League of Legends XXXIII: Game of Mundo

[Darth Mario]

League of Legends XXXIII:
Game of Mundo


Because Mundo rules what he pleases.

You can sign up for League of Legends here (http://signup.leagueoflegends.com/en/signup/). It's a free MOBA, based on Defence of the Ancients.

We maintain lists of players, sorted by server. If you are not on these lists and would like to be, please post in the thread with the following information in bold: Server (if you don't know it, it's likely the region you're in, but it's worth checking anyway), your Forum Name and your Summoner Name
If no reply's been made about adding you after a day or two, first check the lists to see if you've been added, if not, feel free to post again or PM me. Any incorrectly formatted posts will probably be overlooked.

NA Server
{table=head]Forum Name|Game Name
0tt3r | 0tt3r
9mm | cwcriner
Adumbration | Benefice
aethernox | aethernox
Alemil | Alemil
Alter | AlterForm
Anonomuss | OpticalSage
ArcanistSupreme | Arcanist Supreme
Arbitrarity | Arbitrarity
Archangel Yuki | Yocham
assassin89 | nineballcirno
Astrella | Sirroelivan
AtwasAwamps | AtwasAwamps
Aurenthal | Estor
Baron Corm | Baron Corm
Baxter | Thefettered
BinaryMage | BinaryMage
Brother Oni | MarineHK4861
Bliss Authority | Companion N00b
Caradryan | Ying Quliang
cdstephens | cdstephens
Chess435 | Chess435
Copacetic | Azbu
Creed | Moarzed
CrnvorousMeece | CarnivorousMeece
Croverus | Croverus
Cute_Riolu | Cute Riolu
Dallas-Dakota | MustacheMan
Dante & Vergil | Raphiezar
Darth Mario | Darth Mario
Daverin | Daverin
Dentrag2 | Callinectes
dgnslyr | GANKERLagann
Dichotomy | Kaellin
Djinn in Tonic | The Djinn
Dogmantra | Dogmantra
douglas | DouglasM
Dragonus45 | Dragonus45
Drager0 | Drager0
Dragor | Supernaturalist
Draken | Draken Frosthand
DrakeRaids | DrakeRaids057
Dralnu | TomerIsHot
dukexx | JacksonHicks
Duos | DapperGuy
Eldariel | Elealar
efdf | efdf
Elagune | Chopstyx
EndlessWrath | Andurin
Errandir | Ramses III
EternalMelon | EternalMelon
faith | Ferrovax101
FantomFang | FantomFang
Faulty | FaultyClockwork
Fawkes | Count Fawkes
FeverFox | Alcopop
Flechair | Master Zealot
Folytopo | Folytopo
Frankelshtein | McFinkelstein
Fredaintdead | Fredthefighter
Gallus | Anechois
Geigan | Geigan
glemis | glemis
Giant Panda | Le Shirrif
Godskook | Bethor Kookalian
Gourtox | Gourtox
Gruffard | Gruffard
Hanuman | HanumanXoO
Hatevah | Hatevah
Incomp | Incomp
InyutheBeatIs | Believe Inyu
Istari | IstariK
Ivellius | Ivellius
Jamin | CapZich
Joran | Jorana
KaizoMK | KaizoMK
Kara Kuro | RaptorKitty
Kciemir | Ghostface Ki11ah
Kettle | Kettle747
king.com | kingcom
Kinslayer | HaunterReqiuem
kmchii | kmchii
Kopaka | CelesHurricane
Kwazey | Kwazey
LegoShrimp | LegoShrimp
litewarior | litewarior
Lix Lorn | ElixiaLorn
Lord Generic | Lord Generic
LordShotGun | LordShotGun
LostEnder | LostEnder
Low-Key | TheFuzziestBear
lvl 1 sharnian | StarryEagle
Lyxie | Lyxie
Maeglin_Dubh | Tycho Velius
Makensha | Jarbis
MammonAzrael | MammonAzrael
Manticoran | Manticoran
MasatoHyuga | MasatoHyuga
Master_Rahl22 | Goltoth
master256 | QWERTYSTOP
Math_Mage | Mathmage
Mattarias, King. | Mattarias
Malmagor Andrigal | Madmal
Maxios | Maxios20
Meatshield#236 | Meatshield236
Merellis | Merellis
Mike_the_Mystic | Kraemer
Milskidasith | Milskidasith
Mindfreak586 | Mindfreak586
Mirrinus | Parallaxal
Miscast_Mage | MiscastMage
Moklok | KokoBWare
mrzomby | mrzomby
Mtg_player_zach | MtgPlayerZach
Mushroom Ninja | Mushroom Ninja
Mutant Bunny | WhollySpart
Nadevoc | Xenik
Nanoblack | IwearSILLYhats
Nargan | Naryuk
Necroticplague | Yamidamian
Neoseanster | Neoseanster
NeoVid | NeoVid
neXianXavia | neXianXavia
NotAEvilToaster | NeonPie
Octopus Jack | Thalric
PersonMan | Nsev
Pie Guy | Qwazes
pilvento | Kandrass
PhoeKun | PhoeKun
Poison Fish | Baron Von Flib
Protecar | Godreig
Protecar | Atk
Psychotic | SquirrelFish
Qaera | Qaera
Raistlin1040 | Sanevale
Rama | Nargus
Raroy | setokaibasmt
RationalGoblin | AtillathePun
Raveypoos | Rhaviewoos
recklessabaddon | recklessabaddon
revolver kobold | A Magic Kobold
Reynard | Duke Reynington
Serpentine | Lady Serpentine
Shades of Gray | PierreAbelard
shadowwalker64 | shadowwalker65
Shadowleaf | Shadowdancing
Shadow Lord | ShadowLordgiantitp
ShortOne | LittlePoppy
SidCoolios | Irazel
Silverraptor | Silverraptor
Sircarp | Sircarp
SirSigfried | LibertarianSDR
Slash_712 | Catfud
sofawall | sofawall
St. Viers | St.Viers
Starfols | Starfols
SuperPanda | Lokilar
SweetRein | Riot Reinboom
TalonDemonKing | TalonDemonKing
TechnOkami | Techn0kami
Temotei | Temotei221
Terazul | Allegretto
term1nally s1ck | silverdevilboy
Thanatos 51-50 | Thanatos Erebus
The_Fiery_Tower | TheFieryTower
TheGlowingRogue | I Glow In Dark
Thethan | Thethan
The Rabbler | Paco H Jones
The Shadowmind | The Shadowmind
The Valiant Turtle | Valiant Turtle
Thrantar | Thrantar
Thrawn183 | Thrawnyboy
throtecutter | throtecutter
toasty | toastymow
Tono | Tono Chou
Treayn | Treayn
tribble | Smallbluedot
Tychris1 | Tychris1
userpay | userpay
Vauron | Vauron
Volatar | The Volatar
wandiya | wandiya
Winterwind | DreamingHeart
Winthur | Seyruun
woodzyowl | Woodzyowl
Zabel_Zarock | Jon Talbain
Zeful | Zeful
ZeltArruin | ZeltArruin
Zemro | Shivic
ZeroNumerous | ZeroNumerous
Zeteni | Zeteni
zolga | TheZolga[/table]

EU Server--West
{table=head]Forum Name|Game Name
Acromos | Crannoch
Adumbration | Adumbration
Anonomuss | Anonomuss
Brother Oni | MarineHK4861
Cheers | Sam vds
Cyborg Mage | Cyborg Mage98
Eldariel | Elealar
Even Human | SlyGuyMcFly
Gauntlet | Isva
HalfDragonCube | giantmudkip
Maxymiuk | Maxymiuk
Mc. Lovin | B1GB1RDB4G3L
Miscast_Mage | MiscastMage
Morph Bark | Morpheus Bob
Nargan | Naryuk
PersonMan | Scarge
Reynard | Duke Reyn
Talesin | Fridgecake
term1nally s1ck | Silverdevilboy
That'd_be_me | AntiLocke
Winterwind | DreamingHeart
Ziren | Zirenoid
zolga | MasterZolga[/table]

EU Server--Nordic & East
{table=head]Forum Name|Game Name
Dada | Scrattlebeard
Posca | LDRC
Rockbird | Rockbird[/table]

EU Server--Unspecified
{table=head]Forum Name|Game Name
Abakus | Terpfen
Alemil | Alemil
Ayra | Ayramatao
Darwin | DarwinBeGood
Endoperez | Endoperez
Heliomance | Sidhe de Grian
Kurrel | GrinningOni
littlebottom | Littlebottom
lord_khaine | Lord_khaine
Narazil | Narazil
Narkis | Narkis
Penthar | Malderon
Raviepoos | Skittles Unicorn
Shadowleaf | AncientPharma
shadowwalker64 | shadowwalker64
Socratov | Mbutu
Voidhawk | Sidhe ne Awk
Volatar | VolatarUK
Zefir | Einerwie
Zombywoof | Zombywoof[/table]

SEA Server
{table=head]Forum Name|Game Name
abadguy | Smite Thy Enemy[/table]

MUMBLE
Download here! (http://mumble.sourceforge.net/)
Our main means of communication is a mumble server, playing host to a variety of games, including LoL. We're quite a tight knit community, get to know us! Hanging about is a good way to find a game, and if you don't fancy playing something there's always a good chance of a friendly chat. Contact Djinn_in_Tonic via PM if you have a question or want to donate money to keep the server running.
Address: fish.mumbleboxes.com
Port: 36003

Admins: Djinn_in_Tonic (Djinn); Darth Mario; ShortOne (LittlePoppy, Raven); Dogmantra; Nano (Nanoceraptor).

STREAMS
Some of us run streams. You can watch them here.
Silverraptor (http://www.livestream.com/silverrapter?t=527242)
Lyxie (http://www.own3d.tv/lyxie)

GUIDES
Sometimes people write guides and post them in this thread. Other times pro players write guides that people then post in this thread. They often end up here.
General
Guide to General Common Jungler Set-Ups (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12409551&postcount=575), by Mtg_player_zach
Small Guide to Jungle Counterpicking (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12379254&postcount=98), by Winthur
General Guide to AD Carries (http://www.solomid.net/guides.php?g=9234)
Into the Wild - Guide to Being a Better Jungler (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10867111#post10867111) by Mtg_player_zach
Seizing the fourth digit: Playing your way out of Elo Hell. (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=341821) by Math_Mage
Faulty and Raistlin's Quick Build Database: Notes and Stuff (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10942497&postcount=1004) by Faulty and Raistlin
Turning Skill Into Elo: Solo Queue Mindset And Methodology (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=1220673) by MathMage
How to be a Good Team Leader (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=1374492) by Darth Mario

Specific Champions
Riven 101 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12579737&postcount=204), by Arbitrarity
Highly Artistic Blitzcrank guide (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12380155&postcount=115), by Dogmantra
Laser Bear Udyr (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9657101&postcount=39), by Djinn_In_Tonic
Rammus: Can't touch this (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=258919), by Math_Mage
Twitch (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board
[URL="http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10267058&postcount=1448), by Djinn_In_Tonic
Jungle Akali (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10498621&postcount=1358) by Djinn
How to play everyone's favourite Lightning Squirrel (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10518034&postcount=154) by Dogmantra
Lee Sin (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=636475) by Dralnu
Super Serious Rumble Guide (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11052926&postcount=904) by Dogmantra
Jax (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11252389&postcount=652) by Mtg_player_zach
OH SNAP Morgana Can Jungle (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11295698&postcount=1238) by Dogmantra
Anivia Guide (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11514141&postcount=845) by Eldariel
Tristana (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11938481&postcount=1029) by MathMage

CLASSY VIDEOS FOR CLASSY PEOPLE*
Watching these videos makes you a classier person. Fact.
Jungle Janna! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fC6wm9iaNmM)
How to Win Every Game in League of Legends (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrsTE1vpoXM)
Panic at the Nexus (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7WlCbaLI3I)
Sunfire Cape Sunday (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgjfX6crjrg)
Season One Trailer with Commentary (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/news/season-one-trailer-commentary)
D-Town (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wHp4VJ47v0)
Insanity Mix (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGKN1Adzckk&feature=related)
(Truly, Truly) Outrageous (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fC7S05vI-BU&feature=related)
I'm just a noob (Ryze Ryze Ryze again) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wpr1T-pgaZY&feature=related)
e.o.n Shen (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHs_cGUPQ3M&feature=related)
Vendrim-Ionia (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ry3E2UQMe3k&hd=1)
Pwn ur FACE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zf9VSDt0EN4)
Your -Epic- Dreamhack comes true! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKCs1CyBFLg)
Ezreal Custom Skin Spotlight (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zn-HoAPlg-c)
I Just Got Ganked (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpNVN33fj4Y&feature=channel_video_title)
Keep Feeding (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MaR0frKc4a0)
Champion Rap Battles -- Brolaf vs. Gentleman Cho'Gath (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZ-r300BVFI)
Combinasion BOOM! League of Legends (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwzsXR4sM_Y)
All in the Cards (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9d3342IXSs)
No One Ganks Like Garen (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bD4uiTQsRJg)
Rammus Taunts Everyone (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-8Q4PM4PXM)

COMICS AND PICS
It's like your eyes are getting a massage.
LoL Comic (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=48169) by Elagune
Learn Your Alphabet (http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/6264/g28376.png) by Dogmantra and Pierreabelard (with a mention in Summoner Showcase #36 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cy7JWV-HA28&feature=feedu)!)
Chibi Champions (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=763895) by pika7
Gender Swaps (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=606416) by ShowMeYourMoves
Champion Flowchart Guides (http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=608154) by Renekton Bot
Patch Day Comic (http://i.imgur.com/kHtwk.jpg) by DaemianFF

TRAVEL BACK IN TIME: PREVIOUS THREADS
Proof we're not all experiencing collective haullucinations.

League of Legends XXXII: Cupcakes and Kittens and Squirrels. Oh my! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=237600)
League of Legends XXXI: I'll Start My Own Team! With TF And Janna! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=234631)
League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=231927)
League of Legends XXIX: Are Nerfs Vayne In This Grave Situation? (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=229460)
League of Legends XXVIII: Ahri-Vederci, Dodge. Hello, Viktory. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=12466887)
League of Legends XXVII: Your Sister's Hotter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=225730)
League of Legends XXVI: We've officially jumped the shark (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=223894)
League of Legends XXV: Who is your Summoner, and what does he do? (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=221849)
League of Legends XXIV: Today's Noob Strat, Tomorrow's New Meta (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=219436)
League of Legends XXIII: gunbladeface.jpg (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=217744)
League of Legends XXII: Teamwork OP, Nerf Nao (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=215725)
League of Legends XXI: For The Love Of God Amumu, Stop Crying! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=213794)
League of Legends XX: Riot's in the Playground (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=211977)
League of Legends XIX: 15 million players, and nary a Morgana (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=210332)
League of Legends: XVIII: ┻━┻ ︵ （╯°□°）╯ (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=207908)
League of Legends XVII: Gondor Has No Tank, Gondor Needs No Tank (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=205488)
League of Legends XVI: Alas, Poor Game Balance, I Knew Him, Morello (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=203298)
League of Legends XV: Robots Are Better Than Trees (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=201024)
League of Legends XIV: We're So Broken That We're OP! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=198948)
League of Legends XIII: Our Skill is Hard to Deny (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=196765)
League of Legends XII: It's Worth It Because I Said So In The Thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=194886)
League of Legends XI: It's Hard to Post Like This in Heels (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=192695)
League of Legends X: Armored Armadillo Delivers Ambiguous Affirmative (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10646164#post10646164)
League of Legends IX: New Thread Available! Only 6300 IP! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=188076)
League of Legends VIII: Gali-Os: They're idolicious! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=185516)
League of Legends 7: Truly, Truly Outrageous! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=182486)
League of Legends 6: Jannaaaaaaaaaa! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=178334)
League of Legends 5: Tall Grass Used Garen! DEMACIAAA! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=173805)
League of Legends 4:CAWCAWCAWCAWCAWCAW (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169616)
League of Legends 3: You only need to click once (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164008s)
League of Legends Goes Where It Pleases 2 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=158135)
League Of Legends: We post where we please. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=139094)
*Flair and class provided by your local Dogmantra!

[Reinboom]

Bug finding offer is serious and still stands.

Goal: Find either the most bugs or most impactful bug out of all who submit.

Requirements:
Each bug must be 'new' (not in the Riot system. Basically, a new discovery.), and must be reproducible.
Each bug must have the word "bug" (in bold) in the post. This is so I can find it easier.
Bugs may be the air client (pregame stuff), the game, or even the website (anything under the *.leagueoflegends.com or competitive.*.leagueoflegends.com base urls. Minisites like Dominion are not included)

Mini contest end date:
2012/5/1

Winner gets 3900 RP.

[Joran]

I'm not able to give information that hasn't already been given on replays.
That's mostly confined to: All tech developed for spectator is developed with replays in mind. The dev team constructing spectator is the same team constructing the replay system (Their internal name is: The watch team.)

Timeshift:
It can't move beyond the 3 minute mark.

Core portions of how the system works:
1. When you join a replay, you're get a package of information that details everything in the game up to the spectator server's offset (3 minutes back). When you timeshift, you don't ask the server for more information, you simply rewind through those actions you've already been given. The server is constantly telling you more stuff while you're doing this.


Sweet, you answered the question I was going to ask next. It sounds like the spectator gets all the data from before the spectator joined the game. In that case, it sounds like replays should be close. After all, a replay is just that package of information that the spectator server sends except spanning the whole game.

Thanks again for all the behind the scenes info.

P.S. 10 win IP boost! Wait, that means I'll have to stop playing bot games.

[Dienekes]

Bug finding offer is serious and still stands.

Goal: Find either the most bugs or most impactful bug out of all who submit.

Requirements:
Each bug must be 'new' (not in the Riot system. Basically, a new discovery.), and must be reproducible.
Each bug must have the word "bug" (in bold) in the post. This is so I can find it easier.
Bugs may be the air client (pregame stuff), the game, or even the website (anything under the *.leagueoflegends.com or competitive.*.leagueoflegends.com base urls. Minisites like Dominion are not included)

Mini contest end date:
2012/5/1

Winner gets 3900 RP.

Ahh that's a pity. In the last 3 days I've seen 4 pretty horrible bugs, but I have no idea how they happened so they're all more or less not reproducible.

[TechnOkami]

Bug: In the pre-game champion select, is the text you type in supposed to disappear as soon as the 10 second countdown to in-game starts? If so, that might be a bug, and I'll claim it if it happens to be.

[thubby]

Bugs
poppy frequently causes her wall slam effect on empty space.

gragas' passive's mouse over text is replaced by abyssal scepter's aura effect text when he has that item.

in champion select, if you enter the masteries menu with a champions portrait on the right side and someone leaves, it will stay there.

[TechnOkami]

New Bug!

If you use Akali's ultimate repeatedly enough, a green stream similar to her dash animation will follow her around. It just happened to me in a game I was playing. Also, I don't know if it happened due to this, but I had a custom skin on at the time. To everyone else, they cannot see the custom skin, so they definitely saw the green stream behind her, though I did not.

[ex cathedra]

Bug finding offer is serious and still stands.

Goal: Find either the most bugs or most impactful bug out of all who submit.

Requirements:
Each bug must be 'new' (not in the Riot system. Basically, a new discovery.), and must be reproducible.
Each bug must have the word "bug" (in bold) in the post. This is so I can find it easier.
Bugs may be the air client (pregame stuff), the game, or even the website (anything under the *.leagueoflegends.com or competitive.*.leagueoflegends.com base urls. Minisites like Dominion are not included)

Reina, do any Riot staff keep a list of bugs that are public knowledge somewhere on the forums? I understand why that might not be the case for some of the more problematic bugs (e.g. double viktor ult), but there are likely a lot of relatively harmless bugs and it is hard to know if they've already been brought to Riot's attention.

I've encountered the following bugs:
In All-Random game modes, and perhaps in real games, there will occasionally be a problem with the Champion Trade button. The trade window will open but not respond, and if a player dodges the window (with the same champions and player) will still exist in the following game. It can interfere with subsequent trade requests. Easily reproduced. (http://i.imgur.com/ZFg3b.jpg)
While normally reserved with players who've had a faulty reconnect, the untargettable tower bug seems to be popping up in entirely normal games. You can still attack-move, but it can be difficult and troublesome in many situations. At the moment, difficult to reproduce.
Champions with the "Improved Recall" mastery and some form of stealth with a decent duration (Teemo, Akali, Eve, Twitch) can recall while stealthed. Easily reproduced.

[TechnOkami]

While normally reserved with players who've had a faulty reconnect, the untargettable tower bug seems to be popping up in entirely normal games. You can still attack-move, but it can be difficult and troublesome in many situations. At the moment, difficult to reproduce.

I can back this, seeing that I experienced this in the game as Akali I mentioned above. Another player who did not disconnect or have a faulty connection had the same thing happen to him.

[Temotei]

Bug: When using quicksilver sash, it sometimes causes the "bubble" (cleanse effect) to continue on the champion until death. Has happened twice in the same game.

Bug: Very rarely, Lee Sin will get caught on a wall while trying to use resonating strike on an enemy near a wall, such as wolves. This causes him to get stuck in the wall for a few seconds and get pushed out one way or another. Damage happens as normal, in my experience.

Bug: Lee Sin gained some sort of rainbow effect behind him. He was faster than the average Lee, but not so fast that I've never reached that point. One game happening so far.

[fred dref]

I experience bugs virtually non-stop, but none of them seem to be reproducible.

[PersonMan]

Bugs
gragas' passive's mouse over text is replaced by abyssal scepter's aura effect text when he has that item.

It also changes to Kayle's slow ('this unit is slowed and blah blah blah'), a stun, and similar, in my experience. This has happened both games I played him.

[Litewarior]

Bug

If someone dodges in champ select, the music keeps playing even after the dodge.

Sometimes in blind pick, the final 10 second countdown doesn't happen.

[Draken]

A theory specifying Litewarrior's mentions based on my obeservations.

Bug

The champ select countdown apparently isn't stopping when a queue dodge happens. This means that, when that countdown reaches the last 10 (or is it 15? I forgot, whatever) seconds, the sound effect plays, wether you are in a new champ select lobby or in any other area of the client.

Also, saw an Ezreal's ultimate not produce particles (or minimap icon) in a game yesterday. Ult still went off and still killed me, of course.

----------

And I want to write Heimer's rockets not prioritizing champs as a bug, but woefully, I know that it is a feature.

[Qwertystop]

You heard him everyone.
http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/abandon-thread-snail.gif
Ok, seriously, what is with that pic?

[TechnOkami]

Ok, seriously, what is with that pic?

What ISN'T with that pic? I think it's pretty dang awesome to be honest.

[SlyGuyMcFly]

The awesome feeling when you steal Dragon with a rank 1 Infuse :smallcool: I used to think Soraka was super-boring, but turns out she's not. She's actually pretty fun. Just requires a very different mindset.

[PersonMan]

The awesome feeling when you steal Dragon with a rank 1 Infuse :smallcool: I used to think Soraka was super-boring, but turns out she's not. She's actually pretty fun. Just requires a very different mindset.

Well, pre-nerf she was invincible late game (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12570945&postcount=114), and even now she's pretty cool.

I just had my first encounter with a 5-man troll team. They tried to surrender, which surprised me. In the end they did, 5 for 0 against, and in response I got our team to do the same. We weren't fast enough, though, and still won.

[Dante & Vergil]

Bug: I don't know how it happens for sure, but when I press the key for a non smart cast spell and wait to use it, cause I'm either waiting for an opportune moment or I'm moving, after a certain amount of time of "holding" the ability, when I click all it does is retreat-ping and I can't do anything else. Now, this may or may not be how it happens, but the lock-up has happened every day, if not every game I'm in, and causes serious problems, especially teamfights.:smallmad:

Also, as a side note, does anyone here know how to disable the scroll function of the touchpad on laptops? I need to know cause it causes my game browser to minimize everytime it's in use.

[Qaera]

Bug: Katarina's ult can be canceled. Very easy to reproduce.

~ ♅

[Dante & Vergil]

What's the 10 win IP boost from cause me and abunch of people were really confused when we saw it today?

[toasty]

Bug: Katarina's ult can be canceled. Very easy to reproduce.

~ ♅

Her ult is channeling. It should be cancellable. See Galio ult, nunu ult.

Or am I completely wrong?

[Boowells]

Her ult is channeling. It should be cancellable. See Galio ult, nunu ult.

