A different angle on Tarquin's actions

[torugo]

I see a lot of post saying either Tarquin is crazy for attacking the order like that or Tarquin is prepared to defeat the order and that's why he attacked like that.

I think there is another option people is not considering. What if Tarquin attacked the order like that because it is his intention to die fighting against the order in a epic battle for the gate? Isn't it his intention to die epic and be known forever? IF he dies by Elan's hand fighting as Thog in the fight for the gate and then Elan takes off the mask only to see his father...seems dramatic and epic for me.

What do you think?

[Forikroder]

I see a lot of post saying either Tarquin is crazy for attacking the order like that or Tarquin is prepared to defeat the order and that's why he attacked like that.

I think there is another option people is not considering. What if Tarquin attacked the order like that because it is his intention to die fighting against the order in a epic battle for the gate? Isn't it his intention to die epic and be known forever? IF he dies by Elan's hand fighting as Thog in the fight for the gate and then Elan takes off the mask only to see his father...seems dramatic and epic for me.

What do you think?

didnt yo post something like this in the discussions thread?

if Tarquin dies there he falls of the Ziggurat and gets burried by the desert until A) Malack digs him out and ressurects him or B) his team true ressurects him (or whatever the ressurect that doesnt need the body is called)

him dieing there accomplishs nothing, as far as he knows Elan actually has no problem killing him

[ti'esar]

This was brought up in the discussion thread, and I find it no more convincing here than I did there. Tarquin's goal is not to die in a "cool" fashion. That's his back-up plan. He has every advantage at this point - to think that he's going to just give all of that up so he can die is frankly ridiculous, and in my view seriously misunderstands the man and his attitude towards dramatic conventions.

[Gift Jeraff]

:roy: Elan! We have to deal with 5 people kicking our collective asses from afar and our wizard is MIA. Don't waste time taking off our fallen enemy's headgear for no reason.

or

:durkon: Destruction! *successfully destroys Not-Thog's body* (Yeah, it doesn't seem like the type of spell he'd use, but there's nothing preventing him from casting it rules-wise.)

or

:nale: Z, Disintegrate and Plane Shift my father's body so no one knows he died here and none of his little friends can resurrect him.

[NerfTW]

He's not taking the Order on alone. He's the meat shield. He's doing his job, attracting attacks so the casters can fire their spells.


I really don't see how anyone could get the impression that the rest of the Linear Guild isn't right behind him launching their own attacks.

[Sith_Happens]

I really don't see how anyone could get the impression that the rest of the Linear Guild isn't right behind him launching their own attacks.

:nale: Permission to hasten my inheritance granted.

That still leaves Malack to probably help out though.

[Forikroder]

:nale: Permission to hasten my inheritance granted.

That still leaves Malack to probably help out though.

Nale doesnt have the kahones to try and betray Tarquin, if he jsut sits there and lets tarquin dies then malacks surprise round would involve him taking out sabine and watching Nale fall to his death

[The Zoat]

Nale doesnt have the kahones to try and betray Tarquin, if he jsut sits there and lets tarquin dies then malacks surprise round would involve him taking out sabine and watching Nale fall to his death

What about Feather Fall?

[Kish]

What about Feather Fall?
That would be a hilarious time for Nale's armor to cause arcane spell failure.

(One of the many disadvantages of using multiclassing to create a faux-bard: Elan can safely cast his spells in light armor. Nale can't.)

[raymundo]

That would be a hilarious time for Nale's armor to cause arcane spell failure.

(One of the many disadvantages of using multiclassing to create a faux-bard: Elan can safely cast his spells in light armor. Nale can't.)

Actually, that would be so hilarious, I kinda hope this is one of the one-in-a-million-chance predictions that's actually true.

Really, the last time I saw an "important" character dying in one of my two favorite webcomics - namely this one and Goblins - was Chief's mutilation.
Go Nale! You can do it. (die gruesomely, that is)

[rgrekejin]

That would be a hilarious time for Nale's armor to cause arcane spell failure.

(One of the many disadvantages of using multiclassing to create a faux-bard: Elan can safely cast his spells in light armor. Nale can't.)

