Build Advice for a Gestalt cleric(With some stipulations)

[Theroc]

Okay. So, from advice in a previous thread I started and the gaping hole in roles I saw in the party, I'm doing something I'm totally unfamiliar with and seekin' a bit of advice.

I'm going to try a Cleric. I was originally going to avoid it for fear of CoDzilla, but my party is almost entirely some form of fairly powerful Gestalt (Paladin|Sorcerer, Warlock|Dread Necromancer, Duskblade|Warblade, Druid|(Psychic Warrior or Swordsage, undecided there), so I felt backin' the Druid up with some healing might be a good idea... but healbot is NOT what my character will be specializing in.

Here are the things I(we) have to work with
Beginning at level 1(Still want ideas for later on in the build since we are hoping this campaign goes for awhile.)
Any WoTC source, homebrew reviewed on Request. (Currently accepted Homebrew: The Evolutionist by Draken (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=240717), Conceited from DandDwiki (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Conceited_(3.5e_Flaw)), Directionless from the previous site, the constitution benefit is dropped though due to overpowered, [url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/High_Metabolism_(3.5e_Flaw)]High Metabolism from dandwiki again. (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Directionless)
1 Flaw allowed
Anything +1 LA template/racewise will have it's LA waived entirely to increase RP options.
100 starting gold or the better of the classes gold, whichever is greater.
Restriction: Absolutely NO demonic/evil/diabolic traits in your character. DM's younger sister is playing and has some sort of condition which causes panick when these subjects come up, regardless of context. I don't understand it, but I'll respect it because I have no intention of being 'That Guy'.

One side of my Gestalt will be the Evolutionist, since I requested it and I really, really like the class. Other side I currently intend to eventually go Geomancer, heavily leaning towards the divine side. Spell Versatility could be used for keying my Divine spells off of charisma if I understand correctly, allowing me to avoid MAD a bit. I'll be using the Half-Minotaur for backstory reasons (Character was a wizards insane experiment, hence the template and Evolutionist side of the gestalt).

Character concept is a fairly straightforward combat brute (Thinking Evolutionist can help some of the heavy lifting on this end, but I've heard Clerics are amazing frontliners too), who can also support his allies a bit as well. If I can rebuke instead of turn undead without losing too much healing effectiveness, that's a bonus but not required.

My Rolls for attributes were:
16
16
16
15
15
12

Any advice for whether to start with Sorcerer+Precocious apprentice to allow more cleric levels in the future or if I should just do cleric first and take 3 sorc levels instead of 1, etc... would be much appreciated. Also, suggestions for base race, etc...

[JeminiZero]

Why do you need Cha for? DMM fuel?

Spell versatility only lets you key DCs off Cha. For spell access and bonus slots, Wisdom is still required. So even with spell versatility, you will still want at least 19 Wis to access your high level spells.

In fact, because a Cleric tends to be buff focused, DCs are LESS important than bonus slots. To this end, I would recommend using the Dynamic Priest feat instead (from Dragonlance, Legend of the Twins, keys your divine spell access and bonus slots off Cha, but DCs are still based on Wis, although you COULD change that with Spell Versatility).

[Theroc]

Why do you need Cha for? DMM fuel?

Spell versatility only lets you key DCs off Cha. For spell access and bonus slots, Wisdom is still required. So even with spell versatility, you will still want at least 19 Wis to access your high level spells.

In fact, because a Cleric tends to be buff focused, DCs are LESS important than bonus slots. To this end, I would recommend using the Dynamic Priest feat instead (from Dragonlance, Legend of the Twins, keys your divine spell access and bonus slots off Cha, but DCs are still based on Wis, although you COULD change that with Spell Versatility).

A couple reasons I prefer charisma over wisdom. Having a Half-Minotaur freakish looking guy who eats people the bad guys(Swallow Whole Mutation from Evolutionist) who can be perfectly charming and well-mannered and be... likable I find utterly hilarious for RP effects. DMM fuel is a consideration, though I *Might* be playin' light on DMM since I don't wanna overshadow anyone in the party. The other reason was to increase the effect of turn/rebuke.

