What's the best armor for my situation?

[INoKnowNames]

I'm trying to shop for equipment for a character.

The Max Cost of it can not exceed about 12,000 gp.

The Dex Bonus doesn't matter all that much.

I would -prefer- to avoid an Armor Check Penalty. I hate Armor Check penalties.

Arcane Spell Failure doesn't matter at all, period.

The Speed can not be inhibited. So to that end, it's gotta be classified as a Light Armor.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

The only thing I've found has been a Mithral Chain Shirt, though. There's got to be something better than that...

Any chance you guys know any better?

[Snowbluff]

The best armor would be to split your money between a Ring of Protection +x, Amulet of Natural Armor +x, Chain Shirt +x, and Animated Heavy Shield +x (1+).

Just compared the prices, and buy the combination of items at their varying values to get the best combination. Ex: Ring of Protection +1, Amulet of NA +1, Chainshirt +2.

Also, making the Chain Shirt Githcraft (DMG2), Feycraft (DMG2), and Mithril will cut Armor Penalties. A Mithril Breastplate will get you another AC without slowing your movement (counts as light armor).

[Diarmuid]

Are you trying to focus on maximizing the armor bonus? What other qualities are you interested in for armor.

Based on your limited information I would think a MW Chain Shirt or Mithril Breastplate is probably your best bet for a base item. You'll have a -1 ACP, but 4 or 5 Base Armor and it'll be considered light.

The MW Chain Shirt is 1 less Armor, but only costs 250gp. The Mith BP is 5 Armor but costs 4200 as a base item.

So depending if you're looking for armor, or if you're looking to stack on a bunch of enchantments will color your decision.

[INoKnowNames]

The best armor would be to split your money between a Ring of Protection +x, Amulet of Natural Armor +x, Chain Shirt +x, and Animated Heavy Shield +x (1+).

I wonder if it was important to mention that I spent 10,020 on an Animated Heavy Shield already, and that I've also already got a source of Natural Armor. I'm just looking for regular armor armor to wear. And I don't think I'm going to have enough money left over for a Ring.


Also, making the Chain Shirt Githcraft (DMG2), Feycraft (DMG2), and Mithril will cut Armor Penalties. A Mithril Breastplate will get you another AC without slowing your movement (counts as light armor).

Feycraft and Githcraft don't remove any of the penalties I'm looking to avoid, and a Mithral Chain Shirt was my first suggestion. A Mithral Breastplate would leave me with the annoying Armor Check Penalty I'm hoping not to have. Even if it's just a minor inconvenience, it's still an inconvenience.


Are you trying to focus on maximizing the armor bonus? What other qualities are you interested in for armor.

As high an Armor Bonus I can get with 0 Armor Check Penalty and No Speed Penalty.


Based on your limited information I would think a MW Chain Shirt or Mithril Breastplate is probably your best bet for a base item. You'll have a -1 ACP, but 4 or 5 Base Armor and it'll be considered light.

Dang...


So depending if you're looking for armor, or if you're looking to stack on a bunch of enchantments will color your decision.

I highly doubt I'm going to have the money to stack enchantments on it (not to mention I'm not even sure where to start looking on deciding what enchantments I want to put on the armor, so I don't feel like trying to start that process now).

Do any of those responses make anything clearer? Or is this the best I can do, given what I'm looking for?

[Kerilstrasz]

mithral shirt from dmg for 1100

[ahenobarbi]

Mithral breastplate, with defending armor spikes +1.

Have Magic Vestment cast on the breastplate and Magic Weapon on armor spikes. Redirect all bonus from defending armor spikes to give you armor bonus.

You will get +7 to +15 armor bonus this way (depends on Magic Vestment and Greater Magic Weapon caster level) for (a bit over) 12'000 gp.

[Answerer]

The fact of the matter is is that base armors aren't very good or interesting. 90% of my characters have just taken the Chain Shirt and called it a day. It's not worth the money and penalties to do more.

[INoKnowNames]

mithral shirt from dmg for 1100

You might have been sword-saged there. Possibly by the op post, at the very least.


Mithral breastplate, with defending armor spikes +1.

Have Magic Vestment cast on the breastplate and Magic Weapon on armor spikes. Redirect all bonus from defending armor spikes to give you armor bonus.

You will get +7 to +15 armor bonus this way (depends on Magic Vestment and Greater Magic Weapon caster level) for (a bit over) 12'000 gp.

Unfortunately, I don't think I can afford that.


