Zombie Pirates!

[Babale]

An upcoming campaign of mine will have pirate zombies. Well, closer to pirate liches actually; they're somewhere between skeletal and zombie. Think Pirates of the Caribbean. So, here's my question: How do I make them unkillabale, mechanically, without making them unbeatable? The idea is, not matter what you do to them, they won't die, but you might be able to disable them--temporarily, at least.

My current idea is to give them a d12 HD, maxed out, DR 10/-- and regeneration 10. They'd be completely unkillable in the long run; if you are good enough, you can knock them out for a bit, but not forever; and since they'll have few class levels, they won't be too dangerous. With these stats, they're pretty much invincible when fighting normal NPCs (such as other ship crews), but shouldn't pose much of a threat to a determined PC. This will be offset by their large numbers and the fact that there will be a way to destroy their immortality.

So... Thoughts?

[Duke of URL]

Actually, just using the Lich template and ignoring the spellcasting requirement gets you most of the way there (maybe bump CR by +1 if you're going to grant them some form of fast healing, or not if you lower the DR). The PCs can "destroy" them, but they keep coming back until their phylactery is found and destroyed.

Of course, they'll have to get new ships if they get driven off one, but that shouldn't be too hard, and figuring out what port they're raiding to acquire ships might be a major clue in tracking down the location of the hidden phylactery.

[Amphetryon]

Actually, just using the Lich template and ignoring the spellcasting requirement gets you most of the way there (maybe bump CR by +1 if you're going to grant them some form of fast healing, or not if you lower the DR). The PCs can "destroy" them, but they keep coming back until their phylactery is found and destroyed.

Of course, they'll have to get new ships if they get driven off one, but that shouldn't be too hard, and figuring out what port they're raiding to acquire ships might be a major clue in tracking down the location of the hidden phylactery.
This.
Make them liches,

put their phylactery either as their ship or somewhere at the bottom of the ocean in a treasure chest,

? ? ?,

profit!

[Babale]

I did consider using liches. But, well, here's the plot, this might help.

Ages ago, there was a sorcerer pirate. Like most magic users, he sought immortality. Unlike most magic users, he found it. He made himself and his crew immortal, unable to die by age, disease, poison, or sword. But while his spells prevented him from dying, they did not prevent him from aging. Slowly, slowly, he grew older. His body decayed while he lived. Eventually, nothing was left but a dessicated corpse, yet one who still lived.

I haven't really thought about what would happen if, say, he was chopped up, or if he was Disintegrated. I think his body parts would still be animate in the first case, and work to reform. In the second case, the spell would protect him.

Part of turning skeletal made him loose his arcane power. Before he did, he crafted a number of amulets that bestow this same immortality on the wearer. How should I represent THAT effect, mechanically? I was thinking of letting someone who wears that amulet be allowed to stay up while in negative hit points. At a certain point, say at negative Level X Con Bonus hit points, the wearer is disabled, though still alive. If the amulet is removed while the wearer is at negative hit points, he dies at once. Or rather, after giving a dramatic speech.

[Ninjadeadbeard]

Pirates? Zombies? :smallamused:

Give your pirates all the benefits of being Liches, then homerule that they share a single phylactory kept by the Sorcerer somewhere. If they're ever beaten in a fight, roll 1d4 or something and have them insta-regenerate that many rounds later. Same goes for anyone wearing the Amulets. If killed, self-resurrect in 1d4 turns.

[Andorax]

While we're talking variants on undead...just give them the physical abilities of skeletons/zombies/ghouls/wights (whatever fits your power level) and tack on the reformation ability of ghosts.

Nothing you said indicates they have to come back immediately, or be impossible to take out within the boundaries of a single fight...just have the next dusk, next moonrise, whatever cause them to reform on the deck of that self-same accursed ship.

[Babale]

Nothing you said indicates they have to come back immediately, or be impossible to take out within the boundaries of a single fight...just have the next dusk, next moonrise, whatever cause them to reform on the deck of that self-same accursed ship.

I said that they don't come back at all, because they shouldn't be killable in the first place. They're immortal, literally and completely. In fact, they aren't really undead; they're actually animated by positive energy.

[Babale]

Does anyone have any experience with monsters that are either unkillable or that regenerate as soon as you cut them down? If so, how did it work out?

[Igneel]

Closest thing I came to this was using the Zombie/Skeleton (I forget which) variant in the Libris Mortis book to grant them various additional abilities such as Fast Healing, faster movement, (and for the Zombies) a disease that can be spread through their newly added Bite attacks for a Undead Apocalypse scenario.

Maybe something like the Curst template (Monsters of Faerun/Lost Empires of Faerun). Pending on the version will determine how unkillable they are. The Monsters of Faerun version is the older and much harder version to kill, as the only way to be 100% sure they won't come back is to bypass their Spell Resistance with a Remove Curse spell. Even cutting their heads off didn't keep them down forever.
The Lost Empires nerfed it so that destroying its body is another way to kill it along with the remove curse.

[Babale]

How dangerous would you say a group of 10 to 15 1st level Rogues or Warriors who can't be killed or stopped for more than a round or three be to a 6th level party of 3?

[Amphetryon]

How dangerous would you say a group of 10 to 15 1st level Rogues or Warriors who can't be killed or stopped for more than a round or three be to a 6th level party of 3?

If it's only one round, and if the party is unable to end combat by leaving the area, it's ultimately fatal for them, I'd figure. If nothing your party can do will end the combat, then the only way for the fight to stop is for them to escape, or die.

[Babale]

Ah, I should have clarified: the undying pirates, when they come up, woułdnt be the main enemy. They'd be more lïke an environmental factor... the party's real goal would be to steal an ïtem, fight a normal boss fight, etc.

[Morph Bark]

Part of turning skeletal made him loose his arcane power. Before he did, he crafted a number of amulets that bestow this same immortality on the wearer. How should I represent THAT effect, mechanically? I was thinking of letting someone who wears that amulet be allowed to stay up while in negative hit points. At a certain point, say at negative Level X Con Bonus hit points, the wearer is disabled, though still alive. If the amulet is removed while the wearer is at negative hit points, he dies at once. Or rather, after giving a dramatic speech.

If you want it to be balanced, make it so that the amulet simply doesn't allow you to die, even if you go very deep into negative hit points (or it could make it so you never drop below -9). This does not work if they are undead though, as undead are destroyed at 0 hp. Furthermore, undead cannot have regeneration, because creatures without a Con score cannot have regeneration (if they could, they would never be able to take damage, thus defeating your whole idea and making any such creature functionally nigh-invincible).

Rather than give them tons of HP, DR and Regeneration (all of which would still allow them to be killed), make them immune to poison and disease and unable to die from hp damage, but in such a way that if they drop below 0 they still fall unconscious. Or make it so that anything that deals lethal damage to them deals nonlethal damage instead (regeneration 0), but ONLY if they aren't also undead.