Ranger (make it awesome)

[Thumperganker]

A friend is going into a campaign with us and she is new to dnd. She want to play a ranger with bows. We will be starting at 12th level. First favoured enemy is humans, because we've been told by the dm that thats pretty much the main enemy. I need suggestions on a build for her, i don't really play the ranger. She wants to be some form of elf, though race is not set in stone, and we are allowed LA and templates. So great knowledge of forum, please gift me with your suggestions

[JadePhoenix]

Use Mystic Ranger. Use the Ranger spells from Champions of Ruin and Spell Compendium. That should be enough.

[Thumperganker]

Source for mystic ranger? and all 12 levels? no prc? race?

Mystic ranger i looked up, more casting. She's probably better off going less casting if anything because she is new to the game.

[JadePhoenix]

Source for mystic ranger? and all 12 levels? no prc? race?
Mystic Ranger is from Dragon Magaine 336.

Well, you certainly can get a prc (since mystic ranger casting almost stops at 10th), but you don't need it.

Also, I advise getting favored enemy (arcanists) from Complete Mage. And the feat Nemesis from BoED (if she doesn't mind being exalted; Mystic Ranger is good-only already). Stalker of Kharrash, from the same book, gets favored enemy (evil). The other source is Harper Paragon, but that is setting specific (from Player's Guide to Faerun). You could take Sword of the Arcane Order for an extra oomph, but that's not really necessary.

Mystic Ranger is powerful enough and about as good as you can get with a ranger. If I was this friend you're mentioning, I'd choose the rest of my build based entirely on my background, the setting and all that jazz.

[Lonely Tylenol]

Mystic Ranger is from Dragon Magaine 336.

Well, you certainly can get a prc (since mystic ranger casting almost stops at 10th), but you don't need it.

Also, I advise getting favored enemy (arcanists) from Complete Mage. And the feat Nemesis from BoED (if she doesn't mind being exalted; Mystic Ranger is good-only already). Stalker of Kharrash, from the same book, gets favored enemy (evil). The other source is Harper Paragon, but that is setting specific (from Player's Guide to Faerun). You could take Sword of the Arcane Order for an extra oomph, but that's not really necessary.

Mystic Ranger is powerful enough and about as good as you can get with a ranger. If I was this friend you're mentioning, I'd choose the rest of my build based entirely on my background, the setting and all that jazz.

You can also drop the Wildshape ACF from Unearthed Arcana, and find room for 3-4 levels of Scout somewhere in here (I suggest doing so at level 12, when your spellcasting stagnates) so that you can grab the Swift Hunter feat at level 15 (giving you Skirmish damage progression equal to your combined Scout and Ranger levels, and the ability to apply Skirmish damage to favored enemies that are normally immune to precision damage), which is an extra +5d6 on your attacks by level 20 if you're moving around. You could then use your wild shape to change into a wild cat that grants pounce (there are a few), so you get this damage on all your iteratives on a charge. If you wanted, you could also grab Improved Skirmish as a feat, which would increase the total to +7d6. You're also still a Ranger with full spell progression and Wild Shape (and can take Natural Spell at your own discretion), which basically turns you into a Druid lite/Spellthief gestalt. Now you really don't need a PrC, as doing so stagnates your good spell progression as well as your Skirmish progression and Wild Shape uses (you only want enough Scout levels to qualify for Swift Hunter, plus maybe the fourth for a bonus feat if you think it's tasty).

[Namfuak]

While all these suggestions are good for optimization, the mere fact that she wants to play a ranger with a bow tells me that she probably is interested in what the ranger does out of the box, which on the tin is using a bow, tracking, having an animal companion, etc.

So, assuming that she wants to play a basically vanilla ranged ranger (ha ha), she would probably do this:

(Wood) Elf Scout 4/Ranger 16 or Scout 3/Ranger 17 (1 extra 2nd level spell, HIPS instead of a bonus feat)
Feats:
1. Point Blank Shot
3. Precise Shot
Scout 4: Imp. Skirmish (if she does the second path, take this feat at 12)
Ranger 2: Rapid Shot
Ranger 3: Endurance
6: Swift Hunter (Comp Adv)
9: Her choice, maybe one of those fancy ranged grappling feats from CWar I think. If she takes the second path or is allowed to wait to take feats, take Imp. Manyshot here
Ranger 6: Manyshot
12: Up to you, Imp. Skirmish if you took the second path.

