[PF] Crossblood Sorcerer viability?

[jaybird]

In a mid-op campaign, how viable would a Crossblooded (Dragon/Orc) Sorcerer be as a blaster and primary arcanist, assuming there's also going to be a full divine caster and probably a half-caster in the party? I figure Human will be a necessity for the extra spells known. Expanded Arcana can more-or-less cover for the lost highest level spell.

[Jack Zander]

I don't think its all that bad. The biggest problem you have to worry about is not being able to cast your highest level spells until the following level after the norm. I recommend taking a metamagic feat to help offset this a bit.

[deuxhero]

Blasting Orc/Dragon Sorcs with metamagic is its primary use (its secondary is getting into DD with another bloodlines abilities)

[Dr. Yes]

I played almost that exact build in a friend's one-shot, and it was pretty ruinous. Depending on encounter size you'll at least match, and usually outshine, everyone else's damage. I found myself resorting to "God wizard" standbys like Glitterdust and Black Tentacles in order to scale back performance and avoid immediately trivializing encounters.

[doko239]

I played a similar build (Orc/Primal (Cold) bloodline), as a Half-Orc, with the Irrisen Ice Mage feat and Gifted Adept trait, focusing on Burning Hands. Requires a bit of DM Handwavium regarding Crossblooded and Wildblooded working together, but it's reasonable RAI.

At 1st level, he cast Burning Hands, as a Cold spell, dealing 3d4 + 6 damage. Stuff died. :smallbiggrin:

[grarrrg]

In a mid-op campaign, how viable would a Crossblooded (Dragon/Orc) Sorcerer be as a blaster and primary arcanist, assuming there's also going to be a full divine caster and probably a half-caster in the party? I figure Human will be a necessity for the extra spells known. Expanded Arcana can more-or-less cover for the lost highest level spell.

DRAGON and Orc bloodlines you say?
Might as well take 4 levels of Dragon Disciple. You will lose a caster level, but it has a clause where you gain the bloodline spells at the level you could cast them.

May want to take up to 8 level of Dragon Disciple (so you still get level 9's).

[jaybird]

DRAGON and Orc bloodlines you say?
Might as well take 4 levels of Dragon Disciple. You will lose a caster level, but it has a clause where you gain the bloodline spells at the level you could cast them.

May want to take up to 8 level of Dragon Disciple (so you still get level 9's).

Hmm...so the way it works is, if I go into DD at level 6 (Sorc5/DD4), because I can cast 4th levels as an 8th level Sorcerer, I get Fear (Draconic bonus spell, normally gained at Sorcerer 9) at level 8? Interesting, interesting...

Unfortunately, it doesn't look like anything else it gives works well with a blaster/arcanist role - what it DOES seem tailor-made for is a Sorcadin gish.

[Ravens_cry]

I have an idea that uses Primal Elemental/Dragon Crossblood then three levels of Rogue then go Arcane Trickster for a magic sneak attacker with +2 to each of the chosen element dice, including sneak attack dice.
Magical Knack is also awesome for this plan.

[Chained Birds]

I have an idea that uses Primal Elemental/Dragon Crossblood then three levels of Rogue then go Arcane Trickster for a magic sneak attacker with +2 to each of the chosen element dice, including sneak attack dice.
Magical Knack is also awesome for this plan.

Alchemist (Vivisectionist) would probably work too.

[Benly]

Alchemist (Vivisectionist) would probably work too.

It would be functional, but I'm not sure that it's the superior option in the case of a three-level dip. With a three-level dip, you get extracts that won't be scaling, mutagen and a discovery, while rogue gets you twice the skill points, evasion, and a rogue talent. Given that the character focuses specifically on sneak attacks with spells rather than the Vivisectionist's usual feral mutagen/natural attack spam, I suspect that the mutagen is going to be less valuable than usual, so I actually lean towards rogue for the three-level dip in this particular build.

[doko239]

If you wanna go Arcane Trickster, I'd recommend Arcane Blast (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advanced/advancedFeats.html#arcane-blast) for your primary attack. Less damage than spells, but the advantages are:

- Any spell slot can be used
- No SR
- No Save
- No Resistance/Immunity
- Untyped damage

Add sneak attack to that and go to town :smallbiggrin:

[jaybird]

That Arcane Trickster build sounds pretty good in terms of damage and utility - might look at building one some other game. This one, though, I'm going to be playing the primary arcanist, and crossblooded already takes enough bite out of the Sorcerer in terms of his toolkit.

