What to do with these epic levels....

[Yorae]

So, I have a gish-y character approaching epic levels.

Some backstory before my question (you can skip it if you're a tl;dr sort):


A significant portion of his backstory is that his native city-state funded for his arcane and martial training, in exchange for years of service to said state's Arcane Guard - an organization related to the large university in the center of the state (which hold significant political sway), as well as the state's millitary. Specifically, he is tasked with investigation of magics and artifacts that may be of interest to the state, whether for the sake of academia or for defense. This has led to his station in life essentially as a sword-swinging, spell-casting Indiana Jones-type.

His position in life suits him just fine, since he is both intensely curious (a condition which has gotten him into all sorts of trouble - e.g., if I don't poke the button, I might NEVER know what it does!) as well as an obervant follower of Kord, who relishes a good fight. His specialty is transformative magic - most combat consists of him buffing up, turning into something nasty (for the majority of the story, typically a War Troll), and then smashing faces. He also favors the use of force effects, protecting himself with Mage Armor and Shield and restraining opponents with Otiluke's Resilient Sphere and Forcecage.

(This earned him the nickname "Ugly Bubble-Troll" from a party member who didn't like him overly much.)
[/end gushing about backstory]



In addition to serving as a plot hook to get him into the campaign, his characterization and backstory made one particular class really jump out at me when I was trying to figure out what to do with him for epic levels -- Agent Retriever. Seriously, flavor-wise it's like someone created it with him in mind.

I was working on figuring out how to enter it, created a build, and then...

Well, I realized it sucks.

Here's why:

Benefits:
Uncanny Location: Can already do this for almost free via Shapechange -> Elemental Weird for Discern Location. Shapechange is exactly this guy's game.

Ethereal Jaunt x/day: They knew this was a caster PrC, right? You can just.. you know... cast it. Or Shapechange -> Nightmare for free Etherealness.

Tracking Skill Bonus: ... because large bonuses to Track are useful, I guess?

Force Sphere: Cool, I guess, especially with the character's ongoing theme. 1/day... too bad you had something better than this many levels ago, in the form of Forcecage.

Plus, it requires track, a pretty much useless feat, and tons of ranks in Gather Information, which I haven't invested in and isn't a class skill for any class I have.

So, I'm looking for advice on what I should do with my epic levels.

This guy's build (finishing at level 21) is:

Warblade 2 / Wizard (Transmuter) 4 / Jade Phoenix Mage 10 / Abjurant Champion 5

I was planning on picking up Agent Retriever by taking Human Paragon 3 first - the first level to make Gather Info a class skill (which I would then start retraining), the second to pick up Track as a bonus feat, and the third because who doesn't love permanent +2 to your favorite stat? However, it looks like this plan is a wash, because the payoff for all the investment is lousy.

Any other PrCs I should look at that fit his theme and have useful class features? Any other recommendations for his epic-ness?

[Randomguy]

Oh! I know this one! Master Transmogrifist!

Normally it isn't a great gish class because of poor BAB and it loses 9's if you take it all the way through, but you're already in epic levels, so normal BAB isn't in effect, so poor BAB doesn't matter, and you've already got 9'th level spells! In fact, it actually boosts your fighting capabilities to beyond that of a full BAB character over time, since you eventually get +6 to attack rolls thanks to battle mastery.

It also goes well with the focus on transformation spells.

The loss of CL still hurts, though, and you don't have great hit dice either.

Argent savant also works, since you like force spells, and you lose less caster levels, but the benefits aren't as great.

[Toliudar]

Given his fondness for Shapechange, would Master Transmogrifist be helpful? It won't do much for the first while, but could help with his versatility later on.

[Yorae]

Maybe I can get a houserule for martial arcanist so that it progresses by +1 per epic level, rather than being totally screwed over by it?

If so, the lost CLs wouldn't be painful. Many of the Master Transmogrifist's abilities are useless when you're using shapechange anyway... the capstone, though -- that is a thing of beauty. I'd love to use it, but d4 hit dice for 10 levels might be bad for a guy who is supposed to stand in melee all the time.

I might see taking Argent Savant 2 for the Force Armor ability - that, plus Abjurant Champion means your normal mage armor / shield spell now gives you +11 AC, which is pretty hilarious.

[Randomguy]

Some other options: There's initiate of the sevenfold veil, which fits well with abjurant champion. You don't get much hp, but that's more than made up for by the warding abilities.

There's warshaper, but that doesn't progress casting, which sucks.

