible to talk to and befriend the spider.

Also, about using web to get onto a wall, it's based on Spiderman, mostly a memory of one of the games where, in one level, you have to get pass laser sensors, and to do that you use web to go from one wall to another without touching the sensors, and when you get to the wall, you stay on the wall. It's like Spiderman using webslinging to go from building to building and being able to just stop and hang out on the side of a building, I mean, he doesn't fall off, now does he?

May I also suggest adding some Weapon Proficiencies (like katanas and wakizashis) because Ninjas ended up making the Rogue class seem much less useful, especially with all their weapon proficiencies.

Also, how about the ability to use Silk Weaving to, let's say, grab a bomb that is near an ally with a strand of web, and send it flying off behind you. Also, how about using your web to disarm an enemy by using it to grab their weapon. How about using your web powers to pin an enemy to the ground or to a tree.

Also, I think that the ability to bring back the spider web that you make would be useful (using the web to descend from the ceiling, stab a guard, and then have the web recede so that your on the ceiling again).

How about the ability to have the web be held by your feet when you stop moving downward, but when you do move upward/downward, you have to use your hands? (so that an SB Assassin could just come down, break a guards' neck, and come back up, could be explained by having that part of the web be sticky)

You just know that people will be refering to the Sense of the Hunter Technique as their "spidey senses tingling." Well, that is until the GM has a rock fall on them...

For Grip of the Spider, did I read this right, you can walk on walls and across ceilings using only your feet? Heck yeah. *stands on wall, uses Oil of Silence on a rifle, and shoots a guard* Was I reading it right though?

I suggest that you set this class as an alternate class for Rogue (like Ninja is) so that players can take levels in SB Assassin or Rogue or Ninja, but only one of those three, not two of them or all three.

Also, how are there not more people commenting on this class?

masterstalker2

2012-04-18, 11:45 PM

This is going to be my attempt at making web slinging/gliding mechanics, because I can and I'm bored.

[spoiler] A Spider Blood Assassin with the Silk Weaver Technique has the ability to use this ability as an alternate form of movement, using the strength of spider silk to keep him in the air. The silk used is a special kind that dissolves once the Assassin releases it for more than two rounds.

The SB Assassin sends web from his hand to a location of his choice (or just a location that allows him to continue moving in the direction he wants to) and, if held, can be used to turn, as in turn around corners or turn around.

This form of movement allows the Spider Blood Assassin to avoid many obstacles that would hinder his movement if he was on the ground (for example, spikes). Though there may be other obstacles, like birds and bridges high up going from tower to tower.

If the Spider Blood Assassin hits a structure, he can make web to get down safely or continue web slinging before falling. If he has the Grip of the Spider Technique, than he will not fall and can climb up the wall if he wants to get to a window or some other spot on the structure.

A Spider Blood Assassin with the Silk Weaver Technique who reaches level 5, or learns the Technique after level 5, gains the ability to use Silk Weaver to make a sort of kite and glide around with it, using Silk Weaver to raise his altitude when he to low and is near a structure taller than he is high.

A Spider Blood Assassin is also capable of using Silk Weaver to propel himself towards a wall, landing next to the wall, or on the wall if he has Grip of the Spider. [spoiler]

Please tell me what you think about it, I just came up with this in about 10-20 minutes at 12:30 AM.

PS - If someone would tell me how to make spoilers on my posts, I would appreciate it.

Milo v3

2012-04-19, 12:28 AM

Thank you again for replying to my post.

The reason that I suggested the web parachute is that some spiders do that in real life. They don't actually. Some people call it a parachute but all they are doing is creating a webline, letting the web be caught in the wind, this then pulls them with the web because of their tiny weight.

Also, Wizards get the Fly spell at level 5, and Sorcerers get it at level 6. The web slinging allows travel through some areas better than others. By allowing the SB Assassin the ability to make a sort of kite made out of web, they can get through places like forests much easier, and can be combined with the web slinging to keep them going. Maybe you could have it so that, if you have Silk Weaving, if you reach level 5 or you get the Technique after level 5, you can use the kite to glide to help keep up with those flying wizards.
I don't think Wizards can do it, makes it a valid argument for balance. Also if you can web swing, why would you ever glide?

Also, how exactly would it be overpowered to have the sneak attack and skill points progress at the same rate as a ninja or rogue?Because the class in its current state is as powerful as a Ninja or Rogue, if not more powerful. Adding in more power, makes it more powerful.

About Weapon Finesse, my group has it so that it is also used for damage.That doesn't change how my ability works though.

Also, you are already giving the SB Assassin a bonus feat, you could just give them options for them to choose from where they must meet the requirements and they have to be on the list, also it would be nice to have the ability to exchange it for a Technique, not an Advanced Technique of course, just a regular one. Also, need I mention the fact that a Fighter gets 11 bonus feet, I mean sure they don't get many abilities, but it still helps make them a lot stronger if done right.
I've changed it so that you gain a Technique.

I suggest having it so that spiders start off neutral or unfriendly towards the SB Assassin if that spider is normally hostile to make it possible to talk to and befriend the spider.
That would mean mind controlling every spider creature you come across, that would be too powerful flavour wise for me to put that at a low level.

Also, about using web to get onto a wall, it's based on Spiderman, mostly a memory of one of the games where, in one level, you have to get pass laser sensors, and to do that you use web to go from one wall to another without touching the sensors, and when you get to the wall, you stay on the wall. It's like Spiderman using webslinging to go from building to building and being able to just stop and hang out on the side of a building, I mean, he doesn't fall off, now does he?I was meaning how does he propel himself towards the wall. As this class is you could probably already do that. Jump at the wall then use Grip of the Spider to hold onto the building.

May I also suggest adding some Weapon Proficiencies (like katanas and wakizashis) because Ninjas ended up making the Rogue class seem much less useful, especially with all their weapon proficiencies.
I see no reason to add in japanese weapons into a class that has nothing to do with japan, flavour-wise or mechanically.

Also, how about the ability to use Silk Weaving to, let's say, grab a bomb that is near an ally with a strand of web, and send it flying off behind you. Also, how about using your web to disarm an enemy by using it to grab their weapon. How about using your web powers to pin an enemy to the ground or to a tree.
So far you can pull objects and weapons towards you but I haven't got the mechanics to make you throw it away. I do plan on adding in the ranged grapple using web though.

Also, I think that the ability to bring back the spider web that you make would be useful (using the web to descend from the ceiling, stab a guard, and then have the web recede so that your on the ceiling again).
Good idea.

You just know that people will be refering to the Sense of the Hunter Technique as their "spidey senses tingling." Well, that is until the GM has a rock fall on them...
:smallamused:

For Grip of the Spider, did I read this right, you can walk on walls and across ceilings using only your feet? Heck yeah. *stands on wall, uses Oil of Silence on a rifle, and shoots a guard* Was I reading it right though?
:smallamused:

I suggest that you set this class as an alternate class for Rogue (like Ninja is) so that players can take levels in SB Assassin or Rogue or Ninja, but only one of those three, not two of them or all three.
I didn't know that you can't be a Rogue and a Ninja. :smallconfused:

This is going to be my attempt at making web slinging/gliding mechanics, because I can and I'm bored.

[/spoiler]
A Spider Blood Assassin with the Silk Weaver Technique has the ability to use this ability as an alternate form of movement, using the strength of spider silk to keep him in the air. The silk used is a special kind that dissolves once the Assassin releases it for more than two rounds.

The SB Assassin sends web from his hand to a location of his choice (or just a location that allows him to continue moving in the direction he wants to) and, if held, can be used to turn, as in turn around corners or turn around.

