Supernatural spell

[kabreras]

Just a quick question...

Lets say i can cast limited wish as a supernatural spell.

What if i use it to replicate permanency, do i have to eat the XP loss from pernamency or it is counted still as supernatural and i dont have to pay anything ?

Still on my way to build a dweomerkeeper...

[Alleran]

The Limited Wish is replicating Permanency, so the wish XP cost will apply, and it states:

"When a limited wish duplicates a spell that has an XP cost, you must pay that cost or 300 XP, whichever is more."

Since it'll likely be more, that's what you'll be paying when you cast the spell.

However, because Supernatural Spell explicitly removes the XP cost of the spell, you pay a grand total of nothing.

[kabreras]

Great, just what i wanted to ear :)

So basically if i slap this with spell domain on my dweomerkeeper cleric, i got acces to the whole 1 to 6 level of wizard spells for free.

[Alleran]

So basically if i slap this with spell domain on my dweomerkeeper cleric, i got acces to the whole 1 to 6 level of wizard spells for free.
Yes, though it'll only be free for the number of times per day you can use Supernatural Spell. Still, off the top of my head I think there's a Polymorph + Awaken + Contingency combo that will net you constantly-increasing mental stats for free using the ability, so it's quite broken.

It's also broken when you're throwing out epic spells with 20k XP costs without paying the XP cost.

Or when you're using free Wish and Miracle. Or free Gate. Or just about free anything, really, and that doesn't even get started on the other benefits of supernatural variants of spells (can't be dispelled, etc.).

[marcielle]

Have you just found an infinite Int increasing loop only limited by how much downtime days you have?

[kabreras]

Well goal is not to break the campaign.

Point is that supernatural spell is quite usefull just for rezs for exemple.

Now im just still wondering abut the spells to put on the mantle...

[Talya]

Hmmm. Somehow I am unfamiliar with this "Supernatural Spell" ... thing. The name seems rendundantly superfluous. What's it do?

[Yuki Akuma]

One assumes it makes a spell into a supernatural ability.

Meaning the name isn't redundant at all, considering "supernatural" is a game term with a specific meaning.

[Urpriest]

Hmmm. Somehow I am unfamiliar with this "Supernatural Spell" ... thing. The name seems rendundantly superfluous. What's it do?

The capitalization probably made you think it was a feat. It's just the name of the Dweomerkeeper class ability that lets them cast spells as supernatural.

[kardar233]

Well goal is not to break the campaign.

Point is that supernatural spell is quite usefull just for rezs for exemple.

Now im just still wondering abut the spells to put on the mantle...

Supernatural Spell doesn't like most resurrection spells as it specifies the spell must be standard-action cast or lower, IIRC.

[kabreras]

Supernatural Spell doesn't like most resurrection spells as it specifies the spell must be standard-action cast or lower, IIRC.

Mmmm now that you mention it...Damn !

Any way around that ?

[Alleran]

Mmmm now that you mention it...Damn !

Any way around that ?
Use Wish or Miracle to duplicate the spell as a standard action, and Supernatural Spell to avoid paying the XP cost.

[kardar233]

Means you don't get free True Res though.

[Alleran]

Means you don't get free True Res though.
Yes you can - use Miracle to duplicate it, picking the greater effect. Since True Resurrection is a 9th level spell and therefore a "powerful request" (it doesn't fall into line with the available effects of Miracle that don't have an XP cost), you just pay the XP and the Miracle happens. Except you don't have the XP cost, because Supernatural Spell is erasing it for you.

[kardar233]

Most DMs I've played under wouldn't let you use the Greater Request clause for any event short of a BBEG fight or something similarly narratively important. But I'd let you have it if you pitched it well enough.