Wildshape Mystic Ranger Swiftblade.

[Snowbluff]

Can I get some help with this? I want to make a Wildshape Mystic Ranger/Swiftblade

It's no secret that Swiftblade (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070327) is my favorite Gish style. SO, I want to put that with something I don't like using my fave ACF. Wildshape Ranger (UA). Splash in the Mystic Ranger (Dragon 336) and you got something good. A gish that is straight up weaker than OMGSORCADIN, but is playable at all levels. Could I get some help with this.

A side note, Mystic Ranger stops getting new spell levels past 10, so losing CL isn't that bad for them.

The unfinished Handbook I am using for additional Mystic Ranger Tips.
(http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=10830.0)
So here goes:

Ask a Wizard in the party for his spellbook for spells. If not, dipping Wizard is pretty much nessesary

Ranger6/SB9/Ranger+5

Feats:
Flaw1: Dodge
Flaw2: Mobilty
1:Power Attack
3:
6: *HURK* Sword of the Arcane Order
9: Natural Spell (Arcane Strike may go here)
12: Arcane Strike
15: Extend Spell (If you don't like Metamagic Rods).
18:

As you can see, it's not really complete. Any idea what I can fill these slots with?

[Flickerdart]

You're going to want Sword of the Arcane Order in the mix.

[Snowbluff]

You're going to want Sword of the Arcane Order in the mix.
For... the Wizards spell... in CoV
Dammit, that 6th level slot has to pull triple duty, and I really don't want to Shuffle feats here. T^T
Whose idea was it to make SotAO require an even number of levels?

[Dusk Eclipse]

You could take magical training (PGtF iirc) and get your own Spellbook.

[Flickerdart]

You can just buy a spellbook. A spellbook is an item, not a class feature.

[Snowbluff]

You could take magical training (PGtF iirc) and get your own Spellbook.

Hmm, intriguing. A good way around the Spellbook thing.


You can just buy a spellbook. A spellbook is an item, not a class feature.

Yeah, but IDK about the checks and such. ::::3
Could you elabor8 plz?

[Flickerdart]

There are no checks involved if it's your book. You only require checks if it's a borrowed spellbook.

[Chronos]

There are other feats that can replace Dodge for meeting prerequisites, and are at least marginally more useful. For instance, if you're doing anything at all relating to Incarnum, Midnight Dodge is strictly better than the regular version.

[ILM]

I tried something similar recently but ran into a snag: Swiftblade only progresses arcane casting. Unless Mystic Ranger specifically says you cast spells as arcane spells, SotAO only lets you prepare arcane spells but you still cast them from your ranger spell slots, i.e. as divine spells (much like a wizard with arcane disciple doesn't qualify for PrCs that require and advance divine casting).

[Snowbluff]

There are no checks involved if it's your book. You only require checks if it's a borrowed spellbook.

Kk! Same costs as Wizard writing in the 8ook, right? ::::)


There are other feats that can replace Dodge for meeting prerequisites, and are at least marginally more useful. For instance, if you're doing anything at all relating to Incarnum, Midnight Dodge is strictly better than the regular version.

Yeah, I'll look into them. The To8 has a Fire version as well.


I tried something similar recently but ran into a snag: Swiftblade only progresses arcane casting. Unless Mystic Ranger specifically says you cast spells as arcane spells, SotAO only lets you prepare arcane spells but you still cast them from your ranger spell slots, i.e. as divine spells (much like a wizard with arcane disciple doesn't qualify for PrCs that require and advance divine casting).

That's debatable, and even if it was not, the power of this combination is not to the point of wrecking the campaign that the other DMs in my would allow it.

[JadePhoenix]

I tried something similar recently but ran into a snag: Swiftblade only progresses arcane casting. Unless Mystic Ranger specifically says you cast spells as arcane spells, SotAO only lets you prepare arcane spells but you still cast them from your ranger spell slots, i.e. as divine spells (much like a wizard with arcane disciple doesn't qualify for PrCs that require and advance divine casting).

