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Lactantius
2012-06-08, 05:31 AM
We all know how many different arcane spells can be found within all the books.
Many of them are just overlooked; many are too narrow and too circumstancial to memorize them safely on a daily routine base.
Well, let's assume we don't have the preparation problem in the first place so that we could use those rare spells at the moment we need them. Let's assume mechanics like 15-minute-re-memorization, Spellpool or the alacritous cogitation feat.
Let’s create a list with spells which don’t gain much attention.
Goals:
1) Find creative uses for spells with a broad, general effect
2) Compare the rare spells with the daily “bread and butter spells” and evaluate them.
3) Maybe tweak those rare spells if they are too weak and too focused so that they would be more attractive to use them.
So, this list of spells should include spells which are
a) too circumstancial if you don’t find other good creative possibilities or
b) try to tweak them a bit (to get a broader and more practical field for them).
I will start off with this list (feedback welcome). The order is completely random.

Clairaudience/Clairvoyance:
By the book, it sounds like a good “surveillance camera” spell. I wonder if there are more creative used than defending or guarding a certain location.
In fact, most times the party is on the move. Sure, we are in a world simulation game where spell application possibilities are only limited the the players themselves.
Anyway, and good idea to use this spell effectivly? Consider the VERY low duration (too low, maybe tweak it)?
Tweak suggestion: duration 10 min/level (D)

Energy Vulnerability (PH2) and Vulnerability (SC):
Both spells deal with the defense mechanics of your opponent, one with energy resistances, the other with damage reduction. Both effects appear around mid-level-play more often, so you could assume it would be a good idea to put those spells on your daily routine list - or not? The cost is a problem, though (slot 3 and 5, respectively). But I think their debuff quality is pretty good since the whole party hits those demons and dragons better and stronger. Lowering the energy resistance is the answer to standard resistances (certain at higher levels) and can make damaging spells a bit more attractive. Albeit the usual OP talk that wizards shall not use direct damage spells, I like to deal damage anyways. It’s an archetypical element of wizards, and my practical experience showed that it is not the weakest option to contribute with damage, even if you have those fighters.
So, if we assume that your opponents will have energy resistances and/or damage reduction, would energy vulnerability and vulnerability be worth a shot? Another nice thing is that you get debuff qualities with spells of the abjuration spells (which could be useful if you specialized and banned the Necromancy).

Etherealness, Swift (PH2):
The cheaper version of Etherealness which is usually available at higher level. This could be a good alternative since you could apply the ethereal effect on mid-level-play. The question is where you can apply the duration of 1 round except as escape mechanism in combat.
Ideas?

Field of Resistance (PH2):
Party buff which grants spell resistance 11+CL. It is level 5 though, and it is an area buff, so the SR only works as long as your allies keep up to 20 ft distance to you. I find this one appealing since wizards gets nearly no chance to cast spell resistance. And since SR is a rare feature, I would make use of this spell. Or is SR itself too weak to focus on?

Scattering Trap (PH2):
This spell sounds pretty good and can be applied to defend positions or just to create chaos on a normal battlefield. The good thing is that your shuffling squares grow with your caster level and that the spell is pretty cheap (level 3). I mention the last point because there is a great competition around spell level 4.

Stifle Spell (PH2):
I always liked mechanics which allow a duel (caster vs. caster) scenarios. One attempt to make that working in combat was to disrupt spellcasting. Unfortunately, all those attempts work around concentration checks. This sounds reasonable, but most casters would maximize their concentration skill so that such a skill check won’t be a problem after all if the DC wouldn’t be very high. So, what could we do? Increase the DC of concentration checks? Stifle Spell is one of the better “disrupt spells” since the DC is a bit higher (14 + own casting stat modifier + spell level being cast). But Stifle Spell is level 4 (high competition) which means that we talk about a level range of 8 – 10. At this range, an enemy wizard will have a concentration skill modifier of +11 till +13. It will be even more since you can assume that those enemy wizards won’t start with CON 10, so add up +1 till +3 for the constitution modifier. Say we have an own INT of 20 and the enemy tries to cast one of his powerful spells (level 5), the DC would be 24 (14 + 5 + 5). So, the enemy wizard would save with a chance of ~50% . Is that fine if you consider the opportunity cost (casting a 4th-level spell just to hinder the enemy to cast one spell)? Ideas to improve the “disrupting spell line” or just keep it as it is? Maybe including spell focus? Stifle Spell would gain a profit of spell focus (abjuration) that way.

