View Full Version : 3.5/PF Magic Rework

2012-05-29, 02:41 PM
I might run this in a campaign as an experiment in the near future.

Divine and Arcane casting.
Rather than there be 9 spell levels, I cut everything off at 5th level spells.
Rather than 2 levels between new spell levels, you have 3. Meaning you hit 5th level spells approximately around 15 or so.

However, to make up for such a severe cutoff, you get access to the spell slots as normal. So you still get 9th level spell slots, for meta magic purposes. It's just that there are no spells in the game higher than 5th level, and you learn them a little bit later. Possibly including a reduction of cost and greater availability for metamagic rods and staves as well. I might allow access to some 6th Level Spells, strictly through items.

Spontaneous Casters would still get the same number of spells known for the spell level, and would probably learn them at the same rate, but not necessarily. This would likely need some adjustment.

Not sure how classes with only 6 spell levels would be adjusted, I'll get to those later.

The reasoning is to have a lower magic world, further justified by the notion that casters would be extremely rare. There will probably be a further story related reasoning for this. Namely, it is a planet where Demons are highly attracted to magic of all kinds, and throws MAJOR forces at any high concentrations of magic in the world.

So, would this be TOO severe a nerf? What would it do to the Tier System for those classes?

2012-05-29, 05:46 PM

2012-05-30, 12:16 PM
It's not that I dislike magic. Far from it.
I just want to run a low-magic campaign, but still feature magic classes as relevant parts of the party, and possibly still as relevant parts of society in the world. I want to place more relevance on the lower level spells and on metamagic to get the job done, rather than rely on higher level spells.

I could throttle magic in the world by fluffing it that way and making magic harder to access. Or I could actually make magic less advanced and less progressed.

In a world where casters can't pick up Wish just by leveling up, imagine how carefully the party might approach something like a Genie.

Imagine the challenge it presents when a monster can cast a spell-like ability that isn't even on ANYONE's spell list. In the world. It feels far more unique, knowing anything about that monster can be vital.

It's got the potential to be fun, and have the desired effect. I'm just curious what it's going to do to classes like Wizards and Sorcerers and Clerics and such. Access to new levels of magic 1 level later? How bad could it be?

2012-06-02, 05:33 PM

2012-06-02, 11:32 PM
To answer your questions:

1) No, I don't think it would be too severe a nerf.

2) Honestly, I have no Idea. I think it would lower the Tier somewhat, since the power curve will come down, but I would think Teir 1 would likely only drop to 2. They still have the versatility, after all.

It could impact what kinds of magic items are available, as well.

I like the idea, though.

2012-06-04, 10:40 AM
I discussed it with my party. They seem to be cool with it.
I may restrict casting classes to Druid, Wizard, Sorcerer, Cleric, Oracle, Bard. I'm not sure how to handle some classes like Summoner because they get Class Features which mimic 9th level spells, but only get 6 spell levels. So I'll either restrict the class (enemy NPC's) or we can find a fix for it if one of my players is THAT set on playing a Summoner.

I'm considering making it up to 6th level casting (we can use the Bard Spells known list for telling when someone has access to a new level of casting), making 7th level spells show up on on items. Most likely showing up on 1 use per day incredibly rare items. And 6th level spells get pretty darned potent. I'm not sure if I want to leave other spell casting schools as is (IE-Bard only gets 6 levels of spells) to make life easy. It does also make those classes just a smidge more competative in such an environment.

I just realized it does throw some itemization for a loop. Minimum caster level to create things like a Wand of X is now higher, therefore in theory, item costs would be higher. I think I'll just leave prices of items as they are, but I'll come up with an in-story reason for it. Party only discount due to awesomeness, but with a better explanation than that.

Now I just need my in-game reason why casters can not learn 7th, 8th, and 9th level spells. Which, if the in-game reason is flexible enough, may be something that the party manages to overcome. Destroying some crazy mcguffin-laden multi-planar bastion of magic which is sealing the magic? Discovering the teachings of some long lost scholars/shadowy organization?
Destroying the offspring of the god of magic? Nullifying some pact made by the gods?