Mystic Ranger is still a divine caster. Yeah, you need houserules to build a Mystic Ranger/Swiftblade.
Also, Mystic Ranger does not have a spellbook. Unless you're going to be borrowing spellbooks left and right for Sword of the Arcane Order, I'd avise you to get the Arcane Training feat.
Of course, that is only relevant if your DM houserules Swiftblade as advancing Mystic Ranger casting.

[Flickerdart]

Kk! Same costs as Wizard writing in the 8ook, right? ::::)
Same cost, yes.


Mystic Ranger is still a divine caster. Yeah, you need houserules to build a Mystic Ranger/Swiftblade.
Also, Mystic Ranger does not have a spellbook. Unless you're going to be borrowing spellbooks left and right for Sword of the Arcane Order, I'd avise you to get the Arcane Training feat.
Of course, that is only relevant if your DM houserules Swiftblade as advancing Mystic Ranger casting.
Mystic Ranger doesn't need to advance through Swiftblade, as it gets no spells after 10th level anyway. As long as he meets the prerequisites, he can get in and chill.

You also don't need Magical Training to own a spellbook, nor to scribe spells into one. If you're going to be pedantic about it, Magical Training doesn't grant you the ability to scribe spells into your book either - it just lets you cast spells like a wizard, not learn spells like a wizard.

[JadePhoenix]

Mystic Ranger doesn't need to advance through Swiftblade, as it gets no spells after 10th level anyway. As long as he meets the prerequisites, he can get in and chill.
Mystic Ranger stops getting new spell levels after 10th. It still gets new spell slots. You can qualify and ignore your spellcasting, though, if you're fine with having 3rd level spells throughout 9 levels of Swiftblade and getting 4th level spells at level 16.


You also don't need Magical Training to own a spellbook, nor to scribe spells into one. If you're going to be pedantic about it, Magical Training doesn't grant you the ability to scribe spells into your book either - it just lets you cast spells like a wizard, not learn spells like a wizard.
Well, I would be much more inclined towards allowing someone with Magical Training to scribe spells into a spellbook than someone who simply bought a spellbook (because otherwise we'd have a market for commoners selling spellbooks to wizards). That's just me, though. RAW, you need a borrowed spellbook.

[nedz]

For... the Wizards spell... in CoV
Dammit, that 6th level slot has to pull triple duty, and I really don't want to Shuffle feats here. T^T
Whose idea was it to make SotAO require an even number of levels?

Those game designers just love to give you choices.


Same cost, yes.
Mystic Ranger doesn't need to advance through Swiftblade, as it gets no spells after 10th level anyway. As long as he meets the prerequisites, he can get in and chill.

But the OP's build only has 6 levels of MR before 15th ?

[Snowbluff]

Those game designers just love to give you choices.



But the OP's build only has 6 levels of MR before 15th ?

Yeah, the reason why alot of my 8uilds get really good at 12 is 8ecause I use alot of feats you can get at level 6 at the earliest. XXXXD

IDK why you 8uds are still talking a8out this. I already said that my group allows it to progress Arcane. Read the Mystic Ranger Hand8ook, it makes a reason8le argument either way.

[Flickerdart]

Well, I would be much more inclined towards allowing someone with Magical Training to scribe spells into a spellbook than someone who simply bought a spellbook (because otherwise we'd have a market for commoners selling spellbooks to wizards). That's just me, though. RAW, you need a borrowed spellbook.
I would make the argument that a character capable of casting 5th level spells has more magical training than someone who casts three cantrips.

[nedz]

IDK why you 8uds are still talking a8out this. I already said that my group allows it to progress Arcane. Read the Mystic Ranger Hand8ook, it makes a reason8le argument either way.

Didn't see where you said that, and besides others may be interested in the build.

[Snowbluff]

Didn't see where you said that, and besides others may be interested in the build.

It's still valid anyway. You get your 10 levels of Ranger and your 9 levels of Swift8lade. It's a Damn good com8o even with the gimpy CL.

It's flexi8le, too. You can swap Ranger levels in for your Swift8lade ones if you are in dire need of a Size Category or high HD 8east form. Imho, the extra Standard is worth more. I would like it to casting a Celerity every round. >::::D GEHEHEHEH!