As hilarious as that would be, I don't think Nale is currently wearing armor. His current get-up just kind of looks like a black vest. Which, if he's supposed to be mirroring Elan, makes sense, as Elan has also stopped wearing armor (since it interferes with his Dashing Swordsman class abilities).

[rbetieh]

I think Tarquin is just looking for a good fight and the chance to earn some XP by removing some of the members of the Order he seems to not care for. He seems pretty sure that he isn't going to die here, and I am inclined to believe that a character designed around stacking the deck in his own favor at every turn probably has this well figured out. You beat these types by uncovering an "impossible angle" not by falling into the same traps over and over again until it works. Since Elan has already found such an angle, we will just have to wait until he plays it. And he can't play it if he is fighting "thog"....

[kickassfrog]

I think Tarquin is just looking for a good fight and the chance to earn some XP by removing some of the members of the Order he seems to not care for. He seems pretty sure that he isn't going to die here, and I am inclined to believe that a character designed around stacking the deck in his own favor at every turn probably has this well figured out. You beat these types by uncovering an "impossible angle" not by falling into the same traps over and over again until it works. Since Elan has already found such an angle, we will just have to wait until he plays it. And he can't play it if he is fighting "thog"....

Yeah, but he agreed with Malack not to harm Durkon, he sure as hell won't hurt Elan, and presumably Haley by extension.
And he certainly relishes the challenge of fighting Roy. He may kill him or try to recruit him.
The same goes for Belkar, so he may die in the coming fight.

[Valyrian]

1. As already said, Tarquin's goal isn't to die in a cool fashion. His goal is to be the de facto ruler of a huge empire for as long as possible. Making for a great story when he finally is defeated is basically just his consolation price for this situation, that doesn't mean that he is actively pursuing it.

2. It's not really his final fight that would make his end memorable. As I've said in the thread for this strip, Tarquin doesn't think in action scenes, he thinks in storylines. He thinks he will be remembered because he made for a good villain for a whole story. And like he said to Elan after their rooftop duel, it's too early to conclude this story for now.

3. Would you think that someone who has a complete party at his disposal, but still charges directly into melee and consequently gets killed is an epic strategic mastermind that's worth remembering? I would say it's a pretty stupid move (based on your assumption that Tarquin plans to get himself killed, which I don't agree with). So this kind of action really runs counter to his overall plan.

[rbetieh]

Yeah, but he agreed with Malack not to harm Durkon, he sure as hell won't hurt Elan, and presumably Haley by extension.
And he certainly relishes the challenge of fighting Roy. He may kill him or try to recruit him.
The same goes for Belkar, so he may die in the coming fight.


You may not want to exclude Haley off the bat, plenty of Helicopter Dads like to have a say in who dates whoom, and by now he knows full well that Haley is related to that annoying old coot that thinks himself a revolutionary....

[Toy Killer]

I honestly think he's setting up himself to fall to Elan's Hand, and Giving Nale all the reasons in the World to pick up where he left off. what kind of Megalomaniac mastermind wouldn't love setting up a perpetual Cain/Abel Scenario after his death?

of course, there is this pesky 'saving the world'-thing involved, but it allows Elan to say 'No, my dad has to wait, we have to save the other gates first' and rise to the hero that he needs to be to, well, heroically kill Tarquin and Nale to descend deeper into darkness to take over in his father's place.

[Forikroder]

You may not want to exclude Haley off the bat, plenty of Helicopter Dads like to have a say in who dates whoom, and by now he knows full well that Haley is related to that annoying old coot that thinks himself a revolutionary....

he has no idea whos Haleys father is, i doubt he cared to look at the records he only wanted to see them to satisfy his curiosity and he had better things to do the files are probably sitting on his desk waiting for him to return

[silversnowe]

Ooh, but maybe he wants to kill off Haley so it will be even more dramatic when Elan shows up to try to overthrow Tarquin? Vengeance for his lover and all that.

