[Pathfinder] Sorcerer spells and bloodline advice

[wallofterror]

I am joining a Kingmaker campaign and I am gonna be a sorcerer and start at level 3.

I just want your advice or suggestions.

level 0 spells: detect magic, prestidigitation, acid splash, flare, mage hand
level 1 spells: grease, color spray, magic missile

Still don't know which bloodline to choose between Arcane, Destined or Fey.

Thanks for advices if you think I should get other spells.

[rollforeigninit]

I like the flavor of destined best but the most solid bloodline is probably Arcane. That being said, Fey gives you some not-usually-available to sorcs options. Nice if you like the semi-druidy flavor.

[Benly]

I am joining a Kingmaker campaign and I am gonna be a sorcerer and start at level 3.

I just want your advice or suggestions.

level 0 spells: detect magic, prestidigitation, acid splash, flare, mage hand
level 1 spells: grease, color spray, magic missile

Still don't know which bloodline to choose between Arcane, Destined or Fey.

Thanks for advices if you think I should get other spells.

Fey bloodline is very powerful but specialized. The bloodline arcana's +2 bonus to compulsion DCs can be combined with other DC boosters like Spell Focus (Enchantment) to really hammer home your compulsions. If you go with fey bloodline, you'll probably want to get a compulsion spell to replace Color Spray. Sleep is the classic, but it's losing steam already by level 3. Hypnotism is pretty versatile, but not so great for combat.

Destined bloodline is defensive. Its spells are all about protecting you or giving you early warning, and all but one of its abilities are defensive in nature. If you want to be hard to take out, Destined is a pretty decent choice, but you'll need to use the rest of your build to figure out what you're actually doing while enemies fail to kill you.

Arcane bloodline is versatile. Its spells fill in the utility gaps that a specialized build might overlook, and its abilities make you better at modifying spells with metamagic and add even more spells to your list. Arcane can go well with just about anything.

As far as your spells go other than that, I would really recommend against Flare. If you're taking it for tactical reasons, Dazzled is an extremely ineffective condition (just -1 on attack rolls) and you'd be better off with Daze or another utility cantrip like Read Magic. If you're taking it for thematic "I want to be able to conjure bursts of light" reasons, Dancing Lights is probably more useful as a mobile light source.

[wallofterror]

Thanks for the advice ! I was also considering the Draconic bloodline.

What about feats, any good or must feats I should get first ?

I am going to be for sure a human.

[Benly]

Thanks for the advice ! I was also considering the Draconic bloodline.

Draconic bloodline's spells and some of its abilities suggest a character who gets into melee and mixes it up more than most sorcerers - it's heavy on personal buffs, and it gives you claws and natural armor. However, it's also excellent for a blaster - the bloodline arcana is very potent in that regard, the breath weapon is an extra blast, and it gives you flight through both a spell and an ability.


What about feats, any good or must feats I should get first ?

I am going to be for sure a human.

Since we were discussing bloodlines, I'd be remiss not to bring up Eldritch Heritage (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/eldritch-heritage) and the improved (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/improved-eldritch-heritage) and greater (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/greater-eldritch-heritage) forms thereof, which let you poach the bloodline powers from another bloodline at a slightly reduced level.

[stack]

It is worth noting that you can shift your casting stat using some of the wild blooded options, sage for INT or empyreal for WIS. Nice if you want skill points or an excellent will save.

[Wagadodo]

One good reason to go human, if you hadn't already thought of it, is after third level to start taking the subsition favored class bonus to take an extra spell lower than the level that you can cast. One of the best reason to go human besides getting that extra feat.

[ericgrau]

Until you're casting 4th level spells at level 8 so you can get extra 3rds it isn't that special though. Even then it's good not spectacular since it's not your highest spell level and you still have ~5 other low level spells to cast. I might go gnome for the extra HP, AC, +1 to hit on your rays later and heck +1 save DC on your color spray at the moment. Half-orc is good if you plan on a lot of fire spells, and there are bloodlines that help even more (draconic and fire IIRC).

For the bloodlines pick your flavor. Arcane and draconic seem to be better than the rest. But I'm noticing an awful trend of everyone picking them, which is going to get dull from lack of variety.