[Flickerdart]

It's still valid anyway. You get your 10 levels of Ranger and your 9 levels of Swift8lade. It's a Damn good com8o even with the gimpy CL.

It's flexi8le, too. You can swap Ranger levels in for your Swift8lade ones if you are in dire need of a Size Category or high HD 8east form. Imho, the extra Standard is worth more. I would like it to casting a Celerity every round. >::::D GEHEHEHEH!
Wildshape Ranger only ever gets Small and Medium animal forms, so you don't get the extra size.

[Snowbluff]

Wildshape Ranger only ever gets Small and Medium animal forms, so you don't get the extra size.

Huh. Forgot a8out that. In that case, ranger levels can hang for all I care. I can't think of any medium forms worth the extra HD requirements. Down with the Ranger levels! More Swift8blade!

[JadePhoenix]

Why Ranger 6 btw?

EDIT: Also, isn't Fleshraker Medium-sized?

[Flickerdart]

Huh. Forgot a8out that. In that case, ranger levels can hang for all I care. I can't think of any medium forms worth the extra HD requirements. Down with the Ranger levels! More Swift8blade!
Swiftblade 10 doesn't get you much either - +1 BAB, +1 to two saves and +10ft of Swift Surge. You'd be better off jumping into Fighter or something, for a shiny bonus feat.

[Snowbluff]

Swiftblade 10 doesn't get you much either - +1 BAB, +1 to two saves and +10ft of Swift Surge. You'd be better off jumping into Fighter or something, for a shiny bonus feat.

Yeah, I agree. I was talking about priorities. I should of made that clear, sorry. Not being able to use the last ability stings a little. It would work great with Ranger.

[Fable Wright]

First, you really do need Sword of the Arcane Order at 6th level. Otherwise you can't qualify for Swiftblade, given that Haste is not a ranger spell. Second, Natural Spell should definitely be next, as at that level, most of your spells would probably be long-term buffs and swift action casting spells (Bladeweave, Karmic Aura and derivatives, Wraithstrike) that let you full attack when needed. Then at 12th level Arcane Strike can let you clear out the higher-level spell slots when needed. As for feats... you should probably get Practiced Spellcaster in there somewhere to make up for the caster levels, probably at 3rd for convenience. Combat Casting to get into Abjurant Champion seems like a fine option as well, if you want to go that route. Other than that, you could add in some metamagic feats. Extend spell comes to mind... 3rd level slot for two rounds of touch attacks seems fine to me, especially when you have the option to get Hastes in that last all combat while freeing up your 3rd level spell slots.

Also, someone's been reading too much Homestuck...

[Snowbluff]

First, you really do need Sword of the Arcane Order at 6th level. Otherwise you can't qualify for Swiftblade, given that Haste is not a ranger spell. Second, Natural Spell should definitely be next, as at that level, most of your spells would probably be long-term buffs and swift action casting spells (Bladeweave, Karmic Aura and derivatives, Wraithstrike) that let you full attack when needed. Then at 12th level Arcane Strike can let you clear out the higher-level spell slots when needed. As for feats... you should probably get Practiced Spellcaster in there somewhere to make up for the caster levels, probably at 3rd for convenience. Combat Casting to get into Abjurant Champion seems like a fine option as well, if you want to go that route. Other than that, you could add in some metamagic feats. Extend spell comes to mind... 3rd level slot for two rounds of touch attacks seems fine to me, especially when you have the option to get Hastes in that last all combat while freeing up your 3rd level spell slots.

Also, someone's been reading too much Homestuck...

Yeah, SotAO is definitely first, I'll fix that.

I'm going to point out A8J might be catch 22. You want to keep the duration up on your Wildshape, so Ranger is not o8solete.

IIRC, A8J is Arcane Progression, so having it be valuable as Swift8lade would mean it progressing spellcasting as well. Swift8lade is straight up superior defensively, as it consolidates many of your defensive 8uffs into one spell. Offensively A8J is good in it's own way, IIRC.

As for Extend spell, we have W8L for a reason. The only reason you take Extend Spell over a Rod o' Extend is so you can get Persistent Spell. And the only reason you do that is 8ecause I don't know if Rods o' Persist exist. ::::P
(The same applies to A8J's duration bonus to A8jurations).