This form of movement allows the Spider Blood Assassin to avoid many obstacles that would hinder his movement if he was on the ground (for example, spikes). Though there may be other obstacles, like birds and bridges high up going from tower to tower.

If the Spider Blood Assassin hits a structure, he can make web to get down safely or continue web slinging before falling. If he has the Grip of the Spider Technique, than he will not fall and can climb up the wall if he wants to get to a window or some other spot on the structure.

A Spider Blood Assassin with the Silk Weaver Technique who reaches level 5, or learns the Technique after level 5, gains the ability to use Silk Weaver to make a sort of kite and glide around with it, using Silk Weaver to raise his altitude when he to low and is near a structure taller than he is high.

A Spider Blood Assassin is also capable of using Silk Weaver to propel himself towards a wall, landing next to the wall, or on the wall if he has Grip of the Spider.
[/spoiler]

Please tell me what you think about it, I just came up with this in about 10-20 minutes at 12:30 AM.
Spoilers work by doing a this (without the ?): [SP?OILER]Inside area[/SPOILER] or you could click the SPOIL button at the top of the text area of the edit/new post page.

As for your ability, how much distance can they travel each round with this ability, how much does the altitude change with each use of the kite, how far can you go with the kite, how far distance can you move with propeling yourself to the wall, does it take an action?

masterstalker2

2012-04-19, 01:05 AM

The distance the kite can go, well I'm not sure, it depends on whether or not they continue propelling themselves using web, and the kite would, for the most part, be used in areas where it would be hard to use webs (forests, deserts, etc). Also, for propelling yourself towards a wall, you send the web at the wall, it hits the wall, and you then have it recede, pulling you towards the wall a good speed without hitting the ground, though that would probably need to be balanced, and it could be used to get pass traps or go down a hallway at high speeds.
*cue a minotaur seeing a blur speeding pass him and the minotaur falling down in surprise*

For sending items away after grabbing them with the web, think of a sling, only instead of spinning it in your hand, it spins around you, and you spin the item around on the end of the web, and then you let go, sending it flying away.

For weapon proficiencies, the katana and wakizashi were examples of items that could be added.

You never gave me a response on the things about using the web to go down behind a guard and using a grapple roll to break his neck while staying up using a sticky part of web between your legs.

Propelling yourself pass a wall, I think that may be a free action, I'm not sure. The distance you can travel each round would depend on the wind (I was thinking a base of 60 feet, like the Fly spell, or maybe 45 feet), also it depends on if he is propelling himself pass a wall, which he can do to gain speed and altitude. Doing a dive and then pulling up can also add speed.

May I also suggest you give the Spider Blood Assassin proficiency in Whips and an ability that allows the the SB Assassin to use his web as a one-handed whip, and can dual-wield them, possibly with daggers on the end if he attaches them.

How about, as a mount, the SB Assassin gains a large-sized spider as a mount as a class ability, since Samurai and Cavalier and Wizards and Sorcerers can summon mounts.... you know what, never mind, he can just websling and hitch a ride on one of them. Though you could have the Child of Araneae grow large-sized as a mount when the SB Assassin chooses to but gains no size bonuses or penalties except for a bonus to speed which is only received out of combat.

Also, seeing as how this is effectively an alternate class for the rogue, it seems like they should get the full Sneak Attack damage, not like SB Assassin can turn invisible or have a ki pool, while the Rogue and Ninja get plently of things that the SB Assassin don't have, the SB Assassin also have things that Rogue and Ninja don't have.

I'm surprised I'm thinking straight, since it's 2:00 AM and I went to sleep at 3:00 AM yesterday.

Also, how am I the only person, other than you Milo, who is commenting on this, it's an amazing class.

Milo v3

2012-04-19, 01:44 AM

The distance the kite can go, well I'm not sure, it depends on whether or not they continue propelling themselves using web, and the kite would, for the most part, be used in areas where it would be hard to use webs (forests, deserts, etc).
The Kite doesn't make sense though, the air would go through it, and if it doesn't I doubt it would be generate enough lift to slow your decent.

Also, for propelling yourself towards a wall, you send the web at the wall, it hits the wall, and you then have it recede, pulling you towards the wall a good speed without hitting the ground, though that would probably need to be balanced, and it could be used to get pass traps or go down a hallway at high speeds.
*cue a minotaur seeing a blur speeding pass him and the minotaur falling down in surprise*
It isn't a mechanically device, you can't get the web to receed.

For sending items away after grabbing them with the web, think of a sling, only instead of spinning it in your hand, it spins around you, and you spin the item around on the end of the web, and then you let go, sending it flying away.I understand that, I was more meaning mechanically.

For weapon proficiencies, the katana and wakizashi were examples of items that could be added.Those weapon have nothing to do with this class though as this isn't Japanese Oriented.

You never gave me a response on the things about using the web to go down behind a guard and using a grapple roll to break his neck while staying up using a sticky part of web between your legs.I don't see why you can't do that already.

May I also suggest you give the Spider Blood Assassin proficiency in Whips and an ability that allows the the SB Assassin to use his web as a one-handed whip, and can dual-wield them, possibly with daggers on the end if he attaches them.That dagger whip sounds more like an item rather than an ability. But making a whip doesn't sound overpowered.

How about, as a mount, the SB Assassin gains a large-sized spider as a mount as a class ability, since Samurai and Cavalier and Wizards and Sorcerers can summon mounts.... you know what, never mind, he can just websling and hitch a ride on one of them. Though you could have the Child of Araneae grow large-sized as a mount when the SB Assassin chooses to but gains no size bonuses or penalties except for a bonus to speed which is only received out of combat.
It shouldn't be hard to gain a large Child of Araneae I'll add one in.

Also, seeing as how this is effectively an alternate class for the rogue, it seems like they should get the full Sneak Attack damage, not like SB Assassin can turn invisible or have a ki pool, while the Rogue and Ninja get plently of things that the SB Assassin don't have, the SB Assassin also have things that Rogue and Ninja don't have.
I guess. I would prefer a second opinion before I make changes to this though, as it changes the balance significantly.

Also, how am I the only person, other than you Milo, who is commenting on this, it's an amazing class.
Not sure might be people already saw it a month ago, in a competition. In fact the 1st place award in my signature is my prize for this class.

masterstalker2

2012-04-19, 01:54 AM

Milo v3

2012-04-19, 02:57 AM

Ok, for the Dagger Whip, it's a dagger at the end of a web, and for the proficiencies, I didn't mean give him Katanas and wakizashis, those were examples, you can give him a longsword, scimitar, Cat-o-nine-tails.

Also, I'll post suggestions for the web swinging in the web swinging thread.

Added Whip and the Dagger Whip to the proficieny as wells editing the Techniques a bit and adding in a way to make weapons.

masterstalker2

2012-04-19, 05:50 PM

I'm not sure whether or not I was kidding when I had mentioned the Dagger Whip, but I don't think I was... but I do not regret suggesting it, though it does need to be a bit stronger, or else the SB Assassin could just buy a Scorpion Dagger instead.

I was also thinking that maybe there could also be other versions, like a version where you attach a short sword to the end.

Also, I was thinking that you unlock the Weapon of the Web at level 5 if you have Silk Weaver, rather than having as a separate Technique, same with Araneae Hand, which you have learned at level 10, though it seems like it should be learned at level 5.

For Camouflage, it says you need 12 ranks in stealth, wouldn't that mean you have to be level 12 to learn it so that, by then, you'll have put 12 skill points into stealth or is this something the group has been doing wrong (which I hope it is).

