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Fawsto
2012-06-18, 07:15 PM
Well... Thats quite it, guys:

I need help building a level 10 Druid. My focus' on melee with Wild Shape. I am using 25 point buy. I have 49k in gold to expend.

While i'd like to see some sugestions on feats, I am quite overwhelmed by the items. I don't know what to buy...

Can you guys help me?

LadyLexi
2012-06-18, 07:25 PM
Druid 5/Warshaper 1/Master of Many Forms 4

Warshaper for the immunity to crits while wild shaped. After lv 7 of MoMF go back to warshaper for the rest.

That's what I would do.

kardar233
2012-06-18, 07:26 PM
If you have the Magic Item Compendium you can buy Wilding Clasps to make any items work while Wild Shaped. Necklace of Natural Attacks (Savage Species) is good here.

Otherwise, you don't have many options; the only really good one is Wild Dragonhide Full Plate.

Feats-wise, you'll want Natural Spell if you intend to do any casting at all. In two levels, grab Frozen Wild Shape for Twelve-Headed Cryohydra form, which is one of the best WS forms there is.

Eldariel
2012-06-18, 07:28 PM
What kind of a source list are you working with? Something I wrote long ago for a Level 7 Druid:

Skills:

Concentration, Knowledge: Nature are must maxes. Concentration for a melee caster and Knowledge: Nature so you know what you're summoning and what-not. If your DM side-steps that, feel free to skimp on K: Nature tho.
Spellcraft is a must max if you're the only spellcaster or if you want more soloability. Not that important with other casters.
Spot and Listen are superb and ones I'd always strive to max out as a Druid as observational talents are awesome.
Handle Animal should take enough ranks that you can reach +10 with your Animal Companion (counting the +4). This allows you to take 10 to teach it tricks, which means you can teach all the tricks you need. Teach it combat tricks and if you need to Push it, just take 20. If you're gonna form a Druidic herd of animal helpers though or take more combat helpers ・la Handle Animal Guide (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19871522/The_Handle_Animal_Guide), you'll want to max it especially if Charisma isn't your strong suite.
Survival is a fine skill but you get most of the uses you want out of it without a single rank thanks to your immense Wisdom. I'd save points there.
If going for a combatant, you'd want to consider a few cross-class skills. First, Balance is very useful to have 5 ranks in simply to not be flat-footed when Balancing (e.g. on Grease, Marbles or such). Then, Tumble is obviously superb for a non-armored character; just max it if you can afford it. Then, many forms come with bonuses to Hide and Move Silently so putting cross-class ranks in those could be helpful.


Feats for Wildshape fighting:

Frozen Wildshape [Frost]: Cryohydra Wildshape)
Aberration Wildshape [LoM]: Few good tentacle monstrocities and if you have Assume Supernatural Ability [SS] (totally broken tho, careful) also many insane Sus.
Multiattack: Relatively obvious
Lion's Pounce [CD]: Consideration-worthy if using Pounceless forms
Jotunbrud [PGtF]: Imp Trip/Imp Grapple boost individual combat strats and have prereqs but Jotunbrud boosts them all; consider formers too though


Feats for summoning:

Greenbound Summoning [LEoF]/Rashemi Elemental Summoning [UE]: Cornerstones if you're gonna focus on this strategy. Rashemi picks up around the teens, while Greenbound rocks the early levels. Those could actually be worth picking up even if not focusing since these expand your options by quite a bit.
Augment Summoning: Must if you focus, pretty weak otherwise.
Rapid Spell [CD]: With Ring of the Beast [CChamp], you effectively get Standard Action Summons instead. Must if you focus, worthless otherwise.
Ashbound [ECS]: Extra duration and To Hit. Again, good if you focus, weak otherwise.


Feats for casting:

Extend Spell: Very key for many of your boost spells; first makes 'em last all day and then 48 hours to only need 'em every other day.
Quicken Spell: Extra spell each turn on high levels, even low level, can be very useful.
Sculpt Spell: If you're interested in your Battlefield Control (Druid has some good ones), this is good.
Metamagic School Focus [CM]/Easy Metamagic [DR325]: If really interested in damage spells. Probably not worth it anymore though.



And yeah, I'd pick up Natural Bond if you can use it by DM. I don't really like Companion Spellbond though. I generally just either use Metamagic Rods of Chain [MiC] to buff, or cast my buffs twice. The 30' limitation is still too little for my taste.