Personally, I figure that he just wants to gauge the Order's strength in combat first-hand. He's seen how Roy and Elan fight a one-on-one, now he wants to see how they work as a team. He doesn't want the rest of his own current party aiding just yet because he's fairly certain that would end very poorly for the Order, and he doesn't want the Order to die at this point in time. He's also probably fairly certain he has a safe escape should the Order prove too strong for him. Given his wealth, I'd wager he has at least one item that can cast Dimension Door or an equivalent escape.

[Forikroder]

Ooh, but maybe he wants to kill off Haley so it will be even more dramatic when Elan shows up to try to overthrow Tarquin? Vengeance for his lover and all that.

Personally, I figure that he just wants to gauge the Order's strength in combat first-hand. He's seen how Roy and Elan fight a one-on-one, now he wants to see how they work as a team. He doesn't want the rest of his own current party aiding just yet because he's fairly certain that would end very poorly for the Order, and he doesn't want the Order to die at this point in time. He's also probably fairly certain he has a safe escape should the Order prove too strong for him. Given his wealth, I'd wager he has at least one item that can cast Dimension Door or an equivalent escape.

or

as crazy as it sounds

Tarquin is actually interested in the giant amount of power thats in the basement and is willing to kill the order to get to it

i mean heros are a dime a dozen, sure it would be extra cool if Elan kills him but taking over the continent that much faster is also extra cool and some other hero will eventually show up for him to have his epic duel with, with any luck elan will escape or get ressurected somehow and he gets the best of both worlds

[rbetieh]

he has no idea whos Haleys father is, i doubt he cared to look at the records he only wanted to see them to satisfy his curiosity and he had better things to do the files are probably sitting on his desk waiting for him to return

Sigh....Tarquin is a smart guy with a knowledge for the dramatic and a penchant for getting accurate information (and a possible tie to the Cliffport Thieves Guild). He can guess that they are related (which I would add is all I have said, I never specified the relation in my last post) by same personality traits and last name. Based on what I have said above, the odds of Tarquin believing the old coot was Seymore Butts and not Ian Starshine is infinitesimal. KillKill brought Tarquin the files when he was drafted into the guild, so yes Tarquin knows these two are related.

[Zarzar]

Here's my rambled logic on Tarquin's motives:

Tarquin's a schemer, on the most grandiose level. He's probably been sitting in the desert for years (since Nale left) trying to think of the ways he's going to become a legend. None of the local punks trying to rise up seem worthy enough for Tarquin's epic demise.

Then here comes Elan, his long-lost son and golden opportunity. He realizes he's part of a rag-tag group of adventurers, which, according to genre savvy, are probably unable to be defeated easily. And they're likely trying to save the world. But Elan is still a child, barely known and barely able to grasp the immense plans Tarquin has for him. He needs to grow to become the hero that is legendary enough to defeat him and make Tarquin's story immortal.

So what does Tarquin do? He shows Elan all the love in the world. Indulging childish fantasies, throwing parades and celebrations. Elan's hate for Tarquin becomes a kind of painful love, which is spiked by the fact that Tarquin isn't subtle at all about the fact that he's Evil, while Elan is Good. It's good tempering for a bitter battle at a later date, once Elan is grown.

And then Nale is involved with the entire "save/destroy the world" process? And he's been learning to be a more intelligent, less brash villain? Even better! Pit Nale vs Elan, and see who is stronger! Or better yet, have both sons hate him enough that they have to bring together their one bond, family, to destroy their evil-er father. That bond of villain and hero is Tarquin's very blood. It makes Tarquin's very essence legendary!

So he sicks Malack onto Nale, forcing Nale to eventually side with Elan for the sake of his life, and the lives of his allies. Both grow beyond their childish ambitions over time, constantly fighting, but neither really winning. They become well known for their legendary deeds in saving the world, become immensely powerful as fighters in their own right, and then they turn their eyes towards one of the great evils left in the world: Tarquin.

Tarquin, seeing as his end is nigh, throws all of his wealth at Nale and Elan to stop them, knowing that Nale wants his money and power, and Elan wants "the greater good". The war and siege becomes well known throughout the world, and no one could ever forget the Michael Bay-esque destructive battles that happen to topple the Great Evil Tarquin. Tarqin dies (or fakes his death) and the ensuing battle between Nale and Elan blows up the legend of Tarquin to an even higher degree.