[Dr. Yes]

If you wanna go Arcane Trickster, I'd recommend Arcane Blast (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advanced/advancedFeats.html#arcane-blast) for your primary attack. Less damage than spells, but the advantages are:

- Any spell slot can be used
- No SR
- No Save
- No Resistance/Immunity
- Untyped damage

Add sneak attack to that and go to town :smallbiggrin:

Big meh to that. Admittedly bypassing SR is nice, but I can't think of any touch spells that give a save against their damage, and Elemental metamagic will get around resistances just as easily without giving up so much of your damage potential.

[Ravens_cry]

If you wanna go Arcane Trickster, I'd recommend Arcane Blast (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advanced/advancedFeats.html#arcane-blast) for your primary attack. Less damage than spells, but the advantages are:

- Any spell slot can be used
- No SR
- No Save
- No Resistance/Immunity
- Untyped damage

Add sneak attack to that and go to town :smallbiggrin:
If I go the acid, cold, or electricity route I can use zero level spells and get +2 damage on each damage, including sneak attack die Still, it's not a bad feat, and definitely worth considering for a wizard arcane trickster.

[docnessuno]

If I go the acid, cold, or electricity route I can use zero level spells and get +2 damage on each damage, including sneak attack die Still, it's not a bad feat, and definitely worth considering for a wizard arcane trickster.

Sorry, doesn't work.


0-level spells may not be sacrificed in this manner.

Also Arcane blast is not a Spell, so bloodline powers don't apply.

[doko239]

Sorry, doesn't work.



Also Arcane blast is not a Spell, so bloodline powers don't apply.

I think he meant, he can sneak attack with Ray of Frost or some such, and will get +2 damage on each sneak attack die.

I'm not certain it works that way, but it's interesting

[Ravens_cry]

I think they meant, they can sneak attack with Ray of Frost or some such, and will get +2 damage on each sneak attack die.

I'm not certain it works that way, but it's interesting
Exactly.
My reasoning is sneak attack die I am pretty sure are explicitly the damage type dealt, so using a piercing weapon to deal sneak attack is plus xd6 piercing damage, and using a spell that does fire damage will deal fire damage to sneak attack deals plus xd6 fire damage. Both Draconic and Primal Elemental both add +1 damage per die rolled.

[docnessuno]

Ok, sorry for the misunderstanding.
But i'm not sure that the sneak attack dices would get the +2 damage/die. I think that is pretty much a "grey area" in the rules.


that spell deals +1 point of damage per die rolled

I can see people assuming that the SA dices are indeed part of the spell, while other insisting that SA (while doing the same elemental damage of the spell) in not part of the 'spell' itself.

[CTrees]

Pyromancer Gnome is an obvious addition, though it ties you to fire damage.

[grarrrg]

Pyromancer Gnome is an obvious addition, though it ties you to fire damage.

Half-Orc Sorcerer Favored Bonus will generally outclass that (eventually).

[Ravens_cry]

Despite the harshness of the -2 to to charisma, Goblin could work. It's got the same sorcerer favoured class bonus as human.

[grarrrg]

Despite the harshness of the -2 to to charisma, Goblin could work. It's got the same sorcerer favoured class bonus as human.

Almost, not quite.
Goblins can only add "Fire" descriptor spells to the list.
Still, grab all/most your 'blasty' spells with Goblin bonus, and you'd be ok.

Also, maybe not for 'this' build, but grabbing Empyreal or Sage Bloodline for NON-CHA based casting would work nicely for a Goblin.
And between the +4 Dex and Small Size, Ray/Touch spells should be a focus.

[Ravens_cry]

Almost, not quite.
Goblins can only add "Fire" descriptor spells to the list.
Still, grab all/most your 'blasty' spells with Goblin bonus, and you'd be ok.

Also, maybe not for 'this' build, but grabbing Empyreal or Sage Bloodline for NON-CHA based casting would work nicely for a Goblin.
And between the +4 Dex and Small Size, Ray/Touch spells should be a focus. I must have missed that. I like the idea of non charisma casting.
Even better if Goblin favoured class bonuses apply to High Goblins (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/3rd-party-races/jon-brazer-enterprises/high-goblin-jbe).

[CTrees]

Half-Orc Sorcerer Favored Bonus will generally outclass that (eventually).

Agreed. It all goes to "at what level are you playing?"