Also, for Child of Araneae, I was thinking that at level 10, you can also call a large-sized spider, which can also be used as a mount.

Milo v3

2012-04-19, 08:31 PM

I'm not sure whether or not I was kidding when I had mentioned the Dagger Whip, but I don't think I was... but I do not regret suggesting it, though it does need to be a bit stronger, or else the SB Assassin could just buy a Scorpion Dagger instead.Never heard of that before? What book is that in?

I was also thinking that maybe there could also be other versions, like a version where you attach a short sword to the end.
Added

Also, I was thinking that you unlock the Weapon of the Web at level 5 if you have Silk Weaver, rather than having as a separate Technique, same with Araneae Hand, which you have learned at level 10, though it seems like it should be learned at level 5.
I think adding everything to Silk Weaver would get rather excessive.

For Camouflage, it says you need 12 ranks in stealth, wouldn't that mean you have to be level 12 to learn it so that, by then, you'll have put 12 skill points into stealth or is this something the group has been doing wrong (which I hope it is).
My fault. I was remembering 3.5e rules. I'll fix it.

Also, for Child of Araneae, I was thinking that at level 10, you can also call a large-sized spider, which can also be used as a mount.
I'll get on that large spider.

masterstalker2

2012-04-19, 09:10 PM

Well, have Weapon of the Web and Araneae's hand be the same Technique, and have them unlocked at level 5 if you have Silk Weaver.

For the Scorpion Whip, it's in Ultimate Combat, I'll post a link to the Scorpion Whip

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/whip-scorpion

Also, what about the Web grenade? could be a normal ability that is gained, or could be a technique that you get if you get the Web Hunter Advanced Technique.

Also, how about adding a feat where, when taken, you instead get another Assassin Technique, with an advanced version for Advanced Techniques.

Also, if you have camouflage at 9 ranks, wouldn't that make Child of Araneae 6 ranks? Having it at 9 ranks makes it so that, as soon as they get it, they will have the large-sized spider.

Also, for the Child of Araneae, at level 15 or level 20, have it so that it becomes upgraded to your full level, or to a level higher than 20 (as in, your Spider Blood Assassin levels count as druid levels for this Technique but with a +2).

masterstalker2

2012-04-19, 09:32 PM

If you don't mind, I'm going to put a spoiler box with Weapon Proficiency suggestions.

Weapons Page - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons

Katar, Tri-bladed - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/katar-tri-bladed

Bastard Sword - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/sword-bastard

Garrote - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/garrote

Butterfly Knife - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/knife-butterfly
Helps to have a good hold-out weapon to attach to a web whip

War Razor - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/war-razor

Falcata - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/falcata

Longbow (normal and composite), Crossbow (Light, heavy, repeating, heavy repeating, double)

I take it firearms are a no?

Firearms - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/firearms

Just tell me what you think about them being used for this class, also, I suggest using the Pathfinder website that lists the weapons to make finding the stuff easier. Even I use it, and I have all the books.

masterstalker2

2012-04-20, 10:14 PM

Umm, can you please respond to my previous posts.

Milo v3

2012-04-20, 10:32 PM

Well, have Weapon of the Web and Araneae's hand be the same Technique, and have them unlocked at level 5 if you have Silk Weaver. Weapon of the Web and Araneae's Hand have nothing to do with each other.

For the Scorpion Whip, it's in Ultimate Combat, I'll post a link to the Scorpion Whip

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/whip-scorpion
My computer blocks that site so I can't see what is on it.

Also, what about the Web grenade? could be a normal ability that is gained, or could be a technique that you get if you get the Web Hunter Advanced Technique.
But how would it work?

Also, how about adding a feat where, when taken, you instead get another Assassin Technique, with an advanced version for Advanced Techniques.
I think they are already getting too many Techniques.

Also, if you have camouflage at 9 ranks, wouldn't that make Child of Araneae 6 ranks? Having it at 9 ranks makes it so that, as soon as they get it, they will have the large-sized spider.I'll fix that.

Also, for the Child of Araneae, at level 15 or level 20, have it so that it becomes upgraded to your full level, or to a level higher than 20 (as in, your Spider Blood Assassin levels count as druid levels for this Technique but with a +2).[/QUOTE]That would make it more powerful than Animal Companion which would be overpowered.

If you don't mind, I'm going to put a spoiler box with Weapon Proficiency suggestions.

Weapons Page - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons

Katar, Tri-bladed - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/katar-tri-bladed

Bastard Sword - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/sword-bastard

Garrote - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/garrote

Butterfly Knife - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/knife-butterfly
Helps to have a good hold-out weapon to attach to a web whip

War Razor - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/war-razor

Falcata - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/falcata

Longbow (normal and composite), Crossbow (Light, heavy, repeating, heavy repeating, double)

I take it firearms are a no?

Firearms - http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/firearms

Just tell me what you think about them being used for this class, also, I suggest using the Pathfinder website that lists the weapons to make finding the stuff easier. Even I use it, and I have all the books.

I can put in some crossbow stuff. But I can't access anything else because of the blocks on my computer.

masterstalker2

2012-04-20, 11:29 PM

I'll put in the stats for the weapons.

Katar, tri-bladed - Damage (DAM) -1d3 small (S), 1d4 medium (M), Piercing (P), Crit X4

Garrote - DAM - 1d4 (S) 1d6 (M), Slashing, can be used to choke (choke could be added to the Weapon of the web).

War Razors are effectively daggers but with a +2 to sleight of hand.

Butterfly Knives are effectively daggers, but the crit is 19-20/X2 and has a +2 on sleight of hand.

Longbow - DAM - 1d6 (S) 1d8 (M), X3 crit, range of 100, range of 110 for composite. Could be used for Weapon of the Web where, instead of the whole weapon is made of web, you use the string to add more damage, and you would have to make the bow or just replace the string (I wouldn't blame you for not taking this Weapon of Web thing for the longbow seriously).

Also, I suggest adding Heavy Crossbow as a weapon proficiency, because even wizards get it, which I find... interesting since they use magic.

Also, all the weapons listed are in the Core Rule Book, except for the War Razor (Inner Sea World Guide), Butterfly Knife and Garrote (Adventure's Armory), both are books that I don't own though.

Milo v3

2012-04-20, 11:51 PM

masterstalker2

2012-04-21, 12:18 AM

Milo v3

2012-04-21, 12:23 AM

Actually, I just realized that the light and heavy crossbows are simple weapons, I do suggest adding Crossbow, Repeating proficiency, and maybe Heavy Repeating Crossbow proficiency.

I also suggest adding in Longbow proficiency since assassins need a weapon with good range.

Repeating Crossbows don't really fit the flavour of the class and you can't use sneak attack at a large range so most would never use a longbow.

masterstalker2

2012-04-21, 12:35 AM

masterstalker2

2012-04-21, 10:52 PM

Please respond to my post about the longbow.

Milo v3

2012-04-22, 01:16 AM

Well, with quick draw, you can start of using a longbow, then, when the enemy about to get in range, quick draw the bow away at the end of the turn before he is right next to you and draw your swords, and then when he is up to you, you feint and get a sneak attack in since he'll be flatfooted. This makes a longbow a good choice for a Spider Blood Assassin, who will probably get Quick Draw.

Sorry about the delay, I was at a party for my seven year old cousin. :smallsmile:

I guess that would work. But I am reluctant to adding in a large number of Proficienies.

masterstalker2

2012-04-22, 01:20 AM

Thank you for replying, and I can understand what you mean by that, though three of the proficiencies have to do with Spider Blood Assassin only abilities (ability to make a whip, and ability to make a whip with a dagger or short sword on the end). Also, my thought on being able to restring a bow using spider silk to do more damage using Weapon of the Web is ridiculous, think about it if you dare.

masterstalker2

2012-05-02, 12:00 AM

Milo v3

2012-05-02, 12:37 AM

I'm currently playing a Spider Blood Assassin in a campaign, and my brother mentioned something about Silk Weaver.

