[PF] Me and ALL the Animal Friends

[grarrrg]

Alright, first things first, this could be considered a sequel to this thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=237701).

The short version of that post was a character that had full progression Mount, Animal Companion and nearly full progression Familiar.
The build was Cavalier 4/Druid 16 OR Cavalier 4/Ranger (Falconer) 16

So you'd have 4 PC/NPC's for the 'cost' of just one PC (and we aren't even using Leadership!).

But I got to thinking... we can do better than just 3 little friends.

Cavalier 4 w/Horse Master Feat stays the same.
13 CHA for Eldritch Heritage > Familar also stays the same.
BUT we are going to take 16 levels of Cleric (I have no idea how I didn't think of this before but...), we are NOT going to worship a deity, because our Domains of choice do not share a deity (if for some reason we NEED to worship a deity, then the Separatist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/archetypes/paizo---cleric-archetypes/separatist) archetype steps up, we lose 2 levels on one of our Companions though).
Our Domains shall be Animal (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/domains/paizo---domains/animal-domain), and Scalykind (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/domains/paizo---domains/scalykind-domain).
Animal grants a Companion at Cleric-3, Scalykind a Companion at Cleric-2.
Taking Boon Companion twice should be self explanatory.

After all is said and done, we have:
Mount: level 20 (Cavalier)
Companion: level 17 (Animal)
Companion: level 18 (Scalykind, must be a Snake, or if Subdomain allowed, any Dinosaur)
Familiar: same HD/BAB as us, level 18 for 'Familiar Abilities' (note, we have 16 BAB)


BONUS ROUND!
Drop 3 levels of Cleric, throw on 3 levels of Shadowdancer (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/core-rulebook/shadowdancer).
At 3rd level, a Shadowdancer gets a "Shadow" that shares our BAB and has 1/2 our HP (like a Familiar).

Cavalier 4/Cleric 13/Shadowdancer 3
Mount: level 20
Companion: level 14
Companion: level 15
Familiar: same HD/BAB as us, level 18 for 'Familiar Abilities'.
Shadow: same HD/BAB as us (16 BAB if Fractional allowed, otherwise 15)

Also, we have spent the vast majority of our feats. 3 for Shadowdancer pre-reqs, 2 Boon Companions, 1 Horse Master, and 2 to get a Familiar.
I recommend Human as race for the Bonus Feat :smallcool:


Too much?

[deuxhero]

Multiple instances of Animal Companions stack, not overlap/produce 2, in PF.

This is too your benefit if Eldritch Heritage: Sylvan is allowed, as you get to Druid level+(CL-5, minimum 1). The wording on everything else prevents you from getting higher than normal animal companions though.

[jaybird]

If you just want a lot of friends, why not try Summoner/Paladin with Eldritch Heritage (Arcane) for an Eidolon, a Mount, and a Familiar?

[Drelua]

If you don't mind 3rd party stuff, you could try the Beastmaster (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/3rd-party-classes/tripod-machine/beastmaster). They basically get d12 HD, full BAB and a tonne of animal companions at different effective druid levels. Maybe take the trait that gives you UMD for a bunch of group buff wands, and just swarm people with a pack of tigers and wolves. Wolves to knock 'em down, tigers to shred 'em.

[grarrrg]

Multiple instances of Animal Companions stack, not overlap/produce 2, in PF.

This is too your benefit if Eldritch Heritage: Sylvan is allowed, as you get to Druid level+(CL-5, minimum 1). The wording on everything else prevents you from getting higher than normal animal companions though.

*internet rummaging*
According to most of the stuff I can find you CAN have MULTIPLE Animal Companions (withOUT resorting to the Pack Lord Archetype).