EDIT: I don't have Martial Weapon Proficiencies as a Mystic Ranger. Rolling an Elf should fix this nicely for those who are wondering. I'll add this note to the OP later.

Thank you. These suggestions should be fine for others, 8ut they aren't suita8le for my needs.

Don't diss the spiderspeak. I could 8e messing with your way of typing as well, 8ut I will not.

I am re8uilding myself and recognizing my Scorpio traits. The last few weeks have 8een horrid, and if I had a way to constantly remind myself of my more evil tendencies and thirst for vengeance such as this, my life would 8e 8etter than it is now. 8esides, isn't keeping up with it in the first place way too much? XXXXD

[herrhauptmann]

Ditch power attack as your 1st level feat.
Take an alternate combat style (dragon mag).
I forget the issue, but you can double check it in pathfinder srd since they did the same thing with their ranger a few months back.
Combat style feats become power attack, cleave, great cleave (I think).
edit and off topic:
geh, why swap out b for 8? You don't do it in other threads.

[Snowbluff]

Ditch power attack as your 1st level feat.
Take an alternate combat style (dragon mag).
I forget the issue, but you can double check it in pathfinder srd since they did the same thing with their ranger a few months back.
Combat style feats become power attack, cleave, great cleave (I think).
edit and off topic:
geh, why swap out b for 8? You don't do it in other threads.

Nope, can't. I gave up my Com8at styles for Wildshaping. Which is a lot better than a 8unch o' feats that I can get with first level feats. ::::P

Read Homestuck. The scorpio troll types like this. She's a true scorpio in every fashion. And has my favorite superpower. I've 8een through some stuff so I'm doing things to keep my inn8 8ad 8ehavior in check. This what I do while typing.

[herrhauptmann]

Nope, can't. I gave up my Com8at styles for Wildshaping. Which is a lot better than a 8unch o' feats that I can get with first level feats. ::::P

Ahh, right, wildshape ranger. Forgot.


Read Homestuck. The scorpio troll types like this. She's a true scorpio in every fashion. And has my favorite superpower. I've 8een through some stuff so I'm doing things to keep my inn8 8ad 8ehavior in check. This what I do while typing.
So you're emulating trolls? :smallconfused:
Reminds me more of the Bloods. If they write something, swap out C with numbers. Why? Because they're just sillly.:smallbiggrin:

[Lateral]

W3LL, 1 TH1NK YOU H4VE 4 PR3TTY GOOD BU1LD S3T UP, 3XC3PT FOR TH1S: 4R3 YOU PL4NN1NG ON PL4Y1NG TH1S CH4R4CT3R FROM L3V3L ON3? 1F YOU'R3 ST4RT1NG B3LOW L3V3L 5, YOU M4Y F1ND 1T TO B3 MOR3 D1FF1CULT; YOU DON'T G3T W1LDSH4P3 UNT1L F1FTH L3V3L, 4ND YOU'R3 STUCK T4K1NG NOT-SO-GR34T F34TS TO QU4L1FY

POW3R 4TT4CK W1LL H3LP 4LL3V14T3 TH1S, 4S W1LL C4R3FUL 1T3M S3L3CT1ON 4ND TH3 F4CT TH4T YOU'R3 4LSO 4 MYST1C R4NG3R, BUT W1THOUT SWORD OF TH3 4RC4N3 ORD3R TH3 MYST1C R4NG3R SP3LL L1ST 1SN'T SO HOT

TH1S SHOULDN'T B3 4 B1G D34L, SO LONG 4S YOU R3M3MB3R TH4T 1T C4N B3 4 PROBL3M 4ND D34L W1TH 1T 4CCORD1NGLY, BUT 1T'S 4 GOOD TH1NG TO 1D3NT1FY

[Snowbluff]

Ahh, right, wildshape ranger. Forgot.

So you're emulating trolls? :smallconfused:
Reminds me more of the Bloods. If they write something, swap out C with numbers. Why? Because they're just sillly.:smallbiggrin:

Thanks for the heads up, any way.

Each of the Trolls writes funny. One wriite2 doubliing certaiin letter2 and using 2 iin place of 's'. ANOTHER TALKS IN ALL CAPS CUZ HE'S ALWAYS ANGRY ABOUT SOMETHING STUPID. What are the 8loods from? ::::)

[Lateral]

you know

YOU CAN ALWAYS JUST LINK TO HOMESTUCK. (http://www.mspaintadventures.com/)

might make things easier. :0)

NO MORE THREAD DERAILMENT, EITHER.

honk.

@V:
it took

A RIDICULOUSLY LONG TIME.

this is way easier.

HOOOOONNNNK

honk. ;0)

[Snowbluff]

W3LL, 1 TH1NK YOU H4VE 4 PR3TTY GOOD BU1LD S3T UP, 3XC3PT FOR TH1S: 4R3 YOU PL4NN1NG ON PL4Y1NG TH1S CH4R4CT3R FROM L3V3L ON3? 1F YOU'R3 ST4RT1NG B3LOW L3V3L 5, YOU M4Y F1ND 1T TO B3 MOR3 D1FF1CULT; YOU DON'T G3T W1LDSH4P3 UNT1L F1FTH L3V3L, 4ND YOU'R3 STUCK T4K1NG NOT-SO-GR34T F34TS TO QU4L1FY

POW3R 4TT4CK W1LL H3LP 4LL3V14T3 TH1S, 4S W1LL C4R3FUL 1T3M S3L3CT1ON 4ND TH3 F4CT TH4T YOU'R3 4LSO 4 MYST1C R4NG3R, BUT W1THOUT SWORD OF TH3 4RC4N3 ORD3R TH3 MYST1C R4NG3R SP3LL L1ST 1SN'T SO HOT

TH1S SHOULDN'T B3 4 B1G D34L, SO LONG 4S YOU R3M3MB3R TH4T 1T C4N B3 4 PROBL3M 4ND D34L W1TH 1T 4CCORD1NGLY, BUT 1T'S 4 GOOD TH1NG TO 1D3NT1FY

Yeah. Keep in mind my Spellcasting is significantly better that a regular ranger, almost at T2 capa8ility. I think the progression works itself rather smoothly 8esides that fact that WotC likes to make a lot of feat for level 6 and not for level 3. Level 3 really needs some love. XXXXD

I don't know which is more awesome. The fact that you could type that, or that I could read it just fine. May8e I've exposed myself to too much Megatokyo or other sources of l33tsp34k...

[Snowbluff]

you know

YOU CAN ALWAYS JUST LINK TO HOMESTUCK. (http://www.mspaintadventures.com/)

might make things easier. :0)

NO MORE THREAD DERAILMENT, EITHER.

honk.

Didn't have to, I just got you to do it for me.

...dammit.

Side note, or center note... I might pick up a reserve feat, but those are also level 6. ::::(

Perhaps we could do some o8tain familiar and improved familiar. The full 8a8 can make the familiar a fierce com8atant.

[Lateral]

back on topic.

(STILL DOING THIS THOUGH)

instead of trying to spend all those feats

JUST TO GET A FAMILIAR,

why not just take wild cohort?

THAT'S FAR LESS FEATS, THE BASE IS MUCH STRONGER, AND IT SCALES BETTER.

you can also take one of the acfs for the normal companion

BECAUSE IT WILL SUCK ANYWAY

also, while not really raw

SEE IF YOUR DM WILL LET YOU TRADE FAST MOVEMENT FOR POUNCE

like a barbarian, with spirit wolf totem in complete champion.

IF YOUR DM WILL GO FOR IT, DO IT.

everyone loves pounce plus haste plus natural attacks

EXCEPT FOR THE GUY WHOSE THROAT YOU'RE TEARING OUT. :0)

[Snowbluff]

back on topic.

(STILL DOING THIS THOUGH)

instead of trying to spend all those feats

JUST TO GET A FAMILIAR,

why not just take wild cohort?