Sword of Deception (SC): Another pretty decent conjured sword. A big drawback is that your sword gets only a bonus to attacks equal to your caster level. They kept out Intelligence completely.
I dunno, all those better "weapon conjurations" get CL + casting stat. For a 4th-level-spell, i find it a good tweak.
Tweak suggestion: To hit is INT + CL.

Symbol-spells: they could be so handy and a nice tool if they would not have that hefty price tag on it. I mean, 5000 gp for a one shot, stationary debuff?
Maybe just delete the gold requirement? Maybe you could make a transportable rune?
I just like the flavor of rune magic and would apply it.

Power Words: same as symbols, but with the HP-cap. This mechanic is pretty stupid since it conveys metagaming (control/estimate the hit points of your enemy).
Maybe just delete or stretch the HP-limit?
Especially the symbols and power words are enchantment-heavy spells. No wonder why people ban this school if the real gems get a massive nerf. Ideas?
I see good uses for flavor, utility and combat with tweaked symbols and power words.
Tweaks for symbols: remove or lower the material cost to make the spell more attractive for adventuring parties. As written, it only helps a NPC which protects his dungeon/stronghold with symbols (since the material cost is no issue at all).
Tweaks for Power Words: find another mechanism than hit points or make the HP cap bigger
Both spells tweaks could increase the versatility and power of the enchantment school so that a specialist would think twice if he bans enchantment or not.

Misdirection: an overlooked, better form of undetectable alignment? You can send false information to spying inquisitor-like priests or paladins. I read the spell and thought: "there are certainly
way more ways to apply this spell."
In direct competition I see the whole "anti-scrying-line." There is a plenty of them. I fear there are too much to use them all well. We have nondetection, sequester, detect scrying and false vision.
Too many or do you have a goood idea to use some in a mix?


Magic Mouth: I like creative ideas for this flavorlike spell (besides the classic enchantment for portals to welcome guests).
Creative ideas?

Illusory Script: sounds like a very broad, open-ended spell. Besides spellbooks or plot-relevant parchments (letters, maps) you surely find more ideas.
Don't you?

Transmute Rock to Mud/Mud to Rock: besides such nasty combat stuff like flesh to stone and then back to mud, I would like to see more utility and flavor ideas to apply this line of spells.
Maybe include stone shape and move earth?

Contact Other Plane: could it be a worthy divination to plan your next moves? Yes, if we screw the INT-drop. Why, you ask? Because clerics dont lose their casting stats while they use commune, which is very similiar to this one. So, why nerf CoP and keep commune on top?

Planar Binding: I know, the gateway to overpowered munchkin stuff. Not my goal. I’m interested in summons which don’t need a hardcore bargain, especially if you consider that our wizard is a friendly, good-aligned dude who does not deal with evil beings or forces good outsiders to work for him.

Contingency: post your best contingencies here. I just know the classics (globe vs incoming magic, teleport away, open up stoneskin/invisibility after getting hit...)
Side note: since many players ban evocation and use craft contingent spell instead, how useful is this feat really? The costs are pretty high if you consider the fact that you cast many contingent spells over and over.

Banishment: to make this one working, you must carry the stuff which demons n’ devils hate. Besides the PHB-proposals, what solid ideas do you have?

Drawmji's Instant Summons: I never bothered that much with that spell, but at 7th-level, it should be really, really useful, shouldn't it? At least, it sounds like a cool, emergency “get-this-certain-item-spell,” but since it is level 7 and costs 1000 gp, I wonder what items could make this spell attractive (say, except special plot items).

