Goodly warlock help

[Feyyore Dirkear]

Is it possible to create a blaster lawful good warlock. Providing the deal was made with a goodly outsider. Eberron setting. So advice anyone? I'm curious hehe.

[ThiagoMartell]

Is it possible to create a blaster lawful good warlock. Providing the deal was made with a goodly outsider. Eberron setting. So advice anyone? I'm curious hehe.

RAW, warlock needs to be chaotic or evil, so no.
You could start as chaotic good, go into a prc that progressed invocations and then switch alignments to lawful good, but you wouldn't be able to take warlock levels.

[Feyyore Dirkear]

RAW, warlock needs to be chaotic or evil, so no.
You could start as chaotic good, go into a prc that progressed invocations and then switch alignments to lawful good, but you wouldn't be able to take warlock levels.

Hmm Chaotic would work fine, used that one before hehe.

[Slipperychicken]

Hmm Chaotic would work fine, used that one before hehe.

Ask your GM about allowing a LG Warlock. Alignment restrictions like this are just plain dumb IMO.

[Urpriest]

Hellfire Warlock doesn't have any alignment requirements. At most you'd be losing out on Mortalbane.

[ThiagoMartell]

Hellfire Warlock doesn't have any alignment requirements. At most you'd be losing out on Mortalbane.

Mortalbane has no alignment requirements as well.

[Manly Man]

This here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226021) is an excellent homebrew fix for the class, allowing you to have more than just a demonic lineage. The only one I haven't seen on there is one for an elemental lineage, though I really don't wanna know the details about how one would have gotten a fire elemental to make babies.

[Feyyore Dirkear]

Thanks hehe. I'll see what all this comes up to. The last time I created a goodly warlock, he was with the celestial heritage. The DM had allowed me to do it and to go into Acolite of skin using Guardinals.

Thank you for the help. A good part of which I hadn't known or concidered. Warlock's as a class are underrated but very useful and powerful at times.

[ThiagoMartell]

Thanks hehe. I'll see what all this comes up to. The last time I created a goodly warlock, he was with the celestial heritage. The DM had allowed me to do it and to go into Acolite of skin using Guardinals.

Thank you for the help. A good part of which I hadn't known or concidered. Warlock's as a class are underrated but very useful and powerful at times.

So you wear an angel's skin... and you're Lawful Good? :smalleek:


This here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226021) is an excellent homebrew fix for the class, allowing you to have more than just a demonic lineage. The only one I haven't seen on there is one for an elemental lineage, though I really don't wanna know the details about how one would have gotten a fire elemental to make babies.
What's there to fix? Warlock is pretty good by itself. A different take, sure, I can see that. But "a fix"? Warlock is not broken, you don't have to fix it.

[Siosilvar]

So you wear an angel's skin... and you're Lawful Good? :smalleek:

Not necessarily literally. Easy enough to fix via fluff: Close association with the angels slowly turns you into an angel (if you keep taking levels of this modified version of the Acolyte of the Skin PrC, anyway).

[AmberVael]

What's there to fix? Warlock is pretty good by itself. A different take, sure, I can see that. But "a fix"? Warlock is not broken, you don't have to fix it.

A lot of people aim at a bit higher power level than the warlock sits at. Speaking in terms of tiers, Warlock is tier 4, and lots of people like tier 3 instead.

I do love the warlock, but I tend to agree with that sentiment- though I think really all that's needed to 'fix' it up to that power level is more invocations. Of course Some variety in heritage options is nice too, which the base class doesn't really provide.

Still, that's all a matter of preference. Mechanically speaking, it does function just fine, so it isn't really broken as in unusable, maybe just a little low powered at times.

A little more on topic: I actually just made some celestial flavored invocations, if you're interested in homebrew. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=245205) (Toot toot, I gotta horn). If nothing else, I do have some fluff in it that could provide an interesting perspective on what a good/celestial warlock would be like.