For Silk Weaver, there is no weight limit, that can lead to instances where a druid turns into a gorilla or some other heavy animal that can climb, and climb up the rope behind you, without the rope breaking. So, for the weight limit of the rope, it should be X + SBAs weight + SBAs max carrying capacity.

Good to hear my homebrew is being used.
Also Interestingly Pathfinder doesn't have weight limits on ropes so I didn't add any in. Theoretically Spider Silk might be able to hold amazingly weights because of its Elasticity and Strength.

masterstalker2

2012-05-02, 01:30 AM

You have a point.... but wouldn't that mean that your web would be able to hold on to as many medium-sized creatures as you want without it breaking if it were to work like a rope? Also, what if the SBA has a spell that allows him to become a cat, there is no player race small enough to climb that, though a spider-cat would be interesting...

Also, for web grenade, a few things I've come up with is that it would be a 5ft radius, will require an Escape Artist check (DC of X + level of SBA) to get out of, and will be able to be thrown X feet (maybe 30?).

Also, for Silk Weaver, why is it that you are only able to make horizontal and vertical webs? Why not diagonal webs? And how about the ability to spend extra actions making a larger strand of silk (like you can spend a full-round action to make it longer, or spend a swift action to go with the standard action).

Milo v3

2012-05-02, 01:40 AM

You have a point.... but wouldn't that mean that your web would be able to hold on to as many medium-sized creatures as you want without it breaking if it were to work like a rope? Also, what if the SBA has a spell that allows him to become a cat, there is no player race small enough to climb that, though a spider-cat would be interesting...
I guess it is more up to DM rather than mechanics. Also Kobolds would be able to climb that without problem.

Also, for web grenade, a few things I've come up with is that it would be a 5ft radius, will require an Escape Artist check (DC of X + level of SBA) to get out of, and will be able to be thrown X feet (maybe 30?).
I suggest you look at the Web Hunter Advanced Talent.

Also, for Silk Weaver, why is it that you are only able to make horizontal and vertical webs? Why not diagonal webs? And how about the ability to spend extra actions making a larger strand of silk (like you can spend a full-round action to make it longer, or spend a swift action to go with the standard action).
Mainly because I couldn't figure out how to write it out.

EDIT: Also that Quote in your Signature was orginally from Edgar Allan Poe.

masterstalker2

2012-05-02, 05:00 PM

Well, I was thinking that the web grenade could be a normal technique that would be a lower level version of Web Hunter.

For Silk Weaver, do you mean for using different actions to create more silk? I was thinking that it could add 50% of the total amount of web you can make (like using a swift action with the standard action would make it so that you can make it 45 feet).

Also, for Web Slinging, how about the ability to catch someone who is falling by catching them with web, and also the ability to catch someone the same size as you or smaller mid-swing. I also suggest adding to Web Slinging the ability to carry a creature up to the same size category with you while using Web Slinging (you could say that the person shifts from one hand to another, is held by web, is holding onto you, or something else).

Also, thank you for telling me where the quote in my signature is from.

masterstalker2

2012-05-02, 10:12 PM

I've seen that you've started an entry for the new Pathfinder Grab Bag, it ended up giving me an idea. How about you make a second kind (separate from the Grab Bag entry) that is a Venom-based Prestige Class for Spider Blood Assassin. You could also have it as a Technique or as an Advanced Technique (probably Advanced Technique).

For it, you could have multiple versions, there would be three versions, Venom (could be considered Neutral for this), Carnage (Evil), and Toxin (Good), or you could have them give the SBA the abilities associated with them (could check wikipedia). Though, if you did add this, the SBA would be limited to being bonded with only one symbiote as to prevent them from becoming overpowered.

I would really like to see this added, since it seems like it would be fun to me.

Also, maybe an (Advanced) Technique or class feature that allows you to turn into a Medium-sized or Large-sized Spider X amount of times per day.

Milo v3

2012-05-02, 10:56 PM

Well, I was thinking that the web grenade could be a normal technique that would be a lower level version of Web Hunter.I'll think about adding it in as a Basic Talent.

For Silk Weaver, do you mean for using different actions to create more silk? I was thinking that it could add 50% of the total amount of web you can make (like using a swift action with the standard action would make it so that you can make it 45 feet).
Not sure of what your saying could you explain?

Also, for Web Slinging, how about the ability to catch someone who is falling by catching them with web, and also the ability to catch someone the same size as you or smaller mid-swing. I also suggest adding to Web Slinging the ability to carry a creature up to the same size category with you while using Web Slinging (you could say that the person shifts from one hand to another, is held by web, is holding onto you, or something else).
You can already grab people mid-swing as far as I'm aware, the same way that you can grab people mid-flight.

Also, thank you for telling me where the quote in my signature is from.
Your welcome.

I've seen that you've started an entry for the new Pathfinder Grab Bag, it ended up giving me an idea. How about you make a second kind (separate from the Grab Bag entry) that is a Venom-based Prestige Class for Spider Blood Assassin. You could also have it as a Technique or as an Advanced Technique (probably Advanced Technique).
I'll think about it, but I don't think I will. This is because when I make prestige classes they have 20 levels rather than 10 or 5. It would be exactly the same as the Tainted Scion Of Venom thus pointless.

For it, you could have multiple versions, there would be three versions, Venom (could be considered Neutral for this), Carnage (Evil), and Toxin (Good), or you could have them give the SBA the abilities associated with them (could check wikipedia). Though, if you did add this, the SBA would be limited to being bonded with only one symbiote as to prevent them from becoming overpowered.
IMO There traits aren't really varied enough to be seperate classes.

Also, maybe an (Advanced) Technique or class feature that allows you to turn into a Medium-sized or Large-sized Spider X amount of times per day.
I'd prefer to stay away from the Mystical themed stuff.

masterstalker2

2012-05-02, 11:18 PM

masterstalker2

2012-05-03, 12:23 AM

Oh, forgot to mention the thing about Silk Weaver.

What I had meant is that, you can already use a Standard Action to make a 30 foot strand of silk. How about being able to expend other actions along with the Standard Action to make it longer, like using a Move Action or Swift Action along with the Standard Action already being used. Also, to have it at it's longest, you could use a Full-Round Action to make the the strand of web.

Milo v3

2012-05-03, 01:00 AM

Thank you for responding, also the thing about being able to turn into a spider has to do with one of the Spiderman comics I read about on Wikipedia where Spiderman becomes a giant spider temporarily, so that Marvel can use the story to give that version of him powers rather than him using web launchers.
I think your talking about when he when he turned into Man-Spider and he dies and comes back with new powers. That transformation was actually caused by another person and it isn't one of his abilities.

Also, for the thing about the symbiotes as a Technique or Advanced Technique, or as a Feature where you choose which symbiote you want at a certain level, you have to admit that it would be cool. Each symbiote would have its own advantages (and possibly disadvantages) that the SBA would receive depending on which symbiote he selected. You would probably be limited on the amount of times you can use the symbiote each day to prevent it from being overpowered. The symbiote would have it's own INT, WIS, and CHA when its not in use, and would be able to communicate with the SBA.[/QUOTE]
Symbiotes never gave their masters any power and completely dominated them (other than Toxin and Venom (Which don't really count as they are insane)) so if that it would turn them the SBA into an NPC.

