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TechnOkami
2012-06-16, 12:56 AM
...Evil Characters.

Now, I can write really good backstories and backgrounds for Evil Characters, but I cannot play as a convincing evil guy. I don't know if it's just because I feel too corny doing it or if I have my pesky morality coming into play, I just can't friggin' do it- and it annoys the hell out of me!

So, I'm coming to you, GitPeople. I need some honest to goodness help in roleplaying evil, because I can't seem to do it.

Craft (Cheese)
2012-06-16, 01:08 AM
I have a similar problem: I can't play a character well unless I really sympathize with them and want to see them succeed.

Something that's partially worked for me and might work for you too: Give your evil character humanizing qualities, like "Loves puppies" or "Can't function properly in the morning without a nice cup of tea."

Even if these qualities never come up in play, or even if the rest of your table never finds out about them, the humanizing qualities help because they give you vital context to understand how the character thinks. I might not be able to understand a crazed serial killer, but I can understand a puppy lover.

GreenZ
2012-06-16, 01:48 AM
When I started roleplaying I also had a bit of difficulty roleplaying evil characters that I've learned to work around. There are generally four main things I make sure to do when I roleplay evil aligned characters.


1. Make them believe in their own goals. Nobody says "Hey I'm going to enslave these people simply because I want money and I can" instead the thought process is more understandable at a basic level such as believing that "This is simply how the world works" or "If you get caught and enslaved you deserve to be."

2. Have reasons for them making these choices. Tie decisions together and proactively weave some character into the choices; many people who grew up with slavery, for example, simply believe that it's how the world is supposed to work. Sometimes other aspects of the character can flavor decisions; slight mental disorders or common phobias such as paranoia, superiority complexes, and fear of death can be perfectly valid choices for why your evil character does what they do without taking over the character altogether.

3. Once you choose a few choice aspects and decisions base future choices and decisions on those first few. For example, a person who sees slavery as OK would also be much more likely to endure torture. The first few choices should tie into almost every single choice thereafter.

4. Being evil does not mean always choosing evil options. Just because your character enslaves people doesn't mean they burn down cities, backstab allies, and plot world domination all the time; maybe they tend to like living in cities, sees value in having trusted allies, and don't want to put up with the fuss of ruling over anyone but still like to have their own personal servants?


As the above poster said, humanize them; evil people are not always world conquering machines, most exist in daily society without causing too much fuss in fact.

Arcanist
2012-06-16, 01:48 AM
...Evil Characters.

A lot of people have this problem my friend... :smallfrown:


Now, I can write really good backstories and backgrounds for Evil Characters, but I cannot play as a convincing evil guy. I don't know if it's just because I feel too corny doing it or if I have my pesky morality coming into play, I just can't friggin' do it- and it annoys the hell out of me!

You see, I'm the opposite, I'm terrible at writing backstories for Villains and I can be a very convincing Villain... I find it easier to just throw away your morality (temporarily) and think of yourself as #1. "The Fighter needs to be resurrected? Well thats horrible but I think he'll enjoy life more as a Corpse creature or even better! a Death Knight!" Being a villain has very little to do with just being Evil its more about wanting more and more then everyone else... I find greed and hunger to be very good sources of villainy, however Pride is what your really looking for... :smallamused:

Honestly... I find it much more simply to just find a specific type of Villain archtype (Look through Exemplars of Evil) and then exemplify it for a few days before your game... For example: I remember one time I pretended to be a psychotic, megalomaniac, Cerebremancer (StP Erudite/Generalist Wizard book keeping was what was really driving me crazy) in the time span of a few games (like 7) I managed to intimidate the entire party into electing me leader, convince the Cleric of Heironious to take me before his abbot (as to where I Dominated him) and eventually lead us to conquering the neighboring Theocracy...

The example character wanted more power then anyone and he wanted above all else to become a god... :smallamused: He didn't care who he had to step on to get it, he just wanted power and he didn't care what he lost :smallamused:


So, I'm coming to you, GitPeople. I need some honest to goodness help in roleplaying evil, because I can't seem to do it.

Ah, theres your problem! You still have respect for the people around you :smallbiggrin: ... Get rid of it :smallannoyed:

TechnOkami
2012-06-16, 01:57 AM
Ah, theres your problem! You still have respect for the people around you :smallbiggrin: ... Get rid of it :smallannoyed:

I... think I just figured out why I can't do the Evil stuff...