The fact of the matter is is that base armors aren't very good or interesting. 90% of my characters have just taken the Chain Shirt and called it a day. It's not worth the money and penalties to do more.

Spell casters have it so much easier...

Guess I'm going with the chain shirt unless anyone else has any bright ideas.

[Diarmuid]

The easiest answer to your question appears to be a Mithril Chain Shirt +3.

You're looking at 10,100gp for a +7 Armor bonus, no ACP, and no movement penalty.

I, and many others, would argue that it might be much more beneficial to stack on some enchantments in place of of the extra +2 on the armor. 2 more AC is nice, but 3/day 20% miss chance for 5 rounds activatable as a Swift action is certainly stronger IMO (Blurring Armor property, MIC). Similarly, Death Ward (Armor Property, MIC) is worth losing 1 armor IMO.

[Snowbluff]

I wonder if it was important to mention that I spent 10,020 on an Animated Heavy Shield already, and that I've also already got a source of Natural Armor. I'm just looking for regular armor armor to wear. And I don't think I'm going to have enough money left over for a Ring.



Feycraft and Githcraft don't remove any of the penalties I'm looking to avoid, and a Mithral Chain Shirt was my first suggestion. A Mithral Breastplate would leave me with the annoying Armor Check Penalty I'm hoping not to have. Even if it's just a minor inconvenience, it's still an inconvenience.


Kk, so you have the Animated Shield. Good.

Keep in mind the Amulet is an Enhancement Bonus to Natural Armor. So if you have Natural Armor from another source, like your race or a class feature, the amulet will add more.

A Ring of Protection +1 is only 2kgp. As opposed to making a +2 Chainshirt +3, which is 5kgp.

[INoKnowNames]

The easiest answer to your question appears to be a Mithril Chain Shirt +3.

You're looking at 10,100gp for a +7 Armor bonus, no ACP, and no movement penalty.

I, and many others, would argue that it might be much more beneficial to stack on some enchantments in place of of the extra +2 on the armor. 2 more AC is nice, but 3/day 20% miss chance for 5 rounds activatable as a Swift action is certainly stronger IMO (Blurring Armor property, MIC). Similarly, Death Ward (Armor Property, MIC) is worth losing 1 armor IMO.

I wonder how much I haven't explained to make this easier to find.

I'm not concerned about adding the +1s or Special Properties right now. I'm completely aware that Magic Vestment (and for weapons, Greater Magic Weapon) make actually buying anything more than a +1 a waste in almost all situations.

I'm just looking for the starting armor, as a point to jump from. I'm surprised with all the upgrades that can be applied to make Spell Failure go away, and make the armor do anything you want, that there's no way to make the armor penalty for medium and heavy armor go away, even in other types of books...

[JeminiZero]

Nimbleness property costs +1 equivalent and reduces ACP by 2. So a Mithral Breastplate +1 with Nimbleness costs 4.200 + 4,000 = 8,200 gp and grants +7 AC. Upgrading it to +2 basic enhancement / +1 Nimbleness will cost another 5,000 gp.

[JoeYounger]

I'm a bit confused. Why would a mithral BP have a -1 check penalty? Regular BPs have a -4, mithral lowers it by 3, and if its made of mithral it reduces it by another 1 leaving a mithral BP with a -0 check penalty. Reading on the SRD doesn't say that the -3 for being mithral replaces the -1 for being masterwork. It only says that the cost for being MW is figured into the prices given. The -3 (mithral) and the -1 (MW) are from different sources and are both unnamed types. Does that equate to stacking in 3.5?

[Gavinfoxx]

I believe this is how it goes...

Normal Breastplate ACP: -4
Masterwork Breastplace ACP: -3
Mithral Breastplate ACP (Always Masterwork): -1 (-1 Masterwork, -2 mithral for -1 total)

[JoeYounger]

Normal Breastplate ACP: -4
Masterwork Breastplace ACP: -3
Mithral Breastplate ACP (Always Masterwork): -2


Spell failure chances for armors and shields made from mithral are decreased by 10%, maximum Dexterity bonus is increased by 2, and armor check penalties are lessened by 3 (to a minimum of 0).

So...

Normal Breastplate ACP: -4
Msterwork Breastplate ACP: -3
Mithral Breastplate ACP: -0

Am I doing this wrong?