After 12, there aren't any feats that I am remembering as necessary. There are some feats from CAdv, Cscoundrel, and CWar that could be nice for archers. Also, if she is actually spending time doing it, you could look at craft magic weapons and armor and look into any bows you might want to craft, or special arrows.

[Thumperganker]

Yes the out of the box ranger seemed to be more her thing, which book was scout in ?

[Gray Mage]

Yes the out of the box ranger seemed to be more her thing, which book was scout in ?

Complete Adventurer as well. The build Namfuak posted that mixes scout and ranger is commonly known as the Swift Hunter. You can find more information about it and cherry pick them here (http://dictummortuum.blogspot.com.br/2011/09/swift-hunters-handbook.html).

[eggs]

Mystic Ranger doesn't lose much of anything beside the Animal companion. It just slows the advancement of some abilities (favored enemy, fighting style) and speeds the advancement of others (casting). It even manages to do this in a way that doesn't suck or play as dully as a Swift Hunter (ie. chanting "I move 10 feet and attack... again" until the phrase echoes through your very dreams).

If the Animal Companion is a serious priority deal, she can either put the Handle Animal skill to use or grab the Wild Cohort (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031118a) feat.

[gallagher]

Cloistered Cleric 1/Ranger 4/Ur Priest 2/Bone Knight 10/Ashworm Dragoon 3

Zen Archery, whatever DMM you want, you have super awesome immunities, and get to ride a sand worm. possibly a zombie ashworm, i didnt look into that. Make a bow out of bone so it gets an extra d6 against living, just cuz.

i dont know how feasible the feats would be for this build, or the skills, i kinda just rattled that off the top of the dome but i think it could work. BAB +18, so you get four arrows plus you get your archery style from ranger. you get an animal companion and a mount, see if your DM will let you take the paladin/ranger stacking feat for that. if not, get a bird or something sneaky to provide your character with something else

also, this build gets 9th level divine spells at level 17. be a neutral or evil character and prepare harm. or make your bow spell storing and fill the slots with inflict spells for extra damage.

this is not only awesome, but would look really really really cool. or at least be silly

[gallagher]

Cloistered Cleric 1/Ranger 4/Ur Priest 2/Bone Knight 10/Ashworm Dragoon 3

Zen Archery, whatever DMM you want, you have super awesome immunities, and get to ride a sand worm. possibly a zombie ashworm, i didnt look into that. Make a bow out of bone so it gets an extra d6 against living, just cuz.

i dont know how feasible the feats would be for this build, or the skills, i kinda just rattled that off the top of the dome but i think it could work. BAB +18, so you get four arrows plus you get your archery style from ranger. you get an animal companion and a mount, see if your DM will let you take the paladin/ranger stacking feat for that. if not, get a bird or something sneaky to provide your character with something else

also, this build gets 9th level divine spells at level 17. be a neutral or evil character and prepare harm. or make your bow spell storing and fill the slots with inflict spells for extra damage.

this is not only awesome, but would look really really really cool. or at least be sillyok so i looked into it, did a little research in case you, me or anyone else wants to try this build for giggles.

you need 3 feats and several skills, for which i advise human+able learner. take either cloistered cleric or divine bard, and ranger 4. in that time you will have taken spell focus [evil] as well as (gasp) iron will. thats not too bad because you also get a ranged feat from being a ranger, and an animal companion (get a hawk at this low of a level, it gives you a distinct advantage outside). next two levels are ur priest in which you take zen archery, which is not too bad a place to start your character.

then comes the fun part. bone knight is a 9/10 casting, 7/10 BAB (missed on my last estimate from bad memory) that will eventually give you undead immunities. i suggest you take craft magical arms and armor for this because you will save a buttload on making your armor and weapons yourself. the best part of doing that here is because you will want to put freedom enhancement, which is +5, on the heaviest armor you can, because that way you dont have any of the penalties for the heavy armor and can keep on using your ranger feats.