The hardest part is really equipment. Pick up:
Heaviest Possible Bardings: For your AC, Armor never hurts. Any other possible animals you might want should also wear these.
Monk's Belt/Wild Armor: For yourself. One or the other. If going with Wild Armor, also pick up Animated Shield eventually.
Wilding Clasp [MiC]: Allows you to wear equipment as per normal in Wildshape forms. Absolute lifesaver.
Metamagic Rods of Extend and Chain: For buffing.
Strand of Prayer Beads (Beads of Karma): +4 to Caster Level for your boost spells.
Orange Prism Ioun Stone: +1 to Caster Level for all spells.
Ring of the Beast [CC]: Covered above.
Mantle of the Beast [CC]: Somewhat useful. Swift Action Wildshaping. Note that Monk's Belt doesn't like it tho.
Circlet of Rapid Casting [MiC]: 'cause quickened spells are good.
Ring of Enduring Arcana [CM]: +4 to CL against Dispels on your stuff. Exceedingly useful.
Ring of Spell-Battle [MiC]: Great for countering spells and such. Pretty obvious.


And the obvious Wis/Con/Dex/Str boosters (though remember your buff spells, Freedom of Movement and so on when thinking of equipment). Also, don't forget that Wand of Lesser Vigor [SC] is the best healing item in the game along with Healing Belt [MiC] for everyone, and Scrolls of Last Breath [SC] and Wands of other such utility are worth keeping around.


Spells
Level 0:
Detect Magic: Very convenient, probably gonna fill most of your slots on this level.
Light: Sometimes you just need some.


Level 1:
Babau Slime [SC]: Wildshaper's damage buff.
Beget Bogun [SC]: I guess you might as well pick one up.
Camouflage [SC]: If you care for hiding...
Enrage Animal [SC]: For AC buffing. Not that good on these levels anymore.
Entangle: Best Battlefield Control spell in Druid's arsenal. Prime candidate for Sculpting too.
Eyes of the Avoral [SC]: I like to prepare one of these for when your massive Spot doesn't get the job done.
Faerie Fire [SC]: A cheap anti-Invisibility tool.
Omen of Peril [SC]: One of the few good low-level Divinations.
Spider Hand [BoVD]: Yeah, superb scouting. Prepare one or so.
Twilight Luck [BoED]: Boost for saves. Convenient.
Winged Watcher[i] [SC]: When you don't want to expend Wildshape for a quick scan of the surroundings or escape or whatever.


Level 2:

[i]Acorn of Far Travel (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fw/20040710a): Convenient spell for some other spells requiring terrain
Align Fang [SC]: Useful buff. With Animals' "many attacks, average damage", this helps a ton. Also Silvered and Cold Iron Fangs.
Barkskin: Staple buff, later on Extend couple of times for full-day coverage.
Bite of the Wererat: Combat buff for you or AC.
Blinding Spittle [SC]: Blind target creature. No save. Yeah, it's a bit crazy.
Creeping Cold [SC]: Extend-bait. Against tougher guys, can deal very notable damage though starts off slow.
Halo of Sand [Sand]: Deflection-bonus to AC.
Nature's Favor [SC]: AC buff.
Splinterbolt [SC]: If you want a damage spell...
Transmute Rock to Mud [SC]: Handy BF Control spell.
Wild Instinct [RoE]: If you have a slot, boosts to skills for just having it around.


Level 3
Alter Fortune [PHBII]: When things go FUBAR. Tend to keep one around just in case, though Druid can't use the default "Scroll it" so one generally has to wait until you reach high enough level.
Arctic Haze [Frost]/Haboob [Sand]: BFC of choice for the level.
Bite of the Werewolf [SC]: Solid buff.
Blindsight [SC]: Obvious.
Girallon's Blessing [SC]: Long duration buff with some damage, and more importantly hands you can manipulate stuff with.
Greater Magic Fang: On all your weapons always. Once you get +2 or better, need to cast on each weapon separately.
Sleet Storm: Very solid BFC.
Spiderskin [SC]: Barkskin with some boosts.
Spiritjaws [SC]: Fun Force-spell.
Venomfire [Serp]: Insane damage buff.
Wind Wall: Scrollable with very key uses.