Tarquin is a legend, and no one dares utter his name without fear of his evil or respect of his power.

[Jaros]

Sigh....Tarquin is a smart guy with a knowledge for the dramatic and a penchant for getting accurate information (and a possible tie to the Cliffport Thieves Guild). He can guess that they are related (which I would add is all I have said, I never specified the relation in my last post) by same personality traits and last name. Based on what I have said above, the odds of Tarquin believing the old coot was Seymore Butts and not Ian Starshine is infinitesimal. KillKill brought Tarquin the files when he was drafted into the guild, so yes Tarquin knows these two are related.

Did he even hear the name 'Ian Starshine' though? Does that name mean anything to him?

[zimmerwald1915]

Did he even hear the name 'Ian Starshine' though? Does that name mean anything to him?
Kilkil brought Tarquin the files on Ian and Geoff just before Tarquin and Nale inducted him into the Linear Guild. Such files usually contain a prisoner's name as well as his number.

[Jaros]

Kilkil brought Tarquin the files on Ian and Geoff just before Tarquin and Nale inducted him into the Linear Guild. Such files usually contain a prisoner's name as well as his number.

Ahh, thanks, had forgotten about that.

He was interrupted, and I suppose you could say he no longer cared about that prisoner with the new stakes, but yeah I'm betting he does know who he is.

[Forikroder]

Sigh....Tarquin is a smart guy with a knowledge for the dramatic and a penchant for getting accurate information (and a possible tie to the Cliffport Thieves Guild). He can guess that they are related (which I would add is all I have said, I never specified the relation in my last post) by same personality traits and last name. Based on what I have said above, the odds of Tarquin believing the old coot was Seymore Butts and not Ian Starshine is infinitesimal. KillKill brought Tarquin the files when he was drafted into the guild, so yes Tarquin knows these two are related.

Tarquin thought he was familiar but didnt really seem to concerned about it, he wanted to see the files but between the person in question already have escaped and Nale jsut letting him know about the giant lump of power that he needs to move fast to get i doubt he took the time to read the finals

its like saying Tarquin realising he missed tea time and having a glass of tea while reading the newspaper before moving out

also its possible he doesnt have Ians name Ian and Geoff went in on purpose so unless Tarquin is working with Bozzok instead of Geoff working with Bozzock (and imo pretty unlikely Tarquin is working with Bozzok) then Ian probably gave a fake name

and i dont think they ever used Haleys last name, while Haley and Ian share the same hair colour if i was tarquin id think that Haley was related to the draketooths more then some old prisoner

[St Fan]

Did he even hear the name 'Ian Starshine' though? Does that name mean anything to him?

We didn't see him hearing the name, but Kilkil was about to bring the info about the two prisoners he'd just pardoned when he was recruited into the Linear Guild. It is very likely they finished this conversation afterward, and that Tarquin made the relation with Elan's girlfriend.

Not absolutely, entirely certain -- Ian Starshine could have used a false name while in the Empire of Blood, after all -- but there's still a good chance that, yes, Tarquin know everything.

[Tijne]

also its possible he doesnt have Ians name Ian and Geoff went in on purpose so unless Tarquin is working with Bozzok instead of Geoff working with Bozzock (and imo pretty unlikely Tarquin is working with Bozzok) then Ian probably gave a fake name

and i dont think they ever used Haleys last name, while Haley and Ian share the same hair colour if i was tarquin id think that Haley was related to the draketooths more then some old prisoner


From the note in 131 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0131.html), I think it's safe to assume that Tarquin had a record of Ian's full real name and a connection between him Haley.

[Forikroder]

From the note in 131 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0131.html), I think it's safe to assume that Tarquin had a record of Ian's full real name and a connection between him Haley.

most likely but not completely certain since theyve switched countries an undeterminate amount of times (but at least once before the Empire of Blood) so its possible the original records didnt exist anymore especially if one of the kings decided to remove all the old records and make new ones up to date


but assuming he knows Ians name he still doesnt know Haleys last name

[Leecros]

i doubt he took the time to read the finals

Man, I hope Professor Tarquin read the finals. I spent a long time on that last essay and i would hate for it all to go to waste. :smallbiggrin:






but assuming he knows Ians name he still doesnt know Haleys last name

That would really depend on how involved Tarquin was with the plot around Haley's father. Of which we have little detail on. If he was intimately behind it then it would be a simple deduction.