Mordenkainen’s Stuff: Mordenkainen is no bad-ass magician, that’s for sure. Just take a look at his spell inventions, maybe tweak, and maybe find more hidden usages?
Mordenkainen’s Disjunction: the King of undoing magic and disenchanting. Sadly, the WBL-progression and importance of magic items for the character powers in D&D make the useage of this spell impossible as written. But I would like to see a supreme dispel spell at level 9, so I would like to keep and tweak it. One attempt could be to delete the result of permanent dispelling. Maybe suppressing the magical abilities would fit? On the other hand, maybe the world simulation needs a dweomer which can completely disenchant (dangerous) items? But that would be artifacts most times, and those receive a “resistance vs. disjunction” anyways (a wizard 20 has only a 20% chance to affect an artifact). So, what could be a good tweak? And should there be a defence against disjunction (like a caster level check)?
Tweak suggestions: suppress magic ability of items instead of disenchant them permanently.

Mordenkainen’s Faithful Hound: this is pretty nice since it is a combination of an alarm spell and a minor, invisible summon. As a level-5-spell, it is expensive. On the other hand, you could apply extend spell and make your dog last 20+ hours.

Mordenkainen’s Lucubration: you just exchange a higher power (level 6) to get some versatility. I don’t understand why you wouldn’t make use of other spontaneous mechanics in the first place. Plus, which spells are worthwhile to sacrifice one 6th-level spell?

Mordenkainen’s Magnificent Mansion: you have style and a luxurious living standard, even on journey. You could even supply smaller warbands or civilians with the included food (1 dozen per CL!). Besides style and shelter, what other creative uses do you have?

Mordenkainen’s Private Sanctum: this spell is that good that I would even use it as daily spell. There is always a case where you want to talk, plan strategies and so on without the risk to get eavesdropped. Could be a nice synergy with your Magnificent Mansion while travelling. More ideas?
Control Weather: sounds cool, but besides large-scale-battles, I can't see when to make good use of them. On the other hand, it is one of those iconic powers of wizardry to shape the pure elements of nature (storms, rain, lightning).

Light of Lunia/Mercuria/Venya (SC): I like the theme of the spell. They look like kind of “good, white magic wizardry.” Sadly, the mechanics are not that good. At level 1, with Light of Lunia, we get a light spell which we can discharge to deal 1d6 damage. The good thing: the damage is untyped and it increases to 2d6 vs undead and evil outsider. So, we have a win, but only if we knew in the first place that we will face those creature types. Downside: range is 30 ft, which is bad for a wizard, especially around level 1-5. Another downside is that it is a ray, so you must succeed on a ranged touch attack. For 1d6/2d6 at level 1, that’s pretty difficult, especially if you just could go with a standard magic missile and auto-hit. A good thing: you gain 2 rays, so – if I read the spell correctly – you could deliver both rays in the same round, therefore dealing 2d6 (or 4d6 vs undead and evil outsiders). That could make the spell work good enough to apply it as a daily spell.
At Level 2, the Light of Mercuria boosts the ray base damage to 2d6/4d6. With 2 rays, that would mean we could apply 4d6 or even 8d6 vs undead/evil outsiders in one round. Do I read that correctly? If so, I would rate those spell definitely higher.
At Level 3, the Light of Venya boosts the ray base damage again to 3d6/6d6. Again, both rays used, we would deal 6d6 or even 12d6 vs undead or evil outsiders. That’s insane. Furthermore, at level 3 we gain some versatility to heal our party instead of deal damage. Sadly, the secondary ability refers to your divine spellcaster level which is odd. I would tweak it to allow it for arcanes too. The cure would be 1d6 + CL (max. 10) per ray. Suggestions, comments?

Forceward (SC): since force effects are pretty strong and difficult to overcome, a ward against this effects seems a good idea. But how useful is it after all? The downsides: it is an immobile sphere with a 15-ft-radius, so you have to stay stationary to make use of the effect. It has only 1 min/level-duration, which is a very impractical time unit. It is too much for a fight and too low for out-of-combat. Forceward blocks magic missiles, orb of force and maybe bigby’s hands. Plus, it blocks incorporeal movement, so it could be a good countermeasure against shadows, wraith or ghosts (other ideas?). The downside again: those creatures get a will save. Good thing: it works as a counterspell vs. other, stationary force effects so you could dispel a wall of force or a resilient sphere that way (remember that there are nearly no other countermeasures against those effects besides disintegrations).