You could use the rules for epic prestige classe characters, found in complete arcane and a few other places, to keep taking levels in J.P.M, but since none of J.P.M's abilities really progress this isn't too great. On the bright side, you get more maneuvers, spellcasting and d6 hd. Also, I think you get epic bonus feats, which is nice.

If you become a lich, you turn all your HD into d12, solving the d4 problem, but it doesn't really make much sense for your character.

I can't believe I forgot about swiftblade! It's always useful. Also, every single level gives you a few class features, which is more of a progression then most. Sadly, you probably don't have/want to get dodge and mobility (but if you do, there's yet another feat you can pick up to ignore the extra damage from power attack, which is awesome in many ways).

Also, not exactly fighting your fluff but not necessarily deviating from it, there's knight phantom (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20050706a&page=4). In the same way that swiftblade is haste incarnate, this is phantom steed incarnate. Sadly, very few class features, and full BAB doesn't do anything in epic levels. All you really get is phantom steed 1/day/class level. It's still better then eldritch knight though.

[Yorae]

I think I like your first ideas, Randomguy - they actually fit quite well. I'm only seeing one problem - the hit points.

Conveniently, Argent Savant 2 after Abjurant Champion 5 gives me enough time to retrain an old non-epic feat to Eschew Materials for MAster Transmogrifist.

Any ideas on how to counter the HP loss of taking that many levels of d4 hit die?

Also, am I reading Reflexive Change right in that, even using shapechange, every time you use reflexive change to completely forgo your next turn? It uses the word "action", so it's hard to tell. Do they mean whatever action it would have taken to shapeshift? So, if you used polymorph, you lost your next standard, if you used shapechange, then you couldn't use a free action to shapechange on your turn? Or maybe they are referring to it being an immediate action, which eats your swift next turn? I'm not really sure.

[Randomguy]

For reflexive change, I don't think the text refers to losing your next swift action, since that happens automatically. I think that it means you lose your next standard action. :smallfrown: See if you can get your DM to rule it that you lose the action it would have taken to shapeshift.

To counter hp loss: There's the improved toughness feat, which gets you hit points equal to your HD (and increases as you level up) which gets you more hp then taking epic toughness would at this point.
There's the slow trait, which halves your base speed (which doesn't really matter, you'll be flying most of the time) and gives 1 extra hp per level up.

There's the minor shapeshift reserve feat, which you probably have already, that lets you get temporary hp equal to your HD and can be refreshed as a swift action. There are also a few smaller benefits, but you can only have one at a time. Also, +1 to CL for polymorphing spells, like shapechange.

Other then that, you can boost your constitution score as high up as it can go, or become a lich for all d12's, but I don't think there's anything else.

You could, however, try to increase your survivability in other ways: It's better to just not be hit then it is to have high hitpoints. The a few good ways to do this, (celerity, wings of cover, abrupt jaunt) but you've only got the celerity line and standard defensive illusion spells like displacement, mirror image, and greater blink (most of which aren't so great during epic levels thanks to most people having true seeing). You can also pump your AC and touch AC as high as possible, but with magic that isn't hard to do.

[Yorae]

I suppose that my AC will be really high anyway due to mega bonuses on Mage Armor and Shield.. and there's always greater mirror image, etc... and I'll be constantly turning into things with high CON (damn you constructs, for having awesome abilities and no CON score!).

[Rubik]

I suppose that my AC will be really high anyway due to mega bonuses on Mage Armor and Shield.. and there's always greater mirror image, etc... and I'll be constantly turning into things with high CON (damn you constructs, for having awesome abilities and no CON score!).Well, constructs do get hp for size increases, and the Faerie Mysteries Initiate feat will give you +Int to hp instead of Con (which is good for constructs and undead -- do fey have a thing for sparkly vampires and emotionless robots?).

[Randomguy]

If epic spellcasting is permited, you should probably use the ward seed to make a custom abjuration that defends against disjunction, dispel magic (and friends) and true seeing, to stop people from dispelling your buffs or seeing through your illusions.

It's one of the only balanced-ish ways to use epic spellcasting.

EDIT: swordsaged by the most hilarious thing I have ever read.

[Roguenewb]

Epic Magic up the 24 hour shapechange effect, and then just use that. What else do you need in life? Take levels in freaking commoner.

[Yorae]

Epic Magic up the 24 hour shapechange effect, and then just use that. What else do you need in life? Take levels in freaking commoner.

How would one go about making an epic spell version of Shapechange (one that could presumably assume a form with more hit dice, retain the free action to change forms, and retain the extraordinary and supernatural abilities of each form)? Isn't the Transform seed massively weaker than the 9th level spell version?