Level 4
Bite of the Wereboar [SC]: Same as other Bites.
Enhance Wild Shape [SC]: Absolute must; Hours/Level that grants you Ex abilities of the WS forms and can be used to buff them in other ways too and can be cast multiple times.
Freedom of Movement: Slightly obvious. Tho notably, you can kinda swim with it regardless of your form. Pick up Waterbreathing if going that road tho.
Giant Vermin: High CL and you get yourself a panzerwagen.
Greater Luminous Armor [BoED]: Your personal Fullplate if going the Monk's Belt-road. Lesser Restoration solves the Sacrifice.
Last Breath [SC]: Dying is last year.
Passage of the Shifting Sand [DrM]: Useful escape, blinding or whatever.
Scrying: Yeah, knowing is half the battle and so on.
Wall of Salt [Sand]: A decent Wall-spell.


Also, learn the Summons as you have them spontaneously. Of special note is SNAIV for Unicorns as healbots.

The important stuff tho:
- Straight Druid is of course the best. Greater Magic Fang on all your weapons, use Barkskin and any spells from splats you have available for buffing (Enhance Wildshape especially).
- Max Wis & good Con. Can dump Dex & Str. All level-ups in Wisdom. Can be Middle-Aged (-1 all phys, +1 all mental); it's usually beneficial and allows for 1 point higher Wis if you go down that route.
- Natural Spell on 6. Rest to taste; if you wanna Wildshape, focus on that.
- Can take Monstrous Feats for combat; Multiattack is a near must for a Wildshape warrior.
- Wildshape feats to gain extra forms; Frozen Wildshape for Cryohydra is of particular note.
- Spells that enhance wildshape fighting.
- Skills; Concentration and Knowledge: Nature are near-musts, you probably want Spot/Listen and cross-classing Tumble & Balance is a good idea. Spellcraft if you're the only mage in the party. Your Wisdom will take care of Sruvival.

Lateral
2012-06-18, 07:42 PM
25 point buy? Harsh, but you're a Druid. Put priority on Wisdom, then on Constitution- DEX and STR can both be dump stats, since they're replaced in Wild Shape. For your sixth level feat, of course you have to take Natural Spell; for your 9th level feat, I'd recommend either the aforementioned Frozen Wild Shape in order to get Cryohydra forms, or Blindsight, a Wild feat from Masters of the Wild. It's 3.0, but it gives you 120 foot blindsight, all the time. Your other feats can be pretty much whatever you like- you'll probably want combat feats, like Multiattack or something.

Use a lot of buff spells- the Druid list has some pretty good ones; Bite of the Were-Whatever, Enhance Wildshape, Greater Magic Fang, Venomfire, et cetera. If you do Frozen Wild Shape your default form will obviously be a ten-headed Cryohydra, but if you don't there are plenty of other great forms as well. You have a number of options- Fleshrakers are very powerful, even at tenth level, since they open up Venomfire for hours/level of uncapped CLd6 acid damage on three of your four natural weapons, and there are lots of other great ones too.

Gavinfoxx
2012-06-18, 07:55 PM
Get Natural Spell at 6, spend your L1 and L3 feats on whatever secondary things you want to do other than focus on wild shaping, and pick one of the feats that expands your list of forms at level 9. I think two of Dragon Wild Shape, Exalted Wild Shape, and Frozen Wild Shape are possible at level 9, but I totally forget WHICH ONES are actually possible. Also remember that all three give you talking forms, if the DM doesn't like you having a Pearl of Speech or whatever to speak in all wild shape forms. Also the Enhance Wild Shape spell is great.

Here is a list of good wild shape helping feats in general:

Dragon Wild Shape (Draconomicon)
Exalted Wild Shape (Book of Exalted Deeds)
Frozen Wild Shape (Frostburn)
Assume Supernatural Ability (Savage Species)
Multiattack (Monster Manual)
Improved Natural Attack (Monster Manual)


Here's an old thread talking about similar stuff you could look at:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=239383

GnomeGninjas
2012-06-18, 08:31 PM
I don't know if there are any good venomous creatures but if you can find a good one to wild shape into, cast venom fire on yourself and do a whole bunch of damage. Be sure to first cast windwall to deflect the books the DM throws at you.

Invader
2012-06-18, 08:35 PM
Here's a good place to start for druid equipment

http://coboard.wikia.com/wiki/Druid#Equipment

Lateral
2012-06-18, 08:47 PM
Get I think two of Dragon Wild Shape, Exalted Wild Shape, and Frozen Wild Shape are possible at level 9, but I totally forget WHICH ONES are actually possible.
Dragon Wild Shape can't be taken until 12, unfortunately- it's incredibly good.