Oh, forgot to mention the thing about Silk Weaver.

What I had meant is that, you can already use a Standard Action to make a 30 foot strand of silk. How about being able to expend other actions along with the Standard Action to make it longer, like using a Move Action or Swift Action along with the Standard Action already being used. Also, to have it at it's longest, you could use a Full-Round Action to make the the strand of web.
Good idea.

masterstalker2

2012-05-03, 01:06 AM

For the symbiotes, you could find a way to justify it, like the symbiote and SBA being friends or something, or, when the SBA bonds with the symbiote, they have to go through an hour long ritual that prevents the symbiote from taking over (though you can have it so that the symbiote cannot be used all the time). You can have the Symbiote and SBA make a deal (an example, that would not be set in stone, could be that when the SBA normally sleeps, the symbiote has his "playtime" and the SBA becomes fully rested.

Also, about your argument that the symbiote takes over their host, making the SBA an NPC, wouldn't that make your (insert class name here) class pointless? You'd have to add the ritual for it to work is the thing, or else you just create a character who is immediately an NPC.

Milo v3

2012-05-03, 01:19 AM

Could you place that comment about the NPCification on the Comments page for the competition (Here is a link so you don't have to search (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=234663&page=5)) as I'm not meant to even mention my entry on other threads as part of the rules.

As for the ritual. That seems rather mystical in nature. Also I believe that a Symbiote would be very overpowered as an ability as it increases so many traits.

masterstalker2

2012-05-03, 01:26 AM

Milo v3

2012-05-03, 01:35 AM

Well, its Pathfinder or D&D 3.5, stuff is mystical, the Spider Thralls are mystical, their ritual is mystical, so it would make sense to allow a ritual and/or deal with the symbiote.

Also, to prevent the symbiote from being overpowered, you would be limited to the amount of times per day you can use it. I was thinking that it would be SBA class levels + CHA modifier or something similar to that. Also, I think that the symbiote would be nothing compared to the Monk's Quivering Palm ability.

Spider Thralls are the capstone and I wanted him to be able to command arthropods at some stage as he does so in The Other.

Also even with limited uses per day it would still be overpowering. Symbiote would be more powerful than Rage which is the Key Feature of the Barbarian giving it access to something which is more powerful than the point of a whole other class is overpowering.

As FYI this class is aimed at Upper Tier 3 (maybe low 2) for balance and don't want to go higher.

masterstalker2

2012-05-03, 05:07 PM

The symbiote would have disadvantages to prevent it from being overpowered.

Also, have you seen some of the rage powers a Barbarian can get? One power allows them to grow wings and fly. Another power allows them to move X3 or X6 their speed once per rage. They can gain DR/-, and another gives them a scent ability. Another power allows them to deal double crit damage on one attack when raging. Also, the Rage ability already gives +4 to STR and CON along with a +2 to Will saves.

The Symbiote for SBA could be similar to Rage for the Barbarian in that there are Symbiote Powers or something. The Symbiote would work for X amount of rounds per use, and could be used X amount of times per day. Also, Symbiotes don't give their host any power, it depends on the Symbiote. The Symbiote would cause its host to be fatigued after being activated.

Also, Venom and Toxin aren't insane, especially compared to the rest of their species. Venom's species are parasites that infect a host and drain their adrenaline, eventually killing them. They isolated Venom because he wanted to commit to one host, rather than use it up.

According to the Planet of the Symbiotes storyline, he was deemed insane by his own race and imprisoned on Battleworld to prevent it from polluting the gene pool when his race discovered that Venom desired to commit to his host rather than use it up.

Milo v3

2012-05-03, 06:20 PM

That would be overpowered. This class is already rather powerful and I don't want to upset the balance or make other classes pointless.

And Venom is insane for his species. In his culture, commiting to a single host is a form of insanity.

masterstalker2

2012-05-03, 06:59 PM

I'll agree on both things that you said because your right.

Though, despite Venom being insane for his species, he is somewhere between a villain and an antihero, he is Spider-Man's arch-nemesis, though he and Brock will agree to help innocents.

Also, I now have an idea for and Ex-Spider Blood Assassin.
If you become infected with a Symbiote, if you attempt to resist it and let it bond with you, or you fail to resist it (failing a Will Save) and fail to get rid of it within the next 1d4 days, all your levels in Spider Blood Assassin become levels in your Grab Bag class, and you can no longer take levels in SBA, unless a spell such as Wish or Atonement is used. Along with Vice Versa for your Grab Bag class, where you have to regain the Symbiote in 1d4 days or your levels in the class become Spider Blood Assassin levels unless a spell such as Wish or Atonement is used on you.

Milo v3

2012-05-03, 08:00 PM

Though, despite Venom being insane for his species, he is somewhere between a villain and an antihero, he is Spider-Man's arch-nemesis, though he and Brock will agree to help innocents.
Just because he is insane doesn't mean he can't be good.

Also, I now have an idea for and Ex-Spider Blood Assassin.
If you become infected with a Symbiote, if you attempt to resist it and let it bond with you, or you fail to resist it (failing a Will Save) and fail to get rid of it within the next 1d4 days, all your levels in Spider Blood Assassin become levels in your Grab Bag class, and you can no longer take levels in SBA, unless a spell such as Wish or Atonement is used. Along with Vice Versa for your Grab Bag class, where you have to regain the Symbiote in 1d4 days or your levels in the class become Spider Blood Assassin levels unless a spell such as Wish or Atonement is used on you.

Good idea. I hope this doesn't break the rules though. I'll ask on the comment page to make sure I can reference it.

masterstalker2

2012-05-04, 11:55 PM

I suggest adding to Grip of the Spider that, when the SBA does need to roll climb, he is allowed to take ten, even when threatened.

Milo v3

2012-05-05, 12:38 AM

I suggest adding to Grip of the Spider that, when the SBA does need to roll climb, he is allowed to take ten, even when threatened.

Wouldn't that be pointless? You don't need to make climb checks with it.

masterstalker2

2012-05-05, 09:54 AM

The thing is that the Technique says that you don't have to make climb checks when traversing vertical or horizontal surfaces. What about diagonal surfaces (yes that was meant purely as a joke). What if they are doing something that involves rolling climb, they should have the ability to take 10, unless they don't have to roll climb for that either. Also, I suggest adding that they can reroll climb checks if they fail.

masterstalker2

2012-05-07, 08:18 PM

Milo v3

2012-05-07, 08:39 PM

For Drain the Fluids, I suggest adding the ability for the SBA to use it to gain an amount of temporary health equal to their HDd8 (as is, a level 6 SBA with Drain the Fluids can get 6d8 temporary health), or you could have it lower.

I prefer it being used as a health regaining function, this stops the SBA's from killing people before a fight so they can have tonnes of health.

masterstalker2

2012-05-07, 08:54 PM

The SBA would be attacked as by guards for killing random people, also, there would be a limit to the drain, like the creature drained has to be equal to or greater than the level of the SBA - X, and they gain 1 HD per level over X (where X equals something like the level of the SBA - 2).