Or am I completely wrong?

He's joking.

Okay, so I have a funny story to tell:
So, I recently queued up with a Shen who did not call jungle, but decided to afk after Udyr instalocked jungle. He went afk for the whole game (only lasted 20 minutes) and taunted us throughout the game. Totally useless jerk. I had locked in Blitzcrank and was intending to lane bot with Ashe, but instead, I was forced top against Akali.

Now, normally, this should've been a silly and stupidly hilarious lane that I should've lost. But Akali was absolutely TERRIBLE. I just leveled up E and walked up to her a couple times and beat her up. She was scared of me for some reason that I can't quite fathom, despite being, y'know, Akali. Somehow, I managed to even KILL her before she was level 6. I don't even know. I didn't even get to pull her into the tower once. I just walked up and smashed her with E. If Shen hadn't been so terrible, we probably would've won that game.

[Zemro]

Bug: Very rarely, Lee Sin will get caught on a wall while trying to use resonating strike on an enemy near a wall, such as wolves. This causes him to get stuck in the wall for a few seconds and get pushed out one way or another. Damage happens as normal, in my experience.

Actually, I have encountered this one quite frequently in my Lee Sin games, and could probably reproduce it pretty easily.

Each time I've done it has been coming up to the purple wolves camp from below. I move a bit towards the lane entrance into the jungle by the bushes and double-tap Q to get to the camp quicker only to have myself kick the wolf in the face and then snap back to the other side of the wall.

[fred dref]

What's the 10 win IP boost from cause me and abunch of people were really confused when we saw it today?

I hear reading reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends or, alternatively, Riot's own website, could tell you useful info. Info such as Riot gave everyone a 10-win IP boost because of all the problems with the Hecarim patch.

[Draken]

So. Playing Nautilus, got grabbed by Blitzcrank just as I was Dredge Linin' to a wall.

Didn't move an inch in the end. :smalltongue:

[Dante & Vergil]

I hear reading reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends or, alternatively, Riot's own website, could tell you useful info. Info such as Riot gave everyone a 10-win IP boost because of all the problems with the Hecarim patch.

First time really hearing of reddit, and I already checked the main site and there was nothing on it, so don't be rude about man.

[Litewarior]

Ooo, one more bug. EDIT: Actually a couple more:

At least playing against a Twisted Fate, after he uses a card, the gold card image still appears above his head, even after he threw the card, and no matter which card it was. (Picks blue card, blue card appears above head, throws it, gold card appears above head).

When attacking the wolves on the blue side, occasionally the wolves will not look like they're attacking, but I'll still be taking damage and hearing their attacks.

At least as Vlad in the PBE, when my default skin is the Blood Lord Skin, the title will not show up after I lock in, unless I move the viewer to another skin, even if I don't own the skin, and back again.

[toasty]

BUG:
Jungle Minions do not aggro properly, specifically Wolf and Wraith camp. You attack them out of their line of site (I THINK) and they will sit there, deal no DPS, but take dps as if they had been aggroed.

[fred dref]

First time really hearing of reddit, and I already checked the main site and there was nothing on it, so don't be rude about man.

There kinda was. (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2067549)

[PersonMan]

There kinda was. (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2067549)

*Looks at first page of the subforum*

*Does not see the thread*

Although I did see one asking about it (the free IP boost), interestingly enough.

[ChaosOS]

Bug on live

Repro steps
1. Have a kog'maw be at least level 6 (Need ultimate)
2. Have an akali drop her shroud and go invisible
3. Use Kog's ult on akali
4. Watch how kog fails to gain vision

I think this is a bug b/c I was doing fine vision-wise when I hit a shaco and then he stayed visible after he Deceive'd.

[Mutant Bunny]

So, now that there's the whole rune switch-up thing, should I be investing in flat AP blues?

[Dante & Vergil]

Well I figured since everyone gets a 10-Win IP boost, you'd think that they would put it up on the main site where everyone would see it, and not on the forums, where fewer people would, cause I don't fequent their forum enough to get updates like that.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Bug on live (Reproducible: Maybe?)

In a game earlier today, Mordekaiser's Ult particle effect stuck to Ezreal and persisted past the duration of the ultimate, and possibly through death. Only about 50% of my teammates saw the effect, and in teamfights it was impossible to tell who was actually Ulted and who wasn't (since the damage is low enough that it's hard to use that as the judge in a fight).

[Zombulian]

Muuuuuuuuuuuuundoooooooooooooo

[dgnslyr]

So, I must have not been in complete control of my mental facilities, and I decided to impulse buy Kennen.

Right now, I start either boots or Doran's Shield, as appropriate, focusing W in lane, and harassing with a Q-W combo, with an autattack proc whenever it's up. Itemwise, my first big item is the big book made of books that turn into a gun (WotA), followed with a spiffy watch (hourglass) and a chilly stick (Rylai's). I can't say I quite have his playstyle down, though, though I might be more successful if I could actually land shurikens. Any advice from the playground?

[PersonMan]

So, I must have not been in complete control of my mental facilities, and I decided to impulse buy Kennen.

Right now, I start either boots or Doran's Shield, as appropriate, focusing W in lane, and harassing with a Q-W combo, with an autattack proc whenever it's up. Itemwise, my first big item is the big book made of books that turn into a gun (WotA), followed with a spiffy watch (hourglass) and a chilly stick (Rylai's). I can't say I quite have his playstyle down, though, though I might be more successful if I could actually land shurikens. Any advice from the playground?

Something I've seen fairly often is to lightning rush forwards, hitting the enemy if possible, throwing a Q at them and following up with a surge (or whatever that lightning-at-everything-marked thing is) and proc'd AA.

So one might rush through the minions in the center, Q, surge, then AA for the stun and hit once or twice before turning (or chasing, if they're low). An advantage to this is that you can often surprise people who aren't prepared to dodge by suddenly not being behind the minions.

[Math_Mage]

So, I must have not been in complete control of my mental facilities, and I decided to impulse buy Kennen.

Right now, I start either boots or Doran's Shield, as appropriate, focusing W in lane, and harassing with a Q-W combo, with an autattack proc whenever it's up. Itemwise, my first big item is the big book made of books that turn into a gun (WotA), followed with a spiffy watch (hourglass) and a chilly stick (Rylai's). I can't say I quite have his playstyle down, though, though I might be more successful if I could actually land shurikens. Any advice from the playground?

Random playstyle advice incoming.

Autoattacks are very important for harass at early levels. I've even started Doran's Blade against top lanes without good counter-poke.

Even if you can get a stun off in harass, sometimes it's better to leave the opponent with two marks for a few seconds until your cooldowns are up and you can mark him again after stunning. This increases the amount of zoning you can do and makes your trades more favorable.

Having Lightning Rush lets you play very aggressively, as you're safe from many junglers. Don't use it for harass when pushed, however, as this can be suicide. Indeed, I pretty much only use E for harass if it's a stun proc.

On that note, you can readily end a trade or run away by QWEing a stun, and this is often better than simply running away.

Level 1 Lightning Rush lets you farm caster creeps under tower with 1 autoattack after a turret shot, absent your own minion aggro.

Probably the best way to mass farm with E-W is to rush through creeps, then autoattack things that would survive your W until you can kill everything at once. Otherwise you're left with a bunch of low-health creeps that all need to be last-hit at once.

Abyssal, or at least a Negatron Cloak, can be extremely useful against magic damage spam from the likes of Vlad. Deathcap is good for maximizing your one-shotting potential against a bunch of squishy damage dealers. Your build is best for surviving bruisers when you have damage support from your own bruisers and/or AD carry.

[TechnOkami]

Muuuuuuuuuuuuundoooooooooooooo

He's the best, ain't he?

[Terazul]

So I just had one of the most amusing games ever as support Olaf on Dominion.

http://i.imgur.com/pQffk.jpg

Basically the lobby chat went something like this:
Malz: “I'm going AD.”
Friend1: “Ok then, I'll be AP Ashe”
Friend2: “ASPD Alistar”
Me: “Support Olaf”
Malz: “Really, I'm serious, AD Malzahar.”
Friend1: “We're serious, too. AP Ashe.”

And then, Hilarity. The Teemo remained eerily silent until the end, but was a bro for playing along. He also got hit by Ashe arrows alot. Now Available as a Replay! (http://www.leaguereplays.com/replays/match/395673/)

[Winthur]

He also got hit by Ashe arrows alot.

http://i49.tinypic.com/30c6q39.jpg

[Daverin]

So, since I haven't seem to have seen much about him, how is Hecarim? Is he the supreme-ultra ganker his set suggests he should be? Also, looking at a clip of gameplay with him, he looks huge!

Also, I'm thinking I may pick back up with League this summer. Maybe.

[Winthur]

So, since I haven't seem to have seen much about him, how is Hecarim? Is he the supreme-ultra ganker his set suggests he should be? Also, looking at a clip of gameplay with him, he looks huge!


I think he's an underperformer. His jungle clear, sustain, ganks, etc etc... are meh.

[Daverin]

And looking again, now he doesn't. Maybe was a fluke in the other vid? :smallconfused:

Also, slightly disappointing. I actually was somewhat intrigued by his design.

[PersonMan]

And looking again, now he doesn't. Maybe was a fluke in the other vid? :smallconfused:

Also, slightly disappointing. I actually was somewhat intrigued by his design.

He's big, like Sejuani, but you get used to it after the initial 'oh my, this champion practically covers half of the fountain!' moment.

I've seen him more often as a top than a jungler, and he seems to be fairly effective.

[SpaceMouse]

So I just had one of the most amusing games ever as support Olaf on Dominion.

http://i.imgur.com/pQffk.jpg

Basically the lobby chat went something like this:
Malz: “I'm going AD.”
Friend1: “Ok then, I'll be AP Ashe”
Friend2: “ASPD Alistar”
Me: “Support Olaf”
Malz: “Really, I'm serious, AD Malzahar.”
Friend1: “We're serious, too. AP Ashe.”

And then, Hilarity. The Teemo remained eerily silent until the end, but was a bro for playing along. He also got hit by Ashe arrows alot. Now Available as a Replay! (http://www.leaguereplays.com/replays/match/395673/)

as the attack speed alistar in the game, i am seconding the fact this game is incredible and support olaf is unstoppable.

[Nadevoc]

Bug: (Probably known)
While playing Lulu, holding Alt (or whatever is bound to the Pet Command button) causes your orders to be ignored.

Bug:
Mundo can't go in or through walls, trees, and other obstacles, even if he pleases.


Unrelated, my PC is being screwy so I can't play until I figure it out, which makes me sad.

[Dada]

Bugs:

PvP.net:

1) Profile - Ranked Stats overview:
When viewing the ranked stats overview of a summoner, up to three ratings may be displayed:
Arranged team 3v3, Solo/Duo queue and arranged team 5v5. Only the Solo/Duo queue rating makes sense currently.
The team 3v3 and 5v5 ratings should either be removed, or updated to show the top rating of any team which the
summoner is a member of.

2) Ignore list is not respected ingame:
When you are in a game with a user on your ignore list, they will initially show up as ignored when pressing
[TAB]. You will however still be able to see their pings and chats. Un-ignoring and re-ignoring them by
clicking the icon fixes this.

3) Ignored user in chat rooms:
If an ignored user sends a message to a chat room you are both participating in, the "new message" sound
will be played, even though you are not able to see the message.

4) Ignoring and Un-ignoring removes user from friend list:
When you ignore a user in-game, they are immediately removed from your friends list. This means that even
if you un-ignore them later in the game, they will not be on your friends list after the game. This is mainly
an issue when using the "/mute all" or "/mute allies" commands.

5) When viewing the ignore list, the summoner icons do not load correctly
See screen shot:

http://i.imgur.com/JMTgK.png


6) Ignore and whispers:
If you ignore a friend in-game, and then try to send them a message using the "/w" command, it will seem to work,
that is, the chat will display "[To]: Name: Message".
The ignored fried will however not receive the message (since (s)he is not on your friends list). This means
that the chat should have displayed "-User not found in friend list-".

The ignore list issues above were all tested on EUNE to avoid the chat issues of EUW

7) The Champion list at the bottom of the "Ranked Stats" tab does not load first time
If you go to the ranked stats of a summoner profile, there should be a list of champions below the "Filter
by Champion" text. This list does not load the first time you open the page. Navigating away (e.g. to the
Profile tab) and back fixes this, and the list loads correctly.

8) Resize issues:
If you resize the PvP.net client window, the actual edge placement (for further resizing) will be slightly
displaced compared to what is shown on the screen. The horizontal scrollbar in the bottom of the PvP.net shop
is also slightly displaced, and can become almost useless due to this (since the client might think it is placed
underneath some of the shop entries.

In game:

9) Permanent Jungle Aggro:
There are some jungle aggro bugs with monster aggro not resetting properly. One of them is captured in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnLpJgK989o&feature=youtu.be (sorry for low quality, it was captured on my laptop)
Me and my partner were consistently able to reproduce it, by having Kayle aggroing the monsters, me running away,
Kayle running away past me (losing aggro) and me then running back to the camp. This bug does not necessarily
effect both players - only one may see the odd behaviour. This hints that it is a client-side issue.

10) Master Yi and Snares interaction:
Master Yi's Alpha Strike (and probably Fioras ult as well) have some weird interactions with snares, as shown in
this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aD6Srg4LbeY&feature=youtu.be
In the first try, I dodge the snare by alpha striking. This is fine.
In the second try, I get snared and am therefore unable to alpha strike. Fine too.
Third try, I get snared, but the alpha strike still goes off, I end up next to Lux, but am still snared. This
shouldn't happen. If I am snared, the alpha strike shouldn't go off -> Alpha strike going off should mean that
I am not snared. This is a weird in-between scenario.

11) Selling items:
If you open the shop window before being back in base, and selects an item in your inventory, this selection
apparently does not work. You have to re-select the item once you are back in base, before you can sell it.
This is shown in this video: http://youtu.be/6ymf8PS79ug
Even though I select Dorans Shield, the sell button does nothing, until I re-select it.

12) Performance of Smoke Screen:
Regardless of your graphics settings, the Smoke Screen ability of Graves kills performance on weak computers.
Even though they might be able to run the rest of LoL just fine, if you ever get a Graves on the opposing team,
you might as well give up team fighting since entering or leaving the smoke cloud drops your fps to below 10.
It is unfortunate that one ability is so much more demanding than the rest of the game. Perhaps this could be
fixed for lower effect settings somehow?

13) Ahri ult ignoring cc *significant*:
The video below shows that Ahri ult can ignore cc. We stack Fiddlesticks fear and Cho's silence so they overlap
in duration, yet Ahri is clearly able to use her ulti once (when the fear wears off) even though she is
silenced. This is an issue with all forms of cc, as far as I can tell.
Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5WzBgdUIIs&feature=youtu.be

14) Permanent Ignite (or other effects):
Sometimes, the graphical effects of spells persist permanently. I have not been able to reproduce
the perma-ignite bug. I have however recently seen it, and I have also encountered perma-ahri-charm
and perma-kayle-ult. In those cases, they did not apply to all players - my team-mates did not see
anything unusual, which hints that this is a client-side issue like the jungle aggro one.

"Bugs":
(though these could be argued to be feature requests)

15) There is no way to hide or auto-reject friend requests:
If you have ever watched Guardsman Bob, or some of the other popular streamers, you know why this is an issue.
With several hundreds of request waiting, it becomes hard for them to find game invites, and the constant
popups obscure some of the bans in champ select, and hides the close and play again buttons in the post game
screen. Manually declining all the requests seems to take up to ten minutes or more, so that is not a good
option.

Bonus content: Mega Cho/Squirrel http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILxh8hsp0xg

Feel free to message me if you have any questions regarding these bugs.

Thanks to: Xami, Nosyeye and my girlfriend for helping me test, reproduce and document these.

Edit: I might do another bunch of bugs later, but I probably won't have time. I also have a bunch of tribunal bugs, if anyone is interested in those.

Edit2: Highlighted the Ahri ult/cc bug since it has cost me several kills and probably games already.

[Darth Mario]

And suddenly, with the promise of Riot-sanctioned RP, my shiny new thread is filled with bugs.

*fetches RAID*

Edit: Though it occurs, while we're on the target, I have a question to ask about the interaction between Morgana's Black Shield and Urgot's ultimate of name I cannot remember. Black shield prevents the suppression, but the location switch still happens as normal at the end of Urgot's channel (which still triggers even if the suppression was blocked, unlike, say, Warwick's ultimate, which appears to leap but not damage). Is this behaving as intended? Because as worded, Morg's Black Shield is supposed to block all CC while it is active, which I would assume a location displacer would be included in.

[Neoseanster]

Oh how I love this IP boost. Almost got enough saved up for Rumble now. :3

Anyone got any tips on playing him?

[fred dref]

And suddenly, with the promise of Riot-sanctioned RP, my shiny new thread is filled with bugs.

*fetches RAID*

Edit: Though it occurs, while we're on the target, I have a question to ask about the interaction between Morgana's Black Shield and Urgot's ultimate of name I cannot remember. Black shield prevents the suppression, but the location switch still happens as normal at the end of Urgot's channel (which still triggers even if the suppression was blocked, unlike, say, Warwick's ultimate, which appears to leap but not damage). Is this behaving as intended? Because as worded, Morg's Black Shield is supposed to block all CC while it is active, which I would assume a location displacer would be included in.

Olaf has the same result, by the way.

[Reynard]

Olaf has the same result, by the way.

As does QSS and (I think) Gangplank's Oranges.

[Qwertystop]

I think there should be someone whose ult has the following effects on the enemy team:
Hides all summoner names
Replaces champion models with grey clouds
Allows friendly fire


What do you think?

[TechnOkami]

And suddenly, with the promise of Riot-sanctioned RP, my shiny new thread is filled with bugs.

*fetches RAID*

I think that there should be an insectoid champion, so there will be a permanent bug in the League of Legends. :smallbiggrin:

[Zombulian]

So judging from my only post in this thread so far, some may have noticed that I like Mundo. The thing is, I've only been playing him for a little bit, but I want to try experimenting. I've done really well with my full build being CR boots, 2 Warmogs, Force of Nature, Atma's, and Maw. But I was just thinking, what about an AP Mundo? Could I perhaps go MP boots, Warmogs, Rylai's, Force of Nature, Deathfire, and another Warmogs? I think it could be fairly decent, I ended up relying heavily on being on fire all the time even as my Health/AD Mundo, so I figured Health/AP shouldn't be bad right?

Comments and feedback appreciated :smallsmile:

[PEACH]

I think there should be someone whose ult has the following effects on the enemy team:
Hides all summoner names
Replaces champion models with grey clouds
Allows friendly fire


What do you think?

Champion ults that reward players for RL communicating (more than the normal reward) aren't necessarily good things. It's also an ult that only exists to cause frustration and makes people blame their teammates, and very unfairly screws over certain champs (anybody with self centered AoEs).

[PersonMan]

Bug:

Sometimes, when you see an enemy recalling, the next time you see them the last half-second or so of Recall animation plays around them.

I'll test this further tomorrow, as I don't have time today.

[9mm]

Bug on live
ease of reproduction: easy

TF's Blue card does not refund mana if it's target dies mid flight. Ironicly this also does not consume stacked deck charges. While red card still depoy's it's aoe slow.

[TechnOkami]

Bug: If you are in Graves' smokescreen while the turret is hitting you, if you remain inside the smokescreen but move out of the turret's range, the turret targeting animation will still follow the champion.

[Mutant Bunny]

Well, that was interesting: just finished a game as support nunu with solo top vayne, cassiopeia mid, lee sin jungle, and a kogmaw who DCed until I was almost level 6.

I survived the first several minutes, farming the lane. Kog reconnected, and we proceeded to farm several kills.

Later in the game, I went to stop a Tryndamere splitpush while my team pushed top. He wanted to kill me.
He tower-dove.
I had stacked armor and ice balls. It did not go well for him. I ended the game 2/1/20

So, yeah, starts as a 4v5, ends VERY satisfactorily. :smallcool:

[Zombulian]

Well, that was interesting: just finished a game as support nunu with solo top vayne, cassiopeia mid, lee sin jungle, and a kogmaw who DCed until I was almost level 6.

I survived the first several minutes, farming the lane. Kog reconnected, and we proceeded to farm several kills.

Later in the game, I went to stop a Tryndamere splitpush while my team pushed top. He wanted to kill me.
He tower-dove.
I had stacked armor and ice balls. It did not go well for him. I ended the game 2/1/20

So, yeah, starts as a 4v5, ends VERY satisfactorily. :smallcool:

Time for a...
http://www.creativeuncut.com/gallery-04/art/nsmb-mushroom-1up.jpg

Played a game with Mundo where I solo'd bottom (why? Because my team was THAT dumb.) Our WW DC'd at lvl 3 and didn't come back for the rest of the game. The first time I went back to base I bought CR Boots and 2 Warmogs. The rest of the game I was the scariest player you have ever seen. Running straight into teamfights while on fire and making everyone bail.

I carried my team to victory with 9/0/17

[Joran]

Bug

After character select, when I'm loading in a game, I will frequently crash out. This seems to happen regularly if I have Firefox open with Youtube playing and I alt-tab out while loading. It has happened when I just had Firefox open and did not alt-tab.

[Reinboom]

Bug

After character select, when I'm loading in a game, I will frequently crash out. This seems to happen regularly if I have Firefox open with Youtube playing and I alt-tab out while loading. It has happened when I just had Firefox open and did not alt-tab.

This sounds like an environment/system issue and not an actual bug, seemingly related to resource problems. This is especially true as the repro steps you've given don't repro it on other machines.
I'm sorry.

To clarify a couple things:
Bugs are: An expected behavior conditionally does not occur OR an expected consistency among a specific design pattern suddenly stops occurring. The conditions are not tied to resources outside of the expected range of the application.

So, "The game fails when another application eats memory" or "The game fails when I lose internet connection" are not bugs.
Of course, "I disconnected, reconnected, and then everything was disco" would be a bug.


And another big factor to all of this:

The repro steps are VERY important. If a bug cannot be reproduced, then the source of the issue can't be found.
With a game this mature, most bugs most be fixed by an engineer going "Well, that's odd. Maybe it's because of X? *changes X*. *Attempts repro steps* (Nope | Yep)." Repeat until "Yep".

So without consistent reproduction steps, the whole process flies out the window and the bug never gets addressed. (Exception to "obvious bugs")



Reina, do any Riot staff keep a list of bugs that are public knowledge somewhere on the forums? I understand why that might not be the case for some of the more problematic bugs (e.g. double viktor ult), but there are likely a lot of relatively harmless bugs and it is hard to know if they've already been brought to Riot's attention.

We don't keep public log of bugs. Our bug tracker is very transparent internally and very engineering, so it can have a LOT of information in it even for the most minor of bugs. It would require someone tasked to keep that list interpreted safely for public view.
There are player made lists however.


It will take me a bit to look in to these and figure out which ones are new or not.
Thank you all thus far. :smallbiggrin:

[PersonMan]

Of course, "I disconnected, reconnected, and then everything was disco" would be a bug.

Bug:

This is not in my signature.

Can I take steps to fix this?

[SlyGuyMcFly]

Sweet giant space monkey-balls do I hate laning against AP 'Raka. Wanna harass? LOLNO Wanna trade? LOLNO Wanna push? LOLNO :smallannoyed:

[Eldariel]

Sweet giant space monkey-balls do I hate laning against AP 'Raka. Wanna harass? LOLNO Wanna trade? LOLNO Wanna push? LOLNO :smallannoyed:

Solution: Be a snake :smallwink:

[PersonMan]

Mundo mid is so weird.

I prefer other lanes, so I can (at least partially) bushcamp, but it seems to work alright. My tankiness let me survive Veig's burst as well as Shaco's ganks fairly easily and I was able to keep Veig from farming easily with Q harass. I got CS I couldn't easily reach with more Qs.

[Reinboom]

Bug:

This is not in my signature.

Can I take steps to fix this?

I would be honored!

[Neoseanster]

Results with Rumble so far: lost lane miserably to Vlad, lost lane miserably to another Rumble, won lane vs an Udyr after losing early, lost lane miserably vs a Tryndamere.

I think there's a reason I mostly play support and jungle. <_< Need moar practice.

[TechnOkami]

I am 5 IP away from 6300, and yet there's nothing I really want to buy (except for skins, 'cause, ya know, skins!)