Force Missiles or Chain Missile (SC): this spells seems like a remembrance to the classic computer RPG neverwinter nights, where you could cast Isaac’s (Greater) Missile Storm. Sadly, the p&p-version is not that useful than the CRPG-version. And then, there is still Orb of Force. But maybe the latter one was too powerful. Anyways, I like those spells and would look for a small tweak to make use of them. One good argument is that our poor evocation school would gain the edge against those casters using conjuration to deal damage  Let’s compare and decide which spell is more useful and how to tweak it:
Chain missile has the same base damage as magic missile (1d4+1). You get 1 missile per 2 caster levels, all striking the primary target (max. 10 missiles with 10d4+10). After that, they bounce to the secondary targets (within 30 ft); comparable with the chain lightning effect. The secondary targets receive only one magic missile (1d4+1) and must be nearby the primary target (30 ft). So basically with chain missile, you would deal damage against one target (5d4+5 at CL 10) and some minor damage against all the secondaries. As shown on the artwork on page 44 of the spell compendium, the spell is made for encounters against ghosts, wraiths, shadows and such stuff since they are hard to hit and their hp are low enough to actually impact them, even with the lower scale of force damage dealt. Another good thing is that chain missile is only level 3 (while force missile is level 4).
Force missile creates magic missiles, too. They deal a flat damage of 2d6 and increase only by the number of missiles which scale low (one missile per 4 caster levels). At level 10, you reach 4d6 force damage, growing to 6d6 at level 12. Good thing: you can allocate all missiles to one target (instead of using the spreading effect).
Summary: personally, I prefer chain missile over force missiles. But the real question is: why would you use any of those two spells if you can have an orb of force with a better scale on damage (1d6/level)? Maybe tweaking around the aforementioned NWN-spell could help: Isaacs Lesser Missile Storm (Level 4) delivers 1 magic missile per CL (max. 10), each dealing 1d6 force damage. The missiles are spread between the number of targets (area: 40 ft-radius). If there are more creatures than missiles, only the nearest target will be damaged. If there are more missiles than creatures, one of the creatures will be hit with multiple missiles.
The Greater Missile Storm works as the lesser one, except as follows: A number of energy missiles (one per caster level up to a maximum of 20) appear and randomly target and hit any creature in the area of effect, evenly distributed to the targets. Each missile does 2d6 points of force damage. A maximum of 10 missiles can hit any one target.
Soo…. If we aim to make a decent force spell besides orb of force, which version or tweak would you apply?

Gedlee’s Electric Loop (SC): This spell seems like another overseen spell. What do we have? At level 2, we get a decent area damage with debuff quality. It deals 1d6/2 CL electricity damage in a 5-ft- radius area (max. 5d6 damage, Reflex half). Not that strong, but: if you fail your reflex save, you must make another will save or be stunned 1 round. Stunning is one of the best debuffs you can deliver, so I like this spell. It targets reflex, so that the DC would still be a viable option around mid levels against casters, monsters and fighters.

Cloud of Bewilderment (Magic of Faerûn vs. SC): this one got updated and nerfed, unfortunately. If you can use 3.0-Material, I would recommend to use the MoF-Version. There, the cloud is a 10-ft-breath-cone which causes stunning and blinding for 1d6 rounds in this area (which is strange, since the area keeps for 1round/lev as cone shape present). Fort negates, which makes the debuff weaker at higher levels. Plus, it is unclear if a creature must save again after the initial round. Ah well, seems like sometimes a 3.5-Update is better, after all.

Quick Potion (SC): let me get this straight: with a 2nd level spell, we can emulate a item creation feat without spending XP or gold? Plus, we can allow our party cleric/druid to make use of our spell? The only limit I see is the duration (1 hour/level) which leads to using a potion pretty soon (instead of hoarding them). But on the other hand, this spell screams for extend spell. Win-win-situation?