the best part of this is that this will mesh well with an all-evil party. get a spellthief/assassin or something and a dread necromancer, and you guys can really team up to use undead hordes for extra beat sticks. you are gonna get 9th level spells, you will have a 9th level arcane caster, and a skillmonkey right there with several undeads. best part is that you will have the ability to take control of some undead, and summon your own, so you can contribute more there. you also bolster undead against turn resistance, so not only are you a relevant marshal character that can use a bow (that you make) or a lance (that you make) you are still a target by virtue of commanding a horde of undead. get a battle bridle sometime in the meantime, it costs 9k and gives you mounted combat. then at level 9 get ride by attack so you can get into ashworm dragoon

you want to round this out with ashworm dragoon. this is because the mount you summon is skeletal. thats right, you have a skeletal ashworm from either dune or beetlejuice (doesnt matter, both are ridiculous). take one less level of ur priest (since you get 9/10 casting anyway in bone knight) and another in ashworm dragoon for a 4th attack. with your remaining feats, do whatever combat style you want, charging is good, archery is ok with a spellstoring bone-bow that you create for cheap. you have 9th level cleric spells and are evil, so i am sure you will find a way to incorporate that.

if you are allowed flaws, take more feats for your combat style or DMM. again this build will be amazing in a party with an assassin and a dread necromancer. you will have undead immunities, will have freedom of movement cheap as heck (compared to what you would normally have to pay, and it is permanent), and will have some pretty good saves, too. 32 pb you want WIS, and your other attributes can be tailored to your specific needs.

[ericgrau]

For a swift hunter you need travel devotion or teleportation or such to get full attacks. You can greater manyshot but the penalty to attack rolls will drop your damage tremendously. Really that build is an archer/skillmonkey blend, which might be complicated and not be the greatest for new players unless she's looking forward to scouting, tracking, trapfinding and so on. The linked guide even acknowledges that it's more for this than for all out damage.

Here's something simpler that focuses more on arrow damage:
Ranger 2 (favored enemy human, rapid shot)/fighter 8/Any 2. She can continue fighter to 12 for greater weapon spec but soon she'll be getting most of her damage from a magic weapon anyway so there might be better options. Get improved rapid shot, ranged weapon mastery and greater weapon focus. That's +8 (!) more to hit than a travel devotion swift hunter though only ~+4 to +5 damage vs. its +5d6. It's semi-cheesy even, but not any more than the movement tricks needed to merely bring swift hunter damage to par. Around 3 feats remain which, if she wants, can go to tricks like ranged disarm and ranged pin (complete warrior I think?). These are superb against human foes and add something more interesting than "I full attack again". Improved favored enemy is also a major consideration.

For gear don't forget boots of speed, lesser bracers of archery, human bane arrows, arrows of various metal types to bypass DR and a nice bow of course, such as +1 holy composite.

I agree that wood elf is a good archer race.

[nedz]

Mystic Ranger doesn't lose much of anything beside the Animal companion. It just slows the advancement of some abilities (favored enemy, fighting style) and speeds the advancement of others (casting). It even manages to do this in a way that doesn't suck or play as dully as a Swift Hunter (ie. chanting "I move 10 feet and attack... again" until the phrase echoes through your very dreams).

Well it looses martial weapon proficiencies, but elf fixes that for longbows at least. As would the 'standard' Lion Totum Barbarian Dip for melle (not that Mystic Ranger needs that schtick because of the Lions Charge spell in SpC).

BTW the "I move 10 feet and attack... again" does change to "I move 20 feet and attack... again" when you take Improved Skirmish. But why aren't you using Rapid Shot at that stage anyway ?

[Curmudgeon]

For a swift hunter you need travel devotion or teleportation or such to get full attacks.
Travel Devotion is excellent for enabling skirmish, but teleportation isn't going to work. You're required to move to qualify for skirmish damage. Being moved (on a mount) and relocating without moving (teleportation) don't satisfy the requirement.

[Soranar]

Here's my favotire ranged ranger build

Race: Raptoran
Alignment: any
templates: none

STATS (32 pts)

STR 18 (main stat)
DEX 8 (dump)
CON 14
INT 8 (dump, you don't sneak: just max out spot/listen + 2 more feats)
WIS 16
CHA 8 (dump)

Ranger 17/Scout 3

Equipment: take a raptoran bow (forget the name), lets you use it with your feet (must be prone when you use it while not flying) to gain 1.5 STR to it

as soon as you can, make that an energy bow and you're set

key feats:

-zen archery (to hit keys off WIS, archery feats are free anyway)
-flyby attack + manyshot (perfect for scout damage bonus)
-swift hunter (for maximum damage)

You become a flying murder machine (ex flight too!) and it's just as damaging as you imagine.

[Lonely Tylenol]

Well it looses martial weapon proficiencies, but elf fixes that for longbows at least. As would the 'standard' Lion Totum Barbarian Dip for melle (not that Mystic Ranger needs that schtick because of the Lions Charge spell in SpC).