Oh well, might as well wait until this Varus chap is released to see if I'd want to play him (by the looks of what he is, probably not).

[tyckspoon]

Of course, "I disconnected, reconnected, and then everything was disco" would be a bug.


Speaking of Disco.. can't even begin to suggest how to reproduce, but another one for the 'visual effects persisting' pile: AI game, Sona was present. Visual effects of Sona's aura stuck around and stacked, resulting in a pretty glowy color-wheel surrounding her everywhere.

[fred dref]

Speaking of Disco.. can't even begin to suggest how to reproduce, but another one for the 'visual effects persisting' pile: AI game, Sona was present. Visual effects of Sona's aura stuck around and stacked, resulting in a pretty glowy color-wheel surrounding her everywhere.

It also kills the FPS of those of us without good computers.

[Silverraptor]

Ok, seriously, what is with that pic?


What ISN'T with that pic? I think it's pretty dang awesome to be honest.

What Techno said. The pic is awesome.

[Sila Prirode]

Speaking of FPS, there is a problem with Graves cloud, where the FPS drops sharply the second I step in it (or he throws it at me). I'm actually not that affected, 'cause 30 FPS is still playable, but a friend of mine drops down to single digits. But I am fairly certain it's not because of glitch, but the large processing power needed for his cloud (for some reason or other). Because it get's worse the more stuff I have running in the background, and people with better graphic cards then me don't experience it that hard.
Now, after typing all this, I'm not sure if I wanted to ask you something about this, or what, so I'm going to leave it like this until I remember. :smallredface:

[Math_Mage]

Solution: Be a snake :smallwink:

Rule 34: I will not turn into a snake. It never helps.

[toasty]

Solution: Be a snake :smallwink:

Scarra says that if you take a specific number of MR runes you cannot lose to Cass as Soraka. Obviously you require a specific runepage at that point, but still, in theory... Soraka beats everyone. :smalltongue:

[tyckspoon]

Scarra says that if you take a specific number of MR runes you cannot lose to Cass as Soraka. Obviously you require a specific runepage at that point, but still, in theory... Soraka beats everyone. :smalltongue:

Was that before or after they adjusted the MR runes to be less superior to the AP ones?

[toasty]

Was that before or after they adjusted the MR runes to be less superior to the AP ones?

Before the nerfs. The point is that he had a specific MR number. I suppose it does throw all the theorycrafting into wack, but the point is that there was and probably still is a very real way to beat Cass with Soraka. Which is why Soraka is a terrible hero who needs to be nerfed.

Redemption! After SEVEN straight losses in Ranked and plummenting into the dreaded 1200 elo rating I have won my last two games. EXTRA REDEMPTION: I played Vlad and won. My vlad rating is still terrible (40%?) but Its getting up there. Thoughts: Pushing as vlad is good, pushing as vlad when you know the enemy can kill you and you don't have summoners is dumb. Furthermore: Vlad v Olaf is a good matchup for Vlad if you rush a Giant's Belt, play back, and try to force Olaf to push.

More thoughts: I wish they would fix GP so that he was good again. Like, they could lower his supportive aspects on his E and his R (IE raise the cooldown), even adjust his slow, so long as I can play that wonderful Q+spam solo top king. As it is, the only "oldschool" tankydps that is really viable top is probably Udyr. WW and J4 are making a comeback, and I love to play WW against certain matchups, but I always get really afraid that I'll get countered. At least I know I can beat Teemo and Renekton if I play properly.

Final thought: My Galio is again in the "good" rating, where I am sure I can play almost any matchup, middle or top as galio and do acceptable. I'm still afraid of Udyr and Vlad because of their early-game ability to punish Galio in top lane, but really, he's such a strong laner and a solid tank/mage that it seems to me there is really no reason to not play him.

Only problem: there are no good "health" items for Galio to buy besides Kindlegem/shurelias. Spirit Visage is alright I guess, but honestly, you don't really need it that much. Its really only good on WW and probably Vlad in certain matchups.

[fred dref]

Only problem: there are no good "health" items for Galio to buy besides Kindlegem/shurelias. Spirit Visage is alright I guess, but honestly, you don't really need it that much. Its really only good on WW and probably Vlad in certain matchups.

If you're there primarily to soak damage and your own damage potential is entirely an afterthought, Spirit Visage is not a weak item on Mundo.

[dgnslyr]

Banshee's Veil, then? It gives a good chunk of health and MR, makes breaking his ult a bit harder, and builds out of a Catalyst for that extra lane dominance to boot. It's really everything the bat-rock-man could want out of a defensive item.

[toasty]

Banshee's Veil, then? It gives a good chunk of health and MR, makes breaking his ult a bit harder, and builds out of a Catalyst for that extra lane dominance to boot. It's really everything the bat-rock-man could want out of a defensive item.

Bveil Requires Catalyst. Catalyst+Chalice is silly, so you probably only want Catalyst. This makes you either VERY blue dependent or where you can't last hit with your spells constantly.

Catalyst on Galio WORKS great, but it requires a different playstyle and puts you at a disadvantage in terms of farming potential.

[Math_Mage]

If it comes to the point where you really really need health, there's always a Warmog's. But the combination of Randuin's and Shurelya's probably provides better itemization paths.

[ex cathedra]

Only problem: there are no good "health" items for Galio to buy besides Kindlegem/shurelias. Spirit Visage is alright I guess, but honestly, you don't really need it that much. Its really only good on WW and probably Vlad in certain matchups.

I think that Spirit Visage is way better than you give it credit for in a ton of circumstances, but whatever.

Galio's defense steroid/damage reduction make him very resilient to burst damage, and his healing makes him much less health-dependent than many mages. I'm not convinced that you should be so worried about health itemization. Health per Level seals are still pretty solid, anyways.

[Maeglin_Dubh]

Tips and tricks for the New Horseman in the toplane? I found his jungle unstable and schizophrenic. Heard he's good top, wondering how people have been doing it.

[toasty]

I think that Spirit Visage is way better than you give it credit for in a ton of circumstances, but whatever.

Galio's defense steroid/damage reduction make him very resilient to burst damage, and his healing makes him much less health-dependent than many mages. I'm not convinced that you should be so worried about health itemization. Health per Level seals are still pretty solid, anyways.

I do run health/lvl heals on Galio. Those and a lot of MR. Alternatively I have some weird "TankAP" page I cooked up with a focus on MR, but with some random other stats as well. Its what I run on top lane galio a lot.

Meh, Spirit Visage might be alright on a few different heroes. GP for instance, but GP isn't very good anymore. :P Its good on Mundo, I forgot about that, yes. Arguably nice on Signed even, and on any team that tries to run gimmicky heal stuff.

I think its just a beef in general I have for tanky mages. If you don't like Rylais/RoA you're out of luck as far as HP goes. I suppose this isn't a huge deal since Chogath, Singed, and Moakai all mostly like one of those items or make it with it via base stat gain.

Rant game of the day:
1st pick is Kog'maw, but he's a derp and bans rammus instead of shaco, so the enemy gets shaco. I do the usual "okay guys don't die to shaco" speech even though i know that SOMEONE on my team will feed FB to Shaco.

Then everyone goes full retard. I pick Nunu because Kog'maw says he will play "AS kog'maw" but somehow we end up with a Graves as well, and a Rumble. Our last pick quickly grabs Udyr and jungles him but I'm like ... this is gonna be bad.

Our kog'maw decides to stick to his AS build, which is apparently malady/wits end (which has to be the WORST build I've seen in a long time). I go bottom with graves and we actually win our lane; our graves is solid and their Janna+Ez can stop us from farming.

But top lane is another story. Rumble v Jax. At 4:30, like clockwork, Shaco ganks and gets a double kill for Jax. They take the tower about 2 minutes later and jax starts pushing. Rumble is decently smart and madly tries to freeze the lane, but also decides that freezing the lane at the 25 minute mark with both towers gone is a good thing. >_> We start to get slaughtered in teamfights because we have effectively 2AD carries and a Melee Mage guy, so we have no real way of keep them off of our damage. The game very quickly devolves into a complete mess as we run around like crazy trying to get kills but mostly failing. Shaco gets IE+PD and is able to 1v1 kog'maw, Arhi hits all her charms nad pretty much destroys us, and there is really nothing we can do about it.

Its just frustrating. Our team comp was terrible, yes. But I am sick and tired of people dying to the first gank top from heroes like Shaco and Lee Sin. They pack exhaust. They start at red buff. Learn to deal with this ****. Its why i now ban both heroes in ranked. Neither is particularly strong, I'm gonna be honest. Okay, Lane Sin is actually really good unless you pick an equally stupid champion (See: Vladimir, Udyr) for laning. But the truth is that Shaco is really easy to stop. Buy wards. Port at 3:45 or something and buy a ward. I do it every game. Every. ****ing. Game. I've gotten religious about my warding top. I still die, but I die to ganks LESS. Why? Because I ward. Because I ward. Because I ward. When I don't ward I die a lot more. Level 2 ganks: expect them. Don't push your lane. Don't walk up to the creep wave. Sit there and use your ranged spells to last hit. Take flash, get ready to ****ing run to your tower and pray that you somehow live and survive to recover from this deadly attack.

Like... I know solo top is the hardest lane in the game. But its not... that hard. People are just lazy. Shaco is a hero that capitalizes on people's mistakes. And personally, I think it is poor hero design on Riot's part to not realize this and deal with him. Like, I'll be honest, if Riot removed him from ranked play I think 95% of the population would collectively let out a sigh of relief. We'd through a party in summoner's rift. SHACO IS GONE. But no, Riot won't do that. They force us to waste bans on shaco. They force us to pray to the gods of reason that our first pick bans shaco. There are 6 bans, use them properly people.

Oh well... I'm probably done for the night. Tomorrow I'll see if I can't reclaim my lost elo. Maybe I can actually get a solo lane and show people how to not feed Firstblood to ganks...

[Math_Mage]

Nunu isn't a good support for AS Kog because you're stacking AS on top of AS. Play Janna or Sona next time for the AD boost. :smalltongue:

I ate a Lanesin alive top with Corki recently, FWIW. But then, the enemy jungler was Amumu, so I had that luxury.

[toasty]

Nunu isn't a good support for AS Kog because you're stacking AS on top of AS. Play Janna or Sona next time for the AD boost. :smalltongue:

I ate a Lanesin alive top with Corki recently, FWIW. But then, the enemy jungler was Amumu, so I had that luxury.

I realize that now, in hindsight, I was gonna kinda/sorta heavily suggest he build IE cuz I'm... Nunu, but w/e the game was kinda just terrible.

[Eldariel]

Its just frustrating. Our team comp was terrible, yes. But I am sick and tired of people dying to the first gank top from heroes like Shaco and Lee Sin. They pack exhaust. They start at red buff. Learn to deal with this ****. Its why i now ban both heroes in ranked. Neither is particularly strong, I'm gonna be honest. Okay, Lane Sin is actually really good unless you pick an equally stupid champion (See: Vladimir, Udyr) for laning. But the truth is that Shaco is really easy to stop. Buy wards. Port at 3:45 or something and buy a ward. I do it every game. Every. ****ing. Game. I've gotten religious about my warding top. I still die, but I die to ganks LESS. Why? Because I ward. Because I ward. Because I ward. When I don't ward I die a lot more. Level 2 ganks: expect them. Don't push your lane. Don't walk up to the creep wave. Sit there and use your ranged spells to last hit. Take flash, get ready to ****ing run to your tower and pray that you somehow live and survive to recover from this deadly attack.

Like... I know solo top is the hardest lane in the game. But its not... that hard. People are just lazy. Shaco is a hero that capitalizes on people's mistakes. And personally, I think it is poor hero design on Riot's part to not realize this and deal with him. Like, I'll be honest, if Riot removed him from ranked play I think 95% of the population would collectively let out a sigh of relief. We'd through a party in summoner's rift. SHACO IS GONE. But no, Riot won't do that. They force us to waste bans on shaco. They force us to pray to the gods of reason that our first pick bans shaco. There are 6 bans, use them properly people.

Oh well... I'm probably done for the night. Tomorrow I'll see if I can't reclaim my lost elo. Maybe I can actually get a solo lane and show people how to not feed Firstblood to ganks...

This surprises me. Are there seriously games at 1200 where Shaco/Lee aren't banned? I've religiously banned them this whole ranked season and whenever I see them not banned, they usually win the game.

Even 1600s lack the coordination to efficiently deal with those much of the time (unless you get to play Lee yourself, then you just trounce Shaco since Lee is ridiculous), and good Lee/Shaco will invariably score early kills. Lee maybe less so since he has too high a skill cap to be utilized effectively by most 1200s but Shaco is obscenely easy. In 2000s I'd dare to not ban 'em (hell, you need to practice playing against 'em for tournaments at that point anyways) but any time before then, no way. Lee I'd still ban since he's the best jungler and the best top in the game.

Besides, strong early gankers mean you can't play as aggressively on lane as you could normally. Since you can win basically every 1200 game ever by playing a strong solo lane and trashing your lane opponent, that decreases your chance of victory considerably. I usually ban Alistar too and would ban Maokai if I had 4 bans.

[Talesin]

This surprises me. Are there seriously games at 1200 where Shaco/Lee aren't banned?

Yeah, I would say they are banned most games but not exclusively. The bans I tend to see most often are Shaco, Kass, Shen, Lee, Ahri and maybe WW but a lot less often than the previous 5.

It used to be Rammus but after his nerfs people seem to think he is less useful. Then you get things like Morde, Galio, Kennen but I wouldn't say they are banned anywhere near as often as the above champions.

[PersonMan]

Tips and tricks for the New Horseman in the toplane? I found his jungle unstable and schizophrenic. Heard he's good top, wondering how people have been doing it.

I haven't played him personally, but a friend of mine ended up randoming him top, so I have a bit of secondhand info.

He used teleport/flash, taking Spirit of Dread I Set the Ground on Fire and It Heals Me For Some Reason early for the sustain. I'd recommend keeping TP up if possible, as the effects of 'suddenly Hecarim teleported into the middle of that fight and got a triple kill*' are tough to understate. Even in other situations, the disruptive effect of 'he was top, now he's in the middle of us' brought by TP + Ult is quite useful.

I don't know much more, as I didn't really watch him in lane, but he went for a Trin Force early and took Merc Treads before the Triple Kill Incident.

*Although, the fight was basically over and consisted of me (Supportlesticks) suicide-ulting the enemy team and getting three of them to about 10% HP.

[SlyGuyMcFly]

Yeah, I would say they are banned most games but not exclusively. The bans I tend to see most often are Shaco, Kass, Shen, Lee, Ahri and maybe WW but a lot less often than the previous 5.

Many, many Morgana bans too. With good reason.

[Eldariel]

Yeah, I would say they are banned most games but not exclusively. The bans I tend to see most often are Shaco, Kass, Shen, Lee, Ahri and maybe WW but a lot less often than the previous 5.

It used to be Rammus but after his nerfs people seem to think he is less useful. Then you get things like Morde, Galio, Kennen but I wouldn't say they are banned anywhere near as often as the above champions.

WW bans really, really confuse me. I keep hearing these arguments about how he "carries harder lategame" than other tops but eh, really? WW better late than Riven, Olaf, Wukong or Yorick for instance? I have a hard time buying that, and they all beat him on lane...

Every time I ask about it in a ranked game, about 70% of the players seems to be convinced that WW is the most OP thing ever and then they're surprised when he doesn't do **** to help them actually win the game. Like, WW beats Vlad but that's like...everybody beats Vlad. Vlad's like the worst laner ever (yeah, I know he has some good match-ups too and that his scaling is decent, I just don't really like champs with that many terrible lane match-ups).


Morg ban I like quite a bit in lower Elo since she's so easy to do well with; someone like Cassiopeia, Karthus or even Ahri is pretty easy to mess up but Morgana is the safest champ in the game, has inevitable scaling and is pretty strong all things considered.

Kassadin ban is kinda silly though 'cause he has so many counterlanes. I like leaving him unbanned simply because if enemy picks Morgana, I can just pick Kassadin and autowin 'cause Morg can't match Kass's midgame impact and you can't die on lane vs. Morgana.

[Talesin]

WW bans really, really confuse me. I keep hearing these arguments about how he "carries harder lategame" than other tops but eh, really?

Oh I agree. I don't think WW is actually more of a problem than any of the other characters you listed. He won't do the damage of Riven, Olaf or Wukong in my opinion but a wits end-bloodrazor'd ult on the ap carry is going to inflict a fair chunk of damage.

I would argue, from personal experience, that it isn't his carry status that makes him such a problem but more that you need a conscious effort to kill him during the laning phase so he's a really safe lane that will guarantee the other guy isn't fed.


Kassadin ban is kinda silly though 'cause he has so many counterlanes. I like leaving him unbanned simply because if enemy picks Morgana, I can just pick Kassadin and autowin 'cause Morg can't match Kass's midgame impact and you can't die on lane vs. Morgana.

Again though i'd argue that he requires a conscious effort to stop, in this case a counter pick, and if he's picked after the mid and top lane are already chosen that does potentially leave someone in trouble. So he's probably better to just flat out ban and stop this problem occuring.

The thing I find most frustrating about laning against Kass is his combo stops all hope of a counter trade. He riftwalks in, silences you, slows you, runs off.

[9mm]

so patch notes... can anyone explain the random WW nerf?

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

so patch notes... can anyone explain the random WW nerf?

Because late-game WW is actually a really, really scary thing. I've been finding this out recently, and it's always alarming. Sure, you can shut him down...but that Ult on a carry is one of your most important teammates dead due to a teleporting, high-damage suppress...and then WW usually has enough tankiness and enough sustain to actually walk out of the midst of the enemy team, and/or continue fighting after that. Think Malzahar if he couldn't be nuked during his Ult, and would lifesteal up to almost full afterwards.

When you think about it, 275 + 1.0/AP + 20% of a target's max health is a LOT of damage to be regaining 80% of...and more than 80% if your team has any spell vamp or you've got a Spirit Visage. Without Blue or any CDR it's on a 6 second cooldown, which is a ton of free healing. Then his passive adds to that?

He's just a super-sustaining, tanky, high-DPS champion with a suppress for the enemy carry or mage (that grants him lifesteal in the process), great chasing power, and a team-wide AS buff. It's a nasty combination, and easy to exploit to great advantage. Sure, he's not as raw-damaging as Olaf or Wukong, but he outsustains the hell out of both, and 20% of max health is a lot of extra damage if your enemy team doesn't have a lot of MR.

It's a reasonable nerf, in my mind, although I might have liked to see the mana cost decreased a bit to compensate for the loss of power, since WW is rather mana hungry with Hungering Strike.

[TechnOkami]

Bug: If you use a health potion on Summoner's rift, sometimes it will give you a targeting cursor instead of automatically activating. It cannot be used on other champions and will only affect the summoner with the health potions. Easy to reproduce.

[Eldariel]

Because late-game WW is actually a really, really scary thing. I've been finding this out recently, and it's always alarming. Sure, you can shut him down...but that Ult on a carry is one of your most important teammates dead due to a teleporting, high-damage suppress...and then WW usually has enough tankiness and enough sustain to actually walk out of the midst of the enemy team, and/or continue fighting after that. Think Malzahar if he couldn't be nuked during his Ult, and would lifesteal up to almost full afterwards.

When you think about it, 275 + 1.0/AP + 20% of a target's max health is a LOT of damage to be regaining 80% of...and more than 80% if your team has any spell vamp or you've got a Spirit Visage. Without Blue or any CDR it's on a 6 second cooldown, which is a ton of free healing. Then his passive adds to that?

He's just a super-sustaining, tanky, high-DPS champion with a suppress for the enemy carry or mage (that grants him lifesteal in the process), great chasing power, and a team-wide AS buff. It's a nasty combination, and easy to exploit to great advantage. Sure, he's not as raw-damaging as Olaf or Wukong, but he outsustains the hell out of both, and 20% of max health is a lot of extra damage if your enemy team doesn't have a lot of MR.

It's a reasonable nerf, in my mind, although I might have liked to see the mana cost decreased a bit to compensate for the loss of power, since WW is rather mana hungry with Hungering Strike.

Uh, are you saying there are carries that don't build QSS against WW (I mean, one builds QSS in general on carries but especially against WW; also in teamfights there's enough CC to negate his ult quite easily)?

[Anonomuss]

So... I got Mordekaiser recently, and boy, do I like him!

First game I played, the enemy team didn't have a jungler, and ran a 2-1-2, so I just pushed my lane to hell and back, while taking wraiths. Ended up with 399cs in around 45 mins. It was a nice intro.

Every game since then, I've wanted to play him mid again, but haven't really been given the chance. So... Jungle Morde? Played three games, and got a decent sense of where he's at. 2 losses, 1 win. He's fast, but cannot gank unless the enemy overextends. He's a bit like shyvanna without a gapcloser. In the game I won, I was lvl 5 by the time the opposing Lee was lvl 3, and I had successfully ganked and scored an assist on mid. Stole Lee's second red, and ended up becoming a powerhouse by late game, with almost a full build.

Its fun enough in normals, but I don't think I could recommend it. Its got some potential in the fast-clear meta, but the lack of a ganking threat is pretty severe. But, with his ult, a gank into bot can sometimes turn a 2 v 2 into a 4 v 1. Doesn't happen often, but when it does, it makes me smile.

[toasty]

This surprises me. Are there seriously games at 1200 where Shaco/Lee aren't banned? I've religiously banned them this whole ranked season and whenever I see them not banned, they usually win the game.

You begin to understand my frustration, yes? :smallsigh:

You have no idea what this elo is like. People ban WW over Shen. Ban rammus over shaco, ban Morgana over Lee Sin. People are very slow the learn. I mean, I ban Shen, Lee Sin and Shaco every game now, but really, its frustrating.


Even 1600s lack the coordination to efficiently deal with those much of the time (unless you get to play Lee yourself, then you just trounce Shaco since Lee is ridiculous), and good Lee/Shaco will invariably score early kills. Lee maybe less so since he has too high a skill cap to be utilized effectively by most 1200s but Shaco is obscenely easy.

At this point I've realize that if you jungle Lee Sin you're good at it. Honestly, though I've never played Lee Sin, it doesn't seem that difficult to get first blood top with him.


Besides, strong early gankers mean you can't play as aggressively on lane as you could normally. Since you can win basically every 1200 game ever by playing a strong solo lane and trashing your lane opponent, that decreases your chance of victory considerably. I usually ban Alistar too and would ban Maokai if I had 4 bans.

No one plays Moakai anymore, I'm more likely to ban Mundo if I want to ban a jungler. Honstly Arhi is a good band because that Taunt is really strong. Vlad is dumb too because ... he's vlad. Alistair is scary enough that if I had an extra ban I'd consider it.

[Maeglin_Dubh]

For horse top, I want to start Boots+3 or Cloth+5 and focus Angry Fire for sustain?

[shadowwalker64]

For horse top, I want to start Boots+3 or Cloth+5 and focus Angry Fire for sustain?

Boots 3 or Cloth5 start is always good, depending on lane matchup. I skill QEQWQR, then skilling R>Q>W>E. You shouldn't really max W as not only does it push your lane a lot, but you're also only healing around 80 damage in total every use at early levels. Your Q is much better for helping you brawl in protracted engagements against other tops, and is one of the main reasons why Hecarim can be played top (can actually gain advantage on Riven if playing correctly lvl 1, from experience). Early level in E is to escape jungle ganks since it gives you ridiculous amounts of movespeed.

Runes, if you were wondering, should be Arpen Reds, Armour Yellows, Mr/lvl Blues and Movespeed Quints (Movespeed Quints+Masteries allow you to start Cloth5 and always have enough speed). Arpen Quints, AD Quints and Health Quints are ideal substitutes. Masteries should be 0/21/9 to capitalize on tankiness

[ex cathedra]

@Toasty: allow me to channel my inner Morello and suggest that no one plays Maokai at your Elo. :smallwink:

[PersonMan]

@toasty: I agree, Ahri is a great band. I love all her music.

Also: hybrid (AP, off AD) Hecarim is hilarious. I might even try it in a real game at some point. W scales at .8, ulti at .8 + .4. Early Sheen for Q spam, then Rageblade, followed by Rylai's, upgrade Sheen to Lichbane, Derpcap.

[toasty]

@Toasty: allow me to channel my inner Morello and suggest that no one plays Maokai at your Elo. :smallwink:

This is of course what i meant. Zach will also inform you that you can just play Mundo so why play anything else. Mundo stronk King.