Rainbow Beam (SC): ok, I admit: I like prismatic spells. With rainbow beam, we get a decent ray at level 2 which automatically dazzles one target (no save). Is deals 1d12 damage/3 CL. The funny and cool thing is that the damage type is totally random, maybe even twice (if you roll an 8 on the table, you get twice the spell effects what is effectively the same as the split ray or twin spell metamagic feat).

Prismatic Mist (PH2): as mentioned before, prismatic spells rock. This one is pretty good and seldom used (I wonder why). The area of effect is huge (30 ft radius) and lasts long (1 min/level). The real seller is that each creature within the mist must make a save each turn. Rolls 1-3 are low damage only, but the cool stuff is all above a result of 4 – the galore of status effects and debuffs: poison, slow, confusion and even daze. 8 is the winner again and could lead to 2 status debuffs at once. As the targets must repeat their saves, a movement blocking spell synergizes very well with this mist (like, evard’s tentacles or solid fog).

Scintillating Sphere (SC): same as fireball, but electricity damage. So whoever said that mass area damage sucks because of fire resistance, should just swap to this one. Electricity is not resisted that much.
Blackstaff (Magic of Faerûn): Another interesting spell which got no update to 3.5. At high levels, I would memorize this spell every day. You can use it in melee (suboptimal, but with a +4 enhancement, manageable) or better, with your Archmage high arcana (you are an Archmage at high level, aren’t you?) arcane reach and use the spell within 30 ft (though, I wonder if arcane reach works here since the spell demands a successful melee or melee touch attack which implies some “real” melee combat). Ah, well, the spell effect: anyone hit by the enchanted staff is subject to a dispel magic effect. Each time. Plus, if you hit a spellcaster, he must make a will save (hard against Level-8-spell) or lose one of his highest spell slot / prepared spell. Also, you can just stay out of melee and give the enchanted staff to someone of your party.

Simbul’s Spell Matrix / Sequencer / Trigger (Magic of Faerûn): they nerfed this spell line so badly in SC that I refuse to use them. Check the MoF for the real thing. I wonder if the MoF-Versions aren’t too strong, though.
The MoF-Matrix (Level 5) holds 4 spells up to level 3 (instead of 1). This brings the rapid buffing onto a new level (say, casting shield, displacement, mirror image and blink with 1 swift action each, for example). The Sequencer (Level 7) allows 4 spells up to 5th level and allows the link-ability. With link, we can create a sequence with 2 or more spells, but only up to 2nd-level spells. So, we could cast 5 spells of level 1-2 with one swift action. Lastly, the Trigger (Level 9) grants us all of the other two, except that now we can link up to level 4 and store up to level 7. Plus, we gain a contingency effect for one or our stored spells or sequence. Who needs the feat quicken spell, again?
Since using the SC-Version is too weak, if the MoF-Version too strong?

Antimagic Aura (Magic of Faerûn): this one is one spell level higher than AMF, but it allows so much more options and potentials: first and foremost, this is no self-centered-sphere, it is a target spell. So, the antimagic effect only affects one target. The range (touch) is – again – no limit, if we use arcane reach. The only barrier is the will save, which negates the antimagic aura effect. On the other hand, all those abjurers who invested heavily into spell focus and greater spell focus (for example, to reach Io7V) can now find good application fields for their invested feats. But anyways, you must not use the aura against a caster. Use it against a strong fighter or any target with magical properties, but low will saves.
Otiluke’s Suppressing Field (CM): I like “shot-down-spells,” especially against other casters (did I mention my fable for caster-vs-caster-duel already?). The logic behind it is simple: if you can neutralize the Tier-1-enemies, your party wins. And, it’s just plain cool to do something like a Mageduel. Anyway, the Field allows us to shutdown a whole magic school or a descriptor. Ideally, you shut down those things that your enemy does need and not you. I like to shutdown necromancy or evil spells if I challenge a necromancer (or any evil cleric cult). If you deal with battlefield controllers, shut down conjuration. The effect is not 100%, but it is a caster level check each time. The casting time is a bit annoying, but we can live with a full-round-cast once in a while, especially if we receive a good duration (10 min/level).

