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View Full Version : [3.P] Heavy Arm [Feat, PEACH]



Strormer
2012-05-15, 03:00 PM
This is a new feat that I've cooked up for my current campaign and I wanted to know what the playground thought of it. I'm not overly concerned that it's too powerful, but I could be wrong. Thanks in advance for any comments or suggestions.

Heavy Arm [Combat]
You have mastered a difficult style of combat relying on your strength to wield a weapon single handed that is far larger and heavier than normal.
Prerequisites: Str 13+, BAB +6 or Fighter level 4
Benefit: Select a two-handed simple or martial weapon which weighs less than 10 lbs. You may use that two-handed weapon as if it were a one-handed weapon. You are still treated, for damage purposes, as having two hands on your weapon.
Normal: A two-handed weapon may only be wielded in two hands.
Special: This feat is treated as an Exotic Weapon Proficiency for the purposes of prerequisites. You may take this feat multiple times, selecting a different two-handed simple or martial weapon weighing less than 10 lbs. each time.

Spiryt
2012-05-15, 03:09 PM
Well, it probably need the clarification about reach etc. - so if you can grab glaive in one hand and wield it while retaining 10 feet reach for medium character.

Because in such case, it would probably be very tempting for some builds indeed.

Strormer
2012-05-15, 03:16 PM
Well, it probably need the clarification about reach etc. - so if you can grab glaive in one hand and wield it while retaining 10 feet reach for medium character.

Because in such case, it would probably be very tempting for some builds indeed.

A glaive is too heavy to wield with this feat as written (weapon must be less than 10 lbs.). The only reach weapon, from the PFCR or APG, that could be used one handed with this feat would be the longspear as it is light enough. Ultimate Combat adds in one or two more reach weapons that this feat would apply to, but nothing too strong.

Spiryt
2012-05-15, 03:30 PM
Indeed, forgot about the weight of reach weapons...

But in this case, the only thing this feat really allows to wield are Greatswords and Falchions, + simple weapons...Perhaps few other weapons from other sources.

And that pretty much gives very small increase of damage, comparable to bad feat in Weapon Specialization...

Being able to wield longspear in one hand and enjoy reach is probably only real gain here.

Strormer
2012-05-15, 03:35 PM
Hmm, I see. I was picturing greatsword and board or twf with bigger weapons. Perhaps not so good then.

Spiryt
2012-05-15, 03:38 PM
Well, the way rules are designed, I guess that one could enjoy slightly bigger damage + bonuses for disarm, sunder, etc. opposed checks.

Can be fluffed like actual 'strong' fighting style too, not necessarily two handed weapon held in one too...

I'm absolutely not good at this, but still I'm not sure it's really worth a feat at all.

Seerow
2012-05-15, 03:47 PM
Why does this feat make changing from one handing to two handing a swift action? By default that is a standard action.

Why does this feat apply to only a single weapon, rather than all qualifying weapons? Seems needlessly restrictive.


Honestly given your prereqs (BAB+6/Fighter 4), you could probably let the two handed weapon still be treated as a two handed weapon while being used one handed (so giving the extra strength and power attack bonus damage). Doing that will make the feat much stronger, but may actually make Sword and Board viable.

bobthe6th
2012-05-15, 04:06 PM
Need to build a serpent strike dual wielding long spear monk


But I wish you would allow exotic weapons. Dual spiked chains sound like more fun then a dire flail...

J.Gellert
2012-05-15, 04:23 PM
I don't fully understand some parts of it.

First; why a swift action to change style? What's the point of changing styles? Why not simply be able to choose how you wield it every time you attack? I just don't see a point, considering it's always more advantageous to use it one way or another consistently.

Second; Why the weight restriction? It feels arbitrary, and in this way makes no sense. I say let it be used with all weapons. If you can lift it, you can attack with it.

Third; it's treated as Exotic Weapon Proficiency when exactly? Can you give an example?

Final question - are you familiar with the Monkey Grip feat?

Strormer
2012-05-16, 12:48 AM
First; why a swift action to change style? What's the point of changing styles? Why not simply be able to choose how you wield it every time you attack? I just don't see a point, considering it's always more advantageous to use it one way or another consistently.

Mostly, this was simply a choice to make it some switch between wielding two handed and a different style. I actually prefer the suggestion of making the weapon treated as two-handed while in one hand and will switch to that instead, making this point moot.