[Psyborg]

This surprises me. Are there seriously games at 1200 where Shaco/Lee aren't banned?

Context: My ranked ELO is currently low 1100s because I played a string of ranked games a while back right as I was switching from being primarily an AP mid player to being primarily an AD carry player, and so sucked at both. I'm confident my normal ELO is higher than that, if not dramatically. Most of the people I play normals with have ranked ELOs in the mid-1200 to high-1500 range. So my normal ELO is probably...pretty typical mid-bronze-level, I guess.

In normal draft at this level, in my experience, the following are 95-100% permabanned, and guaranteed to be first-picked if left unbanned:
~~Morgana
~~Shen
~~Shaco
The following are banned about half the time:
~~Kassadin
And the following are also not uncommon bans:
~~Ryze
~~Kennen
~~Warwick
~~Olaf
~~Soraka
~~Ahri

Oddly, I don't see a lot of Lee Sin, either played or banned. He does generally do very well when he's picked, too, but (like Xerath and Cass, who I would absolutely ban out if I saw them more often) he's so rarely picked that he's not worth the ban.

Personally, I also see a lot of Janna bans, but that's because me and my friends ban her when running an AoE-to-Win comp. I don't think the Janna bans are typical for my level. (I suspect that we'll have to start banning Gragas eventually as we improve; so far no one has countered us with him.)

[Psyborg]

This surprises me. Are there seriously games at 1200 where Shaco/Lee aren't banned?

Context: My ranked ELO is currently low 1100s because I played a string of ranked games a while back right as I was switching from being primarily an AP mid player to being primarily an AD carry player (and so sucked at both), and haven't played ranked since. I'm confident my normal ELO is higher than that, if not dramatically. Most of the people I play normals with have ranked ELOs in the mid-1200 to high-1500 range. So my normal ELO is probably...pretty typical mid-bronze-level, I guess.

In normal draft at this level, in my experience, the following are 95-100% permabanned, and guaranteed to be first-picked if left unbanned:
~~Morgana
~~Shen
~~Shaco
The following are banned about half the time:
~~Kassadin
And the following are also not uncommon bans:
~~Ryze
~~Kennen
~~Warwick
~~Olaf
~~Soraka
~~Ahri

Oddly, I don't see a lot of Lee Sin, either played or banned. He does generally do very well when he's picked, too, but (like Xerath and Cass, who I would absolutely ban out if I saw them more often) he's so rarely picked that he's not worth the ban.

Personally, I also see a lot of Janna bans, but that's because me and my friends ban her when running an AoE-to-Win comp. I don't think the Janna bans are typical for my level. (I suspect that we'll have to start banning Gragas eventually as we improve; so far no one has countered us with him.)

[toasty]

so patch notes... can anyone explain the random WW nerf?

People QQ about WW, WW gets a nerf. He's not OP. He's not even really that good, except as a counterpick. His jungle is slow, his laning early is very, very weak. There is no reason to pick or ban WW except as a counterpick to specific heroes (Shen comes to mind, he actually does pretty good against Shen; WW probably exists as a decent galio counter). WW does nothing that other Bruisers can't do; Lee Sin and Udyr can become equally immortal and are actually better and being aggressive and getting kills. Vlad's sustain is the highest in the game, AND he can actually PUSH his lane. And Vlad actually scales properly into late game. Vlad's early laning is almost as weak as WW, but he has a ranged autoattack and longer ranged harass that costs NOTHING. Oh, and troolpool.

There is no reason to pick WW over Vlad, Udyr or Lee Sin unless you want to stack Suppress, but that's just a silly idea.


Because late-game WW is actually a really, really scary thing. I've been finding this out recently, and it's always alarming. Sure, you can shut him down...but that Ult on a carry is one of your most important teammates dead due to a teleporting, high-damage suppress...and then WW usually has enough tankiness and enough sustain to actually walk out of the midst of the enemy team, and/or continue fighting after that. Think Malzahar if he couldn't be nuked during his Ult, and would lifesteal up to almost full afterwards.

QQS means WW is useless for this reason. Carries that are getting caught are bad carries that deserve to die. WW has flash and ult. Play like it.

Maybe I'm in a really pissy mood because of my recent elo loss (QQ im 1200 elo right now) but the its really a lot easier to play safe than people realize I feel. I mean, I suppose if you are Vayne or Graves you might be in trouble, but Corki, Trist, Cait, Ashe and Kog'maw really don't have an excuse. Well, maybe Kog.


Uh, are you saying there are carries that don't build QSS against WW (I mean, one builds QSS in general on carries but especially against WW; also in teamfights there's enough CC to negate his ult quite easily)?

Yeah, this is sensible speak here. WW probably will never catch the AD carry with his ult unless the AD carry is out of position. Now, I've played a fair bit of WW (probably more than any other hero) and I admit, its actually kinda easy to catch people late game if they're derps. But in a proper 5v5 fight? WW isn't going to be killing the AD carry, he'll be killing the tanks. He actually is probably the best anti-tank Bruiser in the game right now.


When you think about it, 275 + 1.0/AP + 20% of a target's max health is a LOT of damage to be regaining 80% of...and more than 80% if your team has any spell vamp or you've got a Spirit Visage. Without Blue or any CDR it's on a 6 second cooldown, which is a ton of free healing. Then his passive adds to that?

WW is tanky as ****. That's his greatest asset. His damage is alright late game, but its not stellar. Shen does more damage and is almost as tanky. Olaf is better and beats WW in lane. CC and ignite WW and win the game. Olaf cannot be CCed. Neither Shen nor Olaf care much about Ignite (though it hurts). If you didn't save your ignite for a WW team (assuming they don't have vlad; now there is a scary team) then you're probably play wrong.


He's just a super-sustaining, tanky, high-DPS champion with a suppress for the enemy carry or mage (that grants him lifesteal in the process), great chasing power, and a team-wide AS buff. It's a nasty combination, and easy to exploit to great advantage. Sure, he's not as raw-damaging as Olaf or Wukong, but he outsustains the hell out of both, and 20% of max health is a lot of extra damage if your enemy team doesn't have a lot of MR.

Wukong and Olaf rape WW in lane. Its not even funny. Like, its NOT funny. A Ignite/Flash Wukong who starts Doran's Blade can probably kill Warwick at level 3 with proper harass. The only answer for WW is to play passive and call for ganks. That's bad. A good Wukong or Olaf will make sure that WW never gets strong enough to be a threat. He will be tanky, but tanky isn't a threat.


It's a reasonable nerf, in my mind, although I might have liked to see the mana cost decreased a bit to compensate for the loss of power, since WW is rather mana hungry with Hungering Strike.

The mana cost is the only thing keeping WW from being stupid in lane again, as it is, come mid-game, once WW has a Wits End, he's already kinda dumb. Not in the "overpowered" way, but in the "don't harass me, its a waste of time." He still is vulnerable to multiple CC ganks from heroes like Nautilus or Alistair though.

The damage nerf on his Q doesn't really change anything. He is still tanky. He still kills tanks alright. His laning is still alright because of mid-game dominance. But Vlad is still better.


(I suspect that we'll have to start banning Gragas eventually as we improve; so far no one has countered us with him.)

Gragas probably won't be a problem. Outside of a very small number of players at high elo he's completely unplayed. He's a great, great asset to a poke comp though.

[Eldariel]

You begin to understand my frustration, yes? :smallsigh:

You have no idea what this elo is like. People ban WW over Shen. Ban rammus over shaco, ban Morgana over Lee Sin. People are very slow the learn. I mean, I ban Shen, Lee Sin and Shaco every game now, but really, its frustrating.

It's true that I don't have long-term exposure, but I have played 4 accounts out from 1200s this season so I have some idea; silly bans happen, that I do remember. I didn't really focus on things like bans since I spent all of my energy making people let me mid so I could carry the games (though was usually able to sway people to ban Shaco, which is all that really mattered since a good Shaco can really make it hard to get kills on lane especially since it was basically par de course for enemy jungler to camp me).


At this point I've realize that if you jungle Lee Sin you're good at it. Honestly, though I've never played Lee Sin, it doesn't seem that difficult to get first blood top with him.

Well, first blood isn't hard but executing ganks competently throughout the game is more so, let alone teamfighting.


No one plays Moakai anymore, I'm more likely to ban Mundo if I want to ban a jungler. Honstly Arhi is a good band because that Taunt is really strong. Vlad is dumb too because ... he's vlad. Alistair is scary enough that if I had an extra ban I'd consider it.

I do find Ahri is a silly ban. If you wanna ban a solo queue stomper, ban LeBlanc. She's pretty much autowin if you have any clue and play against 1200s. Ahri is no more or less problematic than e.g. Annie on low elo in my experience.

[toasty]

Well, first blood isn't hard but executing ganks competently throughout the game is more so, let alone teamfighting.

Firstblood is often enough to snowball top lane though. :smallsigh:


I do find Ahri is a silly ban. If you wanna ban a solo queue stomper, ban LeBlanc. She's pretty much autowin if you have any clue and play against 1200s. Ahri is no more or less problematic than e.g. Annie on low elo in my experience.

I haven't seen a leblanc in at least two months. Ahri is FOTM right now. :smalltongue:

[Eldariel]

I haven't seen a leblanc in at least two months. Ahri is FOTM right now. :smalltongue:

Aye. Luckily FotM basically means "learn to destroy this champ with any one champ, keep leaving it unbanned and enjoy your free wins". :smalltongue:

[Eakin]

Hey guys, just joined up with this game a few days ago. Summoner name's Eakin3. Everything you're talking about is going waaaaay over my head. I've been playing 5v5 matches against Beginner AIs, and I'm about to hit level 6. I've been trying to get a feel for the different champions and styles. Beginner AIs are starting to feel a little too easy.

Questions:
-How big is the difficulty jump between Beginner AIs and Intermediate? How long should I play before I jump into actual PvP matches?

-Should I be going after the neutral monsters in the jungle, or sticking to a lane?

-Does anybody actually unlock all of these champions? Or do people pick a half dozen or so of them to focus on?

-Who should I be using my IP to unlock? I have the cross-boomerang girl and the cheap healer (Soraka? Sokara? Something like that). Are the more expensive champions better?

[Eldariel]

Questions:
-How big is the difficulty jump between Beginner AIs and Intermediate? How long should I play before I jump into actual PvP matches?

Eh, you should have no trouble in Intermediate bots I'd wager. They get some bonus gold and probably have slightly better coordination and more advanced behavior sensibility but all in all, they're still bots.


-Should I be going after the neutral monsters in the jungle, or sticking to a lane?

If you can. There's a "player slot" in the game called "jungler", which is basically always used in the PvP games between the most skilled players; basically, this player starts the game in the jungle (leaving the toplane also a solo lane) and farms the neutral monsters all game long.

Other than junglers, there's a handful of champions (and champion pairs) who can take some of the small camps like Wraiths, Golems or Wolves before minions engage on lane without losing a significant amount of health for a small XP/gold boost, and later in the game you should pick them up whenever you can spare the time; passing by, kill 'em once you have enough damage/survivability to do it fast and without losing a lot of life (or even gaining with Lifesteal/Spellvamp).

Important camps are the "Lizard"-camp in the middle of the rightside jungle, and the "Golem"-camp in the top of the leftside jungle; those camps confer buffs on you if you kill them. Blue buff gives you mana regeneration and cooldown reduction for its duration (2.5 minutes) and red buff makes your autoattacks deal true damage and apply a slow on the target. These are mostly used for the buffs and in botgames you probably can pick them up yourself come midgame (around level 10 maybe) pretty safely.

Generally autoattackers, particularly ranged ones (like Miss Fortune, Graves or company) without inherent slows like the redbuff (melee types too) and mages like Annie or Morgana like the bluebuff (as CDR increases their damage the most, and they can use the extra mana regeneration).


But the short answer: Pick them whenever it doesn't cost you any creep kills on the lane and you aren't needed somewhere else immediately.


-Does anybody actually unlock all of these champions? Or do people pick a half dozen or so of them to focus on?

You'll eventually unlock them all if you play enough. I try to own all just for trading considerations; in draft mode games champions are picked in player order so picking champions for different roles and counterpicking against those champions is an important consideration and requires trading champions between players after the picks are done.

That said, it's not necessary and I've played over 4000 games already and I still lack some (ones I consider lower priority to get, mostly). But I'm going to have them all eventually. And I can even play basically all of them at least semi-competently (though obviously, the road to true mastery is much longer; I'm only a master of few).


-Who should I be using my IP to unlock? I have the cross-boomerang girl and the cheap healer (Soraka? Sokara? Something like that). Are the more expensive champions better?

Champion cost is in no ways related to their power. What you should unlock depends on what kinds of champions you want to play. Keep trying, find the ones you love and go from there. My first purchase was Janna who I played for the first 20 levels until I ran into Anivia and she froze my heart forever. She's probably still my most-played champion though I've branched out after the ~200 games with basically only her.

[Dienekes]

Hey guys, just joined up with this game a few days ago. Summoner name's Eakin3. Everything you're talking about is going waaaaay over my head. I've been playing 5v5 matches against Beginner AIs, and I'm about to hit level 6. I've been trying to get a feel for the different champions and styles. Beginner AIs are starting to feel a little too easy.

I started by jumping straight into player vs player and that worked fairly well for me. If Beginner AI is too easy just try Intermediate you'll be fine.


-Should I be going after the neutral monsters in the jungle, or sticking to a lane?

By the time you gain a few more levels teams will be roughly divided into:
2 bottom lane (currently AD Carry/Support)
1 middle lane (currently AP Carry)
1 top lane (Bruiser/tank)
1 jungler (very wide range from gankers to carries to tanks)

But even then a lot of times folks still go two people top lane and no jungler and can still win if it's not a super serious ranked game. Now you might be able to go through the jungle right at level 6 but you don't have to. At your low level you're fine just picking a lane and testing your champion out.


-Does anybody actually unlock all of these champions? Or do people pick a half dozen or so of them to focus on?

It depends on the person. A friend of mine has like all but a dozen or so unlocked who is much, much better at this game than I am. I just have about 6 guys I play a lot that I've gotten pretty good with. But I have enough IP to buy quite a lot more, but I just don't. It also helps that the champions I like to play are absolutely never banned, so I'm more or less free to always play what I'm comfortable with.


-Who should I be using my IP to unlock? I have the cross-boomerang girl and the cheap healer (Soraka? Sokara? Something like that). Are the more expensive champions better?

Now when I started playing I set my goals on playing Pantheon because he's a Sparitiate, and I was a History major in college focusing on Greco-Roman era. Lucky for me, I actually really enjoy Pantheon's gameplay and he's still my most played champion.

Now, you'll see that every week they change which champions are available free to play. Personally (after my Pantheon grab) I never buy a champion until I've played them a few times for free. What I would suggest is playing around with each champion, see which position you're most comfortable playing in (personally, I can't support, I'm just terrible at it, and am only starting to not absolutely suck as an AD carry) and then look for which champion feels the most right for you in that position. For example for me, I tank Cho'gath and AP carry with Ziggs. Neither of which are considered the best but they're viable and I'm good with them.

Also just starting out, the cheap 450 IP champions have perfectly fine champions for every style of play. When just starting out, you can do a lot worse than grabbing a couple of those. Hell Ryze is often put in any of the top 3 positions for best AP carry in the game, and he's one of those 450 champs.

[Karoht]

Yeah, the Lizardman/Golem Buffs are frakking awesome to have. Having my skill shot drop below a 30 second cooldown is awesome. Having my auto attacks just burn down creepers at a positively insane speed AND slow everyone down? That's awesome too.

I have never seen what killing Baron Nashor gets you, and I know that slaying the dragon near the bottom lane by the middle of the map basically gets you an XP/Money reward, though I have no idea how large.
You need the full party to kill Nashor, or so I hear tell.

[Eldariel]

Yeah, the Lizardman/Golem Buffs are frakking awesome to have. Having my skill shot drop below a 30 second cooldown is awesome. Having my auto attacks just burn down creepers at a positively insane speed AND slow everyone down? That's awesome too.

I have never seen what killing Baron Nashor gets you, and I know that slaying the dragon near the bottom lane by the middle of the map basically gets you an XP/Money reward, though I have no idea how large.
You need the full party to kill Nashor, or so I hear tell.

Baron Nashor gives the whole team...I recall 3% Health/5 seconds and 1% Mana/5 Seconds regeneration and 40 AP & AD. It's also 300 gold for everyone in the team (and kill reward for the one with the last hit; 25 gold and 900 XP IIRC?). The gold alone is equivalent of 5 kills and the whole packet is easily worth 10k gold.

Dragon is simply 190 gold for the whole team and 25 gold & 200 XP (IIRC) for the killer. It's about equivalent to two kills or a tower in terms of gold gained. Of course, it being spread across the team makes the gold a bit less powerful. Early game in higher level PvP is generally focused around securing the Dragon (and/or Towers; trading Tower for Dragon is common) for the early advantage.

[Daverin]

So... they 'buffed' Irelia. Not nerfed. Buff...


ABANDON SHIP!!! :smalltongue:

In all seriousness, the patch notes don't appear too bad. I must say, I think Ryze players should honestly be happy with some of this; sure, there is some raw scaling power lost, but the making AP slightly more attractive is decent, and a few of the changes look directly aimed at making early game less rocky (having a much quicker projectile can only be a boon. And Overload is actually probably better now very early game.)

However, Hungering Strike nerf; really? Was he causing trouble?

Also, lol at the Zilean change. I can only hope that it is there because someone actually needed it. :smallyuk:

[Reinboom]

Also, lol at the Zilean change. I can only hope that it is there because someone actually needed it. :smallyuk:

It reduces the impact of an accident (leveling rewind at 1) without actually limiting any real play.

[toasty]

Scarra was talking about the Ryze stuff and he said it was a pretty big nerf. Ryze will still be good, but its still a nerf.

[Qwertystop]

When do they add that Chalice upgrade?

[TechnOkami]

Bug (maybe): When you are on the summoner's platform at summoner's rift and do not move, if you try to do a joke/taunt/laugh, the sounds will occur, but the animation won't.

[Darth Mario]

-How big is the difficulty jump between Beginner AIs and Intermediate? How long should I play before I jump into actual PvP matches?

However long it takes you to feel comfortable enough to try. Though something that I feel that bot games teach you that is BAD to learn is a fear of losing. This is a PvP game. Statistically, losing should happen about half the time. But in bot games, it very rarely occurs. This means when you DO jump to PvP you're probably going to feel a lot worse at the game than you actually are. Don't let this get you down, just keep playing. You'll improve faster and if you're in the mood to just win a game you can always jump back to a bot match.

[toasty]

When do they add that Chalice upgrade?

Maybe never. PBE is not live. :smallsmile:

[Maeglin_Dubh]

Patch notes.

Spectator Mode!

Spectate your Friends
Added the ability to spectate games that friends are playing by right clicking their name in the buddy list
Easily identify friends you can spectate by the eye icon near their name
Featured Games
The landing page will now host featured games that anyone can spectate
Click the 'Watch Now' icon to view some of the most skilled players in League of Legends!
Games cycle at regular intervals so be sure to check back often
Directed Camera
Implemented a directed camera mode that will automatically follow the action in game!
The camera will seamlessly jump between champion fights and other critical moments
Interesting events like Champion kills will be prioritized
When multiple Champions are on the screen, the camera will automatically adjust to include them
Timeshift Controls
Spectators can now jump around the timeline of a live game to watch past events!
Replay events in slow motion to review action-filled moments
Spectators can now actively fast forward through the game
Spectator announcer coverage will now report more events
Updated spectator UI elements to respect colorblind mode
New Skins in the Store

Frostblade Irelia
Rune Wars Renekton
PVP.net v1.59

Added a new image for ignored Summoners in the buddy list
Fixed several display inconsistencies when using Summoner Name Change
Summoners must now be level 5 to talk in public chat rooms
Level 1 summoners will still be able to join with read-only access
Pending a hotfix, only game creators can invite players to games
PvP.net Store

Added an indicator to show owned rune content when attempting to purchase a new rune
Rune purchases past the usable rune limit will now be prevented
League of Legends v1.0.0.139

Alistar

Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level
Amumu

Curse of the Sad Mummy cooldown reduced to 150/130/110 seconds from 170/150/120 seconds
Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level
Annie

Base Health increased to 460 from 424
Incinerate Mana cost reduced to 70/80/90/100/110 from 80/95/110/125/140
Molten Shield
Fixed a bug where Molten Shield returned damage to turrets
Duration reduced to 8 seconds from 15 seconds and cooldown reduced to 16 seconds from 30 seconds
Mana cost reduced to 20 from 25
Armor and Magic Resist increased to 20/30/40/50/60 from 10/20/30/40/50
Blitzcrank

Updated playing against tips
Cho'gath

Movement Speed increased to 320 from 315
Dr. Mundo

Burning Agony
Now has a short cooldown upon activation (to avoid accidental disabling)
Base damage reduced to 35/50/65/80/95 from 40/55/70/85/100
Crowd control reduction decreased to 10/15/20/25/30% from 15/20/25/30/35%
Fixed a bug where Burning Agony was reducing the duration of blinds and silences by more than intended
Sadism
Cooldown increased to 75 seconds from 65 seconds
Graves

Fixed a bug where using a ward could break Buckshot's sound
Irelia

Base health increased to 546 from 515
Health per level increased to 90 from 85
Base health regen per 5 increased to 7.5 from 6.5
Base damage increased to 59.3 from 56.3
Jarvan IV

Fixed a bug with Commando and Dragon Slayer skins that caused the game to hitch when first using Demacian Standard
Jax

Fixed a bug where Counterstrike was stunning through spell shields
Kog'maw

Void Ooze slow reduced to 20/28/36/44/52% from 28/36/44/52/60%
Lee Sin

Iron Will Life Steal and Spell Vamp reduced to 5/9/13/17/21% from 5/10/15/20/25%
Safeguard and Iron Will cooldown increased to 9 seconds from 8 seconds
Leona

Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level
Lulu

Glitterlance
Ability power ratio reduced to 0.6 from 0.7
Mana cost increased at later ranks to 40/50/60/70/80 from 40/45/50/55/60
Updated Wild Growth tooltip to reflect knock up ability rather than knock back
Malphite

Fixed a bug where Polymorph was interrupting Unstoppable Force
Master Yi

Meditate
Mana cost reduced to 70/80/90/100/110 from 70/85/100/115/130
Highlander
Fixed a bug where assists with Highlander failed to reduce Alpha Strike's cooldown
Duration changed to 8/10/12 seconds from 6/9/12 seconds
Miss Fortune

Bullet Time now deals physical damage
Double Up secondary target damage increased to 120% from 115%
Nocturne

Fixed a bug with the Ravager skin where Unspeakable Horror was not visually applying the fear tether
Nunu

Added a range indicator to Absolute Zero
Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level
Olaf

Reckless Swing cooldown increased to 9/8/7/6/5 seconds from 8/7/6/5/4 seconds
Ryze

General
Base attack damage increased to 52 from 49
Base missile speed increased to 2400 from 1400
Recommended items updated on The Crystal Scar/Summoner's Rift
Animations updated for Overload, Rune Prison, and Spell Flux
Overload
Mana ratio reduced to 6.5% from 7.5%
Ability power ratio increased to .4 from .2
Overload base damage increased to 60/85/110/135/160 from 40/65/90/115/140
Range reduced to 650 from 700
Rune Prison
Mana ratio reduced to 4.5% from 5%
Mana cost adjusted to 80/90/100/110/120 from 80/95/110/125/140
Rune prison duration reduced to .75/1/1.25/1.5/1.75 seconds from 1/1.25/1.5/1.75/2 seconds
Spell Flux:
Added a 1% mana ratio
Missile speed reduced
Bounce radius increased to 400 from 375
Spell Flux now prioritizes enemy champions over Ryze
Mana cost adjusted to 80/90/100/110/120 from 80/95/110/125/140
Desperate Power:
Passive mana component removed
Active now adds 35/45/55 movement speed
Singed

Base Health increased to 487 from 448
Fixed a bug where Insanity Potion was reducing the duration of blinds and silences by more than intended
Sivir

Boomerang Blade bonus attack damage ratio increased to 1.1 from 1.0
Soraka

Starcall
Duration of Magic Resist reduction decreased to 5 seconds from 8 seconds
Mana cost increased at later ranks to 20/35/50/65/80 from 20/30/40/50/60
Infuse will no longer target allied minions
Astral Blessing armor bonus adjusted to 25/45/65/85/105 from 25/50/75/100/125
Swain

Fixed a bug with Bilgewater and Northern Front skins that caused the game to hitch the first time Decrepify was used
Talon

Rake mana cost reduced to 50/55/60/65/70 from 60/65/70/75/80
Base armor increased to 20.5 from 18.5
Taric

Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level
Udyr

Turtle Stance shield reduced to 60/95/130/165/200 from 60/100/140/180/220
Volibear

Fixed a bug where Majestic Roar was reducing Minion movement speed to 0 at rank 5
Warwick

Hungering Strike
Damage reduced to 8/10/12/14/16% from 8/11/14/17/20%
Zilean

Zilean can no longer level up Rewind at level 1
General

Turret base damage decreased but armor penetration and damage to minions increased
Improved particle scaling on larger characters like Dragon and Baron
Champion skin names will now be displayed on the load screen
New option added: Show All Chat
Cross-team chat in all games is now hidden by default
Cross-team chat in spectated games will also be hidden by default
If you enjoy competitive banter, opt-in using the new toggle in the 'More Options' menu!
Fixed a crash that would occur when attempting to maximize the window while loading into the game
Selected unit outlines are now improved to be less pixelated
"Surrender Vote Failed" message no longer appears to the enemy team
Announcements will now take up the same proportional amount of screen space regardless of the display resolution. The net result is a smaller size at smaller resolutions
Items

Deathfire Grasp
Now builds out of Blasting Wand and Kage's Lucky Pick (total cost reduced to 2600 from 2610)
Now grants 80 Ability Power and 15% Cooldown Reduction, from 60 Ability Power, 12 MP5, and 15% Cooldown Reduction
Increased cast range to 750 from 650
Active base damage changed to 25% +4% per 100 AP of the target's current Health from 30% + 3.5%
Fiendish Codex cost reduced to 1125 from 1245
Morello's Evil Tome
Now builds out of Fiendish Codex and Kage's Lucky Pick (total cost reduced to 2330 from 2350)
Now has Grievous Wounds active
Sunfire Cape aura damage increased to 40 from 35
Will of the Ancients
Now builds out of Blasting Wand and Hextech Revolver
Total cost increased to 2500 from 2100, combine cost reduced to 440 from 465
Atma's Impaler, Manamune, Archangel's Staff, Randuin's Omen, Force of Nature, and Deathfire Grasp tooltips now update dynamically
Fixed a bug where Randuin's Omen tooltip stated the incorrect slow duration
Summoner Spells

Fixed a bug where Teleport could be used after being affected by Crowd Control effects
Fixed a bug where casting Cleanse could interrupt Teleport
Summoner Heal base value reduced to 100 from 145
Co-op vs. AI

Changed Soraka Bot's Wish logic to help all allies instead of just those near her
Changed logic for Master Yi Bot's use of Meditate
Fixed a bug where Dominion bots would prematurely break counter-channel attempts on neutral points
Fixed a bug where Caitlyn Bot did not learn all of her skills

Also, I suck at formatting...