It's 'cause I feel like a complete douche afterwards. :/

NikitaDarkstar
2012-06-16, 01:58 AM
Evil characters can be hard to do, but once you get a hang of them they can be fun.

First of all decide what kind of evil. There's the insane evil that does evil simply because it amuses them. Then you got the highly ambitious evil that generally isn't TRYING to get people hurt, but put their own ambitions above the needs and well being of others. And then of course the evil by generally not caring about others and deflecting responsibility onto others. I'm sure you can think of other types but those are the archetypes I tend to use for Chaotic, Lawful and Neutral Evil myself.

The thing is you need to stop to look at them like their alignment. They're not Lawful/Evil, they're a person, just like the Lawful/Good guy. As such they have friends, family, ambitions, motivations and simply basic needs. And unless they're insane (or uncivilized brutes) they're not going to do things that will get them in trouble if it can be avoided. They also care about what friends they have and might even be protective of them. But a stranger? If they can't benefit from helping a stranger then they're quite likely to just keep on walking without feeling the slightest bit of remorse. If they're getting payed to do something evil (like the classical assassin example) they might be doing it partly because they truly enjoy that type of work, or not see the problem. They got payed to do it, if they said no, someone else would be payed to do it and it would still get done, so where is the harm in profiting from it?

And evil characters aren't likely to see themselves as evil (unless they're clerics serving an evil god and honestly, I tend to classify most of them as quite close to insane and/or power hungry). Granted they probably won't see themselves as good either, but in their opinion they're not really any worse than anyone else (thus neutral in their own opinion), they're just doing what needs to be done. (Sometimes what needs to be done to achieve a goal, sometimes just what needs to be done to stay alive.). But they're also more likely to do what is easiest and best for them at any given point. Need to get in somewhere that's guarded? Well a proper neutral character (or good) would probably knock the guard out and tie them up if they could, the evil character slits their throat because that way the guard can't identify them at all, and the guard knew the risk when signing up for the job, if he wasn't willing to take the risk he shouldn't have taken the job, so it's not really your characters fault now is it?

Mind you, when I go for evil I tend to go neutral/evil, but I find that as long as you can answer the question "Why is my character doing this?" when he's doing something bad you'll be fine. Just as asking "What is in it for my character?" works when he's about to do something good.

Of course all characters have some exceptions from the rules and redeeming qualities. Like my current character, he'll won't stick his nose in anything that isn't his business because well, it's not his business and he has nothing to gain from sticking his neck out for others. But don't let him catch you harming a child, it will be the last mistake you ever made. Why? Because <insert long backstory about lousy childhood here> means he knows what it's like, and growing up he always wished someone would have helped him out, it never happened.

TL;DR
Stop trying to play the alignment, play the character! :p

Arcanist
2012-06-16, 02:11 AM
I... think I just figured out why I can't do the Evil stuff...

It's 'cause I feel like a complete douche afterwards. :/

Well stop caring... its the first step towards being a complete douche :smalltongue:

Yukitsu
2012-06-16, 02:12 AM
The best place to start is laughing. If you can get the evil laughter down, the rest comes relatively naturally.

After you get a really natural sounding evil laugh down, you won't feel really corny saying anything.

Jarian
2012-06-16, 02:13 AM
Well, you seem to have the boring Evil with a capital E mixed up with the fun kind of evil. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MagnificentBastard)

That seems to be your biggest problem.

TechnOkami
2012-06-16, 02:29 AM
The best place to start is laughing. If you can get the evil laughter down, the rest comes relatively naturally.

After you get a really natural sounding evil laugh down, you won't feel really corny saying anything.


Well, you seem to have the boring Evil with a capital E mixed up with the fun kind of evil. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MagnificentBastard)

That seems to be your biggest problem.

I think I have a character who fits that bill...

Leshy
2012-06-16, 05:51 AM
Actually, I've always wondered why actors who plays evil characters in movies are much more recognized and respected. As a matter of fact, I've always been thinking "pff, I could do THAT and win an Oscar". But it might not be an easy job after all.