THAT'S FAR LESS FEATS, THE BASE IS MUCH STRONGER, AND IT SCALES BETTER.

you can also take one of the acfs for the normal companion

BECAUSE IT WILL SUCK ANYWAY

also, while not really raw

SEE IF YOUR DM WILL LET YOU TRADE FAST MOVEMENT FOR POUNCE

like a barbarian, with spirit wolf totem in complete champion.

IF YOUR DM WILL GO FOR IT, DO IT.

everyone loves pounce plus haste plus natural attacks

EXCEPT FOR THE GUY WHOSE THROAT YOU'RE TEARING OUT. :0)

God, this convo roooooooocks. Talking like that is fun, isn't it? ::::D

The Familiar Versus Wild Cohort is a good conumdrum. Except the Cohort has about 13 HD. 13x3=39. Divide 8y 4, round down you have 9 for its 8a8.

The Familiar will have 1/2 your HP and 100% of your 8a8, which is full due to this 8uild. (http://dictummortuum.blogspot.com/2011/08/familiars-handbook.html) It's definitely a stronger option. Some familiars come with power attack of their own as well. Draconic Familiar is also an option. Getting yourself a gold one requires 12th level anyway, and Arcane Strike is less valuable. They also can UMD for you, which is really sweet.

As for pounce, I'll talk with them, but I can learn to pounce with a spell or wildshape. Fleshrakers are Medium, and available as soon as you get Wildshape at only 4 HD.

[Lateral]

hmm, that's true.

SO VERY MOTHER****ING TRUE.

dragon familiar, of course, is a great option

BUT IT'S ALSO A HIGHER LEVEL THING.

might want to actually move arcane strike up a level

OR EVEN NOT BOTHER WITH IT IF YOU FEEL FEAT-STARVED

after all, with maximum spell level five, by the time you get it at level 15

IT'S SMALL POTATOES.

extend spell might not be great either, since it's such a high level and it's unlikely you'd need more than 3 a day

I WOULD JUST GO FOR THE ROD INSTEAD, SO YOU CAN GET IT WHILE THE GETTING IS GOOD.

this also frees up plenty of feats for that familiar stuff

TAKE WHAT YOU LIKE THOUGH.

also, it's good to start thinking about your best spells

SINCE YOU HAVE TO BE PREPARING THEM.

haste is the obvious choice

BUT SWIFT HASTE IS INCREDIBLE WITH PERPETUAL OPTIONS.

at higher levels polymorph/draconic polymorph will be relevant

SINCE YOUR WILDSHAPE ISN'T GONNA SCALE PERFECTLY.

also the wizard and ranger buff staples will be nice.

BUT REMEMBER THAT YOU ONLY HAVE SO MANY ACTIONS

so try to keep buffs either swift-action or long-term.

BESIDES HASTE OBVIOUSLY, THAT'S FINE.

battlefield control is not gonna be your thing of course

BUT SMALL AMOUNTS OF IT CAN BE NICE TO HAVE.

just some stuff to think about :0)

[Snowbluff]

hmm, that's true.

SO VERY MOTHER****ING TRUE.

dragon familiar, of course, is a great option

BUT IT'S ALSO A HIGHER LEVEL THING.

might want to actually move arcane strike up a level

OR EVEN NOT BOTHER WITH IT IF YOU FEEL FEAT-STARVED

after all, with maximum spell level five, by the time you get it at level 15

IT'S SMALL POTATOES.

extend spell might not be great either, since it's such a high level and it's unlikely you'd need more than 3 a day

I WOULD JUST GO FOR THE ROD INSTEAD, SO YOU CAN GET IT WHILE THE GETTING IS GOOD.

this also frees up plenty of feats for that familiar stuff

TAKE WHAT YOU LIKE THOUGH.

also, it's good to start thinking about your best spells

SINCE YOU HAVE TO BE PREPARING THEM.

haste is the obvious choice

BUT SWIFT HASTE IS INCREDIBLE WITH PERPETUAL OPTIONS.

at higher levels polymorph/draconic polymorph will be relevant

SINCE YOUR WILDSHAPE ISN'T GONNA SCALE PERFECTLY.

also the wizard and ranger buff staples will be nice.

BUT REMEMBER THAT YOU ONLY HAVE SO MANY ACTIONS

so try to keep buffs either swift-action or long-term.