ArkenBrony

2012-05-09, 02:56 PM

I noticed one game balance issue, in the Assassin technique ability, one of the abilities granted is
Weapon Training: A Spider Blood Assassin that selects this technique gains Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Focus as bonus feats., the problem with this is greater weapon focus is that it requires lv 8, but you could take this ability at level 2, besides that, i love the class, and will be implementing it into my campaign

Milo v3

2012-05-09, 05:37 PM

I noticed one game balance issue, in the Assassin technique ability, one of the abilities granted is , the problem with this is greater weapon focus is that it requires lv 8, but you could take this ability at level 2, besides that, i love the class, and will be implementing it into my campaign

I'll fix that.

zegram 33

2012-05-09, 07:01 PM

i might be missing where you can get it, but: i would imagine this class would gain the benfits of the "spiders climb" spell at later levels, but on constantly.
is there a particular reason this isnt in (balance or fluff wise?) or is it just something you hadnt really considered.
again, it might be in but im just missing the transition as the class does have several climbing abilities.

similarly, the possibility of crafting/spontaneously laying some kind of web mine (as the "web" spell) would fit well if that appeals to you

nice class though, i love the idea of dropping behind a guy via web

Milo v3

2012-05-09, 08:10 PM

DrewVolker

2012-05-23, 08:13 PM

Milo v3

2012-05-23, 08:29 PM

Hey, I just read over this class and INSTANTLY fell in love with it.
Seriously, great job.
One of my favorite things I found: Child of Araneae.
I have an idea for assassin technique, maybe an advanced one.
I honestly don't know how to fully implement it, but here it goes.
Maybe a feature called "True Child of Araneae", "Greater Child of Araneae" or "Favored Child of Araneae", that improved the level of your spider companion.
Example: You need to take Child of Araneae first, then if you take Favored Child of Araneae your druid level for your companion is equal to your assassin level.

Just an idea I had.

Thanks. :smallsmile:

As for your suggestion, Animal Companions automatically increase level as their master's level up. Thus so does the Child of Araneae. It doesn't increase much but it still useful.

But have just added in an Advanced Technique of the Chid of Araneae, it is called Disciple of Araneae.

DrewVolker

2012-05-23, 08:34 PM

Milo v3

2012-05-23, 08:42 PM

Also I have a quick question here.
Are you intending for the assassin to use the rules for vermin companions in ultimate magic? Like use that version of the monstrous spider for this class's companion, then if they pick to get the large spider just apply the large adjustments to it?

I've never seen those rules before. I've saddly not very familiar to the Pathfinder rules. I actually play 3.5e.

So saddly I'm not actually sure how to answer the question.

DrewVolker

2012-05-23, 08:44 PM

I've never seen those rules before. I've saddly not very familiar to the Pathfinder rules. I actually play 3.5e.

So saddly I'm not actually sure how to answer the question.

I see, no problem. Thanks to replying so quickly though.

Edit:
I think since this is meant for pathfinder you should reword it around a bit.
Child of Araneae (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin generally hunts alone, but by using their instincts they can form a close bond with a medium monstrous spider. This spider is a loyal companion that accompanies the Spider Blood Assassin on his adventures as appropriate for its kind.
This ability functions like the druid animal companion ability (which is part of the Nature Bond class feature), except that the Spider Blood Assassin's effective druid level is equal to his Spider Blood Assassin level – 5. The animal companion possesses half its master's sneak attack dice as well
To select this Assassin Technique you must have at least 6 ranks in Knowledge (Nature).
Also upon reaching tenth level, you can replace your medium monstrous spider companion with a large monstrous spider but your effective druid level is equal to his Spider Blood Assassin level -7. In all other ways the Large Monstrous Spider acts as a Child of Araneae.

Instead of "close bond with a medium monstrous spider", I think it should be "close bond with a giant spider", and instead of "like the druid animal companion ability", "like the druid vermin companion ability from Ultimate Magic". Its the only way you can get a spider companion in the game actually, and has the progression for having a spider companion, so it works perfectly. Also for the large spider part, instead of "replace your medium monstrous spider companion with a large monstrous spider", "choose to have your giant spider grow to the large size category but your effective druid level is equal to your Spider Blood Assassin level -7. In all other ways the large giant spider acts as a Child of Araneae".

Mostly its just name changing, since in pathfinder they call large spiders "Giant Spiders" instead of "Monstrous Spiders", but the way animal companions were handled also changed, instead of just adding bonus HD and things like that, they go off a fixed progression chart based on your "druid level".

Just somethings I noticed.

masterstalker2

2012-05-23, 10:36 PM

DrewVolker

2012-05-24, 11:28 AM

Well Drew, there is a problem with your spider growing to large size. Large creatures don't fit through most doors.

If something like that were to be added, then the growth of the Child of Araneae would have to be able to be reversed at any time.

Also, I would like to see a telepathic link for the Child of Araneae, though only communication, not sight, as that would be gained by A Thousand Eyes, unless you want to give it to those who take Disciple of Araneae.

Yes, I am aware of the issues with having a large spider companion, but the option to have it be changed out for one of large size was already listed in the ability. I was just commenting on how it was said, but I would love for there to be an option for the size of your spider companion to change. Maybe even down to a tiny spider that can sit on your shoulder while you are in town perhaps? Maybe limit the size changing to so many times per day but it can stay in any given size for as long as it wants (with the limit it can become being medium or large depending on if you took the additional penalty to your druid level). I also second the telepathic link idea, would be great for pure flavor reasons.

Edit: Another little thing I noticed. Under sneak attack it says "This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, and increases by 1d6 every four Spider Blood Assassin levels thereafter." The first increase to sneak attack die is at level 4, which is only 3 levels away. Might want to change it to "This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, 2d6 at 4th level, and increases by 1d6 every four Spider Blood Assassin levels thereafter."
Sorry if I am annoying you (or anyone) with these comments, just thought I should point out anything I notice in a attempt to try to help.
Loving this class even more the more I read over it.

Second Edit: Found another thing that should be reworded for pathfinder.
Unrelenting Grip (Ex): The tiny barbs with allow you ascend walls empowered your grip with other things. A Spider Blood Assassin with this technique gains a bonus to grappling equal to a quarter of his Spider Blood Assassin level.
In addition you can never be disarmed.
Instead of "bonus to grappling equal to a quarter of his Spider Blood Assassin level." it should read "bonus on checks made to grapple a foe and to his Combat Maneuver Defense whenever an opponent tries to grapple him equal to a quarter of his Spider Blood Assassin level."

Third Edit: Found another thing that I think is the same between both 3.5 and pathfinder. The save DC for Widow’s Toxin is Spider Blood Level + con modifier. Iirc isn't the norm for save DC's 10 + 1/2 HD + Ability mod? In the end its the same thing I guess, just thought I'd point it out.

Forth Edit: I am really hoping by this time I am not starting to annoy you, I am honestly just trying to help this class, as I have developed a fondness for it, haha.
Anyway, noticed a few more things. Under weapon finesse it says "In addition it its normal effects" I am guessing that you mean to just say "In addition its normal effects" and the extra it is just a typo.

Also the saving throw for death attack is a bit high. I think you got the 10 + class level + ability mod set up from the assassin prestige class, but the difference between that class and this class is the assassin is a 10 level long prestige, which means at max they can get 20 + ability mod for the saving throw. This class is a 20 level long base class, meaning it can get 30 + ability mod. The standard progression for a save dc is 10 + 1/2 HD or Class level + ability mod. I am not saying you should or have to change it, if that is what you were going for then by all means keep it so, just thought I would point it just in case you didn't catch that.

For web hunter I see you have it saying "Each 5-foot section has 14 hit points, and sheet webs have damage reduction 5/—." I think instead of damage reduction 5 it should be hardness 5. If I am recalling correctly objects have hardness which acts just like damage reduction when someone is attack it or trying to break it. Just a little detail.

Other than what I have said already, I think that is it. Mostly its just changing words around to clear things up or present it in the way that a class would have been if actually put in a book and published. I am seriously looking forward to playing this class.

Oh on a side note, I did have a question about the spider thrall ability.
Could you potentially make your Child of Araneae if you had one a spider thrall? I think the abilities given to a thrall would make a great addition to your Child of Araneae.