I don't know if there are any good venomous creatures but if you can find a good one to wild shape into, cast venom fire on yourself and do a whole bunch of damage. Be sure to first cast windwall to deflect the books the DM throws at you.

That's pretty much the Fleshraker in a nutshell.

Invader
2012-06-18, 08:52 PM
There's also the aberrant line of feats but you can't take any till you get wildshape and you def want natural spell at 6th. There are ways to get them earlier, it just depends on how much cheese you want to add to your character.

GnomeGninjas
2012-06-18, 09:00 PM
There's also the aberrant line of feats but you can't take any till you get wildshape and you def want natural spell at 6th. There are ways to get them earlier, it just depends on how much cheese you want to add to your character.

You could save natural spell till 9th since he is starting at 10 it won't matter. That would make it so you can't get ______wildshape at 9.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2012-06-18, 10:27 PM
Stay single-classed Druid, or if you prestige out don't even consider anything that doesn't advance all three of your spellcasting, wild shape, and animal companion progressions.

If you want to use Master of Many Forms, start with Wild Shape Ranger instead of Druid, it's much better suited.

Get a Monk's Belt (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#beltMonks), which gives you the entire AC bonus class feature (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/monk.htm) of a Monk 5, including adding your Wisdom bonus to your AC. Put a Wilding Clasp on it, they're in MIC and cost 4,000 gp each, it makes it 'continue to function' when you Wild Shape.

I'd start with a Ring of the Beast from Complete Champion. This will allow you to use a 3rd level Summon Nature's Ally to get a Unicorn, which can heal and remove poison, plus its Magic Circle is a huge benefit against extraplanar opponents and anything with a charm/dominate effect. Summoning spells are enormously beneficial, not necessarily just for combat. If you suddenly find yourself needing to put out a fire, just spontaneously summon a water elemental. If there's a bad cloud effect, make an air elemental to whirlwind it away.

Get at least two Lesser Metamagic Rods of Extend, and tuck them into your Monk's Belt. One 'function' of a belt is to hold other items, and it 'continues to function' due to the Wilding Clasp, so your metamagic rods will remain useful when you Wild Shape without costing you more Wilding Clasps. These are going to be used on any hour/level buffs you use (Longstrider, Cloud Wings, Luminous Armor, Greater Magic Fang, Venomfire, etc.) and on any other spells that would be useful with a doubled duration (Creeping Cold, Produce Flame).

Have a Circlet of Rapid Casting (MIC, 15k gp) with an Enhancement bonus to Wisdom added (per MIC p234 the cost is equal to that of a DMG Periapt of Wisdom), with a Wilding Clasp. Being able to Quicken a 2nd level or lower spell 3/day for no additional cost is amazing. Use it to throw an Extended Creeping Cold, or to cast an Extended Produce Flame which will deal its damage on every one of your natural attacks as per Holding the Charge, PHB p151. Kelpstrand is another amazing spell to pull out as it can completely disable multiple opponents for an entire fight. Be sure to cast Greater Resistance (SpC) every day, never buy a Cloak of Resistance on a primary spellcaster.

Have a standard Strand of Prayer Beads that's had the Bead of Smiting removed, which is only 9,000 gp per DMG pricing. This can also be tucked into your belt. The Bead of Healing is amazing when you need it, and you can use the Bead of Karma to boost your caster level to 14 when you buff.

Bone Talisman (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20040721a) (turning) tricks! You're a Cleric 14 when it comes to undead, see below:
Get at least 48 spell foci, and apply Unguent of Timelessness (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#unguentofTimelessness) to each one, which takes only six doses for 900 gp. The unguent never wears off, and they can be reused indefinitely. That will make it so time relative to each bone goes by 365 times slower, so at a caster level of 14 your Bone Talismans in turning mode will last about thirty five and a half days. Prepare and cast it once every day along with the rest of your buffs, while the Bead of Karma is active.

Put 35 of those on a loop of string and number them. The bone at one end has the longest remaining duration, the one at the other end has the shortest remaining duration. If you would need to Turn Undead, use them from the end with the shortest duration. When you cast it anew each day on the short-duration end, move that one around the loop to the long-duration end. This allows you to rotate through them so you can have up to 35 turn uses in any given day. Using more than one in a day will reduce that pool, but you can get it back to max between adventures. I doubt you'll ever need to use Turn Undead (35 + number of days adventuring) times in a single adventure, but it doesn't hurt to have them considering how cheap the Unguent is. As your level increases you'll be able to have more active at a time, so add one of the extras to the string each time you gain a day of duration (duration in days is CL x 365/144). Hang it from your belt so you can use it when Wild Shaped.

