[Feat] Cast Through the Soul

[reddir]

I was trying to find a feat or feat chain that would allow a character to cast from a wand or other magic item and having all the character's feats/stats/abilities/etc apply to the spell as if they had cast it from their own spell slots.

No one the Homebrew Request thread offered one up, so I did my noob best...

I've since added different versions:
- 1.0 is the original.
- 2.x is a more liberal feat.
- the x.1 and x.2 versions have significantly different requirements, and are therefore appropriate to different situations.

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Original: Cast Through the Soul 1.0

Cast Through the Soul
The wand-user channels the energy of the spell through themselves before releasing it.
req: Craft Wand, UMD or Spellcraft 9, know the spell being cast.
Benefit: When the character triggers a wand holding a spell they know, they may choose to have it act as if they are casting it from their own spell slots, being affected in all ways that a spell they cast from their own spell slots would be affected, including using their casting stats, their feats, any abilities they have, etc.
Special: Due to the need for the magic to first push through the wand-user before expressing a full spell, this uses 2 charges for each triggering of the wand, not including metamagic or other factors which might increase the charge cost. This does not expend any of the user's spell slots.
Normal: The effects of a spell cast from a wand are set by the creator of the wand. A single trigger of a wand uses a single charge.
Basically: Craft Wand + UMD/Spellcraft 9 ranks + knowing the spell + this feat + 2 charges = cast as if from one's own spell slots.

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Cast Through the Soul 1.1

Cast Through the Soul
The wand-user channels the energy of the spell through themselves before releasing it.
req: Craft Wand or UMD 9 or Spellcraft 9, know the spell being cast.
Benefit: When the character triggers a wand holding a spell they know, they may choose to have it act as if they are casting it from their own spell slots, being affected in all ways that a spell they cast from their own spell slots would be affected, including using their casting stats, their feats, any abilities they have, etc.
Special: Due to the need for the magic to first push through the wand-user before expressing a full spell, this uses 2 charges for each triggering of the wand, not including metamagic or other factors which might increase the charge cost. This does not expend any of the user's spell slots.
Normal: The effects of a spell cast from a wand are set by the creator of the wand. A single trigger of a wand uses a single charge.
Basically: Craft Wand -or- UMD/Spellcraft 9 ranks + knowing the spell + this feat + 2 charges = cast as if from one's own spell slots.

This seems to follow the pattern of requirements set by other wand feats.

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Cast Through the Soul 1.2

Cast Through the Soul
The wand-user channels the energy of the spell through themselves before releasing it.
req: Have the spell ready to cast through a Class-given spell slot.
Benefit: When the character triggers a wand holding a spell they know and are able to cast, they may choose to have it act as if they are casting it from their own spell slots, being affected in all ways that a spell they cast from their own spell slots would be affected, including using their casting stats, their feats, any abilities they have, etc.
Special: Due to the need for the magic to first push through the wand user before expressing a full spell, this uses 2 charges for each triggering of the wand, not including metamagic or other factors which might increase the charge cost. This does not expend any of the user's spell slots.
Normal: The effects of a spell cast from a wand are set by the creator of the wand. A single trigger of a wand uses a single charge.
Basically: having the spell ready to cast within oneself + this feat + 2 charges = cast as if from one's own spell slots.

This changes the requirements. It is no longer enough to know the spell, but one must have it ready to cast - including an unused spell slot of the appropriate level (and spell preparation if needed). In exchange, there are no other feat or skill requirements.

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Cast Through the Soul 2.1

Cast Through the Soul
The magic-item user channels the energy of the spell through themselves before releasing it.
req: Relevant Item Creation Feat or UMD 9 or Spellcraft 9, know the spell being cast.
Benefit: When the character triggers a magic-item holding a spell they know, they may choose to have it act as if they are casting it from their own spell slots, being affected in all ways that a spell they cast from their own spell slots would be affected, including using their casting stats, their feats, any abilities they have, etc.
Special: Due to the need for the magic to first push through the magic-item user before expressing a full spell, this uses 2 charges for each triggering of the item, not including metamagic or other factors which might increase the charge cost. If the item is an unlimited use item, it takes twice the normal time to activate. This does not expend any of the user's spell slots.
Normal: The effects of a spell cast from a magic-item are set by the creator of the item. A single trigger of an item uses a single charge.
Basically: Relevant Craft Feat or UMD/Spellcraft 9 ranks + knowing the spell + this feat + 2 charges = cast as if from one's own spell slots.

This is an expanded version, applying to all sources of magic spells, including scrolls (I recall some type of scroll with multiple uses?), wands, staves, wondrous items, etc.