[Forikroder]

That would really depend on how involved Tarquin was with the plot around Haley's father. Of which we have little detail on. If he was intimately behind it then it would be a simple deduction.

not really, considering how fast the continent forgets old nations its not like Tarquin had a chance of collecting the ransom, i would be surprised if they burnt all the old bounty stuff from the previous countrys

plus he has no way to know she was at the prison thanks to her reality altering bluffs

if he cant find a connection between Haley and Ian then hed be quicker to assume shes a draketooth or not related to anyone important

[Leecros]

not really, considering how fast the continent forgets old nations its not like Tarquin had a chance of collecting the ransom, i would be surprised if they burnt all the old bounty stuff from the previous countrys

plus he has no way to know she was at the prison thanks to her reality altering bluffs

if he cant find a connection between Haley and Ian then hed be quicker to assume shes a draketooth or not related to anyone important

Well, considering that they have Prison Files on Ian, it seems likely that they transferred the information on who they are and why they are in prison. By your theory, it would be likely that they wouldn't have any file on him at all.

[Forikroder]

Well, considering that they have Prison Files on Ian, it seems likely that they transferred the information on who they are and why they are in prison. By your theory, it would be likely that they wouldn't have any file on him at all.

i doubt it, peeing on teh sidewalk earns you life in jail until you become someones weapon rack, at some point when moving all the files i wouldnt be surprised if someone of the prisoners were jsut forgotten or jsut the basic enough information to indentify them and tell them apart

and keeping prisoner files and keeping ransom info is different they can only send a ransom note once, if they sent a ransom note to haley and everyone else there blackmailing every time they changed countries then everyone would have figured it out by now

and again, its extremely likely he stopped caring about a vaguely familiar old prisoner whos now completely missing as soon as he learned there was a macguffin nearby

[Chantelune]

Concerning Tarquin offing Halley to get rid of Ian's daughter... If Tarquin know that Haley is Ian's daughter, I somehow doubt he would bother that much with that information. I mean, Ian spent the last few years in jail doing nothing but trying not to get sent to fight in the arena.

It seems to me a bit doubtfull that Tarquin still sees Ian as a threat, if he ever did, or at the very least enough of a threat to kill Halley for that reason. Tarquin trying to kill Halley to piss off Elan and set him on the rail of seeking his father's demise in the future sounds more likely to me, though.

Don't think he's trying to get kill either, he already stated to Elan that he don't want to rush his death. He wants to enjoy his life as long as he can, then going down with greatness. Don't know what he's up to right now, but would be very surprised if it actually was a suicide solo attack.

[Forikroder]

Concerning Tarquin offing Halley to get rid of Ian's daughter... If Tarquin know that Haley is Ian's daughter, I somehow doubt he would bother that much with that information. I mean, Ian spent the last few years in jail doing nothing but trying not to get sent to fight in the arena.

It seems to me a bit doubtfull that Tarquin still sees Ian as a threat, if he ever did, or at the very least enough of a threat to kill Halley for that reason. Tarquin trying to kill Halley to piss off Elan and set him on the rail of seeking his father's demise in the future sounds more likely to me, though.

Don't think he's trying to get kill either, he already stated to Elan that he don't want to rush his death. He wants to enjoy his life as long as he can, then going down with greatness. Don't know what he's up to right now, but would be very surprised if it actually was a suicide solo attack.

plus Tarquin finds a perverse pleasure in Elans wrestling with himself the whole "i have to stop him but hes my father" thing, if he kills haley then it pushs Elan deep deep into the "ill kill taht evil bastard" and turns elan into a tragic hero

(or elan takes Haleys body to the nearest cleric and ressurects her and pretends it never happened, the whole killing someone to make someone else hate you doesnt work as well with such easily accesable ressurection)

[rbetieh]

Concerning Tarquin offing Halley to get rid of Ian's daughter... If Tarquin know that Haley is Ian's daughter, I somehow doubt he would bother that much with that information. I mean, Ian spent the last few years in jail doing nothing but trying not to get sent to fight in the arena.