The spell list looks good. Some possible 2nd level spells next level are:
flaming sphere: even better now that Pathfinder buffed it, you could easily get 20++ damage a fight from a single action (if not 35) when a raging barbarian is doing 15. But I'd still swap it out later on.
web: perhaps the best since 2e. Save or no save 1-3 foes are in big trouble, or really their unaided allies are.

Hmmm, dang that's it. Not much even in the APG. Glitterdust got severely nerfed and IMO it was overhyped to begin with. Once you get 3rd level spells I'd look into the following for 2nd level: false life, invisibility, levitate, scorching ray and fiery shuriken (UM).

[doko239]

Magic Missile in combination with Toppling Spell (Ultimate Magic) is a fantastic combo, even more so with the Magical Lineage trait. 1-5 trip attacks per round, using CL + Cha instead of BAB + Str, at magic missile range? Yes please!

Also good is Create Pit combined with Aqueous Orb (both from APG). Create a pit, then use Aqueous Orb to sweep enemies into the pit. Even if an enemy makes the save to escape the orb, there's nowhere to go.

[wallofterror]

what you guys think about the first feats to get as level 3 ?

As a human I would have 3 feats to choose:

I was thinking Improved initiative but it is also in some of bloodline feats... isn't it too good to wait ?

And I don't know what to get : toughness to have more HP ?

Is it too soon to get metamagic feats ?

[deuxhero]

Ramzarian Priest is crazy good (you like having every divine spell usable spontaneously?), but pretty much impossible to use for the fluff.

Slyvian+Boon Companion is a Fighter as a class feature.

[Rift_Wolf]

Ramzarian Priest is crazy good (you like having every divine spell usable spontaneously?), but pretty much impossible to use for the fluff.

Slyvian+Boon Companion is a Fighter as a class feature.

Which books are those in? I found the Sylvan bloodline, but not Ramzarian or Boon Companion.

[doko239]

Which books are those in? I found the Sylvan bloodline, but not Ramzarian or Boon Companion.

Boon Companion is from Seekers of Secrets, Razmiran Priest is from Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Inner Sea Magic

[deuxhero]

And on the SRD
Boon Companion (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/boon-companion)
Razmiran Priest (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/archetypes/paizo---sorcerer-archetypes/razmiran-priest)

[ericgrau]

Improved initiative is fairly ho-hum except in very high optimization settings where the fight is won in round 1 so all you have to do is go first. I mean it's ok, but there's no way I'd make it my first or even my fourth feat. In a 5 round fight something like spell focus will give you more mileage.

Try spell focus, greater spell focus or metamagic. Selective spell is epic for area effects, especially on a sorcerer who can apply it spontaneously only when needed. It's actually a big offensive boost rather than a mere defensive measure, since you'll frequently be able to tag many more foes once you don't have to worry about allies. Since it's only +1 I might start with that. Empower will be good later, though not at the moment. Ditto for heighten and quicken (perhaps the best on a sorc). Dazing spell goes really well with magic missile but likewise is +3. I prefer a lesser rod of extend spell over the feat. I'm not up to speed on PF splatbooks so there may be better options. The APG had some other interesting metamagic choices IIRC.

[deuxhero]

Even for a blaster Wizard, going first is essential, as it means all the enemies are in nice groups perfect for sending a fireball or lightning bolt through.

For a wizard with Glitterdust, it's just as important.

[ericgrau]

Get selective spell and do that every round, without worrying about a die roll.

But besides that, you are unlikely to go first even with improved initiative. You're more likely to go a little earlier, that's it. It's good for a small portion of a round which is great when there is one and so-so when there are 3-7.

[deuxhero]

1: Only helps with your allies being in the blast zone, not the enemies not being nicely packed together.
2: It has a spell level increase
3:The enemy is still able to hit you because they moved before you could kill/disable them.
4: Can't be used till level 10 (11 if not straight Wizard). II works from level 1.

[ericgrau]

I think you are making a rather contrived scenario where you roll well (since a +4 simply isn't enough to beat a dozen others), enemies travel in a tight band, and yet they scatter the moment they engage your allies.

What is a thousand times more reliable and common is foes tightly clustering around your allies in melee.

[deuxhero]

It isn't just that you roll well, but that you can afford a high dexterity due to only needing Charisma and having a PC's stats array over an NPC's.

[NamelessNPC]

If you move before your enemies, you get an extra turn in every combat. It's like casting Time Stop for one as a free action. So yes, Improved initiative is good