If you want to make every fight unfairly one-sided, make the rest of your party each buy you a 1st level Pearl of Power, and go in thirds for more Lesser Rods of Extend. With those you'll cast Snowsight from Frostburn on everyone in the party, and you and anyone else who can will also be casting Obscuring Snow from Frostburn, also extended. Nothing you encounter will be able to see through the snow, and things like Blindsense and Tremorsense can pinpoint you but they don't negate the miss chance for concealment. You may want to wear a helmet to the gaming table in case you get a DMG thrown at you.

Future items (level 13+) should include a standard Metamagic Rod of Extend and a 6th level Pearl of Power. Every other day you'll be preparing Energy Immunity (SpC) twice, and using the pearl to cast it three times with the rod of extend. They'll each last 48 hours, which is why you're casting them every other day, so pick three of the five energy types for those. On the days in between, you'll be preparing Superior Resistance (SpC) once and Energy Immunity once, casting each of those and using the pearl to cast Energy Immunity again, still using the rod of extend on all three. Those too will each last 48 hours, so pick the last two energy types. For the cost of those two items and two 6th level spell slots each day, you're continually immune to all five energy types and you get a +6 Resistance bonus to all your saving throws.

Mithril Leaf
2012-06-18, 10:41 PM
If you truly want to break the game to hell and back, open up your Faiths Of Eberron to page 105, and your Savage Species to page 216. You now have everything you need race and class wise. Obviously you'll want to pick up natural spell. For equipment, that ring that boosts your max wildshape level by one. Wilding clasps from the MIC are never a bad idea.

Invader
2012-06-18, 11:13 PM
If you truly want to break the game to hell and back, open up your Faiths Of Eberron to page 105, and your Savage Species to page 216. You now have everything you need race and class wise. Obviously you'll want to pick up natural spell. For equipment, that ring that boosts your max wildshape level by one. Wilding clasps from the MIC are never a bad idea.

Ste you tho of the ring from trappings of the beast set? I believe that bonus is with all 3 pieces unless you know if something else which would be awesome because I'd get one on my Druid lol.

Mithril Leaf
2012-06-18, 11:14 PM
There's a ring that boosts wildshape level? Do you know what it's called or where it's from?

Ah, my mistake. It is actually the full set, of which the ring of a beast makes up 1/3. The whole Trappings of the Beast gives you +1 to effective wildshape level, including unlocking new forms.

Invader
2012-06-18, 11:17 PM
If you truly want to break the game to hell and back, open up your Faiths Of Eberron to page 105, and your Savage Species to page 216. You now have everything you need race and class wise. Obviously you'll want to pick up natural spell. For equipment, that ring that boosts your max wildshape level by one. Wilding clasps from the MIC are never a bad idea.


Ah, my mistake. It is actually the full set, of which the ring of a beast makes up 1/3. The whole Trappings of the Beast gives you +1 to effective wildshape level, including unlocking new forms.

Dang I was hoping I missed it some where. There is the Wild Shape Amulet that allows you to treat your wildshape as if it was 4 levels higher but it's 40,000gp which is quite a lot at lower levels.

Gavinfoxx
2012-06-18, 11:20 PM
Oh if you just choose one of the pure nature planes, and go planar shephard, it is likely you can use that magical beast bit and enhance wild shape to get some freaking CRAZY abilities... very early too!

Invader
2012-06-19, 04:57 PM
Oh if you just choose one of the pure nature planes, and go planar shephard, it is likely you can use that magical beast bit and enhance wild shape to get some freaking CRAZY abilities... very early too!

Planar Shepherd really doesn't get good till 8th when you get magic animals and even then a lot of really good ones have over 10hd but an increase in wildshape level lets you get really crazy at much lower levels.

Spider_Jerusalem
2012-06-19, 05:09 PM
It wouldn't hurt to mention the (deliberate) lower optimization level of your non-crio-hydraing planar shepherds fellow party members, I guess. Seriously, it's a druid, it's not like you need any real help in this case.

Invader
2012-06-19, 06:09 PM
It wouldn't hurt to mention the (deliberate) lower optimization level of your non-crio-hydraing planar shepherds fellow party members, I guess. Seriously, it's a druid, it's not like you need any real help in this case.