Reciprocal Gyre (CA): Did I mention that I like to shut-down casters? Here we have another one to do this. I refer to the CA-Version since the SC nerfed this spell so badly that you cannot apply it correctly. My favorite strategy is to make use of arcane sight to check for good gyre targets. The more buffs, the better. The damage will be pretty high and unresistable (untyped damage). Even the will save does not help that much since half damage (after successful save) is still high with 1d6 per spell level. Again, our abjurer friends who invested into spell focus and GSF could make the DC high enough, even for enemy clerics and wizards. The secondary option is the icing on the cake with giving 1d6 rounds of daze-effect after a failed fortitude save. Many would argue that a will save vs casters is too weak. Well, let’s take a look: an abjurer at level 12 could have: INT+6-item (so INT 27 = +8), SF, GSF, spell level 5, leading to a DC of 25. A cleric at level 12 has Will +7, WIS 27. His will save is +15. In other words, even against a class with natural high will saves we have a 50-50-Chance. Good enough for me. If it is very important (major boss fight), you could apply stuff like spell enhancer, limited wish (-7 on saves) or save rerolls.

Suspended Silence (SC): who said that only clerics could silence. We can do it as wizards, but even better (with a trigger-effect) and longer.
Silence is a nice effect for stealth purpose, but also good to shut-down casters.

Project Image: If you ever liked to use your wizard in the battle without fearing that he could get hit, just use an image and hang around at the side of the arena. I see many application fields here, justifying the cost to cast a 7th-level illusion.

Baleful Blink (PH2): another overlooked shutdown spell against casters or any other creature with low fortitude. After all, you debuff an enemy buy giving him a 50% miss chance. Every time.

Vortex of Teeth (SC): you can deal 3d8 force damage per round as an area effect. So, if you ever looked for a reliable area effect damage spell, here you go. The icing on the cake: you can declare one square as unharmed, so you can spare out your party fighter.

Vision of the Omniscient Eye (Dragon Magic): sounds very interesting. As long as you use it in conjuction with see invisibility or true seeing, you get a +10 on spot checks, are immune to dazzle and blind; and you can use a faerie fire effect once (which will end the spell).
Too narrow and specialized? Or a good bread-n-butter spell?

Kiss of Draconic Defiance (Dragon Magic): okay, since I like caster-shutdown-spells, I also like this one. You can create a huge sphere around you (40 ft radius!). Any enemy caster within the area must make a Fortitude save to cast a spell. If he fails, his spell fizzles. If he saves, he is save from the sphere for the rest of the battle. But then again, we have an abjuration spell of 7th level. If we use a dedicated abjurer (Io7V, SF, GSF), the DC is high enough to screw wizards, maybe even clerics and druids. The icing on the cake is a free counterspell option. But you should think twice if you need it since it will end the spell (and so, the sphere).
Comments?

Mark of the Enlightened Soul (Dragon Magic): if you like to deal damage, this spell can be a nice boost. Swift action means that it will affect the damage spell in the same round. If you play iconic campaigns (good vs evil), the effect will apply most times. +50% is like a free empower spell, after all. One restriction is that the damage spell must be of 3rd level or lower, so you will use this spell in conjunction with fireball/scintillating sphere/acid breath.
One question buggers me: is it better to gain +50% on your damage or is it better to gain the ability to make 50% of your base damage non-resistant (like the flame strike spell)?


Okay, there are certainly much more potent and overlooked spells.
Feel free to post them or to comment, suggest or help to tweak the mentioned spells!

Aharon
2012-06-08, 05:49 AM
Won't comment on all spells, but the Light of... Line:

You can cast the same one multiple times on yourself. They don't stack, but overlap. When you discharge one, the others are still active, so you can discharge them one after the other.

There's the runecaster class in PGtF.
Maximized Light of Lunya * 60 costs him 24000 GP. Did anyone say nova, there?

Yuukale
2012-06-08, 06:48 AM
I'm in a bit of a hurry now, but I'll leave this here, since I believe it's the same purpose: http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=4571.0

supermonkeyjoe
2012-06-08, 08:27 AM
Transmute rock to mud is very situational but can be massively useful in any kind of rocky or mountainous environment.

