Idea for a Quick Core Spellcaster Fix

[NeoSeraphi]

So, the main problem with spellcasting is that the scaling is absolutely insane. Every 2 levels, not only does your current spellcasting improve, but you also get access to a set of much stronger abilities a few times per day. Additionally, spellcasting does not usually require a check in order to succeed. Offensive spellcasting allows a saving throw, and some of them require attack rolls, but spells like summon monster, major creation, polymorph and the like have no chance of failure, while an attack roll by a fighter will always have a 5% chance of failure (usually moreso against a strong enemy) and only the most optimized of skill checks will always succeed on a one at low to mid levels.

For this reason, I feel that the restriction on spells per day does not go far enough, but I know that any attempt to attach a skill check or a roll to spellcasting will simply result in optimization and arms race logic, so I will forego that and simply focus on the scaling issue. Here is my proposal:

No core caster receives the ability to cast 1st level spells at 1st level. Instead, 1st level spells are moved back to 3rd level for wizards, druids, and clerics, and to 4th level for sorcerers. 2nd level spells are moved back to 5th level for wizards, druids, and clerics, and to 6th level for sorcerers. Etc. 9th level spells are removed from the game entirely. The prerequisites for spellcasting prestige classes does not change, and thus entry to most spellcasting prestige classes has been delayed by this change, forcing a cleric or a wizard to stay in an empty base class for a longer stretch of the game.

Note that 0th level spells are not affected by this change, they are essentially taking the place of 1st level spells. So as a 1st level caster, you truly have limited casting ability, rather than somehow gaining the ability to cast both powerful spells for the level and minor magic for the level. This change allows 0 level spells to actually scale into 1st level spells, rather than lumping them together for some reason.

Bards, paladins and rangers are not affected by this change. Bards still receive the ability to cast 1st level spells at 2nd level.

So how does this change affect the game, would you say? Now you can't pull sleep and color spray shenanigans at 1st level, and the DC scaling of your most powerful spells has been delayed by 2 levels, which allows enemy saves to progress and keep up better.

Edit: To be clear: I don't really have a problem with the spells themselves. Spells like glitterdust and stinking cloud are pretty powerful, but I feel they have a place in the game. I just want them to come later because they feel like higher-level abilities than they actually are.

[Steward]

My concern is that players in low-level games won't enjoy playing spellcasters if they are stuck with cantrips and orisons for two or three levels. There might be some really good ones in some of the non-Core books, but as far as I can tell all you really get in Core that's really good is Prestidigitation. And Detect Magic, that's always a staple.

[NeoSeraphi]

My concern is that players in low-level games won't enjoy playing spellcasters if they are stuck with cantrips and orisons for two or three levels. There might be some really good ones in some of the non-Core books, but as far as I can tell all you really get in Core that's really good is Prestidigitation. And Detect Magic, that's always a staple.

Well, you can still do minor magicks like daze, touch of fatigue and ray of frost. And clerics and druids have higher hit points and weapon proficiencies. But how would you suggest I fix it?

[Tvtyrant]

Give a single first level spell as an SLA at level 1? It can be used like 3/day, but it doesn't scale. That might work. Or give them infinite cantrips, so you don't feel like you are carefully conserving extremely weak magic.

[Rogue Shadows]

Well, you can still do minor magicks like daze, touch of fatigue and ray of frost. And clerics and druids have higher hit points and weapon proficiencies. But how would you suggest I fix it?

- Keep the ability to cast 1st level spells at 1st level.

- Go the Pathfinder route and turn cantrips and orisons into at-will spells (eliminating cure minor wounds and inflict minor wounds and replacing them with the PF spells stabilize and bleed, respectivey).

- Change the spell level advancement so that full spellcasters gain 2nd level spells at 3rd level; 3rd level spells at 6th level, and a new spell level every three levels thereafter, to a maximum of 7th level spells at 18th level. OR, if you prefer, some logical progression that caps in 8th level spells. Whatever.

- Increase all spells per day for 1st-7th (or 8th) level spells by 2.

- Fix the spells. Getting planar binding at 15th level rather than 11th does not significantly affect its ability to break the game at all.

There is no such thing as a quick spellcasting fix.

[NeoSeraphi]

Give a single first level spell as an SLA at level 1? It can be used like 3/day, but it doesn't scale. That might work. Or give them infinite cantrips, so you don't feel like you are carefully conserving extremely weak magic.

Yeah, that sounds fair. A 1st level spell, 3/day, but with a caster level of 1.

[Steward]

That sounds fair. I was just worried that, say, a 1st level wizard would be able to use his 0th-level spells three times (not each, but total) and then essentially have nothing magical to do for the rest of the day.

[Tyndmyr]

Tyndmyr's first rule of D&D: Any "quick spellcaster fix" isn't.

This just increases the "wizards suck" portion of the game, while doing essentially nothing to overall balance. If someone sucking for five levels then dominating for fifteen is kind of a weird definition for balance...then fiddling with the numbers of levels doesn't fix that.

[Ashtagon]

Bards get their 1st level spells at 2nd level, while wizards get their 1st level spells at 3rd level?

Given all the other stuff bards have, is there any particular reason to play a wizard at this point?

[Eldan]

Well, you can still do minor magicks like daze, touch of fatigue and ray of frost. And clerics and druids have higher hit points and weapon proficiencies. But how would you suggest I fix it?

I think something like this actually came up in the 5th edition thread once. How to build a low magic spellcaster. My suggestion was basically to give them other class features.

Build a class called the scholar. Give it 0 level spells, bardic knowledge and an archivist's dark knowledge.

Or overall: more things to do rather than just cast spells. Make the wizard the smart guy he is supposed to be.

[NeoSeraphi]

Bards get their 1st level spells at 2nd level, while wizards get their 1st level spells at 3rd level?

Given all the other stuff bards have, is there any particular reason to play a wizard at this point?

Certainly. How about if you want to play a Lawful arcane spellcaster? Or a smart character instead of a charming character?

Also, even if you have to wait for it, the wizard spell list is simply better than the bard's.