I'm pretty sure Mystic Ranger only loses melee martial weapon proficiencies (meaning it retains its use of bows).

By the by - while I have advocated a Wildshaping SotAO Mystic Ranger with Swift Hunter, it doesn't necessarily logically follow that someone has
to use all of these abilities, all the time; a Ranger optimized as such (to have +5d6/+5 AC Skirmish, Wildshape, and 5th-level spells) can decide, at any time, to shoot normally; to move and shoot; to cast spells normally; to cast spells to augment their shooting (and then shoot, if such spells are swift action casts, combining ranged weapon fighting with spells); to cast spells to augment their shooting (and then move and shoot, if such spells are swift action casts, combining Swift Hunter with spells); to fight in melee normally (though they lose proficiencies); to fight in melee in Wild Shape; to move and fight in melee in Wild Shape (combining Wild Shape and Skirmish via Swift Hunter); to cast spells in Wild Shape (combining Wild Shape and spellcasting via Natural Spell); or to cast spells in Wild Shape to augment their attacking (if such spells are swift action casts, combining Wild Shape, Skirmish and Spellcasting via all of the above feats and features). If Swift Hunter follows naturally into "I move 10-20 feet and shoot... Again", then you would be using a small fraction of your abilities each round, which is a crying shame.

(You would be feat-starved, relatively speaking, requiring Sword of the Arcane Order at 6, Natural Spell at 9, and Swift Hunter at 15, plus any bells and whistles you chose to add to these features, such as Dragonfire Strike, Improved Skirmish, the Point Blank Shot -> Manyshot line, and others, so you would, essentially, be "locked in" to a lot of your feat and level choices, limiting you to being a character with 6+INT skill points per level*, full BAB**, two good saves*, spellcasting from two sources, one arcane and one divine, up to 5th-level spells, precision damage up to +7d6, the ability to transform into any small or medium animal, and the ability to mix-and-match any or all of these abilities, which, frankly, sounds like imprisonment to me.)

*This improves for a small window (+8 skill ranks total, net +2 to Reflex overall with no net loss in the other saves if you swap 4 levels of Scout into a 20-level Ranger build).
**This weakens for a small window (-1 BAB).

[Thomasinx]

To be perfectly honest, if she's a new player, Just straight mystic ranger (12 levels of it) is probably the best bet. As for feats, go for normal bow feats. Point blank shot, precise shot, etc. If you want to spice it up, there's always the ranged disarm and ranged grapple feats from Complete Warrior.

Why go this route? Because any sort of complicated strategy is going to completely go over her head. Skirmish? Multi-classed casting? All of this stuff is too complicated for a complete newbie. Before you learn strategic mechanics you've gotta learn how to roll the right dice.

If each level is a straightforward progression, it makes it easy for a newbie to play. Plus, a mystic ranger with a good bow can be quite effective even if the player doesn't know what they're doing. Give her a list of 'suggested' spells to pick for each day, and make sure to pick a good all-around bow. I'd suggest something with multiple types of energy damage (+1 shock flaming frost longbow?) Its easy to use and works well on most types of enemies, regardless of DR.

The important thing is to make it easy and fun for her to play. This means avoiding too many of the swift-command magic items, and focusing on things that activate automatically or have constant effects. Just let her focus on picking between casting and shooting. (or doing both... the ranger has some fun bow-spells in the spell compendium).

Once she gets a feel for the game (maybe level 14 or 15) you can ask her whether she wants to keep levelling in mystic ranger, or possibly take a prestige class, like Seeker of the Misty Isles (It continues spell progression some, and could be used as a fun RP-aside for an elf ranger. It also keeps the d8 hit die and the 6+ skill points to keep things simple).

However, the main thing is to not make the whole thing too complicated for a newbie to play. Honestly, 3.5 is a complicated game that takes a while to get used to.

[eggs]

The Mystic Ranger can be interesting to play with a focus on some of boost-styled archery buffs.

Making flash cards with various effects of spells like Hunter's Eye, Swift Haste, Arrowsplit and Darkflame Arrow can give the player some interesting options, leave the character generally useful, and gently introduce some of the game's complexity.

[Vizzerdrix]

As much as I like the Mystic Ranger, I wouldn't recommend it for a new player. Maybe just a straight up archer ranger with Natural Bond, Ancestral Relic and a few archery based feats so she can get a taste of everything and see what appeals to her.

