best saves

[chaotician375]

what is the most important save to have as high as possible. i know all are useful but which is the most useful.

[Kalim]

It's entirely arbitrary, really.

What's your DM throwing at you? Will saves can't be the best, for example, if you face very little mental or magical effects that call them up. Reflex can't be the best if you aren't dodging fireballs or traps.

Typically, you're better off shoring up your weakest save, rather than trying to bump up any one in particular - exception being that the campaign has proven taxing to your, for example, will save. If you've been throwing tons of will save dice pretty consistently, you might as well get it bumped up if able.

[Keld Denar]

Generally, its Will > Fort > Ref

If you fail a Ref save, you generally only take HP damage. Sucks, but that's why you have HP. Hopefully the damage won't kill you.

If you fail a Fort save, you are generally dead, or wishing you were dead.

If you fail a Will save, you will wish you were dead, because in general, you are trying to kill your friends. One less ally, one more enemy, net swing for your enemies.

[FMArthur]

It's usually somewhere between Will and Fortitude. I think Will saves are worse, IMO. Reflex saves are just plain damage or avoiding getting knocked over. Very temporary, isolated problems if they don't cause you to die right away.

Failed Will saves easily result in utter helplessness as someone manipulates you as they wish, and generally inflict the fullest disables at the lowest levels. Later on a failed Will save can drastically change your role in the game's plot or change your side completely in a battle, putting your character well into negative party value above and beyond just regular out-of-commission effects. And getting sent to another plane is just one of the worst kinds of hassles.

Failed Fortitude saves generally result in very short-term disability and ability damage early on, and later on they serve as a gateway to numerous variations on instant death, which really sucks. There's a really dangerous in-between period but when the party is able to afford the corresponding resuscitation, this is actually less of a hazard than some of the Will effects because you're less likely to lose the battle for your whole party - singular death is inconvenient but a TPK is just Game Over.

[Emperor Tippy]

Will is the best in higher levels.

The worst Fort saves will do is kill you, and resurrection is relatively easy if your party survives. Will saves can make you kill your entire party.

[Person_Man]

I agree with Will > Fort > Ref, especially at low levels.

If you fail a low level Will Save, you're either dead or removed from combat. Sleep, Color Spray, Cause Fear, etc. All are essentially Save or Lose effects.

If you fail a low level Fort Save, you're probably mildly poisoned or contract a disease, or take similar ability damage from a spell. It hurts, but usually not enough to kill you. Even Stunning Fist only prevents you from acting for 1 round.

If you fail a low level Fort Save, you've either taken somewhat more damage, been entangled, and perhaps knocked Prone. It does tend to be the most common Saving Throw rolled though. So it shouldn't be neglected.


Having said the above, it's fairly easy to get ridiculous Saving Throws, or workarounds, or flat out immunities by mid-levels for a moderate investment.

[Chronos]

On the other hand, Mind Blank and True Seeing will between them render you immune to most things with Will saves, and Death Ward will render you immune to many things with Fort saves. It takes a bit more investment to be immune to most Ref saves, though.