Climbing that cliff? nope it's made of mud.

Crossing that narrow mountain ledge? nope, it's made of mud.

Got a castle at the top? Nope, half its foundations are now resting on mud.

That perilous slope is now a 180' long super-fun mud slide

That stone column is now made of mud, hope it wasn't holding up anything important!

that large rocky overhang is now attached to the mountain by mud, down it comes.

Transmuting rock into mud is so much fun.

Aharon
2012-06-08, 01:09 PM
@Reciprocal Gyre
Usually, in this kind of discussion the most recent version of spell is used.

Lactantius
2012-06-09, 04:31 AM
Won't comment on all spells, but the Light of... Line:

You can cast the same one multiple times on yourself. They don't stack, but overlap. When you discharge one, the others are still active, so you can discharge them one after the other.

There's the runecaster class in PGtF.
Maximized Light of Lunya * 60 costs him 24000 GP. Did anyone say nova, there?

Nice idea! Though, I like to review spells in their raw, unmetamagic'ed way. And even with metamagic, I try to stick to non-cheese (no arcane thesis, reducers and so on).
For the Light of Venya, I wonder if it is worth memorizing 2-3 spells.
And if we go the wand route: personally, I dont like to spend over 10,000 gold for a wand. I use wands for spell level 1-3 with minimal CL.


@Reciprocal Gyre
Usually, in this kind of discussion the most recent version of spell is used.

Yes, I am aware of that.
But frankly, I pick the versions which are more appealing or interesting (although I try to nont going the cheese- or overpowered way).
Reciprocal Gyre just sounds like one of those interesting spells, but as written in the SpC, it is just too weak for a 5th-level spell. 1d12 per spell may sound nice, but it can be really weak if your opponent uses 2-3 buffs (and that amount is pretty usual if we don't have a major villain).
With 1d6/spell level, you have a better reliability, even with 2-3 low level buffs.
The same approach was done with the (Simbul's) Spell Matrix/Sequencer/Trigger-Line.
In SpC, this spells are not worth the slots since you could get better mechanics to simulate more cast spells/round.
In Magic of Faerûn, this spells ware much more powerful. Some may argue tha they could be too powerful, especially because you could deliver up to 4 spells.
I'm curious. 4 spells sounds strong, but then again, you can only apply 1 per round, so it works similar to a damage-over-time-spell: you must be sure that the combat last long enough to make use of the effect.
Later on, you maybe stick to the "link"-feature instead, so you will stick to two spells, but cast simultaenously.
This sounds pretty strong, but since it affect low level spells, I see it in the range of those low-level-buffs you want to cast, but never have time for (like, blur/shield/protection from evil/mirror image).


I'm in a bit of a hurry now, but I'll leave this here, since I believe it's the same purpose: http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=4571.0

Thanks, a very useful thread. The author goes an interesting way by compiling each spell in conjunction with metamagic and item creation.

But this thread could work alongside with the other one.
The purpose of this thread is to collect creativity and to give rare/circumstancial spells a spotlight so that you could tend to use them more often in your own game.
One reason for that was that I got tired of the bland OP-suggestions which include the daily used battlefield controls, debuffs and party buffs around the same builds (focused conjurers, ScMs, incantatrix and stuff).
IF we can give those rare mentioned spells more versatility, they could be a nice backup for those ususal core and no-brainer spells.

sonofzeal
2012-06-09, 05:00 AM
I once built a Suel Archanamach whose signature was Extended Swift Etherealness for four rounds of it, at a very reasonable spell level. Pretty effective, all told!

Kerilstrasz
2012-06-09, 05:14 AM
Etherealness, Swift (PH2):
The cheaper version of Etherealness which is usually available at higher level. This could be a good alternative since you could apply the ethereal effect on mid-level-play. The question is where you can apply the duration of 1 round except as escape mechanism in combat.
Ideas?

heres an idea... (you have to be able o cast it 2wice in the same day)

it's night... ppl went to sleep... stores are closed... and you want that pile of gold in the local store... go by the wall,cast it and step in... get the thinks you want, cast it again and step out :P

another 1...
hide an item... hold the item,cast the spell, leave the item in the ethereal plane and w8 1 round to get bk.

i dont know if the following works... but cant you do the above with an oponent?

