Just Lion Around

[Arranis Thelmos]

Well... I think I just made a serious, game breaking mistake as a DM. During my last session, my players (five of them, all level 2) were on their way to support a villiage under siege and one of them made a joke about 1d4 lions lying in the road for no apparent reason. Well, I laughed and said something along the lines of "Well, I hope you thought at was funny, because that is exactly what you see." The group then encountered one lion, just lying in the middle of the road. I justified this by saying that the invading army used lion-drawn chariots, even though we all knew it was based around the joke the other player made. The party cleric wanted to try to try to tame it, as having maxed out the handle animal skill. I thought there would be no way he could actually do it. He sat on it's back and made the roll to determine it's reaction. One natural 20 later, and the party now has a mascot. ><

And they named it Lionel.

Well, here's the problem. I didn't have access to the Monster Manuel, so I just made up it's stats on the go. It didn't really see any combat, so it wasn't an issue. Now I've just looked up the stats for the tiger, planning to repackage it as a lion (like I said, no MM). However, looking at them I'm worried that it is a lot more powerful than I had imagined. Tiger
Size/Type: Large Animal
Hit Dice: 6d8+18 (45 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 40 ft. (8 squares)
Armor Class: 14 (-1 size, +2 Dex, +3 natural), touch 11, flat-footed 12
Base Attack/Grapple: +4/+14
Attack: Claw +9 melee (1d8+6)
Full Attack: 2 claws +9 melee (1d8+6) and bite +4 melee (2d6+3)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Improved grab, pounce, rake 1d8+3
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +8, Ref +7, Will +3
Abilities: Str 23, Dex 15, Con 17, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 6
Skills: Balance +6, Hide +3*, Listen +3, Move Silently +9, Spot +3, Swim +11
Feats: Alertness, Improved Natural Attack (bite), and Improved Natural Attack (claw).
Environment: Warm forests
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 4
Advancement: 7-12 HD (Large); 13-18 HD (Huge)
Level Adjustment: —
These great cats stand more than 3 feet tall at the shoulder and are about 9 feet long. They weigh from 400 to 600 pounds.

Combat
Improved Grab (Ex)
To use this ability, a tiger must hit with a claw or bite attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If it wins the grapple check, it establishes a hold and can rake.

Pounce (Ex)
If a tiger charges a foe, it can make a full attack, including two rake attacks.

Rake (Ex)
Attack bonus +9 melee, damage 1d8+3.


It's hp total is about as much as the full party's put together, it looks like it gets three attacks a turn, and has the potential to be a serious game breaker. All in all am I just too worried about this, or have I just turned by players into a group of metaphorical Tucker's Kobolds?

[Demonic_Spoon]

Behold! The awesome powers of the internet! (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/lion.htm)

That said, remember that it is still a dumb animal, as such not capable of complex tactics, easily tricked/avoided/sidestepped and may flee from the weirder opponents(aberrations, the stranger magical beasts, demons, etc.)

[Randomguy]

Use the SRD (system reference document): lion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/lion.htm). It's only slightly weaker than the tiger.


I think you should roll with it. You also said that the invading army is using lion drawn chariots, and that they were on their way to help out the town being invaded, so it's level appropriate humans + lions vs. the PC's + a lion.

I suggest that your other encounters either use ranged attacks, hit and run tactics or include an opponent made to handle the lion though, to stop them from steamrolling encounters. Or just factor in the lion when deciding on the CR of the encounters you make.

Remember that while the PC's gain power and items over time, the lion doesn't, so this will only be a temporary problem.

EDIT: lion'd.

[Demonic_Spoon]

Also, unless your cleric has wild empathy from a domain power or something he shouldn't have been able to do that, handle animal just doesn't work like diplomacy. And still wouldn't have added his handle animal ranks to the check.

[Arranis Thelmos]

Thanks for the help everybody! I had been looking for half an hour and couldn't find anything.:smallredface: I also see I used handle animal wrong too, so I'm not going to try that again, thanks DS! :) I'm feeling a whole lot better about this, thanks!

[Tvtyrant]

The sad part is that it is going to die in a few levels. A Lion isn't going to survive very well at equal HD fights, much less higher.

[Demonic_Spoon]

Not if you make it a full fledged party member! Awaken animal anyone? :smallbiggrin:

[Slipperychicken]

Not if you make it a full fledged party member! Awaken animal anyone? :smallbiggrin:

Next time a party member dies, reroll as the (now awakened) Lion. Stats as Anthro-Lion, give it class levels.

[Unusual Muse]

Just factor the lion's CR (on the party's side) into your encounters.

[Jeff the Green]

Well, I see two good options.

Option One: Don't use stats as written for the lion. One possibility is a leopard (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/leopard.htm), increased in size to large (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/improvingMonsters.htm#sizeIncreases) without pounce. Also, the players shouldn't be able to give it directions without spending time training it per the Handle Animal rules.

Option Two: Retcon it. Tell the players, honestly, that you goofed and having a lion ally is too strong for where they are right now. Therefore, the cleric didn't actually tame the lion, it was just hoping that the party would lead it back to its masters/feed it steak/be steak. Upon realizing that they weren't going to it leaves.

[Yahzi]

Just play it like a lion.

Enemies attack, the lion pounces on one... and then spends the rest of the fight eating its kill.

[Raimun]

Perhaps it's a cowardly lion?

Then you could also recruit a Warforged, an animated scarecrow and a girl from another dimension with magical shoes.

[Flickerdart]

Is it a male lion? Male lions, especially those trained to pull chariots for some reason, aren't hunters. So the PC will have to train it to attack before it will bother helping the party in battle.

[Morph Bark]

Perhaps it was not a fully-grown lion and you DID provide the right stats? :smallamused: