Conan D20, SAGA and D&D 3.5? HELP!

[Empedocles]

I know I've been asking a lot of compatibility questions lately. It's for my absolutely all encompassing base class compendium (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=241689), a collection of all published base classes in D&D (including 3rd party publishers). It's approaching 500 classes (that's estimated. I'd be lying if I said I'd counted) and, well, I'm enjoying every opportunity to expand it :smallbiggrin:

That was the shameless plug.

This is the actual question: how compatible are the Conan d20 classes and SAGA classes with 3.5? I feel like the Conan classes will be underpowered, but in terms of mechanical conflict (something that just wouldn't work) are there any? Same goes for SAGA (including alternative mechanics in SAGA, of course. Just played alongside 3.5 classes). Are these viable? Worth including in the list?

[Jeraa]

This is the actual question: how compatible are the Conan d20 classes and SAGA classes with 3.5? I feel like the Conan classes will be underpowered, but in terms of mechanical conflict (something that just wouldn't work) are there any? Same goes for SAGA (including alternative mechanics in SAGA, of course. Just played alongside 3.5 classes). Are these viable? Worth including in the list?

I don't know about SAGA, but as for Conan d20 classes, there are mechanical differences.

Conan classes all contain 2 different defense progressions Parry defense and Dodge defense. They all also have something called a Magic Attack Bonus. Also, all Conan classes stop gaining hit dice after 10th level, and don't gain bonus hit points from their Constitution after 10th level (though they do still gain bonus hit points from Constitution for their first 10 levels). Some classes also are proficient with Two Weapon Combat, which works differently in Conan. (Two-Weapon Combat is both a proficiency, and a feat. Those proficient with it automatically gain the feat for free.) The Conan barbarian class is totally different from the 3.0/3.5 barbarian class.

Dodge/Parry Defense
Dodge Defense is 10 + size modifier + Dexterity Bonus + Dodge bonus. It can be used against all attacks, but you must have an unoccupied space adjacent to you or you take a -2 penalty to your Dodge Defense.

Parry defense is 10 + size modifier + Strength Bonus + Parry bonus. It is only useful against melee attacks, and requires you to have a shield or weapon to parry with. (Trying to parry while unarmed gives you a -4 penalty to your parry defense.)

The person being attacked gets to choose which of the two defenses he uses against that attack.

Magic Attack Bonus
Magic Attack Bonus is only used with Sorcery. An attack roll is made (1d20 + magic attack bonus + charisma bonus), and that usually sets the Save DC of the spell or ability. Though there are a few other uses for it as well.

Two Weapon Combat
You can fight effectively with a weapon in each hand.
Prerequisite: Base attack bonus +1.

Benefit: When you fight with two weapons, you take no penalty to your attack rolls so long as at least one of the weapons is a light weapon. You take only a –4 penalty to all attack rolls if both weapons are one-handed.

Normal: A character who is not proficient in two-weapon combat has a –2 penalty to attack rolls if using a light or one-handed weapon in his primary hand and a light weapon in his secondary hand, or –6 if using a one-handed weapon in each hand.

Though the normal stuff (hit die type, BAB, saves, skill points, etc) all work the same. The stuff mentioned above could easily just be ignored if you aren't using Conan d20 rules. The scholar class, if you choose the sorcery options, uses an entirely different magic system however, and is simultaneously both stronger and weaker then a D&D spellcaster*. The soldier is just the Fighter class, with a small extra bonus. The thief class seems comparable to the rogue class. I don't know how the rest compare to standard D&D classes, however. Most of the D&D core classes have some sort of magic, while only the Conan Scholar class has magic (and then only if he chooses the sorcery options – you can be a scholar without any magic at all.) They were never meant to be used together.

*
Conan scholars, at 14th level, are capable of killing over a thousand people and destroying all plants and normal animals in an area 30 miles across. At 12th level, they can summon a Pit Fiend or Balor (well, they could if those existed in the Conan setting). They could even summon Asmodeus or Demogorgon themselves (they can summon a demon/devil with hit dice equal to or less then 2x the scholars level, though they can choose to refuse to serve) Also at 12th level, they can turn anyone into a were-creature (like a werewolf). But at the same time, there are no fireballs, lightning bolts, magic missiles, or invisibilities. There are no flashy combat-style magics in Conan.

[Empedocles]

Those various mechanical differences don't seem like a huge deal though, since I don't think removing them renders any class useless. The scholar is just an alternative magic system, and if a class is really reliant on the AC bonuses you could give it a monk's unarmed AC progression.

Any thoughts on SAGA?

[Empedocles]

Nobody else want to contribute here? :smallfrown:

[Empedocles]

Anybody? Please?

[Ashtagon]

It's traditional to wait at least 24 hours between bumping your own threads.

[Jeraa]

After a quick look at SAGA edition classes, there are differences.

THere are no saving throws - Saga has Fortitude Defense, Reflex Defense, and Will defense. 1st level characters have massive amounts of hit points (a 1st level noble has 18 hitpoints + their constitution modifier, while soldiers have 30+their constitution modifier.) The Saga skill system works differently, and Saga characters don't have skill points (they add 1/2 their character level to the skill check, with an additional +5 if they are trained in the skill).

Reflex/Fortitude/Will Defense
All equal to 10 + your level + ability modifier + class bonus + some other bonus. Saga classes don't have saving throws, and the 3 defenses replace the Armor Class system as well.

Also note that no Saga material is Open Content. You really shouldn't be reproducing that material in any product you intend to distribute or otherwise make available to others (for your own personal use is fine). Its illegal.

Edit: But after checking your link, its just a list and not the actual mechanics of the classes. Thats fine. Nothing wrong with that.

[Ashtagon]

Edit: But after checking your link, its just a list and not the actual mechanics of the classes. Thats fine. Nothing wrong with that.

A common misunderstanding of the law. There are certain very limited cases in which you can use copyrighted material in something that is to be released for public use. A simple list or index is one of those uses.

[Ashtagon]

Edit: But after checking your link, its just a list and not the actual mechanics of the classes. Thats fine. Nothing wrong with that.

A common misunderstanding of the law. There are certain very limited cases in which you can use copyrighted material in something that is to be released for public use. A simple list or index is one of those uses.