[Eldariel]

Patch notes.

*snip*

Tip: Go to the forum page and "Quote" the Patch Notes post, copy the quoted part. The forums use the same code so it's directly compatible and you can retain all the formatting with zero effort invested, thusly:

Spectator Mode Patch Notes
Spectator Mode!
Spectate your Friends
Added the ability to spectate games that friends are playing by right clicking their name in the buddy list
Easily identify friends you can spectate by the eye icon near their name

Featured Games
The landing page will now host featured games that anyone can spectate
Click the 'Watch Now' icon to view some of the most skilled players in League of Legends!
Games cycle at regular intervals so be sure to check back often
Directed Camera
Implemented a directed camera mode that will automatically follow the action in game!
The camera will seamlessly jump between champion fights and other critical moments
Interesting events like Champion kills will be prioritized
When multiple Champions are on the screen, the camera will automatically adjust to include them
Timeshift Controls
Spectators can now jump around the timeline of a live game to watch past events!
Replay events in slow motion to review action-filled moments
Spectators can now actively fast forward through the game
Spectator announcer coverage will now report more events
Updated spectator UI elements to respect colorblind mode


New Skins in the Store

Frostblade Irelia
Rune Wars Renekton


PVP.net v1.59

Added a new image for ignored Summoners in the buddy list
Fixed several display inconsistencies when using Summoner Name Change
Summoners must now be level 5 to talk in public chat rooms
Level 1 summoners will still be able to join with read-only access
Pending a hotfix, only game creators can invite players to games


PvP.net Store

Added an indicator to show owned rune content when attempting to purchase a new rune
Rune purchases past the usable rune limit will now be prevented


League of Legends v1.0.0.139

Alistar
Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level

Amumu
Curse of the Sad Mummy cooldown reduced to 150/130/110 seconds from 170/150/120 seconds
Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level


Annie
Base Health increased to 460 from 424
Incinerate Mana cost reduced to 70/80/90/100/110 from 80/95/110/125/140
Molten Shield
Fixed a bug where Molten Shield returned damage to turrets
Duration reduced to 8 seconds from 15 seconds and cooldown reduced to 16 seconds from 30 seconds
Mana cost reduced to 20 from 25
Armor and Magic Resist increased to 20/30/40/50/60 from 10/20/30/40/50


Blitzcrank
Updated playing against tips


Cho'gath
Movement Speed increased to 320 from 315


Dr. Mundo
Burning Agony
Now has a short cooldown upon activation (to avoid accidental disabling)
Base damage reduced to 35/50/65/80/95 from 40/55/70/85/100
Crowd control reduction decreased to 10/15/20/25/30% from 15/20/25/30/35%
Fixed a bug where Burning Agony was reducing the duration of blinds and silences by more than intended
Sadism
Cooldown increased to 75 seconds from 65 seconds


Graves
Fixed a bug where using a ward could break Buckshot's sound


Irelia
Base health increased to 546 from 515
Health per level increased to 90 from 85
Base health regen per 5 increased to 7.5 from 6.5
Base damage increased to 59.3 from 56.3


Jarvan IV
Fixed a bug with Commando and Dragon Slayer skins that caused the game to hitch when first using Demacian Standard


Jax
Fixed a bug where Counterstrike was stunning through spell shields


Kog'maw
Void Ooze slow reduced to 20/28/36/44/52% from 28/36/44/52/60%


Lee Sin
Iron Will Life Steal and Spell Vamp reduced to 5/9/13/17/21% from 5/10/15/20/25%
Safeguard and Iron Will cooldown increased to 9 seconds from 8 seconds


Leona
Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level


Lulu
Glitterlance
Ability power ratio reduced to 0.6 from 0.7
Mana cost increased at later ranks to 40/50/60/70/80 from 40/45/50/55/60
Updated Wild Growth tooltip to reflect knock up ability rather than knock back


Malphite
Fixed a bug where Polymorph was interrupting Unstoppable Force


Master Yi
Meditate
Mana cost reduced to 70/80/90/100/110 from 70/85/100/115/130
Highlander
Fixed a bug where assists with Highlander failed to reduce Alpha Strike's cooldown
Duration changed to 8/10/12 seconds from 6/9/12 seconds


Miss Fortune
Bullet Time now deals physical damage
Double Up secondary target damage increased to 120% from 115%


Nocturne
Fixed a bug with the Ravager skin where Unspeakable Horror was not visually applying the fear tether


Nunu
Added a range indicator to Absolute Zero
Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level


Olaf
Reckless Swing cooldown increased to 9/8/7/6/5 seconds from 8/7/6/5/4 seconds


Ryze
General
Base attack damage increased to 52 from 49
Base missile speed increased to 2400 from 1400
Recommended items updated on The Crystal Scar/Summoner's Rift
Animations updated for Overload, Rune Prison, and Spell Flux
Overload
Mana ratio reduced to 6.5% from 7.5%
Ability power ratio increased to .4 from .2
Overload base damage increased to 60/85/110/135/160 from 40/65/90/115/140
Range reduced to 650 from 700
Rune Prison
Mana ratio reduced to 4.5% from 5%
Mana cost adjusted to 80/90/100/110/120 from 80/95/110/125/140
Rune prison duration reduced to .75/1/1.25/1.5/1.75 seconds from 1/1.25/1.5/1.75/2 seconds
Spell Flux:
Added a 1% mana ratio
Missile speed reduced
Bounce radius increased to 400 from 375
Spell Flux now prioritizes enemy champions over Ryze
Mana cost adjusted to 80/90/100/110/120 from 80/95/110/125/140
Desperate Power:
Passive mana component removed
Active now adds 35/45/55 movement speed


Singed
Base Health increased to 487 from 448
Fixed a bug where Insanity Potion was reducing the duration of blinds and silences by more than intended


Sivir
Boomerang Blade bonus attack damage ratio increased to 1.1 from 1.0


Soraka
Starcall
Duration of Magic Resist reduction decreased to 5 seconds from 8 seconds
Mana cost increased at later ranks to 20/35/50/65/80 from 20/30/40/50/60
Infuse will no longer target allied minions
Astral Blessing armor bonus adjusted to 25/45/65/85/105 from 25/50/75/100/125


Swain
Fixed a bug with Bilgewater and Northern Front skins that caused the game to hitch the first time Decrepify was used


Talon
Rake mana cost reduced to 50/55/60/65/70 from 60/65/70/75/80
Base armor increased to 20.5 from 18.5


Taric
Now gains 1.25 Magic Resist per level


Udyr
Turtle Stance shield reduced to 60/95/130/165/200 from 60/100/140/180/220


Volibear
Fixed a bug where Majestic Roar was reducing Minion movement speed to 0 at rank 5


Warwick
Hungering Strike
Damage reduced to 8/10/12/14/16% from 8/11/14/17/20%


Zilean
Zilean can no longer level up Rewind at level 1


General
Turret base damage decreased but armor penetration and damage to minions increased
Improved particle scaling on larger characters like Dragon and Baron
Champion skin names will now be displayed on the load screen
New option added: Show All Chat
Cross-team chat in all games is now hidden by default
Cross-team chat in spectated games will also be hidden by default
If you enjoy competitive banter, opt-in using the new toggle in the 'More Options' menu!

Fixed a crash that would occur when attempting to maximize the window while loading into the game
Selected unit outlines are now improved to be less pixelated
"Surrender Vote Failed" message no longer appears to the enemy team
Announcements will now take up the same proportional amount of screen space regardless of the display resolution. The net result is a smaller size at smaller resolutions


Items
Deathfire Grasp
Now builds out of Blasting Wand and Kage's Lucky Pick (total cost reduced to 2600 from 2610)
Now grants 80 Ability Power and 15% Cooldown Reduction, from 60 Ability Power, 12 MP5, and 15% Cooldown Reduction
Increased cast range to 750 from 650
Active base damage changed to 25% +4% per 100 AP of the target's current Health from 30% + 3.5%
Fiendish Codex cost reduced to 1125 from 1245
Morello's Evil Tome
Now builds out of Fiendish Codex and Kage's Lucky Pick (total cost reduced to 2330 from 2350)
Now has Grievous Wounds active
Sunfire Cape aura damage increased to 40 from 35
Will of the Ancients
Now builds out of Blasting Wand and Hextech Revolver
Total cost increased to 2500 from 2100, combine cost reduced to 440 from 465
Atma's Impaler, Manamune, Archangel's Staff, Randuin's Omen, Force of Nature, and Deathfire Grasp tooltips now update dynamically
Fixed a bug where Randuin's Omen tooltip stated the incorrect slow duration


Summoner Spells
Fixed a bug where Teleport could be used after being affected by Crowd Control effects
Fixed a bug where casting Cleanse could interrupt Teleport
Summoner Heal base value reduced to 100 from 145



Co-op vs. AI
Changed Soraka Bot's Wish logic to help all allies instead of just those near her
Changed logic for Master Yi Bot's use of Meditate
Fixed a bug where Dominion bots would prematurely break counter-channel attempts on neutral points
Fixed a bug where Caitlyn Bot did not learn all of her skills

[fred dref]

I actually dislike the change to Mundo's Burning Agony. I liked being able to flash it on for a second if I missed a last hit or something. You could get one tick of damage, but you'd take no damage if you turned it off again immediately.

EDIT: Huh, Yi's Alpha Strike change didn't go through. I'm a little sad.

I'm pleased that they didn't reduce Talon's Rake's mana costs as much as they did in the PBE. That was insane.

They changed Cleanse interrupting Teleport, but did they change Olaf ult? I remember costing my team a game due to hitting R too early and canceling a 'port into a Baron fight.

Tooltip changes are nice.

I tentatively like all the AP item changes except WotA, but that's just because I love WotA and how easy it was to build.

[Maeglin_Dubh]

Ah, I just copied it from the page. Good tip.

[PEACH]

When you think about it, 275 + 1.0/AP + 20% of a target's max health is a LOT of damage to be regaining 80% of...and more than 80% if your team has any spell vamp or you've got a Spirit Visage. Without Blue or any CDR it's on a 6 second cooldown, which is a ton of free healing. Then his passive adds to that?

Just wanted to bring this up: His Q is either 275+1.0 or 20% of max health. It is not both. This misconception is annoying and the reason the "build Rabadons on WW, it's so good!" thing came about (though that may have been when it was still Zhonya's Ring).

[Tergon]

So I feel the need to vent something here. Hope nobody minds.

I like Heimerdinger. A lot. He’s probably my single favourite League Champion… and yet it’s so obvious that many people don’t agree. Not only by how rarely I see him played, but also by the fact that, well, folks abuse me for choosing him sometimes. It sort of saddens me, really.

See, here’s what turns most people off Heimerdinger: he doesn’t get kills. His abilities include a low-damage skillshot, an instant shot that hits whatever three targets are closest to you, an autonomous turret that shoots what it likes, and two passives. No nukes, little damage, and unless you’re really paying attention, not much use. Especially if you’re a slow, squishy mage with low autoattack, which is basically going to mean you suck at PvP. Which in turn means that yes, people are right, he doesn’t get kills easily.
So, the obvious solution? Don’t try to. I mean, think about it. A high killscore will not win you a game of League. Killing towers, inhibitors, and the enemy nexus will do that, and nothing else will. Sure, killing champions will help, but how? Why, by giving you gold, experience, and removing the opposition. And if you had a champion who could farm effortlessly, gain experience rapidly, and had no reason to fear the enemy… logically you wouldn’t need to get kills in the first place, now would you?

So what can Heimerdinger do? Well, thanks to his turrets, he can autoattack two separate targets at once, or the same target two times simultaneously. That goes up to three with enough levels, and when splash damage comes in, even a backed-up swarm of minions takes him about two seconds. He needs no other abilities or autoattacks to farm with incredible profit and ease. So clearly, he doesn’t need to worry about that. Hell, he can keep farming heavily while he’s back at the nexus buying gear, something that literally nobody else can claim they’re able to do. And as for worrying about enemy champions, well, what can they really do to him? Walk up and hit him while being peppered by his turrets and creeps? Because he will always have creeps, I promise, with the speed at which he takes down enemy waves. With his stun grenades to hold you there while you die, nobody’s really going to have much luck attempting that. Ganks are only a sure thing if the enemy has made themselves vulnerable, and since Heimerdinger sets up a heavily-armed base everywhere he goes, he’s never really all that vulnerable at all in the laning stages. The only tactic that’s likely to do anything is hanging back and harassing him from a distance and, well, he’ll be at the rear of his mob of creeps lobbing rockets and grenades right back. With that rolling wave of creeps and turrets, he’s easily one of the best pushers you’ll ever see early-to-mid game.

Yes, I know, there are those who aren’t impressed by this. He can farm well and is hard to gank? Why, I’m sure that you play champs like that all the time! And yeah, you probably do, I don’t doubt it. Sure, he might take the occasional tower early game, but you’ll use that time to feed and late game, you’ll be a terrifying force that will send the enemy flying, which is something Heimerdinger will never really be able to do. Instead, he’ll have incredible CC and splash damage, slows, stuns and blinds, as well as quite decent damage for anyone who gets within range, to say nothing of his aura which heals allied units of all types – including towers, which nobody else in the game can boast. Which makes him, if you think about it for even a second, a pretty damn fantastic Support. He can hold almost any position with a tower to back him up, even against a full enemy push – not forever, maybe, but long enough for backup to get there. During the counter-push he can set up fallback points and defensive positions for the team to wait in for the next creep wave, or to run through if they need to escape enemy hunters. And all those folks who are saying that they’d still kill him easily, please, I invite you to try. Walk up and whack him with your lamp-post, Jax, see what happens. It’ll go something along the lines of turret-stun-turret-rocket-ult. And if you were wondering why Heimerdinger bought himself a suit of Thornmail midgame, well, your rapidly-vanishing health bar is the reason why.
Seriously, you want comedy? Get Heimerdinger some Thornmail, stand in the open between your gun turrets, and let the gankers come to you to die. It is hilarious. And it’s also a fully legitimate tactic – you’re aware of the concept of ‘leading’ your enemy into a trap? Heimerdinger is, himself, a walking trap for enemy champions. He’s the king of schmuck bait. It’s actually one of the easiest and most effective ways for him to get kills in the first place, by letting enemy gankers kill themselves on him.

Added up… well, there you have an awesome pusher early game, an awesome support late game, who’s very nearly impossible to gank, farms like a boss, and takes the idea of playing defensively to such a high level that he can use it offensively instead. And yet, just today, a Master Yi on my team found it necessary to call me a “noobfag” (whatever that is) seven times in champion selection for even suggesting that I might go Heimerdinger, before I’d even locked him in. And when the rest of the team encouraged me to select Heimerdinger, he ranted to the other team about how he was clearly the only smart player and the game was already over. Sadly, when you disconnected in an explosion of impotent rage, you’d only had time to get one kill and die four times, so we would never see you reach that full potential (for the record, I was 3 kills 0 deaths at the time).

All in all, if you feel like TL;DR’ing that mess up there, let me sum it up for you neatly. If you agree with my dear friend Master Yi, that Heimerdinger’s high difficulty and low killscore make him useless in a match, please… do us all a favour.
Go back to Counter-Strike, you massive, massive tool.

Thank you.

[Math_Mage]

I hate to be that guy, but apart from very specialized kite/poke/push comps, baiting schmucks IS about all Heimerdinger is good for.

Oh, and jungling. :smallcool:

also GP and Ez can farm from base :smalltongue:

[Tergon]

Go back to Counter-Strike. :smalltongue:

No, seriously, though. I know lots of folks think that about Heimerdinger, but that's because there's so few good Heimerdingers out there! I promise you, he's much much much more effective than folks think. I'll have to make a point of showing you that some time. :smallamused:

[PEACH]

Heimerdinger doesn't work well as a support because he can't actually get fire off of anybody; he can just do some good-ish damage and CC in a specific area. He pushes well, but then again, so does every other mid nowadays, the difference being they can actually threaten a sidelane by running there at six and blasting them. I'd also say he's less "hard to gank" and more "normally gankable by some people, impossible to gank with others." Like, if Malz wants to gank Heimer, outside of being dumb enough to start ulting with a grenade flying, Heimer is going to die (I'm assuming Mazahar isn't dumb enough to start the gank and try to get a full combo during turret range, but he may ult from within them). But if Udyr wants to gank Heimer, well, he's SoL. Basically, anybody with ranged CC or high burst can gank Heimer as normally; it's just melee champs and guys who require attacks to be effective that get screwed.

[Qaera]

Karthus can farm from base, too.

Farm kills, that is. Last hitting is for plebs.

$$$$$ #neverplayedkarthusbefore

~ ♅

[tyckspoon]

I hate to be that guy, but apart from very specialized kite/poke/push comps, baiting schmucks IS about all Heimerdinger is good for.

Oh, and jungling. :smallcool:


Fortunately for Heimer players, League of Legends has no shortage of schmucks.

[Math_Mage]

Go back to Counter-Strike. :smalltongue:

No, seriously, though. I know lots of folks think that about Heimerdinger, but that's because there's so few good Heimerdingers out there! I promise you, he's much much much more effective than folks think. I'll have to make a point of showing you that some time. :smallamused:

Well, what are the virtues you mentioned? Farms well, pushes hard, has good range, good CC, zone denial, can build tanky. I could play Anivia and get all that with better damage output, better teamfighting, and less dependence on a stationary fight. The only real downside is that I can't hit turrets with my spells, and I'm slightly more dependent on blue.

I don't think Heimer is USELESS. I just think he's outclassed for most of the uses to which one could put him.

I'm willing to volunteer for a 1v1, but I'm no AP mid main. Besides, most mages are better at both supporting and escaping ganks than Heimer.

[Tergon]

My default summoner abilities with Heimerdinger are Flash and Heal. And I'll concede that without those, I'd die a LOT more with him. But with those, I will argue cheerfully my ability to stand up to any other hero you care to throw at him. Yes, he's not all that good at ganking, but there are four whole players on your team who are more than capable of doing that. Heimerdinger's best tactic is to simply charge down your lane, laying turrets and farming creeps, right up to the tower. And trust me, with two gun turrets and a few creeps, he can take down those towers FAST. He ignores enemy champions simply because he can! And if someone else is there, well, slows and stuns will let Heimer help make it into an easy kill.

Not every champion has to be a ganker, or able to get twenty kills per game. I regularly get single-digit kills but almost never drop below 15 assists in a game. And if we agree that Heimerdinger can farm like a boss, take down towers easily, and is difficult to actually kill... well, what more do you need? That is the point of the game, after all. And all I can say is that either I'm some kind of supernaturally lucky freak, or else there's some merit to what I'm saying - because I find him to be pretty damned effective in almost any game I play him.

[Qwertystop]

So I feel the need to vent something here. Hope nobody minds.

I like Heimerdinger. A lot. He’s probably my single favourite League Champion… and yet it’s so obvious that many people don’t agree. Not only by how rarely I see him played, but also by the fact that, well, folks abuse me for choosing him sometimes. It sort of saddens me, really.

See, here’s what turns most people off Heimerdinger: he doesn’t get kills. His abilities include a low-damage skillshot, an instant shot that hits whatever three targets are closest to you, an autonomous turret that shoots what it likes, and two passives. No nukes, little damage, and unless you’re really paying attention, not much use. Especially if you’re a slow, squishy mage with low autoattack, which is basically going to mean you suck at PvP. Which in turn means that yes, people are right, he doesn’t get kills easily.
So, the obvious solution? Don’t try to. I mean, think about it. A high killscore will not win you a game of League. Killing towers, inhibitors, and the enemy nexus will do that, and nothing else will. Sure, killing champions will help, but how? Why, by giving you gold, experience, and removing the opposition. And if you had a champion who could farm effortlessly, gain experience rapidly, and had no reason to fear the enemy… logically you wouldn’t need to get kills in the first place, now would you?

So what can Heimerdinger do? Well, thanks to his turrets, he can autoattack two separate targets at once, or the same target two times simultaneously. That goes up to three with enough levels, and when splash damage comes in, even a backed-up swarm of minions takes him about two seconds. He needs no other abilities or autoattacks to farm with incredible profit and ease. So clearly, he doesn’t need to worry about that. Hell, he can keep farming heavily while he’s back at the nexus buying gear, something that literally nobody else can claim they’re able to do. And as for worrying about enemy champions, well, what can they really do to him? Walk up and hit him while being peppered by his turrets and creeps? Because he will always have creeps, I promise, with the speed at which he takes down enemy waves. With his stun grenades to hold you there while you die, nobody’s really going to have much luck attempting that. Ganks are only a sure thing if the enemy has made themselves vulnerable, and since Heimerdinger sets up a heavily-armed base everywhere he goes, he’s never really all that vulnerable at all in the laning stages. The only tactic that’s likely to do anything is hanging back and harassing him from a distance and, well, he’ll be at the rear of his mob of creeps lobbing rockets and grenades right back. With that rolling wave of creeps and turrets, he’s easily one of the best pushers you’ll ever see early-to-mid game.