[ThiagoMartell]

A lot of people aim at a bit higher power level than the warlock sits at. Speaking in terms of tiers, Warlock is tier 4, and lots of people like tier 3 instead.
And that's still not a fix. It's a different take. You can't fix what's not broken.
Also, that's not really understanding the tier system. A 'tier 3 game' allows classes in tier 2, 3 and 4. Optimization can bump you up a tier - any halfway decent melee warlock is tier 3 (good in damage dealing, regular in plenty of other stuff).
Sorry for the rant, but I've been seeing this a lot these days...


I do love the warlock, but I tend to agree with that sentiment- though I think really all that's needed to 'fix' it up to that power level is more invocations. Of course Some variety in heritage options is nice too, which the base class doesn't really provide.
But that's intentional. The Sorcerer is the guy with plenty of heritages or whatever. Warlock is... not.


Still, that's all a matter of preference. Mechanically speaking, it does function just fine, so it isn't really broken as in unusable, maybe just a little low powered at times.
Agree completely. Then again, optimization helps.


Not necessarily literally. Easy enough to fix via fluff: Close association with the angels slowly turns you into an angel (if you keep taking levels of this modified version of the Acolyte of the Skin PrC, anyway).
Then it has absolutely nothing to do with Acolyte of the Skin... and Complete Mage has a prestige class for this, anyway (Enlightened Spirit).

[Daer]

I think eldritch disciple wouldn't require to be chaotic and imho would fit nicely on lawful good warlock (being cleric/warlock)

but till would need few levels of warlock if dm doesn't allow warlock be lawful, which is bit silly which is bit silly as warlocks are pretty much about making deal with greater power.

[AmberVael]

And that's still not a fix. It's a different take. You can't fix what's not broken.
Yes, that would be the point of my third paragraph, which you agreed with. I'm just explaining why it might be viewed as a fix- to some people, it isn't at the optimal power level. That's all.


Also, that's not really understanding the tier system. A 'tier 3 game' allows classes in tier 2, 3 and 4. Optimization can bump you up a tier - any halfway decent melee warlock is tier 3 (good in damage dealing, regular in plenty of other stuff).
Sorry for the rant, but I've been seeing this a lot these days...
No, a tier 3 game would have only tier 3s. However, the tier guide does specify (and understandably so) that a difference of one tier one way or the other around a specific tier should be manageable. It's not blurring the lines between tiers, only clarifying that you can have mild power variance without too much trouble.

Optimization can bump you up a tier, and lack of optimization can drop you a tier, but that's not what the tier system truly measures, or what people mean when they talk about homebrewing a class with a specific tier- the idea is what level it is at while "at rest" so to speak. Your optimization may bump up your warlock a tier, but the fact that you jumped through hoops to do so indicates something about its power level. Tier 3 isn't the natural power level of warlock, and in saying this, you basically admit it.

To put it a bit more plainly- no matter how you optimize, no matter how you power up your warlock character, the warlock is still a tier 4 class (assuming of course, you agree with that assessment). What you did was make a tier 3 character. The power and tier of a single character doesn't change what tier the class is.

As such, when someone indicates that the warlock is tier 4, and that a homebrew revision is a tier 3 version, this is a perfectly legitimate way to describe what their interest and intent is. They want a slight bump in versatility, generally.


But that's intentional. The Sorcerer is the guy with plenty of heritages or whatever. Warlock is... not.

Er, the innate fluff of the sorcerer makes them out to be draconic in heritage, and that's it. Warlock, on the other hand, emphasizes fiendish, but also specifically mentions fey and alludes to other potential powers. This is right in the base class- and yet they don't support it in the mechanics, which some people find frustrating (myself included). It's nice to be able to switch up warlock flavor.

Though calling it heritage might not be the most accurate terminology, there's a lot of talk about pacts and such too, which is also interesting.

In any case, I don't want to derail this thread any more, so I'm just going to leave things here. If you would like a more in depth or lengthy discussion though, I do invite you to PM me on the subject, and we can hash it out there.

[ThiagoMartell]

Er, the innate fluff of the sorcerer makes them out to be draconic in heritage, and that's it.

I don't want to derail this any more than you do. However, there are fiendish and celestial heritage options in Player's Handbook 2 for Sorcerers.
Pathfinder goes an extra miles - bloodlines are the sorcerer's main class feature.