Anyway, my really evil characters, bosses, are neither never shown really early nor they get a lot of "play" time. But their minion(s), who are also evil and get a lot of play time is generally sleazy, arrogant, 5'4 guy, the guy who, if you slap him will fly 30 feet, but still you know you can't do him a **** because he is powerful / have powerful friends. I enjoy having characters like that just to see how much my players will stand his bull**** before they beat the **** out of him :smallbiggrin:

Frenth Alunril
2012-06-16, 07:20 AM
Just remember, "the road to hell is paved with good intentions."

Make the evil all about good intentions, and it becomes an irascible moral dilemma. My players are still trying to figure out the first encounter they had, because the evil they faced was a bug in the ear of a good man.

I always they to make evil rational, it flies in the face of bad villains.

Silma
2012-06-16, 07:54 AM
Maybe you could start with a Neutral Evil Character. Try playing a rogue. HE/She is a thief for many years, so he is accustomed in stealing things. Maybe he has grown without parents, an had to struggle hard to survive in the streets. Maybe he had to backstab a few people in the past in order to live. He is not the kind of bad person that has an ultimate evil goal. Instead he is an opportunist who simply doesn't care in he has to do some bad stuff in order to advance himself. So you can work well in a party, but when it comes to some decisions that your character has to make alone, he believes in vengeance, he refuses to give second chances, and will not hesitate to kill a man in cold blood if that means advancing his own goals. For instance ,if an evil king needs to be overthrown, instead of putting him in jail, you just murder him. Your goal is still pretty noble, but your means are not. That makes you a little bit more evil. Then try to do the same in any kind of similar situations. Keep in mind that being evil is not how your character feels, but how he is perceived in a social setting.

Bit Fiend
2012-06-16, 08:35 AM
For me the most important thing about evil characters is this: Always remember that being Evil is not their sole defining character trait nor is it their purpose in life. They have their own goals, which are often reasonable, some plain egoistical others may be even considered atruistic. It's just their means which are extreme if they feel like it. This is not to say that they will always choose the most evil way possible to do something, however they will choose it when they consider it the easiest/most effective way.

For instance, if he needs information from a prisoner a good character will not resort to torture no matter what (well, he might, but only under extreme circumstances and feel a great deal of regret for doing so). A neutral character will use it as a last resort or at least after attempts at other methods have been ineffective. An evil character won't think twice about it. He will torture the prisoner the moment he thinks its the fastest way to get the information.

Of course there is also the sadistic maniac but I never play those as I find them boring.

Knaight
2012-06-17, 03:21 AM
Of course there is also the sadistic maniac but I never play those as I find them boring.

As a GM, I'd note that these can be useful as bit characters. I'd never put them as anything above a flunky for someone else, and even then they're likely to be hateful fanatics for whom sadism is something they do to those they don't actually consider people, but they can work.

Jack of Spades
2012-06-17, 04:24 AM
There's also the Dexter route. Make a character who is otherwise likable, but for one reason or another (this is a lot easier in magical settings) is compelled to do horrific things. After a while, the character will probably learn to like or at least justify it, the same way most people manage to do with the big chunks of their personality as they age/mature/come to terms with their place in the world. Bam! Evil'd.

Re'ozul
2012-06-17, 09:27 AM
I also can't really play evil characters that well. Though that depends on what kind of evil it is.

Lawful evil with plans within plans where I rarely actually have to do anything directly evil is easy.
Callous evil (leaving a hurt orphan to die, destroying the lifes and hopes of npcs) is so much harder. I can play it and very well from what I am told, but I always feel kinda sad and dirty when I do it. I just like to play do-gooders a lot more.

Sudain
2012-06-18, 11:17 AM
When I started roleplaying I also had a bit of difficulty roleplaying evil characters that I've learned to work around. There are generally four main things I make sure to do when I roleplay evil aligned characters.


1. Make them believe in their own goals. Nobody says "Hey I'm going to enslave these people simply because I want money and I can" instead the thought process is more understandable at a basic level such as believing that "This is simply how the world works" or "If you get caught and enslaved you deserve to be."

2. Have reasons for them making these choices. Tie decisions together and proactively weave some character into the choices; many people who grew up with slavery, for example, simply believe that it's how the world is supposed to work. Sometimes other aspects of the character can flavor decisions; slight mental disorders or common phobias such as paranoia, superiority complexes, and fear of death can be perfectly valid choices for why your evil character does what they do without taking over the character altogether.