Anyway looking forward to hearing back from you.

Last edit I promise :P : I just had an idea for a advanced technique.
Weapon Mastery (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin who takes this technique gains Weapon Specialization as a bonus feat.

At 14th level the Spider Blood Assassin gains Greater Weapon Specialization as a bonus feat.
A Spider Blood Assassin must have the Weapon Training technique to select this one.

Follow the line set for weapons training, including being 2 levels later than what the fighter can get the feats at (14th instead of 12th).

Milo v3

2012-05-24, 06:10 PM

Instead of "close bond with a medium monstrous spider", I think it should be "close bond with a giant spider", and instead of "like the druid animal companion ability", "like the druid vermin companion ability from Ultimate Magic". Its the only way you can get a spider companion in the game actually, and has the progression for having a spider companion, so it works perfectly. Also for the large spider part, instead of "replace your medium monstrous spider companion with a large monstrous spider", "choose to have your giant spider grow to the large size category but your effective druid level is equal to your Spider Blood Assassin level -7. In all other ways the large giant spider acts as a Child of Araneae".

Just somethings I noticed.
Thanks I'll fix it.

Well Drew, there is a problem with your spider growing to large size. Large creatures don't fit through most doors.
That already in the normal Spider Blood Assassin.

If something like that were to be added, then the growth of the Child of Araneae would have to be able to be reversed at any time.
I'm pretty sure that he means that it can happen once. Not at-will.

Also, I would like to see a telepathic link for the Child of Araneae, though only communication, not sight, as that would be gained by A Thousand Eyes, unless you want to give it to those who take Disciple of Araneae.
Interesting idea.

I was just commenting on how it was said, but I would love for there to be an option for the size of your spider companion to change. Maybe even down to a tiny spider that can sit on your shoulder while you are in town perhaps? Maybe limit the size changing to so many times per day but it can stay in any given size for as long as it wants (with the limit it can become being medium or large depending on if you took the additional penalty to your druid level).
Strange idea. I'll think about adding it in.

Edit: Another little thing I noticed. Under sneak attack it says "This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, and increases by 1d6 every four Spider Blood Assassin levels thereafter." The first increase to sneak attack die is at level 4, which is only 3 levels away. Might want to change it to "This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, 2d6 at 4th level, and increases by 1d6 every four Spider Blood Assassin levels thereafter."
I'll fix it.

Loving this class even more the more I read over it.
Thanks.

Instead of "bonus to grappling equal to a quarter of his Spider Blood Assassin level." it should read "bonus on checks made to grapple a foe and to his Combat Maneuver Defense whenever an opponent tries to grapple him equal to a quarter of his Spider Blood Assassin level."
I'll fix.

Third Edit: Found another thing that I think is the same between both 3.5 and pathfinder. The save DC for Widow’s Toxin is Spider Blood Level + con modifier. Iirc isn't the norm for save DC's 10 + 1/2 HD + Ability mod? In the end its the same thing I guess, just thought I'd point it out.
By making the Level + Con it is more balanced for players. As it isn't based on HD it makes the Spider Blood Assassin benefit from focusing in the class.

Anyway, noticed a few more things. Under weapon finesse it says "In addition it its normal effects" I am guessing that you mean to just say "In addition its normal effects" and the extra it is just a typo.
I'll fix.

Also the saving throw for death attack is a bit high. I think you got the 10 + class level + ability mod set up from the assassin prestige class, but the difference between that class and this class is the assassin is a 10 level long prestige, which means at max they can get 20 + ability mod for the saving throw. This class is a 20 level long base class, meaning it can get 30 + ability mod. The standard progression for a save dc is 10 + 1/2 HD or Class level + ability mod. I am not saying you should or have to change it, if that is what you were going for then by all means keep it so, just thought I would point it just in case you didn't catch that.
It is the general opinion that the Assassin class is underpowered and its Death Attack is rather weak, so I thought that it would be fine. I might try to scale it back though.

For web hunter I see you have it saying "Each 5-foot section has 14 hit points, and sheet webs have damage reduction 5/—." I think instead of damage reduction 5 it should be hardness 5. If I am recalling correctly objects have hardness which acts just like damage reduction when someone is attack it or trying to break it. Just a little detail.
I'll change it to hardness.

Could you potentially make your Child of Araneae if you had one a spider thrall? I think the abilities given to a thrall would make a great addition to your Child of Araneae.
You can turn your Child of Araneae into a Spider Thrall.

Last edit I promise :P : I just had an idea for a advanced technique.
Weapon Mastery (Ex): A Spider Blood Assassin who takes this technique gains Weapon Specialization as a bonus feat.

At 14th level the Spider Blood Assassin gains Greater Weapon Specialization as a bonus feat.
A Spider Blood Assassin must have the Weapon Training technique to select this one.

Follow the line set for weapons training, including being 2 levels later than what the fighter can get the feats at (14th instead of 12th).
I'll add it in.

Edit:Very sorry for the double post, it was meant to just be a second edit to my previous one, I guess I hit quote instead of edit. I took what was on this post and put it in my previous post, if a mod or admin wants to delete this post I would very much appreciate it.
If you want you could delete that post yourself. Click Edit on your post, at the top of the section it should allow you to delete the post.

Saddly I'm busy today with an essay and the Grab-Bag Competition so the changes likely wont take affect until I'm able to get back home.

DrewVolker

2012-05-24, 06:30 PM

Don't worry about getting things changed quickly, I perfectly understand.
I am just glad you are so quick to respond to comments and are willing to work with people to add/change things. Seriously, that is just awesome in a homebrewer.

masterstalker2

2012-05-24, 06:52 PM

DrewVolker

2012-05-24, 07:16 PM

For the thing about changing the size beyond the medium and large limit, to things like tiny or small, it would probably be under Disciple of Araneae since it would be a more advanced move.
Also, how about the ability to grow the Child of Araneae up to Huge when you get Disciple of Araneae, if your going to get a special spider, may as well make it better than the other Spider Thralls.

Hmm interesting thought on the huge spider idea.
Normally I would be against letting someone have a huge companion since the bonuses to strength and con would be outrageous, but honestly, the giant spider stats in pathfinder are rather meh at best.
At effective druid level 20 a medium giant spider (the largest they can normally go for companion) has this for a stat line:
Str 16, Dex 21, Con 12, Int -, Wis 10, Cha 2. (With the bonus from animal companion added in) With only a +1 natural armor bonus normally (before adding in the bonus from animal companion).
Kinda meh compared to some other companions, but with the large size bonuses added in its not that bad I guess.

Edit:
Yeah with the changes from medium to large it goes back into good animal companion range.
Stats for a level 20 druid level large spider would be:
Str 24, Dex 19, Con 16, Int -, Wis 10, Cha 2., Natural armor bonus +15 (+3 base, +12 from animal companion advancement). With four points to put in any ability score of your choice along the way (at least one will go into intelligence, because when they are mindless they can't have any skills or feats). I think maybe huge would be over kill, but I don't see why that a large spider companion should have a minus to druid level when you take the advanced technique. I understand you want balance, but having a spider companion with your druid level equal to your assassin level is not gamebreaking. Infact its about par with other companions, especially when you don't have any buffs to cast on them yourself.

On second thought, yeah I'd say maybe keep it at assassin level -3 for the large companion. Its not that big of a deal, a little more balanced, plus anyone who wants to can always take a feat with their dm's permission to give them +3 druid level anyway for animal companion (its from complete adventurer so its dm permission, but I don't see an issue with it).
But it would be nice like I said earlier to have some way to shrink the spider down for while you are in populated/confined areas.

masterstalker2

2012-05-24, 08:42 PM

I was thinking that the huge spider companion could be mostly for group transport, and for taking over towns, cities, kingdoms, planes of existence... you know what, mostly transport.