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Cast Through the Soul 2.2

Cast Through the Soul
The magic-item user channels the energy of the spell through themselves before releasing it.
req: Have the spell ready to cast through a Class-given spell slot.
Benefit: When the character triggers a magic-item holding a spell they know and are able to cast, they may choose to have it act as if they are casting it from their own spell slots, being affected in all ways that a spell they cast from their own spell slots would be affected, including using their casting stats, their feats, any abilities they have, etc.
Special: Due to the need for the magic to first push through the magic-item user before expressing a full spell, this uses 2 charges for each triggering of the item, not including metamagic or other factors which might increase the charge cost. If the item is an unlimited use item, it takes twice the normal time to activate. This does not expend any of the user's spell slots.
Normal: The effects of a spell cast from a magic-item are set by the creator of the item. A single trigger of an item uses a single charge.
Basically: having the spell ready to cast within oneself + this feat + 2 charges = cast as if from one's own spell slots.

This changes the requirements. It is no longer enough to know the spell, but one must have it ready to cast - including an unused spell slot of the appropriate level (and spell preparation if needed). In exchange, there are no other feat or skill requirements.

This is an expanded version, as it also applies to all sources of magic spells, including scrolls, wands, staves, wondrous items, etc.

This feels more "natural", if one is thinking of magic as being shaped by the user from within. In this case, the "conduits" for the spell are all in place, and they tap an outside battery for the power. It also self limits in that a character cannot use this feat with a spell they either don't know or have too low a Caster Level to cast.

For the those who prefer a Hermetic view of magic, the removal of the Item Creation feat requirement may seem inappropriate.

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[Cieyrin]

Looks like it'd work out fine, turning wands into limited staves, essentially.

[reddir]

Thanks Cieyrin.

How do you think it looks if I change the 'prerequisites' line to:
req: Craft Wand or UMD 9 or Spellcraft 9, know the spell being cast.


----[edit]----

I guess the real question in order to finalize this feat: "What are the minimum and/or reasonable requirements for access to this feat?"

[Cieyrin]

Thanks Cieyrin.

How do you think it looks if I change the 'prerequisites' line to:
req: Craft Wand or UMD 9 or Spellcraft 9, know the spell being cast.


----[edit]----

I guess the real question in order to finalize this feat: "What are the minimum and/or reasonable requirements for access to this feat?"

Well, let me change the question to who do you intend it for? As-is, it's very Artificer/Wizard-oriented. If you want to open it up to other caster types, I'd drop Craft Wand, though that takes away from knowing wands so well that you can get extra oomph out of them, like how Double Wand Wielder, Reckless Wand Wielder and Wand Mastery are.

[reddir]

Well, let me change the question to who do you intend it for? As-is, it's very Artificer/Wizard-oriented. If you want to open it up to other caster types, I'd drop Craft Wand, though that takes away from knowing wands so well that you can get extra oomph out of them, like how Double Wand Wielder, Reckless Wand Wielder and Wand Mastery are.

After reading your reply, I tried to find any and all Wand-related feats.

Every single one, excepting Wandstrike, requires Craft Wand...huh.

Also, none, other than [Epic] feats, require Spellcraft. And the only UMD req was 1 rank for Reckless Wand Wielder, again excepting Wandstrike which requires 4 ranks...

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I was hoping to make a general feat that all magic-users could use. Not just the Artificers/Wizards. This would include Divine magic-users, as well as those classes which progress magic at 1 per 2 levels.

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So...

I want to keep the "know the spell being cast" requirement. That is what justifies this feat, to me. ---[Edit]--- In fact, I'm considering changing this to "Must be able to cast the spell, including knowing the spell & having the available spell slot (& having the spell prepared if your class normally requires this)," and dropping the other requirements...however, see the next paragraph. ---[End Edit]---

Craft Wand seems like the natural one and only other req. This is debatable, in that one could argue that taking a Feat is enough to offset using Wands as Staves. However, as was pointed out, almost every other wand feat requires Craft Wand.

---

The question that follows: Is it appropriate to allow the substitution of Spellcraft or UMD for the Craft Wand req?

If so, at what level? Craft Wand is available at Caster Level 5. This would normally equate to max rank 8 in a skill. Are skill rank reqs normally rounded up to an odd integer (in this case 9)?

[reddir]

I added several different versions of the feat to the original post.

Please tell me what you think, in consideration of both usability and balance.

How might you want to change these, either as a Player or a GM?

Your Servant,
reddir

[Reluctance]

That's incredibly powerful for a single feat. Even burning through charges twice as fast, you're still getting a good deal out of treating wands as ministaves. By comparison, Wand Mastery gives +2 to CL and DC, and has a prereq of CL 9. Might work as a feat with Wand Mastery as a prereq.

2.2 is an intersting take on reserve feats. With the understanding that reserve feats let a wizard dip a sorcerer's shtick, without giving anything the other way around. As such, I'd be tempted to give prereqs of Craft Wand and a Spellcraft minimum prereq of 9.

[reddir]

That's incredibly powerful for a single feat. Even burning through charges twice as fast, you're still getting a good deal out of treating wands as ministaves. By comparison, Wand Mastery gives +2 to CL and DC, and has a prereq of CL 9. Might work as a feat with Wand Mastery as a prereq.