Hirax
2012-06-09, 06:28 AM
Binding chain of fate, from Waterdeep. One of the best save or die spells in the game.

Halaster's baleful teleport, from Waterdeep. Does exactly what it sound like.

Suspension, from Shining South. So you want to make an airship?

Skin of the steel dragon, from Champions of Valor or Ruin (I forget which). Persistable SR for wizards.

Mordenkainen's capable caravel, from Stormwrack. What's not to like about have your own mage's mansion on a boat that lasts days/2CL? For bonus points, cast suspension on a few inanimate objects and place them in the boat to create an airship. Suspension has an even longer duration than MCC, so you can easily get weeks out of one airship.

The entire mother cyst line, from Libra Mortis. Necrotic tumor is what dominate spells wish they could be - and it gets around mind affecting immunity!

Choose destiny and warp destiny, Races of Destiny. Natural ones and failed saves are not spoken here!

Algid enhancement and mantle of the icy soul, from Frostburn. What's not to like about spells with uncapped bonuses? Especially when comboed with the following:

Consumptive field, Spell Compendium. Rocket your CL, especially if you're using circle magic.

Flesh to ice, Frostburn. One of the lowest level save or be screwed spells in the game.

Frostfell, Frostburn. Flesh to ice is awesome, but a mass version that also can freeze terrain for hours/level is 100% awesome.

Iceberg, Frostburn. Have you ever wanted a very large object to fall on someone? One large enough that it buries a 40' radius worth of creatures? Another of the best save or be screwed spells in the game.

Undermaster. This allows you to use several spells as a standard action for its 5 round duration, even if those spells normally have longer casting times. That's a great list of spells you can use for 5 rounds, but let's focus on move earth. By reducing it's casting time to a standard action, that means on one round you can move a 750'x750'x10' area of earth (5,625,000 cubic feet) to anywhere within the range of the spell (400+40*CL). That's enough earth to bury even a flying enemy unless they're at a pretty good altitude. Combine with Frostfell to entomb them.

Heroics, Spell Compendium. Fighters, who needs them? Wizards, because this spell requires armor from a 15th level fighter unless you have eschew materials. :smallbiggrin:

Stasis clone, Lords of Darkness. Like clone, but better.

Ensul's soultheft, Waterdeep. Immortality is nice, this is a nice method to obtain it if you've got one hell of mean streak.

Blizzard, Frostburn. A foot of snow per round for rounds/level for hundreds of feet around you. Combo with snowsight to shut down any creature that relies on vision.

Scalding mud, Sandstorm. Anything that can't fly is screwed.

Friendly fire, Examplars of Evil. Just say no to ranged attacks!

Invoke magic, Lords of Madness. Swift action casting time, allows you to cast 1 spell while inside any sort of anti magic area.

Permeable form, Lords of Madness. Be incorporeal for 1 round as an immediate action.

Maze, PHB. Doesn't get enough recognition despite being a core spell, this can take someone out of a fight for several rounds, and it doesn't allow a save! Assay spell resistance and true casting make getting around SR easy, if you're facing something with it.

Downdraft, Spell Compendium. Fling a flying creature 100' towards the ground, or 50' toward the ground if they make their save and don't have evasion. Many flying creatures lack good reflex saves, let alone evasion.

Secret Page, PHB. Easy to overlook, but you can be very creative with this. I enjoy disguising my spellbooks as trashy romance novels with it.

Dancing lights and ghost sound, PHB. Hey what's that over there!

Also, I take issue with your claim that forceward doesn't move with you. When it says immobile, it presumably means it's glued to you, and moves with you, based on the following part of the spell:

Forceward does not push a creature out of the way if you move toward an incorporeal creature or force effect, and such creatures are treated as if they automatically succeeded on their saving throws against this spell.