Yes, I know, there are those who aren’t impressed by this. He can farm well and is hard to gank? Why, I’m sure that you play champs like that all the time! And yeah, you probably do, I don’t doubt it. Sure, he might take the occasional tower early game, but you’ll use that time to feed and late game, you’ll be a terrifying force that will send the enemy flying, which is something Heimerdinger will never really be able to do. Instead, he’ll have incredible CC and splash damage, slows, stuns and blinds, as well as quite decent damage for anyone who gets within range, to say nothing of his aura which heals allied units of all types – including towers, which nobody else in the game can boast. Which makes him, if you think about it for even a second, a pretty damn fantastic Support. He can hold almost any position with a tower to back him up, even against a full enemy push – not forever, maybe, but long enough for backup to get there. During the counter-push he can set up fallback points and defensive positions for the team to wait in for the next creep wave, or to run through if they need to escape enemy hunters. And all those folks who are saying that they’d still kill him easily, please, I invite you to try. Walk up and whack him with your lamp-post, Jax, see what happens. It’ll go something along the lines of turret-stun-turret-rocket-ult. And if you were wondering why Heimerdinger bought himself a suit of Thornmail midgame, well, your rapidly-vanishing health bar is the reason why.
Seriously, you want comedy? Get Heimerdinger some Thornmail, stand in the open between your gun turrets, and let the gankers come to you to die. It is hilarious. And it’s also a fully legitimate tactic – you’re aware of the concept of ‘leading’ your enemy into a trap? Heimerdinger is, himself, a walking trap for enemy champions. He’s the king of schmuck bait. It’s actually one of the easiest and most effective ways for him to get kills in the first place, by letting enemy gankers kill themselves on him.

Added up… well, there you have an awesome pusher early game, an awesome support late game, who’s very nearly impossible to gank, farms like a boss, and takes the idea of playing defensively to such a high level that he can use it offensively instead. And yet, just today, a Master Yi on my team found it necessary to call me a “noobfag” (whatever that is) seven times in champion selection for even suggesting that I might go Heimerdinger, before I’d even locked him in. And when the rest of the team encouraged me to select Heimerdinger, he ranted to the other team about how he was clearly the only smart player and the game was already over. Sadly, when you disconnected in an explosion of impotent rage, you’d only had time to get one kill and die four times, so we would never see you reach that full potential (for the record, I was 3 kills 0 deaths at the time).

All in all, if you feel like TL;DR’ing that mess up there, let me sum it up for you neatly. If you agree with my dear friend Master Yi, that Heimerdinger’s high difficulty and low killscore make him useless in a match, please… do us all a favour.
Go back to Counter-Strike, you massive, massive tool.

Thank you.

Well, I agree with you in theory. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to make it actually work. What runes, masteries, and items do you use, and what order do you skill in? It sounds like you use grenade a lot more than me.

[Math_Mage]

Heimerdinger's best tactic is to simply charge down your lane, laying turrets and farming creeps, right up to the tower.

Okay, here's the problem. You're handing the enemy free XP and gold, probably not denying any mage significantly, and setting yourself up to get ganked. And your only defenses against a gank are blind-stun and summoners, because your turrets are set up where ult won't help.

Most of us are past the point where we think a champion's worth is determined by his ability to get fed on kills. I'm not saying you're a noob Heimer who thinks he can play this gosh-darned game without killing people, though your team comp will hurt for lack of a burst mage in fights.

[Joran]

I don't think Heimer is USELESS. I just think he's outclassed for most of the uses to which one could put him.


Also, Heimerdinger's a lousy inventor who is outclassed by at least 2 other inventors on the Fields of Justice.

[Eldariel]

Yeah, Heimer's fine. There's a few team comps where he absolutely shines (he's one of the best ways to take early Barons and Dragons due to his midgame area control power and obscene repeatable damage) and he's a decent mid overall; overshadowed in most team comps by other alternatives and hard to learn but still fine.

He can actually kill people alright; his damage is in the Twisted Fate class without turrets which is not a bad place to be at. And with turrets he actually hurts a lot. He isn't a burst mage nor is he an AP carry but he's a utility mage with decent damage and is in no ways unviable, to be sure. I think Dan Dinh's little Heimer escapades showcased the incredible strength he has in the right teamcomps.


Also, little fact your dear Master Yi forgot; the level he plays on is the same level where it's completely possible to carry games with Evelynn if you play well enough. Champion choice really doesn't hold a candle to skill on the champion you've chosen until way, way later when everybody is extremely good with the champions they play and absolute masters only have small edges.

[Tergon]

Oh, please don't think my rants are directed at the folks here. It was venting a little frustration by shouting at the invisible spectre of the douchebag who annoyed me, there's absolutely no personal digs going on here, nor claims that my Vast Superiority is Vastly Vast. I'm more than willing to accept that there are plenty of people here who could match me as Heimerdinger, or straight-up beat me. My complaint is with those who consider him to be a sub-par champion.

You're right, of course, in that Heimerdinger is no replacement for a powerful burst mage. My counter is simply that he should never be viewed as such. He's a mage in that he uses abilities more than autoattacks and AP more than any other stat, but beyond that? His turrets are his main weapon and they do a hybrid of physical and magic damage, and once cast they cost zero mana to sit there cheerfully until he drops another one. Otherwise he just lobs the occasional grenade or rocket and concentrates on getting last hits. It requires decent placement of turrets, both in matters of timing and location, but that's not hard to figure out.
Provided you pay attention, and especially with Flash and Heal as your abilities, ganking him is nearly impossible. It can be done, but mostly it requires you to do something stupid. It's about using defensive play in an aggressive manner - advance your wall of turrets and creeps and always have something to fall back to. A ganker will have to run into a storm of bullets to attack, and when they do, Heimer will be waiting there and more than capable of fighting back.

He's not unbeatable, far from it! But I've found him to be a quite reasonable match for any opponent 1v1, a fantastic base defender lategame, and a very handy support player for your team toward the end. His strength is in his flexibility, and the fact that he can duck in to fill multiple roles without a fuss, as opposed to all those nukers and burst mages who can only attack and atttack some more.

[Tergon]

Sorry for the double post...


Well, I agree with you in theory. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to make it actually work. What runes, masteries, and items do you use, and what order do you skill in? It sounds like you use grenade a lot more than me.

Magic penetration reds, mana regen yellows, mana boosting blues, and AP boosting quins. Early game, the boost to your turrets is terrifyingly effective: their power is to deal low damage with rapid-fire shots. Boosting that damage even slightly makes them deadly, and the mana boosters give you far greater sustainability.
Masteries I focus mainly on utility. Again, mana regen is important, and he relies on his Summoner Abilities to evade ganks (I prefer Flash and Heal, like I said). Some in defence won't hurt either. But the general rule that I follow is that Heim's priority early game is sustainability and survival, as he can already farm with ease, and there's not a need for him to actively chase kills yet.

For skills, I throw the first point into turrets and the second into his grenades. From there, upgrading his turrets always has first priority, upgrading his rockets has second, and upgrading grenades has third. And his ult should obviously be given points whenever the chance comes up, like most heroes.
I do use grenades a lot while playing, but I don't prioritise upgrading that skill after the first point. Their biggest advantage is the stun / blind effect, and that works just as well at level one as it does at level five. Frankly, his rockets do a LOT more damage if you can time their usage right.

Concentrate on putting your turrets in the right spot, ideally right were creep waves will meet, or if they're already engaged, put them in the middle of the caster creeps to ward off the enemy champ. As long as it doesn't die, it'll be there as a fallback point after the next wave goes down, getting the most possible use out of each turret.

And above all, micromanage. If your abilities and skills are all on cooldown, or your mana is low, play cautious. You can avoid almost any gank if you're got the spells to throw at someone who runs in at you. If they're on cooldown, hover around your gun turrets and be prepared to duck back safely if they push. More than once I've had someone gank me near my autoturrets, chase me back to the tower, and then walk off... right back to where my autoturrets are still waiting. I've earned many kills that way.

He's a tough champion to learn, but for my money, he's VERY worth it. And since his playstyle is so unique, he's difficult to counter. So many DPS champs will run up for what looks like an easy kill to get shredded by his turrets. Tanks will charge in confident in their magic resistance, only to find themselves stunned and gunned while Heimer runs around avoiding their attacks. Truly good Heimerdingers are so rare that most folks just don't know how to fight one. Use that to your advantage!

[Math_Mage]

Okay, completely different subject, I'm unable to connect from Mumble because I'm on a new computer: it's the known issue. Can an admin kill my old connection so I can get on, please? Thanks much. :smallredface:

[Maeglin_Dubh]

Mages for top?

Ryze, Swain, maybe Annie?

[Math_Mage]

Mages for top?

Ryze, Swain, maybe Annie?

Kennen, Vlad, Rumble are the first to come to mind. Other mages can go top as well, but the major problem with most mages top is that they lack mobility in a long gankable lane. Those three have excellent escapability.

[tyckspoon]

Mages for top?

Ryze, Swain

Kennen/Vlad/Rumble, like Math Mage said, would be my choices for a blind/generic top. Ryze and Swain I would consider for counter/late picks top, when you're fairly sure you have a good matchup, otherwise I would assume they're running mid. Both of them require some quantity of levels and items to take off, and a good early-aggressor bruiser can completely eat you before you get that farm. Also, Swain wants Blue buff very very badly, and you aren't likely to get it without pre-arranging your team to let you have it; jungler and then mid-mage take priority in most people's minds.

[Psyborg]

Bug: In spectator mode, the post-game statistics page shows all summoners' Summoner Icon as the first one in the list, the...blue seige or promote minion, I believe, rather than their correct icon.

[Edit:]Bug: In spectator mode, only maximum three digits of AP are shown. This can cause confusion regarding lategame Veigar and Suicide Karthus with >1k AP. (I suppose Atma's Sion and Bloodthirster-stacking Riven and Malphite are also potential sources of confusion...if extremely unlikely ones.)

[Edit2:]
Also, Swain wants Blue buff very very badly, and you aren't likely to get it without pre-arranging your team to let you have it; jungler and then mid-mage take priority in most people's minds.

Not necessarily. At least for people who've ever played them, or have friends who have or do, blue buff priority is basically: Kassadin > Swain > AP Kog > Anivia > Karthus > Cassio > All others.

[Edit3]Bug: Alt+Tab-ing out of the loading screen for spectator mode crashes the client every time. I do it out of the loading screens for my own games all the time with no issues. Let me know if you need system specs.

[Tergon]

If you're familiar with him, Gragas can also be highly effective soloing top. He's got great staying power and he's hard to take down, and his barrels can take out entire waves of creeps no fuss. Though he can be difficult unless you're very used to his style. Otherwise, yeah, Kennen and Vlad would be my two picks.

[PersonMan]

One of the problems with Heimer is that you need your team to coordinate to win fights. If, say, your team constantly runs into fights while you're still far away, leaving you with no chance to do anything other than Rockets->Grenade to try and cover the escape of a survivor on your side, you can't really do much for them. Other mages can just rush into a fight with their team and burst, but Heimer can only do his 'oh, you didn't want to have negative armor and MR? Sorry.' thing if he can set up his turrets early in the fight or before it starts.

But the good part is that, if the enemy really really needs to get something, you can make them pay more than other mages. This is especially useful in Dominion (quadra kill <3).

Oh, and he has the standard Pusher thing going for him. If the enemy shuts you down early, you can just farm sidelanes until you can utterly wreck anyone who says 'ooh, Heimer! I think I'll kill him!', at least if they're melee.

I don't really know what my runes are (I know I have a single +0.42% crit chance rune, though, like all my other non-AD pages), but I have something like 20/0/10 for the spellvamp in Utility (Archmage is pretty meh until you're basically at full build). I start with turrets, getting rockets next, then grenade. I level turrets to 3, then rockets a few times, then max out turrets.

I haven't actually played Heimer in a while. I think I might go for another Camperdinger Dominion game today (my last one ended up with me getting fed by accidentally pressing R every other minute and getting way more kills than I expected to and then quadra kill).

Interestingly enough, the 'I'm a melee AD and want you to die' effect is one of the reasons I always build spellvamp on Heimer. You can be a fake squishy (that is, you look squishy but regen most of your health with your tons of damage), which is the best kind of squishy. Apart from the ones that just hang out at the edge of fights and bait enemies into getting double killed by a fed AD.

[toasty]

Mages for top?

Ryze, Swain, maybe Annie?

Ryze is alright, no escapes make him tough, Ryze is also rather blue reliant mid-game.

Swain is good, again, somewhat blue reliant but he's not terrible. I played against a good AP swain middle and the ability to zone people out is BRUTAL when played correctly.

My pefered APs top are Galio and Vlad. You probably have to build a little more tanky because... you're playing top lane, but both are really good top if you know how to control the minion wave. Galio himself is really a tank/mage and don't feel bad if you rush a Frozen heart on him, its not a terrible idea.

Rumble is good. Kennen is good. AP Nidalee is still good (!) for poke comps. I think Gragas is a good top but I haven't seen anyone play him a while. Again, probably need to build a little tanky, but you have massive sustain and being melee isn't a huge deal against most heroes that are played top.

Someone once said that Cass is good top, and honestly, Anivia is probably good top (if she wasn't so Blue reliant I would swear she is). Ahri might do alright top I feel. Morgana too.

Honestly, most heroes are viable solo top. The only problem is ganks and lane matchups. In fact, this is entirely what all of laning is about. Its not "is this hero viable in X lane?" its "I'm going against X, can I beat him? What if I get ganked?" That's why I think certain AD heroes are probably viable top and I really want to get off my ass and get better at playing them.

[Eldariel]

Someone once said that Cass is good top, and honestly, Anivia is probably good top (if she wasn't so Blue reliant I would swear she is). Ahri might do alright top I feel. Morgana too.

Hi.

And yeah, if I need to just win toplane I like to run Cassiopeia since she's the ultimate bruiser destroyer in the game. Karthus is something Fnatic likes to run a lot on top too (since they play dual AP basically always) and it seems to work quite well provided you've got aiming down with Lay Wastes and Wall of Pains.

Since it doesn't matter where Karthus lanes with regards to his global presence, putting him on top where he can shred low range bruisers with infinite Lay Waste spam works pretty well.

[Tergon]

Also at the risk of being redundant... Heimerdinger is pretty good solo top as well. He can certainly hold a tower against two opponents easily and get lots and lots of last hits, and against one opponent as long as he wards middle he's got no reason to be scared of anything.

[PersonMan]

Mages for top?

Ryze, Swain, maybe Annie?

Malphite.

What do you mean Malphite isn't a mage? He's a semi-burst/semi-sustained damage armor caster.

Kassadin is someone who I prefer to play top or bot, so you can bushcamp and RQW harass enemies away from minions whenever you feel like they're getting too aggressive. Pushes the lane if you hit the minions, though.

[Talesin]

Malphite.

What do you mean Malphite isn't a mage? He's a semi-burst/semi-sustained damage armor caster.

Kassadin is someone who I prefer to play top or bot, so you can bushcamp and RQW harass enemies away from minions whenever you feel like they're getting too aggressive. Pushes the lane if you hit the minions, though.

Lost a game yesterday against a Malphite who just ate our Fiora top. They had Soraka, Ashe, Malphite, Nunu jungling and Karthus mid. I was playing Kog and more or less every team fight resulted in Malphite and Nunu going straight for me and just having me permaslowed between their two Qs and Nunu's ult.

I also had another game top as GP against Olaf. I won the lane easily killing him 3 times in the first 10 minutes. I brought the crit cloak and a phage to try and offensively snowball the game to a win by ganking other lanes and getting back to my lane to farm before my turret took any of the minions.

We ended up winning and I had the highest gold in the game but olaf really came back towards the end. He just sat top and farmed a huge amount of CS while I was off doing other things. When I tried to gank him he'd just ult and ghost away.

After the game I had a discussion with my friend and he said when I play mid and top I tend to win the lane early game and net a few kills, but then mess it up mid game while other people create a victory out it, and then come good again late game.

[PersonMan]

Lost a game yesterday against a Malphite who just ate our Fiora top. They had Soraka, Ashe, Malphite, Nunu jungling and Karthus mid. I was playing Kog and more or less every team fight resulted in Malphite and Nunu going straight for me and just having me permaslowed between their two Qs and Nunu's ult.

Yeah, Malphite is really brutal when you're playing someone who needs positioning like Kog does. In a fight he can just WREQ1 you, smack you a bit and then finish you with another E unless you're especially tanky or can kill him quickly, which often isn't possible.

Top I notice that he really gets better around level 4 or so, in part because at that point the other laner gets aggressive and you can just say 'no, I'm going to win this fight'. (Then again, I go against a lot of stupid tops when I play Malph. Once I was top against Lee Sin - big potential problem. Noc and I manage to kill him in a gank and only 3 minutes later he fights me in the bush closer to my turret. Alright, I think. Better not ult him, he's just going to shield-dash away after we exchange some smacks. Then he shields himself. Turns out that he seriously just tried to 1v1 me minutes after I got a 300 gold advantage. My response was to kill him, just rushing right back up to him when he kicked me away and ran.)


When I tried to gank him he'd just ult and ghost away.

Solution to this is the same one as 'he flashes away'. Unless he waits for cooldowns to push, just gank a bit more often.


After the game I had a discussion with my friend and he said when I play mid and top I tend to win the lane early game and net a few kills, but then mess it up mid game while other people create a victory out it, and then come good again late game.

Well, I primarily play Malphite or Galio (or Kennen, maybe) when I top, which means that I can make a massive difference by doing the whole 'fed bruiser initiator' thing i.e. rush in, burst and do a bunch of damage, be invincible and beat up the enemy team until my team helps me finish them off.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Okay, completely different subject, I'm unable to connect from Mumble because I'm on a new computer: it's the known issue. Can an admin kill my old connection so I can get on, please? Thanks much. :smallredface:

Sure. I'll do this later today.

[LordShotGun]

So I am curious. With the new ryze changes, why wouldn't you just stack rod of ages on him? The unique passive is relatively unneeded and it gives him everything he wants now.

I actually saw this in play one time and a 4000 hp ryze is a scary thing when combined with just a chain mail and a negatron cloak.

I understand that you may want a banshee's veil instead but how useful is the spell shield? Honestly.

I have never seen it change the out come of battles and by the time it is actually complete, team fights are occurring and the spell shield may save you from a 200-300 damage nuke (at best unless it is popped by the support) while a RoA would be giving you an extra 600 health and massively more damage from the AP and mana.

Edit: Thinking about this more. I realize that while stacking RoA would be nice on ryze, he just needs other items to reach his full potential. For example, tear of the goddess would be next (if not before) and possibly now archangel staff instead.

[ex cathedra]

So I am curious. With the new ryze changes, why wouldn't you just stack rod of ages on him? The unique passive is relatively unneeded and it gives him everything he wants now.

I actually saw this in play one time and a 4000 hp ryze is a scary thing when combined with just a chain mail and a negatron cloak.

I understand that you may want a banshee's veil instead but how useful is the spell shield? Honestly.

I have never seen it change the out come of battles and by the time it is actually complete, team fights are occurring and the spell shield may save you from a 200-300 damage nuke (at best unless it is popped by the support) while a RoA would be giving you an extra 600 health and massively more damage from the AP and mana.

Because... of MR.
Like, duh. I hear that mages spend a lot of the game fighting other mages.

RoA has the disadvantage of being awkward to build. Ryze's extended core takes a while to build already and there are a great deal of situations where turning that Cata or Negatron (depending) into RoA isn't as attractive as, say, finishing Frozen Heart or WotA. BVeil doesn't have that timer. You can hold on to that negatron cloak for 15 minutes and it'll do everything it needs to do. RoA forces you to finish it early, and that's hard enough considering that it isn't as much of a priority as boots, glacial shroud, or tear.

Resistances are also more useful than health at a great deal of expected health vs resist levels, and that's before taking the massive amount of eHP you get from Spellvamp into account. On Ryze, the spell-shield is a secondary effect. He wants the mana, the health, and most importantly the MR. Why? Because MR is cool and MR saves lives. A thought process that begins with "I need MR!" shouldn't end with Rod of Ages.

Also, anecdotal evidence and all that. I can easily retort with the dozens of times I've seen people denied a kill by BVeil's shield restore after a drawn-out fight.

[toasty]

Here's the thing about stacking RoA:
Its not actually that good, even on heroes that the stats are good.

The truth is, you need a balance of stats. Like, you NEED that. You NEED MR, you NEED armor. That's why Ryze gets Bveil/Glacial Shroud. If you're Ryze middle, getting a Bveil makes it very easy to win your lane. There is a reason that Ryze and Galio are so strong middle right now: they naturally counter AP Heroes with their tanky builds. My galio page is basically all MR. That's it. I then get Mercs and Chalice and second focus my W, no one can trade with me. Sure, some heroes, like Morde and Vlad and probably Ryze (Galio v Ryze would be fun; all the tank!) are unkillable without serious ganks, but for the most part you just sit there and farm and push and try to gank then.

[fred dref]

Regarding Heimerdinger, the one I faced recently was basically carrying his entire team. He noticed that I was a 4/0/0 Olaf, so he went top and just completely zoned me for a while (I had lots of armor and a bit of health, not so much MR). Well, he zoned me from kills, not creeps, I was too far ahead for that to happen.

Later, though, we noticed them taking Baron and ran right over to stop them, but man we did not think about how we were walking into a teamfight where Heimerdinger had already set up turrets, and without any of our minions nearby he just kinda shredded us to pieces.

I found him fairly easy to gank as Olaf, btw, for what it's worth. If he can only escape by using summoners, gank him, force him to blow Flash, then go farm Wraith's for 5 seconds as his turrets push up again and walk right back to kill him.

[Temotei]

Bug: On the profile under the Champions tab, many champions won't appear. There doesn't seem to be a pattern. Switching to the Available champions and then back to All gave me several more champions to view, but a lot are still missing.

Images: http://i.imgur.com/VsqSq.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/O8y6a.jpg

[Psyborg]

Bug: On the profile under the Champions tab, many champions won't appear. There doesn't seem to be a pattern. Switching to the Available champions and then back to All gave me several more champions to view, but a lot are still missing.

I've had this happen a few times. No idea what causes it but it's extremely annoying.

Regarding Ryze, well, he's still going to want Frozen Heart because A) complete blue-buff-independence is an amazing thing for any mage, and B) the aura is extremely powerful lategame.

And BVeil _can_ change the outcome of a fight- flashing in front of my carry to tank an Ashe arrow or Fizz fishyult has won me many fights. But I wouldn't complain about seeing a Ryze with Abyssal Scepter rather than BVeil for magic resist- flat-magic-pen is already a strong build on him with his E, and if the PBE version of Haunting Guise goes through (45AP, 20 spell pen, 7% movespeed) it'll be even better.

[toasty]

And BVeil _can_ change the outcome of a fight- flashing in front of my carry to tank an Ashe arrow or Fizz fishyult has won me many fights. But I wouldn't complain about seeing a Ryze with Abyssal Scepter rather than BVeil for magic resist- flat-magic-pen is already a strong build on him with his E, and if the PBE version of Haunting Guise goes through (45AP, 20 spell pen, 7% movespeed) it'll be even better.

That was reverted. :(

[Psyborg]

That was reverted. :(

I knew it hadn't made it to live yet, but I had hopes we'd see it soon. If they reverted it on PBE, though...:smallfrown: Oh well. Flat-pen is still strong on Ryze (especially with his E now being more useful in its own right).

I'd actually been wondering about running Ryze + Battle Soraka solos for double-AP + double-WotA + double-MR-shred. It'd be absurdly strong in prolonged fights, but the combination of short range, low burst, and the fact that I don't know any Battle Soraka players means I've never actually tried it.

Question: How does Vayne fare against Graves in lane, particularly the dreaded Graves/Soraka lane?

I'm a longtime Vayne player, and lately I've been having a lot of success against Graves, which seems odd given his tankiness and burst. I had been assuming I just had more experience in that specific matchup than most of the Graves I faced, but yesterday I saw Chaox on stream pick Vayne into a Graves/Raka lane and proceed to do basically the same thing (only with a lot higher CS :smallamused:). So now I'm wondering if Vayne is a legitimately strong pick in those circumstances.

Also, Question 2: What does the Playground recommend maxing first on Vayne? I always start QE, and after that max W if with Nunu (since he gives a giant AS steroid) and E if with Alistar/Blitzcrank (since they excel at setting up wall stuns). What should I be focusing the rest of the time?

[fred dref]

Almost always focus Q. Like, very rarely focus anything else. Q is really good.

Condemn is good to max in lane if you can get reliable wallstuns, Silver Bolts is good if you cannot and can reliably land 3 hits on a dude. It really depends on the lane, but I think the cooldown reduction on Condemn might be more generally useful.

[Qwertystop]

Sorry for the double post...