1) Wand Mastery does not use extra charges
2) Wand Mastery does not require one to know the spell being cast. It is normally sufficient to have the spell on any of one's spell lists, regardless of level or knowledge.

Do you not think these restrict this feat's use sufficiently to offset the difference?


2.2 is an intersting take on reserve feats. With the understanding that reserve feats let a wizard dip a sorcerer's shtick, without giving anything the other way around. As such, I'd be tempted to give prereqs of Craft Wand and a Spellcraft minimum prereq of 9.

I don't understand how this touches on Sorcerers. If anything, I thought it (and all [Reserve] feats) might be closer to what a Warlock does.

The differences between this feat and regular [Reserve] feats:
1) The character must use a magic item with the spell already in it. Either 2x the charges per cast or 2x the time to cast.
2) A more versatile choice of spells. Any magic-casting item can be employed, as long as the character is already able to cast that spell.

Also, re Sorcerers, they benefit more than Wizards. Wizards must prepare their spells, and therefore lock each spell slot to a single spell. Sorcerers, as long as they have a single spell slot open at each level, can use items for any of their known spells - as long as they are willing to buy the wands/magic-items to do so.

[Reluctance]

1) Wand Mastery does not use extra charges
2) Wand Mastery does not require one to know the spell being cast. It is normally sufficient to have the spell on any of one's spell lists, regardless of level or knowledge.

Do you not think these restrict this feat's use sufficiently to offset the difference?

Wands are usually used to cast spells the character can already otherwise cast. Especially for a wizard, to whom new spells known are cheap. Sorcerers, meanwhile, have no shortage of spell slots but are hard up for spells known. (The feat interacts oddly with UMD users, most notably artificers and warlocks, but that can be addressed later.) It's yet another way to allow wizards to bypass their slots per day limitation while not really touching on anybody else's limiting factors.

Double charges isn't as much of an issue as you may think at first. Especially since most wands top out at over twice their minimum caster level. You're often better off getting double (or better) damage/duration/etc. right now, especially when it comes with things like dispel resistance and DC boosts, than you are doling it out over an extended period of time.


I don't understand how this touches on Sorcerers. If anything, I thought it (and all [Reserve] feats) might be closer to what a Warlock does.

The differences between this feat and regular [Reserve] feats:
1) The character must use a magic item with the spell already in it. Either 2x the charges per cast or 2x the time to cast.
2) A more versatile choice of spells. Any magic-casting item can be employed, as long as the character is already able to cast that spell.

Also, re Sorcerers, they benefit more than Wizards. Wizards must prepare their spells, and therefore lock each spell slot to a single spell. Sorcerers, as long as they have a single spell slot open at each level, can use items for any of their known spells - as long as they are willing to buy the wands/magic-items to do so.

Once again. A sorcerer who knows Fireball can be pretty liberal throwing around Fireballs already. He's more likely to want a wand as a workaround for more effective spells known. A wizard under 2.2, meanwhile, can get around his limited spell slots per day by locking one down to get full effect out of his Fireball wands. That's powerful enough to need another feat as a prereq, but basically allows a wizard who's willing to lock in a slot to have much broader use of a lesser effect. Reserve feats balance this by allowing a lesser effect. CTtS 2.2 balances this with gold cost.

[reddir]

Wands are usually used to cast spells the character can already otherwise cast. Especially for a wizard, to whom new spells known are cheap. Sorcerers, meanwhile, have no shortage of spell slots but are hard up for spells known. (The feat interacts oddly with UMD users, most notably artificers and warlocks, but that can be addressed later.) It's yet another way to allow wizards to bypass their slots per day limitation while not really touching on anybody else's limiting factors.

Double charges isn't as much of an issue as you may think at first. Especially since most wands top out at over twice their minimum caster level. You're often better off getting double (or better) damage/duration/etc. right now, especially when it comes with things like dispel resistance and DC boosts, than you are doling it out over an extended period of time.



Once again. A sorcerer who knows Fireball can be pretty liberal throwing around Fireballs already. He's more likely to want a wand as a workaround for more effective spells known. A wizard under 2.2, meanwhile, can get around his limited spell slots per day by locking one down to get full effect out of his Fireball wands. That's powerful enough to need another feat as a prereq, but basically allows a wizard who's willing to lock in a slot to have much broader use of a lesser effect. Reserve feats balance this by allowing a lesser effect. CTtS 2.2 balances this with gold cost.

I've spent the last day and a half trying to balance this feat line for both Sorcerers and Wizards and have realized I don't know enough about how Sorcerers play to do so.

So, I ask two question of you and the other homebrewers:
1) Can you come up with a way to make these feats equally beneficial to both Sorcerers and Wizards?
2) Is it a critical failing that, according to what Reluctance wrote, Wizards may benefit more than Sorcerers from these feats?