Second; Why the weight restriction? It feels arbitrary, and in this way makes no sense. I say let it be used with all weapons. If you can lift it, you can attack with it.

For the same reason I didn't allow it to be used with exotic weapons, too strong. As mentioned in an earlier comment, a glaive or even dual glaives is slightly obnoxious. This is to keep the feat within reason. Holding and using an awkwardly large weapon in one hand is somewhat difficult. Making it very heavy is silly. Just my opinion.


Third; it's treated as Exotic Weapon Proficiency when exactly? Can you give an example?

Such as qualifying for Exotic Weapon Master PrC or certain exotic weapon only feats.


Final question - are you familiar with the Monkey Grip feat?

Quite familiar. This feat does not do the same thing. Monkey Grip, as written in 3.5, allows a character to wield a weapon sized for a creature larger than itself as if it were sized properly at a -2 attack penalty. That is, a large greatsword is a two-handed weapon for a medium creature with this feat. A large longsword is a one-handed weapon. A medium greatsword is still a two-handed weapon for the same creature and is not affected in any way by Monkey Grip.

This feat allows a greatsword sized for your creature, medium for medium, to be wielded in one hand, normally impossible. With the most recent modification it is treated as if you had two hands on weapon.

I answered the most recent post as it covered every question the earlier posts had put forth, but thank you to all for your input, particularly Seerow for the suggestion to beef up the feat a little.

J.Gellert
2012-05-16, 01:58 AM
But with Monkey Grip, you can wield a Large Longsword, really a Greatsword in everything but the name, in one hand.

So mechanically it's very close, and it imposes a -2 penalty. So your feat feels like trying to "cheat" out of this penalty.

Quotation marks because it sounds like you are the DM, so it's probably irrelevant, but still something to consider.

bobthe6th
2012-05-16, 07:17 AM
monkey grip was always a bad feat, a really bad feat. It gave +2 average damage for a -2 to hit, making it pre spent power attack. This might actually be a feat worth taking, as it is a nice power boost for anyone willing to drop precious feats...

Answerer
2012-05-16, 08:37 AM
I'd ditch the weapon restriction as unnecessary and limiting, at least.

Kane0
2012-05-16, 07:46 PM
monkey grip was always a bad feat, a really bad feat. It gave +2 average damage for a -2 to hit, making it pre spent power attack. This might actually be a feat worth taking, as it is a nice power boost for anyone willing to drop precious feats...

So what would happen if you took Monkey Grip and Heavy Arm?

... TWF greataxes anyone?

bobthe6th
2012-05-16, 08:03 PM
wow, TWF might actually be worth it then...

Reluctance
2012-05-16, 08:22 PM
What's so OP about wielding a shield or a second weapon when you're holding a reach weapon? You can get some nice numbers out of it, but you're still limited by what reach weapons can do. Unless you grab a spiked chain (which is more about funky tricks than being a straight-up damage weapon) or use a nonreach weapon in your off hand (which makes it much harder to bring both to bear).

Seerow
2012-05-16, 08:38 PM
What's so OP about wielding a shield or a second weapon when you're holding a reach weapon? You can get some nice numbers out of it, but you're still limited by what reach weapons can do. Unless you grab a spiked chain (which is more about funky tricks than being a straight-up damage weapon) or use a nonreach weapon in your off hand (which makes it much harder to bring both to bear).

There's a one handed spiked chain in core anyway, so it's not like it's something with no precedent at all.

Strormer
2012-05-17, 08:53 AM
I should add that our setting is fixing two-weapon fighting and vital strike to both be one scaling feat. Makes twf a bit more of an option.

Cieyrin
2012-05-17, 10:59 AM
I concur with the crowd of "remove the 'select one weapon' clause," as well as suggest the maximum weight scale with Strength and effective size, as it's silly for the Str 30 Goliath Barbarian/Fighter to not be able to properly heft a mucking weapon in one weapon. The set weight restriction also favors small creatures, so they can get away with one-handing polearms and other reach and two-handed weaponry.

I'd suggest setting the maximum weight to Str score -3, +/- 3 per size category away from Medium, in pounds. So you're Human Fighter with Str 13 still has the 10 lb limit, the Halfling Fighter with Str 14 has an 8 lb limit, which is still enough for a longspear. The Goliath with 17 Str can heft 17 lbs, which is enough for Greatswords, Greatclubs, Falchions and Spears but not enough for polearms.