The feat advice is helpful. I'll have to look into getting my hands on that book so I can have something to refer my DM to.

[Jack_Simth]

Do you plan on being a Geomancer (Cleric) or a Geomancer(Sorcerer)? Changes advice a bit. From the healing help for the Druid, I'm going to assume Geomancer(Cleric) for now.

How much cheddar do you want?

You can actually get by with 0 levels in Sorcerer. Seriously.
There's a regional feat (Magical Training) in Player's Guide to Faerun, that nets you cantrips, which is enough to qualify you for Precocious Apprentice (Complete Arcane). That gives you second level spells on the arcane side with no class levels at all.

[JeminiZero]

Having a Half-Minotaur freakish looking guy who eats people the bad guys(Swallow Whole Mutation from Evolutionist)

As long as you don't scare the crap out of the DMs sister. :smalltongue:


DMM fuel is a consideration, though I *Might* be playin' light on DMM since I don't wanna overshadow anyone in the party. The other reason was to increase the effect of turn/rebuke.

Consider DMM for support spells like Mass Lesser Vigor to keep the party healthy then.

[Theroc]

Do you plan on being a Geomancer (Cleric) or a Geomancer(Sorcerer)? Changes advice a bit. From the healing help for the Druid, I'm going to assume Geomancer(Cleric) for now.

How much cheddar do you want?

You can actually get by with 0 levels in Sorcerer. Seriously.
There's a regional feat (Magical Training) in Player's Guide to Faerun, that nets you cantrips, which is enough to qualify you for Precocious Apprentice (Complete Arcane). That gives you second level spells on the arcane side with no class levels at all.

You are correct. Geomancer(Cleric). The party consists of 7 people. 3 of that 7 have arcane spellcasting, and two get to level 9 spells. (One has a side in Dread necro, one is a Sorcadin, the other is a Duskblade). We will also have a Druid and a Crusader to assist with healing so I needn't be a healbot(and I don't wanna be.).

Hm... I like that solution. I'll have to make sure my DM will not throw a book at me, however.

I am the most rules-savvy player in my group, and I previously avoided casters explicitly to avoid going overboard. Since half the group or more is going full-casters, I'm slightly less worried over this, especially since I am helping the group (Minus one player who I've literally never even met before) build their characters. So, a little cheese is fine. (The DM *DID* approve Half-Minotaur even after I told him I could have 28 strength at level 1.)

Between Dynamic Priest, Magical Training and Precocious Apprentice, I think I could get around needing a high-wisdom score.

Edit: Forgot to mention another reason I liked cha over wisdom.

The Evolutionist can get access to a mutation which allows them to add charisma to saving throws. (one mutation per saving throw, and requires a feat to access the mutation, but between the aforementioned feats and this mutation, it almost makes Wisdom entirely dumpable.)



As long as you don't scare the crap out of the DMs sister.
I did mention this tactic to the DM, and all he said was it was hilarious. Her issue isn't with monsters as it is with 'Demons', the 'Devil', 'Hell', 'EVIL'. Apparently I can kick puppies as long as demon didn't tell me to do it, and I don't kill innocents.

[Theroc]

Seem to be having trouble locating that book, Jemini. How uncommon is it?

[JeminiZero]

Seem to be having trouble locating that book, Jemini. How uncommon is it?

Its an uncommon splat for what is already an uncommon setting, published by a 3rd party book for an out-of-print game edition. Finding it at your FLGS is unlikely. If you want a dead tree version, you might have to order it especially. :smallfrown:

[Theroc]

Dead tree isn't strictly necessary, as I specifically only want the feat. I just need some sort of quotable source to show my DM so he knows I'm not making stuff up. >.> Granted, he *DOES* accept homebrew pending review, he wanted to 'keep things simple and just use printed 3.5 wizards material' (I don't think he realizes just how many splatbooks 3.5 has).

Edit:

Wait, is this a third party book, Jemini?