3. Once you choose a few choice aspects and decisions base future choices and decisions on those first few. For example, a person who sees slavery as OK would also be much more likely to endure torture. The first few choices should tie into almost every single choice thereafter.

4. Being evil does not mean always choosing evil options. Just because your character enslaves people doesn't mean they burn down cities, backstab allies, and plot world domination all the time; maybe they tend to like living in cities, sees value in having trusted allies, and don't want to put up with the fuss of ruling over anyone but still like to have their own personal servants?


As the above poster said, humanize them; evil people are not always world conquering machines, most exist in daily society without causing too much fuss in fact.


To build a character off this:
Sold into slavery by his parents as a young kid, he learned that slavery A) Sucks, B) is effective, C) is the way of the world. After much mis-treatment and abuse he eventually escaped using his newly developed penchant for magic(Okay so I'm a magic user at heart. Sorcerer because slaves mostly likely weren't allowed to learn magic... :)). Set out to put an end to slavery. Sadly he's learned it always ends up being revived, usually in a means worse than what was stamped out. So instead he's going to unite and unionize the slave trade - setting conditions higher and giving education and a future to slaves.

Flaws: Has no respect for any sentient's dignity or right over their future. If he can make their lives better by reshaping it for them, he probably will. Kinda power hungry, and will eventually need to start being paranoid of assassins.

RP goals: take over and unionize slave trades. Set higher standards by directly managing his own trade, possibly by starting a plantation. He's going to make enemies so he'll need a personal army he can indoctrinate. So... he'll need a *ahem* camp so he can produce out soldiers to protect the camp. While they are doing that he'll provide education, and a fund so his army will have a future. Proving how benevolent he is.

Long term RP: Turn slave trade guild into a center of freedom. Any slave the gives you 5 years their life and obeys unconditionally to anything asked of them will be given free education, the ability to 'buy' the freedom of another slave(who did not make this deal), 50 gold, and allowed to leave unconditionally. You are founding a place where slaves can earn their lives, and future back. All you ask in return is some of their time and willingness to help yourself build a legacy, a better place for your children(one despicable, revolting act at a time). To give them the future and chances in life that we never did.

RP Tactics: You've been there and you understand. You can help make it better. They just have to turn everything over to you. If they won't do it willingly you'll drag them kicking and screaming into your light until they understand exactly how beautiful and wonderful your making the world.

Signature spells:
Charm person
Dominate person
Geas
Planar binding(not for gamebreaking - but as a demonstrate able proof of his power)
Secret Page(for communicating with his guild/plantation).
Glibness(need to work with DM)

Major Skills:
Forgery
Sense Motive
Concentration/Spellcraft
Bluff/Diplomacy

-=-=-
Damn, now I want to play this guy; or put him in a campaign - he seems like he'd be a fun BBEG.

kyoryu
2012-06-18, 01:37 PM
Like a lot of people have suggested, abandon the mustachio-twirling villain, and the sadistic puppy-kicker behind.

The defining characteristic of evil is that they will violate the rights of others. This leaves two interesting questions/points:

1) For what reasons will they violate the rights of others?
2) They are not *compelled* to violate the rights of others, they are simply *willing* to.

Having a character that's willing to be evil for a "noble" cause is a good way to do a sympathetic evil character.

Another good question is to ask how they're able to handle violating the rights of others.

1) They enjoy it (sadistic evil)
2) They're callous about it
3) They're unaware of what they're doing
4) They're torn up about it, but believe they must for a greater good
5) They're torn up about it, but are internally compelled

Also, characters can be selective in their evil. Most people are nice to their friends, at a minimum. But an evil character can be more choosy about their evil - only unleashing it against those who are "worthy" of it, by virtue of real or perceived actions. For instance: "Mages are evil people that seek to tear the world apart." A character that believes this may be a wonderful, upstanding human being in many ways, until they're put in the vicinity of a mage. At that time, their evil ways take over, out of what they believe is necessity. A *lot* of memorable evil characters fit this general skeleton, and most of them won't believe that they're evil.

As a final thought, characters don't have to be pure evil. An evil tyrant that will happily crush his opposition may still genuinely care about and help the poor. The mass murderer may save an orphan from a fire. That doesn't stop them from being evil, and it doesn't make them neutral either.