But I did find one thing that kills my idea (sort of).
Link (http://paizo.com/pathfinderSociety/faq#v5748eaic9os6) to the Pathfinder Society FAQ. Generally if it is allowed in Society, it is allowed in the main game, and it looks like you CAN have more than one Animal Companion in Society games, but there is a "but" in there: (emphasis added)

How many animals can I have at any given time?
...
If you have more than one class-granted animal companion (or eidolon), you must choose which will be considered the combat animal at the start of the scenario. In general, a mount, a familiar or mundane pet, and your class-granted animal(s) are acceptable, but more than that can be disruptive.
So the implication appears to be I can have as many companions as I want, but I can only use one.
Then again, this is the "Society" FAQ, so what goes in one, may not necessarily go for the other.

Also, there are cases where "stacking effective Druid level" would not make any sense. Such as Cavalier + Falconer Ranger. Cavalier must have a "ride-able" companion, and Ranger must have a "bird-of-prey". The 2 restrictions are incompatible with each other (unless you are a Tiny race or something...), so you would almost have to be allowed separate companions.

[marcielle]

As far as pets go, Psicrystal are pretty useful. They get feats, can manifest psionics, fly and have a hardness . And they follow your character level instead of psionic class level so you lose one level off the cleric pets to get a level 20 psicrystal.

[CTrees]

First, we have the text of the animal companion entry (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/druid/animal-companions):
The character's druid level. The druid's class levels stack with levels of any other classes that are entitled to an animal companion for the purpose of determining the companion's statistics.

This does not say a thing about charcters animal companions from two sources other than druid. The Cavalier's mount ability and the Animal and Scalykind domains all lack specifications about stacking, presumably being covered by the animal companion entry (the Ranger's Hunter's Bond also lacks anything about stacking).

Also, the text of Boon Companion supports multiple animal companions:
If you have more than one animal companion or familiar, choose one to receive this benefit. [...] Special: You may select this feat more than once. The effects do not stack. Each time you take the feat, it applies to a different animal companion or familiar.

I'll also note that Pathfinder Society rules are FAR stricter than normal Pathfinder, going so far as to ban most (all?) crafting, which is CLEARLY allowed in normal play. Just because PFS says you can only use one, doesn't mean it's normally true - a lot of their rules are to expedite gameplay, and having one player getting twenty actions per initiative is undesireable (from their perspective).

However

All of these other classes granting animal companions specify effective druid levels. I'm uncertain if this means that they inheret the stacking or not. Complicating matters in Beastmaster archetype (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/ranger/archetypes/paizo---ranger-archetypes/beastmaster), gaining multiple animal companions with different druid levels, and not clarifying stacking rules. Take a Beastmaster 5 with two animal companions, both created from one effective druid level. If that Beastmaster then took fifteen levels of Druid... it's not entirely clear if he simply has 17 effective levels to divide, or if both companions are effectively 16th level.

[Khosan]

You can add in one level in Diabolist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/c-d/diabolist) and you'll get an Imp Companion. Functions like an Animal Companion and scales based on your Diabolist level plus your highest caster level. It can also UMD things for you, so give it a wand or something for extra good times.

[Psyren]

As far as pets go, Psicrystal are pretty useful. They get feats, can manifest psionics, fly and have a hardness . And they follow your character level instead of psionic class level so you lose one level off the cleric pets to get a level 20 psicrystal.

Not quite. While its HD are based on your HD, the abilities (flight etc.) are another matter:


Psicrystal abilities are based on the owner’s levels in psionic classes.

[grarrrg]

This does not say a thing about charcters animal companions from two sources other than druid. The Cavalier's mount ability and the Animal and Scalykind domains all lack specifications about stacking, presumably being covered by the animal companion entry (the Ranger's Hunter's Bond also lacks anything about stacking).
[QUOTE=CTrees;13416186]Also, the text of Boon Companion supports multiple animal companions:

Multiple instances of Animal Companions stack, not overlap/produce 2, in PF.

Firstly, I know no one has specifically mentioned it, but to clarify, a Mount is NOT an Animal Companion. Yes, it uses the same progression table, but it is NOT a Companion.
For proof of this I refer you to the Nature Warden Prerequisites:
"Special: Animal companion class feature*....
* An oracle of nature’s bonded mount ability counts as an animal companion class ability for the purpose of this prestige class."
A Mount is not a Companion, BUT A Companion can still be used as a mount.