BESIDES HASTE OBVIOUSLY, THAT'S FINE.

battlefield control is not gonna be your thing of course

BUT SMALL AMOUNTS OF IT CAN BE NICE TO HAVE.

just some stuff to think about :0)

Yeah, Arcane Strike is a quantit8tive bonus, while natural spell, SotAO and o8tain familiar are qualit8tive, making them more useful.

Yeha, we've been over the damn Extend Spell thing. Someone should make a thread a8out not taking it. >::::D

Polymorphs are something I can do without. The best I can do with them is use them to give myself fighting a8ility, something I already have in spades. The Fleshraker is pretty much perfect for my needs in this 8uild. If I need hands, I'll get Hands of Man. If I need to speak, I probably could, like, cast telepathy or something. Or have a Raven familiar.

I actually have a thread devoted to Swift Action spell for the U8ermount 8uild I did. I was a Arcane Hierophant, so I had Druid and Wizard casting. I pretty much used the Wizard slots almost exclusively for buffs for my mount like Wraithstrike. ::::3

I don't know why I would take Swift H8ste. I can already cast it as a free action with Sudden Casting.

[JadePhoenix]

I don't know why I would take Swift H8ste. I can already cast it as a free action with Sudden Casting.
It's a level 2 spell for Ranger, that's why.
Also, the way you guys are typing is a pain in the neck.

[Snowbluff]

It's a level 2 spell for Ranger, that's why.
Also, the way you guys are typing is a pain in the neck.

Hmmmmmmmm... This should be a8le to be used to qualify for Swift8lade a little earlier, as it functions as H8ste. If you aren't going for Wildhshape and want to get some use out polymorph, this would be a good option.

Sorry about the typing. I'm going to ask to bear with us. It's all in good fun.

And at least I'm not talking in white like Doc Scratch or someone being snarky.

[JadePhoenix]

Hmmmmmmmm... This should be a8le to be used to qualify for Swift8lade a little earlier, as it functions as H8ste. If you aren't going for Wildhshape and want to get some use out polymorph, this would be a good option.

Well, Swiftblade specifies haste and swift haste is not haste. It also specifies 3rd level slots to qualify for the class (though the author has said he would change it for 'all slots in the level haste is on your list' or something similar). If you can convince your DM to allow this (he looks very permissive from what I've seen you saying), more power to you.

[Snowbluff]

Well, Swiftblade specifies haste and swift haste is not haste. It also specifies 3rd level slots to qualify for the class (though the author has said he would change it for 'all slots in the level haste is on your list' or something similar). If you can convince your DM to allow this (he looks very permissive from what I've seen you saying), more power to you.

First of all, it says you have to use all of your 3rd level slots last level to cast haste. If you have 0 3rd level slots, then all of them is none, so using no slots to cast hast last level is fine.

Secondly, Swift Haste is functionally haste. It's not a far stretch, if at all, for it to be allowed.

[Fable Wright]

First of all, it says you have to use all of your 3rd level slots last level to cast haste. If you have 0 3rd level slots, then all of them is none, so using no slots to cast hast last level is fine.

Secondly, Swift Haste is functionally haste. It's not a far stretch, if at all, for it to be allowed.

The prereqs also require the ability to cast haste. Not Swift Haste, but the actual Haste spell, by name. The trick wouldn't work by RAW or get approval from any DMs I know; it's going a bit too far.

[Lateral]

It's kind of a moot point for your build, though, since you want Wild Shape first anyway. Also, remember that the designer later recommended changing the requirement to using all spell slots of the spell level you get Haste at, rather than specifying 3rd (he didn't know about things like Trapsmith when he made the class); that's not official, and it still doesn't make Swift Haste the same as Haste, but it's nice for certain other builds.

And yeah, I forgot about Sudden Casting, which makes it a lot less useful. Still, if your DM lets you apply your Swiftblade abilities to Swift Haste (something that I would almost always allow, but you'll have to talk to your DM), it would be nice if you ever need a second bonus action that round.

[Dusk Eclipse]

FWIW Swift haste is persistable while haste itself not and without MM mitigation (as a level 8th spell).