It seems to me a bit doubtfull that Tarquin still sees Ian as a threat, if he ever did, or at the very least enough of a threat to kill Halley for that reason. Tarquin trying to kill Halley to piss off Elan and set him on the rail of seeking his father's demise in the future sounds more likely to me, though.

Don't think he's trying to get kill either, he already stated to Elan that he don't want to rush his death. He wants to enjoy his life as long as he can, then going down with greatness. Don't know what he's up to right now, but would be very surprised if it actually was a suicide solo attack.

The theory isn't so much that Tarquin sees Haley or Ian as threats. It's more Daddys Helicopter mode activating, kind of like what he did with Thog. When Dad doesn't want his sons hanging around "those kinds" of people, they don't hang around those people. Remember, he want his sons going about things the right way, well the wrong way is to be overthrown by an anticlimactic sneak attack...The right way was a rooftop duel...It's not like he wasn't competing for Elans attention before the gladiatorial arena scene started either.

[Leecros]

at some point when moving all the files i wouldnt be surprised if someone of the prisoners were jsut forgotten or jsut the basic enough information to indentify them and tell them apart

So the entire basis of this part of your argument is that it was...lost in transition?


Lost in transition to where? the kingdom of blood is Tyrinaria, there was a coup where the Empress of Blood ate Lord Tyrinar the Bloody and that's all we know about it. The capitals are even the same and coups don't have to be violent. In fact, it seems likely that it wasn't. What use would Tarquin have for his own troops to slaughter each other(and who would say 'no' to a dragon that just ate your leader)?

As far as transferring the information because of it being under "Tyrinaria". I'm not sure why one would do that? For one, It's a terrible idea to destroy any kind of records even if you're conquering someplace and two, just because kingdoms rise and fall so fast that the common people don't remember it doesn't mean that every vestige of it forever is burned and destroyed. Even then, speculating that whomever was rewriting the documents(if anyone it was probably Kilkil if he was around back then) is a really big stretch.

Even if it was true, Who Ian is is right on the tip of Tarquin's tongue. A name is all it would take to refresh his memory and even if it isn't, a quick Sending to the gentleman from his party that he worked with on Tyrinaria(probably Miron Shrewdanker, the guy who write the ransom note) would probably fill in the rest of the details.

[Gift Jeraff]

He also knows that the prisoners are somehow connected to Greenhilt and someone he gave his word to. As far as he knows, that someone is Elan, another party member, or someone else connected to the race for the MacGuffin. Thus, the identity of the prisoner may indeed be relevant to the matter at hand and/or to the long-term drama with Elan.

[Forikroder]

He also knows that the prisoners are somehow connected to Greenhilt and someone he gave his word to. As far as he knows, that someone is Elan, another party member, or someone else connected to the race for the MacGuffin. Thus, the identity of the prisoner may indeed be relevant to the matter at hand and/or to the long-term drama with Elan.


or roy is as much as a bleeding heart as he seems to be and promised to get the old frail guys out of prison (htem giving him a healing potion during the battle wouldnt have hurt this story either)

[Gift Jeraff]

True. I hadn't considered that.

[Math_Mage]

or roy is as much as a bleeding heart as he seems to be and promised to get the old frail guys out of prison (htem giving him a healing potion during the battle wouldnt have hurt this story either)

The two are not mutually exclusive.

And there's really no reason why prisoner information would have been lost in the administrative shuffle when Tyrinaria became the Empire of Blood.

[Forikroder]

The two are not mutually exclusive.

And there's really no reason why prisoner information would have been lost in the administrative shuffle when Tyrinaria became the Empire of Blood.

i thought Tyrinaria had happened longer back then there very last country

[Math_Mage]

i thought Tyrinaria had happened longer back then there very last country

Tarquin fed Lord Tyrinar to the Empress.