Yeah my DM is going to be really peeved when I turn in a 12HH at 8th level and wreck every thing he throws at us lol.

Snowbluff
2012-06-19, 06:38 PM
Frozen Wildshape (FB) -> Become Cryohydra (MM) -> Cast Improve Wildshape (SC). Win.

Also, pick up Assume Supernatural ability and other new form feats (Aberration, Dragon, etc.) to your liking.

Mnemnosyne
2012-06-19, 06:58 PM
Feat-wise, I'd start with Aberrant Blood (Flexible Limbs) at 1st level, which gives you a +2 to grapple checks and qualifies you for additional abberant feats. This allows you to grab Abberation Wild Shape at level 9, so you can now wildshape into any abberation.

Make sure you pay close attention to the Enhance Wild Shape spell, which allows you to gain all the extraordinary abilities of the new form. A lot of forms have some really useful extraordinary abilities.

Another feat I'd take as early as possible (you qualify at level 1 if you want) is Assume Supernatural Ability. This allows you to pick one Su ability from each form you change into and make use of it. Note: Some people will say you don't qualify at level 1: lies. The requirements are "Wis 13, ability to assume a new form magically." It doesn't specify that the new form even has a supernatural ability. I now direct you to the 1st level spell Aspect of the Wolf, which allows you to magically assume the form of a wolf.

As for items, my primary recommendations are going to be in Complete Champion: Mantle of the Beast (18000 gp, wildshape becomes a swift action and all your wild shaped attacks get a +1 enhancement to hit and damage so you automatically overcome DR/magic), Ring of the Beast (8000 gp, all your SNA spells of less than max level get a +1 level boost, so at level 10 you can use a 3rd level slot to cast SNA IV and it becomes SNA V), and the Armor of the Beast (26175 gp, it's already got the wild property so it shapeshifts as you do, and it gives you +1 wildshape uses per day). Together, they make a set, and they also give you +5 to wild empathy and +1 level to your wildshape ability, so as a 10th level druid, you wildshape as though you were 11th level and so on - it opens up higher HD forms sooner, and unlocks new forms earlier - plants unlock at level 11 since you're wildshaping as though you were level 12, and elementals at 15/18.

Since those three items already exceed your budget...well yeah. That's pretty much it for my item suggestions. Other people's item suggestions are also great, so you'll kinda have to pick which sets of items you want.

Gavinfoxx
2012-06-19, 06:59 PM
You can only turn into a 12hch at 15th level. Just saying. If you are using it for THAT form, you only need to get Frozen Wild Shape at 15th level. Consider and Urskan for a speaking form at 9th level (assuming you pick up frozen wild shape at 9th), instead.

Spider_Jerusalem
2012-06-19, 07:09 PM
Yeah my DM is going to be really peeved when I turn in a 12HH at 8th level and wreck every thing he throws at us lol.

That's not the point. DMs can actually get over any cheesy crap a player does fairly easy. It's the other players that usually get annoyed by game-breaking choices. And in this case, specifically, the other players' characters are:

A tank Knight (with lots of defensive feats, went for Elusive Target)

A "fighter" Theurge(Wizard/Archivist, character is focused only on hitting things with weapons. Doesn't have a single ranged attack. No, not even a scorching ray)

A Dwarf fighter, whose player is still getting the hang of the rules.

A rogue specialized in disguises. Also learning to play D&D.

An unoptimized cleric. Healbot/mild self-buffing, and that's it.

Invader
2012-06-19, 07:58 PM
That's not the point. DMs can actually get over any cheesy crap a player does fairly easy. It's the other players that usually get annoyed by game-breaking choices. And in this case, specifically, the other players' characters are:

A tank Knight (with lots of defensive feats, went for Elusive Target)

A "fighter" Theurge(Wizard/Archivist, character is focused only on hitting things with weapons. Doesn't have a single ranged attack. No, not even a scorching ray)

A Dwarf fighter, whose player is still getting the hang of the rules.

A rogue specialized in disguises. Also learning to play D&D.

An unoptimized cleric. Healbot/mild self-buffing, and that's it.

I'm not sure what your point is. I was just making a joke about being about to get a cryo hydra at 8th level instead of 12? :smallconfused:

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2012-06-19, 10:35 PM
A Hydra is huge size, you can't take its form until Druid 15 regardless of what feats you have.