Milo v3

2012-05-25, 05:14 AM

DONE!

Also as a side note: You may now have Huge Child of Araneae Spider Thrall which you constantly have telepathy with, all the while you dominate with your free Weapon Specialization and Wall Running and Webswinging.

Also this is making me want to make a spell which Enlarges the size of Monsters...

MWAH HA HA HA HA

EDIT: I have now made a way to have a Colossal Child of Araneae. But it penalizes those with larger Child's of Araneae, unless you want it permanent.

Here is a link to the spell (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=244322) (If you want to comment on the spell, could you please do it on the spells page).

DrewVolker

2012-05-25, 12:08 PM

Just looked over the spell milo, and I must say well done. Overall great work.
I've reread over the whole thread to just get a better perspective on how this class has changed since it was made, and I came across an idea that was said that I think might deserve a second look.
Having a set of feats, maybe called "Favored of the Spider Queen" and "Chosen of the Spider Queen" or something along those lines. The lesser version grants you an extra technique, and the greater version grants you an extra advanced technique. Or maybe just one feat that give you an extra technique, but if you pick it on/after level 10 you can also select from advanced techniques?
I know you said you think they got enough already, but I don't see the harm in letting someone who would rather give up a feet to gain more techniques, do so.
Yes in pathfinder feats are as precious as they were in 3.5, but they are still pretty precious.

Just my thoughts on that issue.

Edit: Just relooked over Entropic Disciple, must say that is EXACTLY what I had in mind when I mentioned it, seriously, awesome work. A few things I thought/noticed. Where its telling you what sizes you can change to, up to is one word, I am guessing its a typo. Also the one size up, two sizes down works out perfectly. Makes it so people who keep a medium spider can still get a large one for combat, but out of combat/in town can have down to a tiny sized one on their shoulder.
I think it should be either changed to a non advanced technique though, its not that powerful and I know I would hate to have to wait till level 12 to just be able to make my spider tiny enough that it could go into a town with me. Maybe make it so you have to wait till you have Disciple of Araneae to be able to use it to make your spider larger? That would get rid of the strength/constitution and natural armor bonuses from the size bump up issue until you would have normally be able to do so as the way you first wrote it.

Just some thoughts.

Second Edit: So happy news, I will be playing this class in a pathfinder game coming up and really looking forward to it. I will let you know how it goes and my thoughts on the class after getting to play it in a game. I do hope you consider the feat idea to gain more techniques, because I know I personally would want more than just 10. Don't mind spending feats to get them.

Oh, I did have one quick question. Does the spider blood ability also increase the fort save of the widows toxin ability? Oh and while I mention that ability, I think you should change the save DC to 10 + half spiderblood assassin level + con bonus, because as it stands if you take it early on it will have a very low save dc and if you made it scale based off your sba level it still fits the pathfinder feel of "rewards you for sticking to a base class".

Anyway, looking forward to playing this, thanks again for the awesome class.

Milo v3

2012-05-28, 01:46 AM

Just looked over the spell milo, and I must say well done. Overall great work.
Thanks. :smallsmile:

I've reread over the whole thread to just get a better perspective on how this class has changed since it was made, and I came across an idea that was said that I think might deserve a second look.
Having a set of feats, maybe called "Favored of the Spider Queen" and "Chosen of the Spider Queen" or something along those lines. The lesser version grants you an extra technique, and the greater version grants you an extra advanced technique. Or maybe just one feat that give you an extra technique, but if you pick it on/after level 10 you can also select from advanced techniques?
I know you said you think they got enough already, but I don't see the harm in letting someone who would rather give up a feet to gain more techniques, do so.

I agree, looking at it now, I would want my character to have a good deal of the Techniques and if your willing to give up a feat I think thats more than fair.

Edit: Just relooked over Entropic Disciple, must say that is EXACTLY what I had in mind when I mentioned it, seriously, awesome work. A few things I thought/noticed. Where its telling you what sizes you can change to, up to is one word, I am guessing its a typo. Also the one size up, two sizes down works out perfectly. Makes it so people who keep a medium spider can still get a large one for combat, but out of combat/in town can have down to a tiny sized one on their shoulder.
I think it should be either changed to a non advanced technique though, its not that powerful and I know I would hate to have to wait till level 12 to just be able to make my spider tiny enough that it could go into a town with me. Maybe make it so you have to wait till you have Disciple of Araneae to be able to use it to make your spider larger? That would get rid of the strength/constitution and natural armor bonuses from the size bump up issue until you would have normally be able to do so as the way you first wrote it.

I've Edited in the changes.

Second Edit: So happy news, I will be playing this class in a pathfinder game coming up and really looking forward to it. I will let you know how it goes and my thoughts on the class after getting to play it in a game. I do hope you consider the feat idea to gain more techniques, because I know I personally would want more than just 10. Don't mind spending feats to get them.

Sounds great I hope it works well. Also I'm planning on creating a group of feats for my homebrew classes, Spider Blood Assassin among them, Its might take a few days though as some of the feats are for classes that aren't on this site yet. When is the game going to start or has it already?

Oh, I did have one quick question. Does the spider blood ability also increase the fort save of the widows toxin ability? Oh and while I mention that ability, I think you should change the save DC to 10 + half spiderblood assassin level + con bonus, because as it stands if you take it early on it will have a very low save dc and if you made it scale based off your sba level it still fits the pathfinder feel of "rewards you for sticking to a base class".
No Spider Blood effects Widows Toxin as it isn't created by Craft (Alchemy), I've edited it to make it more like pathfinder though.

DrewVolker

2012-05-28, 02:51 AM

Sounds great I hope it works well. Also I'm planning on creating a group of feats for my homebrew classes, Spider Blood Assassin among them, Its might take a few days though as some of the feats are for classes that aren't on this site yet. When is the game going to start or has it already?

It started yesterday (since its past midnight for me), and will be going on every sunday to my knowledge. Looking forward to seeing the feats, but don't feel like you need to rush. I am more than willing to wait for anything you make, haha.

Milo v3

2012-05-28, 07:48 AM

Here are the Feats of the Web (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=244631)

masterstalker2

2012-05-29, 11:29 PM

Drew, I sort of envy you, that campaign I played where I was a Spider Blood Assassin ended after two days because the group didn't enjoy the gamemaster making so many Dr. Who references, which many people haven't seen, though I want to continue the campaign.

I'd be playing the class in a new campaign, except that we are now doing Shadowrun, where I'm the stealth guy, again.

masterstalker2

2012-05-31, 10:58 PM

Ok, at some point my group is going to be doing a war that combines a bunch of our campaigns. The war consists of Devils, kobolds (we accidentally killed their ambassador, we didn't know why he was in the dungeon, and I wasn't with that part of the group since we split up for the floor) and the kingdom of wherever we are (it's a kingdom the GM made up).

A while ago, I had to sit out a few sessions so my character could be able to control his Werewolf form (a werewolf pinned me and was stabbed by our samurai, and the werewolf bled into me, don't question it), and this was before I discovered this class, or more likely, before it was made.

I can now turn into a werewolf, which has its own class levels (fighter, while my elf form is a ninja) and feat and attributes.

Should I trade in the ability to turn into a werewolf to trade my levels to become a SBA or keep werewolf form?

Milo v3

2012-06-17, 10:22 PM

Any news on how the SBA did during actual play?