[Curmudgeon]

As much as I like the Mystic Ranger, I wouldn't recommend it for a new player.
I don't really understand that suggestion. Mystic Ranger is a 1-page revision. You simply use that class chart and ignore the PH chart. And it removes the animal companion, which as a separate creature is likely to be a source of confusion for a new player. You're instead recommending feats that add complexity to such an animal companion, and also to the weapon the Ranger uses.

Mystic Ranger is fine. Stick to archery-related feats and the player should have a good grasp of the things she can do when playing such a character.

[Morph Bark]

Mystic Ranger (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872054/Alternative_Class_Features_III?post_id=338428258#3 38428258), for ease of reference for the OP.

[Bronk]

I've had friends new to role playing get very discouraged when they try to play a character that they don't understand well, or is overly complicated. If your friend wants to play a ranger strait out of the box, maybe that is just what she needs... something fun to get her into the action.

Help her roll up a strait ranger, taking combat mastery 'archery', and make sure she knows how to use 'rapid shot' and 'manyshot' since you're starting at level 12. It sounds like you have the first favored enemy all set, and make some good guesses for the others.

Help her pick some good ranger feats, like 'improved favored enemy' from CW (adds +3 to all FE bonuses to all FEs), 'extra favored enemy' from Ghostwalk.

I suggest keeping the ranger's animal companion too, because it will give her more fun things to do while you're all playing.

At level twelve, she will get up to third level spells too... If you are combat heavy, and if you use the spell compendium, I suggest Hunter's Mercy (L1, swift, next hit is a crit), Hunter's Eye (L2, swift, for one round you can sneak attack), and especially Heal Animal Companion (L3, heal, but for your animal companion), because no one likes when their pet dies. Later, if she wants a more 'mystic' ranger with more magic, perhaps she can look into getting the 'sword of the arcane order' feat, so that she can prepare wizard spells in her existing spell slots.

If you're allowed to buy equipment, I suggest trying to get a swordbow (for ease of use while playing) and a 'girdle of hate' from the MIC (to enhance her FE bonuses). I also suggest tricking out her animal companion too... maybe barding for a wolf type, or claw enhancers for a hawk/eagle type. If she keeps playing, that will set the stage for giving them magic items and such.

When you play, make sure she knows what her skills can do, and maybe give her a few pointers and/or flash cards for her character's actions. Remind her that she can use multishot during surprise rounds and such, and if something needs to be tracked, let her try first. If your group hasn't had a tracker before now, you might automatically use whatever alternate methods you normally use and shut her character out. Speaking of which, make a point to have your character 'listen' to hers, so she doesn't feel like she's being talked over, left out of decisions, or just not hearing her ideas.

Well, those are my suggestions based on watching friends and significant others check out halfway through a game because they think their character is lame because they find they can't do what they wanted. Hopefully she will have a good experience and want to play more! Good luck!

[Roguenewb]

If she wanted to do two-weapon fighting I'd suggest one of my classic silly builds Scout 3/Wildshape Ranger 6/Daggerspell Shaper 10/ SOMETHING?

The build is a swifthunter with silly stuff on top. You could also go wildshape ranger into Master of Many forms.

[Mirakk]

Starting at level 12? I don't know if I recommend that for a first timer. Maybe it's just me.

Newbies usually have a hard time as it is just understanding the differences between move actions/standard actions/full round actions/swift actions and immediate actions. Or how movement works, what Attacks of Opportunity are and how to avoid them...

[Bronk]

I agree with Mirakk... maybe you could run your friend through a light practice game for a first level character, maybe a pregen that can make use of all the actions in a round. Either way, you should be right there with her to help out with things like that, as well as which dice to use, etc., depending on how used to roll playing games she is in general. Even just adding up a lot of dice can be taxing to someone not used to it.

[White_Drake]

I apologize if this has already been ruled out, I'm pressed for time, so I haven't read the whole thread yet, but so far as classic rangers go, two-weapon fighting is cool too. I've got a build with Ranger 11, Scout 4, and tempest 5. Grab the whole spring attack tree from PH2, and spend the rest of your available feats on TWF mods. I used a longsword w/ hand axe, simple but adequate. To take advantage of the versatility feature of the Tempest, I grabbed Improved Critical. In my not so humble opinion, Wood Elves are by far the best melee race, although you want to make sure not to get caught in protracted melee. Sorry, I've really got to go.