[Forikroder]

Tarquin fed Lord Tyrinar to the Empress.

guess i didnt express the past tense well enough i only recently reread that specific comic and learned i was wrong

[snikrept]

IMO he's here to betray Nale in some manner. We know he wants Elan to survive and get stronger so they can have their epic duel later, and we also know he couldn't care less about Nale.

[Math_Mage]

Malack is indisputably waiting to betray Nale. I don't know if Tarquin is, however. Tarquin's language can be interpreted as indicating that he's still trying to teach Nale (e.g. "Remember, Nale: Who knows you know is as important as knowing it in the first place.") Certainly he doesn't want to antagonize Malack by openly forgiving Nale. However, if he can covertly aid Nale in surviving Malack's betrayal, and end up in a situation where Malack and Nale are both alive, each thinking Tarquin his ally against the other...well, that seems to be the best outcome for Tarquin, and it's the sort of machination I would expect from him. (Credit to someone else for this idea, I didn't come up with it, but can't remember the original source.)


guess i didnt express the past tense well enough i only recently reread that specific comic and learned i was wrong

FWIW, I think the appropriate syntax in that case would be along the lines of "Ah, I had thought Tyrinaria had happened less recently than that." :smallsmile:

[Forikroder]

Malack is indisputably waiting to betray Nale. I don't know if Tarquin is, however. Tarquin's language can be interpreted as indicating that he's still trying to teach Nale (e.g. "Remember, Nale: Who knows you know is as important as knowing it in the first place.") Certainly he doesn't want to antagonize Malack by openly forgiving Nale. However, if he can covertly aid Nale in surviving Malack's betrayal, and end up in a situation where Malack and Nale are both alive, each thinking Tarquin his ally against the other...well, that seems to be the best outcome for Tarquin, and it's the sort of machination I would expect from him. (Credit to someone else for this idea, I didn't come up with it, but can't remember the original source.)



FWIW, I think the appropriate syntax in that case would be along the lines of "Ah, I had thought Tyrinaria had happened less recently than that." :smallsmile:

ya i realised after you commented

[rbetieh]

Malack is indisputably waiting to betray Nale.

Well, I wouldn't call that a betrayal....more like a well-publicized long-term goal. The only ones that can legitimately betray Nale are Tarquin and Sabine, and neither seem to have honestly considered doing that yet.

[silversnowe]

or

as crazy as it sounds

Tarquin is actually interested in the giant amount of power thats in the basement and is willing to kill the order to get to it

i mean heros are a dime a dozen, sure it would be extra cool if Elan kills him but taking over the continent that much faster is also extra cool and some other hero will eventually show up for him to have his epic duel with, with any luck elan will escape or get ressurected somehow and he gets the best of both worlds

Then he'd just blast them all from above instead of trying to take them 1v5. There's no strategic advantage to him pretending to be Thog right now if all he wants to do is kill them and get that power.

[BaronOfHell]

I see a lot of post saying either Tarquin is crazy for attacking the order like that or Tarquin is prepared to defeat the order and that's why he attacked like that.

I think there is another option people is not considering. What if Tarquin attacked the order like that because it is his intention to die fighting against the order in a epic battle for the gate? Isn't it his intention to die epic and be known forever? IF he dies by Elan's hand fighting as Thog in the fight for the gate and then Elan takes off the mask only to see his father...seems dramatic and epic for me.

What do you think?

Tarquin is going to help driving the oots back, which is what Nale (among other things) wants.

[Forikroder]

Then he'd just blast them all from above instead of trying to take them 1v5. There's no strategic advantage to him pretending to be Thog right now if all he wants to do is kill them and get that power.

maybe maybe not we wont know for another couple comics

maybe Nale thinks the Order knows where the gate is and is trying to trick them to retreating to it in order to find it quicker, maybe hes trying to get them to retreat further so he can follow them and not have to worry about traps

[Chessgeek]

maybe Nale thinks the Order knows where the gate is and is trying to trick them to retreating to it in order to find it quicker, maybe hes trying to get them to retreat further so he can follow them and not have to worry about traps

Or both, or neither. Won't be long until we see (probably).