Magic penetration reds, mana regen yellows, mana boosting blues, and AP boosting quins. Early game, the boost to your turrets is terrifyingly effective: their power is to deal low damage with rapid-fire shots. Boosting that damage even slightly makes them deadly, and the mana boosters give you far greater sustainability.
Masteries I focus mainly on utility. Again, mana regen is important, and he relies on his Summoner Abilities to evade ganks (I prefer Flash and Heal, like I said). Some in defence won't hurt either. But the general rule that I follow is that Heim's priority early game is sustainability and survival, as he can already farm with ease, and there's not a need for him to actively chase kills yet.

For skills, I throw the first point into turrets and the second into his grenades. From there, upgrading his turrets always has first priority, upgrading his rockets has second, and upgrading grenades has third. And his ult should obviously be given points whenever the chance comes up, like most heroes.
I do use grenades a lot while playing, but I don't prioritise upgrading that skill after the first point. Their biggest advantage is the stun / blind effect, and that works just as well at level one as it does at level five. Frankly, his rockets do a LOT more damage if you can time their usage right.

Concentrate on putting your turrets in the right spot, ideally right were creep waves will meet, or if they're already engaged, put them in the middle of the caster creeps to ward off the enemy champ. As long as it doesn't die, it'll be there as a fallback point after the next wave goes down, getting the most possible use out of each turret.

And above all, micromanage. If your abilities and skills are all on cooldown, or your mana is low, play cautious. You can avoid almost any gank if you're got the spells to throw at someone who runs in at you. If they're on cooldown, hover around your gun turrets and be prepared to duck back safely if they push. More than once I've had someone gank me near my autoturrets, chase me back to the tower, and then walk off... right back to where my autoturrets are still waiting. I've earned many kills that way.

He's a tough champion to learn, but for my money, he's VERY worth it. And since his playstyle is so unique, he's difficult to counter. So many DPS champs will run up for what looks like an easy kill to get shredded by his turrets. Tanks will charge in confident in their magic resistance, only to find themselves stunned and gunned while Heimer runs around avoiding their attacks. Truly good Heimerdingers are so rare that most folks just don't know how to fight one. Use that to your advantage!

Is it worth hanging around towers to heal them? I know it really helps in laning, but afterward?

[Talesin]

Bug

If you're on the spectator client and you reply to a friend by pressing enter, typing /r hitting space and then starting to type your message it cuts off the first letter.

[Reinboom]

I will be closing the bug submission things now, I need to hand these off to QA. :smallsmile:
They will inform me which are dupes and which aren't. I'll figure out who gets the reward in a couple days.

Of course, any more bug submissions are welcome. Just not part of the contest thingy.

[Tergon]

Is it worth hanging around towers to heal them? I know it really helps in laning, but afterward?

You're right that it helps in laning. The tactic of chipping away at a tower by landing a few hits with each creep wave simply won't work on Heim. He can quite cheerfully farm gold and experience at his tower until he's ready to push back - it's what makes him so effective against two opponents when solo laning top.
Once you're out of that phase, though, the use drops dramatically. It just takes too long to heal a tower in any meaningful way, and while that's always helpful, it's most likely that there are other places you could be at that point. Certainly it's helpful to position Heimerdinger at a damaged tower to defend it against pushes - he can hold it without assistance aganst two or three opponents, and he'll be healing it while he's there - but you'd rarely want to sit out of a fight for the sole purpose of healing a tower. The only time that might be handy is if your base is under heavy attack and you need to repair Inhibitor or Nexus towers, and at that point you're probably already desperate enough that you won't have much to lose.

As for his item builds, I usually (not always, natch!) get Chalice of Harmony, Mercury Treads and Morelio's Evil Tome as my first three items, in that order. They're all quite cheap to buy, and their bonuses really complement Heimer's skillset by making sure he always has that mana pool ready, increasing his MR just a little to shrug off attacks, and with his natural 20% cooldown reduction from his ult, Morelio's will max out his CR easily.
After those three, though, you gotta match it to your opponents. Generally it's a toss-up between making him tanky or increasing his damage through AP. Thornmail works great against DPS, and a Guardian Angel can make him much less attractive as a target. Rabbadon's Deathcap and the Void Staff will make your turrets shred your enemies, and your rockets will deal massive damage. Rylai's and Aegis of the Legion are nice midrange ones - increasing your use in a teamfight while making you individually harder to take down. It all depends on what you need most.

[Qwertystop]

Thanks for the tips:
http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/1315/11128602.png

The first 3 of my deaths were in laning, against Swain. At the end, my first tower had full health. They had no towers except top inhib.

[Duos]

Welp, I've got launcher problems. The launcher wouldn't move into the login screen, and I couldn't figure out what was wrong with it. I tried reinstalling the client from scratch, but it still says that it's unable to connect to the network. here's what the logs say:

05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Solid LauncherLib [1.0.0.33] initializing...
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Add App[League of Legends Launcher] Exe[C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\lol.launcher.exe] to Windows Firewall
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Retrieved dynamic path [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/LOL.Production.SourceURL.xml][http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_AddPackage([LOL.AirRuntime],[http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/],[C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Attempt to retrieve package [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/LOL.AirRuntime.package]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Version retrieved [LOL.AirRuntime] 3/3 [AirRuntime.02_18_2010_01]/[AirRuntime.02_18_2010_01] type [PACKAGE_TYPE_INCREMENTAL]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.AirRuntime] State change [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE] to [PATCHER_STATE_ALLTASKSCOMPLETE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_RemovePackage([LOL.AirRuntime]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_AddPackage([LOL.Patcher],[http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/],[C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Attempt to retrieve package [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/LOL.Patcher.package]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Version retrieved [LOL.Patcher] 18/18 [LOL.Patcher.05_03_2011_RADStransition]/[LOL.Patcher.05_03_2011_RADStransition] type [PACKAGE_TYPE_INCREMENTAL]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Patcher] State change [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE] to [PATCHER_STATE_ALLTASKSCOMPLETE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_RemovePackage([LOL.Patcher]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_AddPackage([LOL.Air],[http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/],[C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Attempt to retrieve package [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/LOL.Air.package]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Restart previous
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Start task [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/ssn/riot.ffs] [LOL.Air_93_73to93.solid] [C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\LOL.Air_p\] [C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\] [0.00/0.00]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Air] State change [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE] to [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Version retrieved [LOL.Air] 93/73 [Final]/[LOL.Air.12_13_2010] type [PACKAGE_TYPE_PROGRESSIVE_VCDIFF]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Air] State change [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE] to [PATCHER_STATE_PREPARE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Start download [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/ssn/riot.ffs]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Air_93_73to93.solid]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\LOL.Air_p\]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\]
05/02/2012 22:32 [WARNING] Download failed [TORRENTHELPER_ERROR_INVALIDMETAFILE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [WARNING] Attempt to retrieve metafile[LOL.Air/93/LOL.Air_93_73to93.solid]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Air] State change [PATCHER_STATE_PREPARE] to [PATCHER_STATE_FAILED]


If anybody can help, I would be rather grateful. If I can't play LoL, I might actually have to do something productive! PERISH the thought. But seriously, help.

[9mm]

... NEW JOURNAL OF JUSTICE! (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/story/issue-30-02-may-22-cle)

I missed these so much.

[Reynard]

Every time I log into LoL and see my 7000 ip just sitting there, I get the urge to top waiting for Varus and just get two 3150 Champs, or Jarvan and some more Ryze runes, or Lee Sin. Every day from now on, I'm going to roll a d20. If I get a 20, I'm going to not bother waiting for Varus. More dice may be involved to see what I DO get, though.


But yeah, that Journal of Justice was a nice surprise. Still letting that "Leblanc is pretending to be Jarvan" thing sit in the background, I see. Seems that, if that's accurate, Leblanc's little spy group wants to bring down the League.

[TechnOkami]

... NEW JOURNAL OF JUSTICE! (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/story/issue-30-02-may-22-cle)

I missed these so much.

SO DID I! q-q

[Math_Mage]

Glad to see we're getting nontrivial lore in the JoJ. One hopes they'll do something with that soon.

[toasty]

I had 8k IP and caved and bought some runes, Gold/10 seals for a 2nd Support-page. I now have 5k RP and I'm probably gonna wait and see if Varus is any good. If he's not I'll buy Riven. I need to learn more solo top bruiser/carries like that. Right now I feel like the only really good bruiser I can play is Udyr. I can play WW and GP, and they're alright, but they're not perfect.

[Tergon]

Thanks for the tips:
http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/1315/11128602.png

The first 3 of my deaths were in laning, against Swain. At the end, my first tower had full health. They had no towers except top inhib.

Haha, nice work! You dominated creep kills and clearly kicked butt in your lane. Bravo!



I had 8k IP and caved and bought some runes, Gold/10 seals for a 2nd Support-page. I now have 5k RP and I'm probably gonna wait and see if Varus is any good. If he's not I'll buy Riven. I need to learn more solo top bruiser/carries like that. Right now I feel like the only really good bruiser I can play is Udyr. I can play WW and GP, and they're alright, but they're not perfect.

Trundle is an under-used champ who's also a lot of fun, and he can start doing some pretty fantastic damage when used right. His only real weakness is that he can't close on the enemy very easily without ranged attacks or dynamic entries.
Depending on how you build him, Blitzcrank is a pretty effective bruiser. Hard to put down and with a whole host of abilities to disrupt an enemy who's trying to fight back, plus he can do some formidable damage.
Otherwise, yeah. Riven and WW and GP are all good choices, we just don't know much about Varus yet! :P

[Daverin]

... NEW JOURNAL OF JUSTICE! (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/story/issue-30-02-may-22-cle)

I missed these so much.

FRAAGGGLE!!! OMGWTFBBQ!!!

This is so completely awesome! If you get a chance Reina, please let Riot know that this is very appreciated. I understood their reasoning behind why they wanted to cut down, but honestly, I never thought their desired approach and the JoJ was mutually exclusive.

Now if we could just get the judgments, or some equivalent. There are definitely a few champs who I played because the judgment made them seem so interesting.

And, a bit belated, but about Zilean, I definitely understand Reina, and I always find it a good sign when a company looks for those little things to change for QoL. Still, I like to poke fun at just about everything (myself included), from time to time. :smalltongue:

[Talesin]

Gragas is such a fun character to play. I messed my build up, should've gone for Hat into Rylai's rather than WotA (was on autopilot with mage builds). We lost the game in the end but I got some compliments from my team saying that i'd played well and I thought a few clutch barrel kill I got helped our team.

Defo going to play him some more. I also repeatidly had to refresh my W at the wrong time but saying that we didn't have a single mexican style stand off. It seemed to end up with our team of 5 meeting up and a team fight starting almost instantly so my timer was off.

[Temotei]

...Zilean...from time to time. :smalltongue:

:smallamused:

I'm glad the journals are back and saying something more than "Gragas wins a drinking contest."

[Litewarior]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Gragas is much stronger in high Elo. In low to mid elo, if the two teams meet, a fight will almost certainly break out immediately, but in high elo, there will be a standoff where both teams are waiting for someone to be out of position, so Gragas can poke more often with that setup.

[Tergon]

I occasionally like to play Gragas as a tanky bruiser rather than an AP caster, just for the fun of it. It's not as dumb as it sounds, either - he has a massive natural health pool, great health regeneration, he can charge in and out of close range fights easily, and with his Drunken Rage he's surprisingly hard to take down, and his hits hurt. Give him a Warmog's, a Sunfire Cape and a Force of Nature and he suddenly becomes virtually unkillable. Then give him some damage and movement speed, and you'd be impressed by the result!
I mean, yeah, it's nowhere near as optimal as his mage build, but damn if it's not fun as hell.

[Eldariel]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Gragas is much stronger in high Elo. In low to mid elo, if the two teams meet, a fight will almost certainly break out immediately, but in high elo, there will be a standoff where both teams are waiting for someone to be out of position, so Gragas can poke more often with that setup.

Eh, it's more that high elo teams know how to play to their team comp's strengths so they (often) try and enable poking for poke champs for instance (unless you have those "AP Nidalee is useless"-people on your team; unfortunately they exist too). The standoffs do occur but it's less of a standoff and more of a team pushing a tower and the other team being in a strong enough defensive position that the attack gets parried; poke teams on the other hand generally setup slow pushes where enemy cannot come out from under their towers due to the damage they would take, and then slowly and methodically whittle down the defense via. poke or poke/heal. Of course, this means they need to play in a manner that negates enemy initiation; a proper initiation "counters" poking, but it's hard to execute against skilled players employing poke.

[ex cathedra]

Bug:
It's possible (via hackz, yo) to allocate more than the normal limit of points into any given mastery, resulting in people with 105% Summoner spell (http://i.imgur.com/T1dme.jpg) cooldown reduction. (http://i.imgur.com/H8UCs.jpg)

I feel like the GITP community bug reports are going to take a bit of back seat to this problem. :smallwink:

It's been going around for a few days and people are climbing the ladder with it; several, at the very least, are already 1900+ because of it.

[LordShotGun]

Bug:
It's possible (via hackz, yo) to allocate more than the normal limit of points into any given mastery, resulting in people with 105% Summoner spell (http://i.imgur.com/T1dme.jpg) cooldown reduction. (http://i.imgur.com/H8UCs.jpg)

I feel like the GITP community bug reports are going to take a bit of back seat to this problem. :smallwink:

It's been going around for a few days and people are climbing the ladder with it; several, at the very least, are already 1900+ because of it.

Huh, so that explains my last several losses. I don't care that I made some bad plays or had poor teammates. I WAS HACKED!!!

[Qwertystop]

Bug:
It's possible (via hackz, yo) to allocate more than the normal limit of points into any given mastery, resulting in people with 105% Summoner spell (http://i.imgur.com/T1dme.jpg) cooldown reduction. (http://i.imgur.com/H8UCs.jpg)

I feel like the GITP community bug reports are going to take a bit of back seat to this problem. :smallwink:

It's been going around for a few days and people are climbing the ladder with it; several, at the very least, are already 1900+ because of it.

Not to mention that the person actually has more than 30 mastery points spent.

[ex cathedra]

Not to mention that the person actually has more than 30 mastery points spent.

Let's see...
1... plus 1... plus 28... is greater than 30?


Huh, so that explains my last several losses. I don't care that I made some bad plays or had poor teammates. I WAS HACKED!!!

Seems legit.

At least ladder play is disabled now. Still, kind of a silly problem.

edit:

oh man I think that I'm supposed to start decaying this weekend. And I can't queue for ranked because of this. :smallfrown:

[PersonMan]

As for his item builds, I usually (not always, natch!) get Chalice of Harmony, Mercury Treads and Morelio's Evil Tome as my first three items, in that order. They're all quite cheap to buy, and their bonuses really complement Heimer's skillset by making sure he always has that mana pool ready, increasing his MR just a little to shrug off attacks, and with his natural 20% cooldown reduction from his ult, Morelio's will max out his CR easily.
After those three, though, you gotta match it to your opponents. Generally it's a toss-up between making him tanky or increasing his damage through AP. Thornmail works great against DPS, and a Guardian Angel can make him much less attractive as a target. Rabbadon's Deathcap and the Void Staff will make your turrets shred your enemies, and your rockets will deal massive damage. Rylai's and Aegis of the Legion are nice midrange ones - increasing your use in a teamfight while making you individually harder to take down. It all depends on what you need most.

My usual build is different: Until Chalice builds into something, it's not worth much late game, so I build an early Tear instead of it. I go for Sorc Shoes, Tear, Hextech Revolver and then Rylai's. After that I go for Void Staff and eventually Derpcap. I build Revolver into WotA and Tear into AA Staff in the end, or earlier, depending.

I sometimes switch Void Staff for Abyssal Sceptre or a similar item.

[Reynard]

Bug:
It's possible (via hackz, yo) to allocate more than the normal limit of points into any given mastery, resulting in people with 105% Summoner spell (http://i.imgur.com/T1dme.jpg) cooldown reduction. (http://i.imgur.com/H8UCs.jpg)

I feel like the GITP community bug reports are going to take a bit of back seat to this problem. :smallwink:

It's been going around for a few days and people are climbing the ladder with it; several, at the very least, are already 1900+ because of it.

I like that he tried to edit the images to hide his name, but failed quite spectacularly to get rid of the GIANT NAME in the first image, and the little one above his portrait on the second.

[ex cathedra]

I like that he tried to edit the images to hide his name, but failed quite spectacularly to get rid of the GIANT NAME in the first image, and the little one above his portrait on the second.

I assumed that someone else took a screen shot of his profile and edited their information out of it. That explains why there isn't a Reset Mastery Points button, etc.

You know that you can look at other people's profile and mastery pages, right? the number of derpy posts regarding those screenshots is making me doubt myself. suddenly 1+1+28=31 and that dude just photoshopped the edit masteries buttons out of his profile and junk

Anyways, spectator mode is still the coolest. Dyrus and Xpecial are on the same team in normals, and they're getting 10-0'd by the enemy quintuple bruiser comp. Wukong/Shen/Irelia/Lee Sin/Jarvan IV. Seems legit indeed.

[Volatar]

Spectator mode just brough me back to LoL, and man, is it awesome.

[Qwertystop]

Let's see...
1... plus 1... plus 28... is greater than 30?

No.
1 in Offense summoner spell mastery
1 in Defense summoner spell mastery
1 in Utility summoner spell mastery
3 in whatever the Utility purple thing is
17 in the Utility movespeed one
7 in the Utility capstone

1+1+1+3+17+7=....


Never mind, i had a brainfart...

[Reinboom]

Bug: Hack

:smallfrown:
Someone missed the client/server directive here. This makes me sad. We're fixing it.

[toasty]

:smallfrown:
Someone missed the client/server directive here. This makes me sad. We're fixing it.

Its sad because I can't play Ranked, so I have no motivation to play LoL, but its good because I don't want to lose to crap like this. :smalltongue:

[Duos]

Welp, I've got launcher problems. The launcher wouldn't move into the login screen, and I couldn't figure out what was wrong with it. I tried reinstalling the client from scratch, but it still says that it's unable to connect to the network. here's what the logs say:

05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Solid LauncherLib [1.0.0.33] initializing...
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Add App[League of Legends Launcher] Exe[C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\lol.launcher.exe] to Windows Firewall
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Retrieved dynamic path [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/LOL.Production.SourceURL.xml][http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_AddPackage([LOL.AirRuntime],[http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/],[C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Attempt to retrieve package [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/LOL.AirRuntime.package]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Version retrieved [LOL.AirRuntime] 3/3 [AirRuntime.02_18_2010_01]/[AirRuntime.02_18_2010_01] type [PACKAGE_TYPE_INCREMENTAL]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.AirRuntime] State change [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE] to [PATCHER_STATE_ALLTASKSCOMPLETE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_RemovePackage([LOL.AirRuntime]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_AddPackage([LOL.Patcher],[http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/],[C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Attempt to retrieve package [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/LOL.Patcher.package]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Version retrieved [LOL.Patcher] 18/18 [LOL.Patcher.05_03_2011_RADStransition]/[LOL.Patcher.05_03_2011_RADStransition] type [PACKAGE_TYPE_INCREMENTAL]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Patcher] State change [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE] to [PATCHER_STATE_ALLTASKSCOMPLETE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_RemovePackage([LOL.Patcher]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Patcher_AddPackage([LOL.Air],[http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/],[C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\]) successful
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Attempt to retrieve package [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/LOL.Air.package]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Restart previous
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Start task [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/ssn/riot.ffs] [LOL.Air_93_73to93.solid] [C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\LOL.Air_p\] [C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\] [0.00/0.00]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Air] State change [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE] to [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Version retrieved [LOL.Air] 93/73 [Final]/[LOL.Air.12_13_2010] type [PACKAGE_TYPE_PROGRESSIVE_VCDIFF]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Air] State change [PATCHER_STATE_IDLE] to [PATCHER_STATE_PREPARE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] Start download [http://l3cdn.riotgames.com/ssn/riot.ffs]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Air_93_73to93.solid]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\LOL.Air_p\]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\]
05/02/2012 22:32 [WARNING] Download failed [TORRENTHELPER_ERROR_INVALIDMETAFILE]
05/02/2012 22:32 [WARNING] Attempt to retrieve metafile[LOL.Air/93/LOL.Air_93_73to93.solid]
05/02/2012 22:32 [INFO] [LOL.Air] State change [PATCHER_STATE_PREPARE] to [PATCHER_STATE_FAILED]


If anybody can help, I would be rather grateful. If I can't play LoL, I might actually have to do something productive! PERISH the thought. But seriously, help.

Alright, gonna bump this up while we're busy talking bout bugs and whatnot, since it got buried under a a deluge of posts about the new Journal.

[Neoseanster]

Have you submitted a ticket to Riot's support service? They're probably much more able to help you than we are.

https://support.leagueoflegends.com/home

[ex cathedra]

:smallfrown:
Someone missed the client/server directive here. This makes me sad. We're fixing it.

I was just teasing. I imagine that it must be pretty stressful over there, though. Sympathies.

[9mm]

now I know it's mean to laugh at new players but something about the plays and the music just tickle my bones (and memories when I was like this) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnkZhh06FxM)

also why doesn't this exist yet? (http://img3.leaguecraft.com/skins/asset/skin_760px_5250_1.jpg)

[Silverraptor]

So guys. Someone let me log in for a game today and I noticed I somehow have 10 IP boosts. How did this happen?:smallconfused:

(Assume that I know nothing about LoL since early April, because I don't.)

[tyckspoon]

So guys. Someone let me log in for a game today and I noticed I somehow have 10 IP boosts. How did this happen?:smallconfused:

(Assume that I know nothing about LoL since early April, because I don't.)

Apology gift for how long it took to get the Hecarim patch working properly.

[XiaoTie]

now I know it's mean to laugh at new players but something about the plays and the music just tickle my bones (and memories when I was like this) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnkZhh06FxM)

also why doesn't this exist yet? (http://img3.leaguecraft.com/skins/asset/skin_760px_5250_1.jpg)

Funniest video of the semester.

The song, Ashe's arrows, WW, Annie, Mundo. PERFECT!

Thanks for posting it here XD

[Silverraptor]

Apology gift for how long it took to get the Hecarim patch working properly.

Huh... Fine with me. Couldn't get on for the patch anyway.

[Math_Mage]

Apparently there's another bug (or hack) (http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/Ec2XAGGV6Os/?resourceId=0_06_02_99) that allows you to see buffs, wards, and blue-pilling in fog of war.

[Tergon]

What's people's opinions on Trundle the Troll? I quite like him in regular games, but everyone and their mother have told me that apparently if I use him for everything other than Jungling I'm commiting some kind of sin against God. There's no doubt he's an awesome jungler, but I honestly prefer laning with him. Thoughts?

[toasty]

What's people's opinions on Trundle the Troll? I quite like him in regular games, but everyone and their mother have told me that apparently if I use him for everything other than Jungling I'm commiting some kind of sin against God. There's no doubt he's an awesome jungler, but I honestly prefer laning with him. Thoughts?

He's not amazing at laning. He has sustain... but that's about it. His jungling is alright, its lackluster, but its good. His ganks are awkward and his CC is limited. His utility is only good if you understand how to use pillar AND your team makes proper use of it.

Basically trundle has no place in Solo queue, but only in organized games as a specific hero for a particular lineup. The only reason I would play him solo top is either in a 2v1 lane or vs. Yorick, since his kit is VERY good for both of those situations.

[Dienekes]

Alright wise folk much better at this game than me. I have a friend, who sucks at this game. To the point where I go in to every game playing with him expecting to lose. But I try to give constructive advice and slowly but surely he's getting better.

Recently he's been trying to jungle Tryndamere, and I find myself in the odd position of not actually having any advice for him. I don't play Tryndamere and rarely jungle. So I was wondering if you guys knew how jungle Tryndamere is supposed to be played, what's the optimal runes/masteries, what summoners, how frequently should he be ganking as opposed to actually jungling, all that jazz.

Thanks in advance.

[toasty]

Standard Jungle runes. Focus your heal thingie. Farm a lot. Give blue to your Middle. Ganking is difficult so focus on farming. Get a Wriggles and then probably an IE. If you can farm uninterrupted for 30 minutes you'll probably carry the team assuming the don't have teemo/a lot of CC.

[tyckspoon]

Standard Jungle runes. Focus your heal thingie. Farm a lot. Give blue to your Middle. Ganking is difficult so focus on farming. Get a Wriggles and then probably an IE. If you can farm uninterrupted for 30 minutes you'll probably carry the team assuming the don't have teemo/a lot of CC.