Secondly, if it is, somehow, indeed true that you can only ever have 1 "Animal Companion" and all "effective Druid levels MUST stack", then I propose this build: Cleric 20, non-deity, w/Animal and Scalykind Domains. My level 35 Snake says "HI!"
Animal is Cleric -3, Scalykind is Cleric -2, the only ruling against having a Companion higher than your Character level is in the Boon Companion Feat. No feat? The sky is the limit!
(Please note, there are only 2 ways I know of to have a Higher level Companion than yourself, the above Cleric build, and a possible interpretation of the Diabolist Imp companion (see below)).



I'll also note that Pathfinder Society rules are FAR stricter than normal Pathfinder

That's my point, the Society FAQ Implies you can have multiple Animal Companions, they just state you can only use one at a time. Also, the one at a time restriction only applies in combat.


Take a Beastmaster 5 with two animal companions, both created from one effective druid level. If that Beastmaster then took fifteen levels of Druid... it's not entirely clear if he simply has 17 effective levels to divide, or if both companions are effectively 16th level.

In that particular case, I would say Beastmaster 5/Druid 15 has 20 "total" effective levels (similar case with a Pack Lord Druid).
This is mainly because your animal companions are 'fluid", in that you can fairly easily change how many you have, and what levels they are.
Although I will say it is unclear if you must put ALL Druid levels towards the same Companion, or if you can divide them up as well.

Here's a situation for those of you saying "only 1 companion, ALL levels stack".
Cleric 4/Ranger 4/Druid 4
Cleric is the Theologian (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/archetypes/paizo---cleric-archetypes/theologian) archetype, w/Scalykind domain (Theologian counts as Cleric+2 for Domain powers, so Snake Companion = Cleric-levels)
Ranger is a Falconer for Full levels.
Druid is a, oh lets go with... a Bear Shaman (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/druid/archetypes/paizo---druid-archetypes/bear-shaman).

The question is, how many companions do I have, and what level? One of them MUST be a Snake, another MUST be a Bird, and the last MUST be a Bear.
And last I checked, there are no "Companionable" animals that meet all 3 requirements (let alone any 2 requirements).



You can add in one level in Diabolist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/c-d/diabolist) and you'll get an Imp Companion. Functions like an Animal Companion and scales based on your Diabolist level plus your highest caster level. It can also UMD things for you, so give it a wand or something for extra good times.

So 12+ levels of Cleric, +1 level of Diabolist, gets me at least a level 13 Imp (minimum 14 if you get to count Diabolist twice)?

IN THE BUILD IT GOES!

[StreamOfTheSky]

How about 2+ levels into the Alchemist archetype(s) of your choice? Tumor Familiar should stack with the "arcane bond" sort of familiar most of the others are classified under...

[grarrrg]

How about 2+ levels into the Alchemist archetype(s) of your choice? Tumor Familiar should stack with the "arcane bond" sort of familiar most of the others are classified under...
My hero.

Alright, here's a build with less shenanigans (still plenty of shenanigans, just not as many), it should be 'more' rules friendly...

Cavalier 4 w/ Horse Master feat > level 20 Mount
Druid (?) 9 (?) w/Boon Companion feat > level 13 Animal Companion
Alchemist 2 > Tumor Familiar
Shadowdancer 3 > Shadow (similar to Familiar)
Diabolist 1+ w/Boon Companion > level 14+ Imp Companion (equivalent to Diabolist level + Caster level, entry can be through a UMD'd scroll)
Tattooed Sorcerer (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/archetypes/paizo---sorcerer-archetypes/tattooed-sorcerer) 1 > Tattoo Familiar (levels specifically stack with "Wizard or Witch" levels)
Eldritch Heritage Feat > Standard Familiar

The Imp Companion will be around level 14 (or higher)
Your FOUR Familiars will each have half of 4d10+14d8+2d6+CONx20 HP
14 Bab each if 'as written', 15.5 Bab each if Fractional
All but 1 of your Familiars will have "Familiar Bonus" levels of only 1 or 2, the last will have effective level 18 (the Feat one)