Chicken-yell and Redbuff provide a lot of slow, but Trynd doesn't have any hard CC. He does have a pretty good approach skill and he puts out a lot of damage. He's not completely self-sufficient in a gank; you need your laner to be on the ball in assisting you in a timely fashion, but that's true of most junglers if you're ganking anything more resilient than somebody who foolishly left themselves exposed in lane while in one/twoshot range.

Take Cleanse and/or buy a Quick Silver Sash and learn to use them. Your effectiveness in fights is hugely dependent on your ability to keep smashing people in the face and press R for extended life/runaway time. There's not much more frustrating than getting chain-CC'd or kited to death before you can ult, or having your entire ult period wasted to CCs (or making a narrow getaway with Undying Rage and then dying to a DoT effect when it expires.)

If your friend gets seriously invested in Tryndamere, get him to practice where and when he can cross walls with Spinning Slash.

[fred dref]

Point of order: No CC effect in the game can stop a Trynd from ulting. The only way to stop him from ulting is to kill him so fast he doesn't realize he needs to ult. Cleanse and QSS are still good for beating Ignite/Exhaust, though. Obviously other CC too, those are just the big ones.

[Math_Mage]

Yeah, I was going to say, Tryndamere is a seriously strong ganker except against stupid escapable champs like Kennen, Corki, Vlad, etc. Burn summoners, come back in a minute, acquire kills. Also, quick Phantom Dancer is a viable option on Tryndamere after Wriggle's and maybe an extra Doran's Blade or two.

[Eldariel]

Chicken-yell and Redbuff provide a lot of slow...

You know you're tired when you read this as "Redbull" and wonder if Tryndamere actually had an ability by that name or if that's a nickname for Bloodlust.

[Dienekes]

So far thanks, but I have a few more questions, because I don't really jungle anyone but Pantheon, who is more ganker than actual jungler anyway.

What are "standard jungle runes and masteries" (his current runepage is something weird like half of his reds are crit, half are attack speed, and his quints are 1 lifesteel, 1 attack speed, 1 movement speed). What route should he start with? Does rushing Wriggles mean cloth/pots or vamp scepter?

[tyckspoon]

Attack Speed reds, armor yellow, whatever you want for blue, because none of the primary blue effects are terribly relevant for jungling. I usually run MR/level. Some kind of offensive quints; flat AD, ArPen, more attack speed all ok depending on what you currently have. Movespeed is never bad if you feel like you're just too slow.

Masteries for Trynd would probably be 21/9/0; grab the Summoners mastery and Bladed Armor out of defense, standard AD offense stuff.

'Generic' farming jungle path for me is Wolves-Blue (smite)-Wraiths-double back to Wolves-Red (the double back means you get here almost exactly when Smite refreshes, so Smite again). Check for potential ganks while you're doing Red; if you have the XP mastery from Utility, you should be level 4. If not, swing by the small Golem camp or pick up Wraiths/Wolves on your way to your chosen gank lane to make 4. Go kill somebody. Skill Bloodlust-Spinning Slash-Bloodlust for your first 3, add Mocking Shout when you expect to be attacking somebody.

Item-wise, Vamp Scepter is better for sustained farming, Cloth + Pots start is better for not getting killed when you go to gank and you have to trade with the target and/or tank minion aggro or if you expect to encounter the enemy jungler.

Edit: If you get pushed into an early back, Cloth start also lets you build to Madred's Razors and then go back out and jungle-farm much more rapidly. Vamp start you have to buy all of the base Razor; with that start, I usually try to do well enough that I can just buy the whole Lantern outright when I back. Need to get a kill or two to do that in good time.

[Reinboom]

Apparently there's another bug (or hack) (http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/Ec2XAGGV6Os/?resourceId=0_06_02_99) that allows you to see buffs, wards, and blue-pilling in fog of war.

That was addressed recently. We know of it. :smallsmile:
Sadly, that one existed a little longer than it should of. Tencent doesn't like to ask us for stuff. :smallfrown:

[Silverraptor]

That was addressed recently. We know of it. :smallsmile:
Sadly, that one existed a little longer than it should of. Tencent doesn't like to ask us for stuff. :smallfrown:

What do you mean? They don't like us finding the bugs?

[Neoseanster]

He's not amazing at laning. He has sustain... but that's about it. His jungling is alright, its lackluster, but its good. His ganks are awkward and his CC is limited. His utility is only good if you understand how to use pillar AND your team makes proper use of it.

Basically trundle has no place in Solo queue, but only in organized games as a specific hero for a particular lineup. The only reason I would play him solo top is either in a 2v1 lane or vs. Yorick, since his kit is VERY good for both of those situations.

Trundle's better than people give him credit for. He's one of the strongest low and mid level duelists, has brutal ganks with his pillar if you set 'em up right, retains decent utility throughout the game, etc etc. He was a little hurt by the jungle rework, because he's all single target damage, but he's still a good jungler, just an under appreciated one. There's a reason Stonewall still has him ranked as god tier up there with Lee/Udyr/Skarner/Nocturne/Mundo.


What do you mean? They don't like us finding the bugs?

It looks like that video was from an Asian server; probably more that it was discovered over there, and they spent a while trying to find a fix for it themselves instead of just bringing it to the attention of Rein and her buddies in LA and letting them do it all easy-like.

[Tesla_pasta]

Now that Udyr is free, I can finally try out a new jungler. this is good, because no one I play with ever jungle so it usually falls to me in solo que.

How does one build the manbeartigerpheonixmonkey? I know wits end and randuins are common choices, but i wanna have a more coherent build as I start to near level 30 and start jungling in ranked.

[tyckspoon]

Boots, Wit's End, Phage. Consider a Wriggle's if you're going Tiger, mostly unnecessary with Phoenix. Build against situation from there.

[dgnslyr]

What? Udyr and Nidalee free? Wonderful! Except it's AP week, so ideally, I'll have no time to play at all because I'm studying.

Jungle Udyr has no need for Wriggle's, because he does all his damage with Phoenix Stance. He can actually get away with boots start, just because his clears are so drat obscene. Since he doesn't need Wriggle's and does plenty of good damage on his own, he can jungle with Philos-HoG.

Wit's and Randuins are definitely great on him, and it'd be a shame not to turn that Philostone into a Shurelia's, when he has enough kiting issues as is. Mallet should also help him keep gaps closed, and I want to impulsively say Atma's is a good buy, though I haven't played much at all since the Atma's change, to be honest, so I don't actually know if it's still a good item or not. He can honestly get away with building almost completely tanky and still do plenty of damage.

[Mutant Bunny]

Trundle's better than people give him credit for. He's one of the strongest low and mid level duelists, has brutal ganks with his pillar if you set 'em up right, retains decent utility throughout the game, etc etc. He was a little hurt by the jungle rework, because he's all single target damage, but he's still a good jungler, just an under appreciated one. There's a reason Stonewall still has him ranked as god tier up there with Lee/Udyr/Skarner/Nocturne/Mundo.

Trundle is fun and interesting, and I've been using him for a long time.

That having been said, there's actually a part of his passive I'm curious about: does it proc if enemies die nearby and you're in the process of reviving via Guardian Angel or Zilean's ult? I think it happened for me once, but I'd like to confirm it...

[Tergon]

I played as Trundle recently and was solo top against two opponents. Because farming was tough, and I needed the sustain, I purchased myself a Tiamat. Now, this helped immensely, and once I was fed it allowed me to destroy in teamfights with the splash damage. But I was chastised for buying one because it's apparently some form of faux pas. It may not have been the most 100% optimal selection, but with Trundle's life absorbing ability and the boost to damage and regen, it basically made all the difference to me. Which got me thinking about when others use it.

So what do folks think of Tiamat? When is it an appropriate choice of item purchase, or is there pretty much always a better choice?

[tyckspoon]

So what do folks think of Tiamat? When is it an appropriate choice of item purchase, or is there pretty much always a better choice?

Almost always something better. If you want the damage, you get a BFS. You want passive sustain/you're getting blocked off from proper farming, Philostone and/or Heart of Gold. Survivability+damage? Wit's, Phage, Wriggles. The only thing Tiamat really has going for it is the splash damage, and the tiny range on that makes it impractical to rely on as a source of AoE damage. If you're using it to help you farm, well, pretty much any other offensive investment of ~2000 gold will also help you cut down minions pretty fast.

[Anonomuss]

I used to rush Tiamat on Kayle, when I was starting out. To me, at the time, it seemed like a solid starter item. Health Regen. Check. Mana Regen. Check. Helps clear minion waves super fast when combined with E. Check.

What can I say :smalltongue: I was just starting out.

But as Tyckspoon just noted, there are better items that do all the same things, just better.

[Tergon]

Seems to be the consensus, and honestly I'd have to agree. It's not bad for a ranged attacker, but there's better choices... and in that specific situation, it was exactly what I needed, but it was laning top with Trundle needing the farm against ranged... something that specific isn't something you can expect to happen that much.

So with that in mind, the obvious follow-up question: How could Tiamat be made useful without making it overpowered? Extending the range too far would make it OP. Perhaps it hits the nearest three units in a limited range or something? Could increase the range to make it more useful that way, even do slightly more damage, but that way it's not hitting EVERYTHING.

[Kaun]

stuck in elo hell!!!!

[ex cathedra]

stuck in elo hell!!!!

Bummer. I can't throw games hard enough to not hit 1600.

[PersonMan]

Sometimes I wonder why I even bother to play Brand when I can just play Malphite.

http://i834.photobucket.com/albums/zz261/Scarge/FLAWLESSMALPHITE.png

I remember how, when I play Twitch, I always go 'ok, I'm stealthed and in the middle of the enemy team...go in!'

So I just WREQ the enemy team whenever I see him in position. It works...except for the part where I don't get my kills (1 was annoying KS - I ignite and peel off, as the damage will kill him, but he snipes him with a basic attack). I have mercenary, though, so I still had tons of money.

I spent the first few minutes of early laning zoning the enemy Ashe/GP and stealing over half of the farm in our lane. Then I got HoG and stopped stealing CS. Sort of.

[Adumbration]

Bummer. I can't throw games hard enough to not hit 1600.

Clearly you have not played enough solo queue. :smalltongue:

[ex cathedra]

Clearly you have not played enough solo queue. :smalltongue:

Hey now, you stay off of our 'Murican servers. :smallwink:

Anyways, as far as a retort goes... it depends on how you mean. Have I played enough solo queue to make accurate statements? Nahh. Have I played enough solo queue to desire to play less solo queue?

Definitely. :smallbiggrin:

[Adumbration]

Hey now, you stay off of our 'Murican servers. :smallwink:

Anyways, as far as a retort goes... it depends on how you mean. Have I played enough solo queue to make accurate statements? Nahh. Have I played enough solo queue to desire to play less solo queue?

Definitely. :smallbiggrin:

Naw, I just thought it a bit unkind way of responding to an apparently frustrated fellow player, so I got curious and checked your account on the US server. Hence the slight poke; hope you were not unduly offended. :smalltongue:

[ex cathedra]

Naw, I just thought it a bit unkind way of responding to an apparently frustrated fellow player, so I got curious and checked your account on the US server. Hence the slight poke; hope you were not unduly offended. :smalltongue:

I was just kidding around. My normal response would be to go into the whole "Elo hell doesn't exist" spiel but I lack the effort and motivation. I've been getting these weird mini disconnects since the most recent patch hit and it's made me more hesitant than normal to solo queue, but I'm more than slightly aware of the fact that ~20 games is quite meaningless. :smalltongue:

[fred dref]

PersonMan, the one thing I always see when I you show your screenshots is that everyone's farm is really, really low.

[Silverraptor]

Trundle is fun and interesting, and I've been using him for a long time.

That having been said, there's actually a part of his passive I'm curious about: does it proc if enemies die nearby and you're in the process of reviving via Guardian Angel or Zilean's ult? I think it happened for me once, but I'd like to confirm it...

I'm going to say, yes.

When I played Mundo a couple times, I sometimes popped my ult just before I got bursted to 0, had the GA revive me, and then appear with almost full health thanks to the rapid regen from his ult.

[Reinboom]

Preliminary:
Dada appears to be the winner. Most notably for the Ahri CC bug.

[Math_Mage]

PersonMan, the one thing I always see when I you show your screenshots is that everyone's farm is really, really low.

To be fair, it looks like farming doesn't win in his games--consider that Nidalee has at least respectable CS for a 23-minute game, but Malphite with 3/0/17 ended up with more gold anyway. When kills come in bunches, they can be more valuable than CS.

[PersonMan]

To be fair, it looks like farming doesn't win in his games--consider that Nidalee has at least respectable CS for a 23-minute game, but Malphite with 3/0/17 ended up with more gold anyway. When kills come in bunches, they can be more valuable than CS.

Aye, to an extent this is true. Nidalee basically camped top to farm the entire game, but she just couldn't keep up with my 'get a kill and multiple assists every minute or so' income level. Early she was a threat, as she was winning the lane against Olaf, but later...well, she wouldn't have made a difference even if she had been in the fights.

To be honest, the enemy was pretty dumb. We won every single fight later on by just standing around, waiting for me to have my ult and Twitch to be in position and for them to forget that if they do anything but run and hide we will massacre them and then just going for a bog-standard initiate-and-suddenly-Twitch routine.

Then again, we didn't really take advantage of our wins to push or take dragon/Baron, etc. It was so much fun to just kill them all over and over, though. Highlight of the game was, IMO, Olaf and I towerdiving their full-HP GP and me walking away with almost no damage.

Honestly, I want to say that if they had gotten their act together they could have turned the tables, but we were just way too far ahead. Anyways, quadra-AD and a bad Fizz is a recipe for disaster when the enemy has a Malphite.

In this case, the only people with good farm on their team were the ones who thought 'hey, rather than just sort of sitting around mid and pretending that my poke can actually do anything (guess who they were trying to poke? Me.), I'll go farm another lane/the jungle!'. They were also slightly more effective in teamfights than the others. But they were pretty worthless, too, because we had gotten fed enough that their better farm didn't matter.


PersonMan, the one thing I always see when I you show your screenshots is that everyone's farm is really, really low.

(I'm assuming the random 'I' there is a remnant from an edited out 'when I see your screenshots'.)

This game, in particular, had especially low numbers because I shared the farm in my lane and we spent more time farming kills mid than laning. Olaf was in lane a lot and Twitch ended up grabbing lots of CS by being fed and therefore farming really easily.

In part it's because I don't post, for example, 40-minute games where people had pretty good farm but we just sort of failed teamfights and lost. I normally just say 'Hey, this was a hilariously fun curbstomp. Time to post it on the LoL thread!', which is also the reason why most of my post-game shots are wins.

---

I do, though, sometimes have 'farm to win' games where the enemy pushes through a lane and I spend lategame just farming as much as possible and avoiding fights until I have way more money than they expect me to have. Of course, I also have games where I want to farm but the enemy has pushed enough that doing so is all but impossible without overextending.

[Eldariel]

Then again, we didn't really take advantage of our wins to push or take dragon/Baron, etc. It was so much fun to just kill them all over and over, though. Highlight of the game was, IMO, Olaf and I towerdiving their full-HP GP and me walking away with almost no damage.

I love these kinds of games. I decided to play two Anivia-games for a change today and both were this type; nothing's quite as satisfying as getting 20-stack Mejai and Leviathan alongside full Warmog's (and since it's Anivia, AA Staff) and being an untouchable CC machine of destruction :smallbiggrin:

[toasty]

Legendary as Galio. Feelsgoodman.

I've also realized that you can actually go Abyssal, Frozen Heart on AP middle galio and still do really well. This is especially true if the enemy team has someone like vayne on it. Otherwise I tend to get an Aegis, then build my Deathcap.

Deathcap on galio is so stupid late game. Its very easy to end up with the highest AP in the game. :D

The best part of the game I just played? the part where the enemy sits in a bush and waits for whoever comes by. Its me. I let all their CC run its course and then ult. I live and we ace them. :smallbiggrin:

[Qwertystop]

Well, this makes my 5th win in a row as Heimer:
http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/5799/81813123.png

[Psyborg]

Firstly, congrats to Dada on all the bugs.

Secondly, I want to comment on this one:

10) Master Yi and Snares interaction:
Master Yi's Alpha Strike (and probably Fioras ult as well) have some weird interactions with snares, as shown in
this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aD6Srg4LbeY&feature=youtu.be
In the first try, I dodge the snare by alpha striking. This is fine.
In the second try, I get snared and am therefore unable to alpha strike. Fine too.
Third try, I get snared, but the alpha strike still goes off, I end up next to Lux, but am still snared. This
shouldn't happen. If I am snared, the alpha strike shouldn't go off -> Alpha strike going off should mean that
I am not snared. This is a weird in-between scenario.

I'm wondering if this is related to Alpha Strike's treatment of targeted projectile spells (specifically, alpha striking while said spells are in flight pops the projectiles visually, but they "hit" and their effects are applied when the alpha strike ends). If there's any delay at all between "determination of hit" and "application of effects" for skillshot snares (and presumably other skillshots), then it's possible for Alpha Strike to go off in between, and the effects end up being applied after landing, just like a targeted projectile (which is, generally speaking, determined to hit as soon as it's fired).

This could be confirmed by testing with Fiora's ult. Unlike Alpha Strike, Blade Waltz pops projectiles both visually and mechanically, allowing her to, for example, evade Sion and Taric stuns, or any of a laundry list of spells. If the odd interaction proves impossible to replicate with Blade Waltz, then the above hypothesis (delay between determination of hit and application of effects by server, Alpha Strike going off in between) is probably correct.

[Dada]

Preliminary:
Dada appears to be the winner. Most notably for the Ahri CC bug.

I'm glad I was able to dig something useful up :smallsmile:


Firstly, congrats to Dada on all the bugs.

Secondly, I want to comment on this one:


I'm wondering if this is related to Alpha Strike's treatment of targeted projectile spells (specifically, alpha striking while said spells are in flight pops the projectiles visually, but they "hit" and their effects are applied when the alpha strike ends). If there's any delay at all between "determination of hit" and "application of effects" for skillshot snares (and presumably other skillshots), then it's possible for Alpha Strike to go off in between, and the effects end up being applied after landing, just like a targeted projectile (which is, generally speaking, determined to hit as soon as it's fired).

This could be confirmed by testing with Fiora's ult. Unlike Alpha Strike, Blade Waltz pops projectiles both visually and mechanically, allowing her to, for example, evade Sion and Taric stuns, or any of a laundry list of spells. If the odd interaction proves impossible to replicate with Blade Waltz, then the above hypothesis (delay between determination of hit and application of effects by server, Alpha Strike going off in between) is probably correct.

Sadly I don't own Fiora, which is why I didn't test that. I assumed that Yi was untargetable while alpha-striking and thus should be immune to effects during the animation - If that is wrong, then this is not a bug. The most likely explanation is probably latency correction - if the snare hits on Lux's end but is dodged on Yi's, then the game somehow has to decide what actually happens. Thinking about this, I am not actually sure if there is a decent way of ensuring either-or atomicity if the clients are responsible for determining whether a skill hits.


stuck in elo hell!!!!

There are two ways to get out of "elo hell":

1) Play enough games that whatever statistic anomaly is keeping you down evens out
2) Take responsibility for lost games instead of blaming them on your team. Always consider how you, personally, could have made a bigger impact.

[PersonMan]

There are two ways to get out of "elo hell":

1) Play enough games that whatever statistic anomaly is keeping you down evens out
2) Take responsibility for lost games instead of blaming them on your team. Always consider how you, personally, could have made a bigger impact.

Way number 3: Have a friend whose ELO is much higher and queue with them in the hopes that they can carry you higher.

EDIT: Way number 4: Don't play Ranked. Optional: Get better* so that, if you feel like going back to Ranked, you can carry up to good ELO.

*I mean getting better at the game, not just the mechanics i.e. team communication, keeping a cool head, tactical analysis, etc.

[Arbitrarity]

Sadly I don't own Fiora, which is why I didn't test that. I assumed that Yi was untargetable while alpha-striking and thus should be immune to effects during the animation - If that is wrong, then this is not a bug. The most likely explanation is probably latency correction - if the snare hits on Lux's end but is dodged on Yi's, then the game somehow has to decide what actually happens. Thinking about this, I am not actually sure if there is a decent way of ensuring either-or atomicity if the clients are responsible for determining whether a skill hits.


I actually suspect that Alpha Strike doesn't pop projectiles/effects as a natural part of it; I've noticed that if you have a targeted stun incoming, and Alpha Strike, you get stunned as soon as you fall out of untargetability. Wouldn't surprise me if there are a few frames where he can get hit by a disabling skillshot during his casting animation and still go into Alpha Strike. As it is, we get weird stuff like "start Alpha Strike animation, target goes out of sight, Alpha Strike cancelled"

[Zen Master]

Ok, so - Udyr is free, and I picked him up. He's all sorts of fun, but I'm slightly hazy on his mechanics. How, for instance, is one supposed to cycle his stances? I pick phoenix for jungle and tiger for lane - but what should be my second stance for either? Turtle? Bear?

[PersonMan]

I go Phoenix -> Turtle -> Bear-> Tiger, myself, when jungling him.

[Reynard]

Ok, so - Udyr is free, and I picked him up. He's all sorts of fun, but I'm slightly hazy on his mechanics. How, for instance, is one supposed to cycle his stances? I pick phoenix for jungle and tiger for lane - but what should be my second stance for either? Turtle? Bear?

Phoenix/Tiger>Turtle>Bear(Get 2 points earlyish, though)> The other of Phoenix/Tiger.

[Boowells]

You can't level up all of Udyr's skills to level 5, so most people just take 3 points in Bear and level the rest of his skills to 5. Remember his stance dance: 3 hits for Phoenix proc and his tiger stance DoT/ASpd can be preloaded into a bear stance stun. The first is important for jungling and the second is important for ganking.

Personally, I don't have a preference for Udyr. Lack of a gap closer means the target has to be overextended and not Lee Sin. Red buff is also likely a necessity. Udyr farms the jungle superbly, but I don't have the foresight to gank well. Just, like, all his ganks get shut down by CC, even soft CC and it's usually not worth it to flash-bear unless your teammate is in a really good position.

[Psyborg]

I actually suspect that Alpha Strike doesn't pop projectiles/effects as a natural part of it; I've noticed that if you have a targeted stun incoming, and Alpha Strike, you get stunned as soon as you fall out of untargetability.

Correct. Alpha Strike is not trollpool (thank <higher power of choice>). Yes, you are untargetable during the animation, but any projectiles already inbound are, at best, delayed until the animation ends. (There are a few non-projectile effects that can be dodged with Alpha Strike- notably Requiem.)

Blade Waltz actually does pop projectiles.

Also, regarding this thread (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2086471) and the codes IronStylus has been putting in his posts (all in the form Ysereh X = Z or Ysereh X = Za where X is a number and Z is a letter. Ysereh is heresy backwards. So far, we have, "The sun always sets <"a codes" start; new sentence/line?> To hide all its")...what are the Playground's theories?

I think there are two basic possibilities:
1. Something Leona-related. I mean come on, it's IronStylus.
2. Stealth Rework. Given how dang long it's been and how worked up people are, I can totally see IS doing something this...involved and planned out in advance to build up to it.

[Neoseanster]

You can't level up all of Udyr's skills to level 5, so most people just take 3 points in Bear and level the rest of his skills to 5. Remember his stance dance: 3 hits for Phoenix proc and his tiger stance DoT/ASpd can be preloaded into a bear stance stun. The first is important for jungling and the second is important for ganking.

Personally, I don't have a preference for Udyr. Lack of a gap closer means the target has to be overextended and not Lee Sin. Red buff is also likely a necessity. Udyr farms the jungle superbly, but I don't have the foresight to gank well. Just, like, all his ganks get shut down by CC, even soft CC and it's usually not worth it to flash-bear unless your teammate is in a really good position.

Hmm, really? I always thought the norm for a level 18 Udyr was five in phoenix /or/ tiger, three in whichever you don't max, and five in each Turtle and Bear, but I haven't played him much for a while.

[SlyGuyMcFly]

Hmm, really? I always thought the norm for a level 18 Udyr was five in phoenix /or/ tiger, three in whichever you don't max, and five in each Turtle and Bear, but I haven't played him much for a while.

That's how I run him. 5 points in bear is a good idea, since it makes you really sticky. Udyr's main problem is getting kited, and bear really helps with that.