***EDIT***

I see what you're saying, but I don't see where it says or implies that the -3 for mithral is already accounting for the -1 of being masterwork. I think it is actually pretty straight forward in saying the mithral is -3 ACP, not -2. I feel like it doesn't mention them not stacking, so they sould.

[Gavinfoxx]

I think Mithral lowers it by 2, not 1, I had a typo.

So its -1 from masterwork, -2 from mithral, for a total ACP of 1 (or -1, depending on how you read it).

[grarrrg]

You might have been sword-saged there. Possibly by the op post, at the very least.


The reason this keeps happening is that you put a "--------" across your post, which looks similar to the "signature dividing line", and a lot of people automatically skip reading signatures.

I actually had to go back up to the OP myself to double check, as I too, had assumed the last bit was "signature".

[JoeYounger]

I think Mithral lowers it by 2, not 1, I had a typo.

So its -1 from masterwork, -2 from mithral, for a total ACP of 1 (or -1, depending on how you read it).


I'm still a bit confused, the SRD says it lowers the ACP by -3 for being made of mithral, and it also says that if its made of mithral then it must be masterwork quality. I'm just having a hard time following the logic of these not stacking when they are from different sources and are untyped bonuses (do these count as bonuses?). I just feel like since it's not addressed it would follow the typical stacking rules which would say they stack.

[INoKnowNames]

The reason this keeps happening is that you put a "--------" across your post, which looks similar to the "signature dividing line", and a lot of people automatically skip reading signatures.

I actually had to go back up to the OP myself to double check, as I too, had assumed the last bit was "signature".

Ah. I see what you mean.


I'm still a bit confused, the SRD says it lowers the ACP by -3 for being made of mithral, and it also says that if its made of mithral then it must be masterwork quality. I'm just having a hard time following the logic of these not stacking when they are from different sources and are untyped bonuses (do these count as bonuses?). I just feel like since it's not addressed it would follow the typical stacking rules which would say they stack.

I think it's because that Mithral items always count as Masterwork, and the price is included in making it Mithral. If you had to pay seperately to make it Masterwork, then it would stack.

It lowers it in total by 3, and it's automatically Masterwork.

In other news, Nimbleness looks like it gives me what I want. Unless someone knows of a better way to do it, I think I'm good to start with a +1 Nimble Mithral Breastplate.

[JoeYounger]

Yeah, I'm tracking now.

Looking at some of the examples (Elven chain and mithral fullplate of speed) its pretty clear that you guys are correct!

[Gavinfoxx]

Mithral Chain Shirt and Mithral Breastplates are my favorite armors if you have some cash. Even if non mithral versions would be 'better' in the short term, in the long term, these can be upgraded.

Mithral Chain Shirt +1 of Light Fortification with +1 Defending Armor Spikes (or Netcutter spikes or whatever)!

[Azoth]

+1 mithral chain shirt (2.1k)=+5ac 0acp
MW DAstana (225)= +1ac stacks with armor 0acp
Mithral Chahar-Aina(1050)= +1ac stacks with armor/dastana 0acp

Total= +7 AC/+6 max dex/0ACP for 3,375gp

Now if you upgrade the dastana and chahar-aina to +1 for another 2k...you can enchant them. Their enchantment bonuses won't stack, but the special abilities will. So for just a little over your budget you can have light fortification, blurring, and death ward on your armor...and still have the same AC as the +3 mithral chain shirt.

[Slipperychicken]

If you get Armor Spikes, putting Smoking (+1) on them is a really cheap way to get 20% miss chance all day. Just keep it going until being a 5ft nauseating cube of smoke isn't useful.

[ericgrau]

Nimbleness property costs +1 equivalent and reduces ACP by 2. So a Mithral Breastplate +1 with Nimbleness costs 4.200 + 4,000 = 8,200 gp and grants +7 AC. Upgrading it to +2 basic enhancement / +1 Nimbleness will cost another 5,000 gp.
Nimbleness is stackable, no?

+1 fullplate of nimbleness x 2, 10,650 gp, 9 AC, 3 max dex, -1 ACP
+1 mithral breastplate of nimbleness, 8,200 gp, 6 AC, 6 max dex, -0 ACP
+2 mithral breastplate, 8,200 gp, 7 AC, 5 max dex, -1 ACP

I think there's some kind of psionic full plate in that can be worn without proficiency. It might not have any ACP either, though it does have spell failure. It's in one of the two main psionic books IIRC.

EDIT: Oh no speed penalty, dang.

[rot42]

Nimbleness is stackable, no?

I think there's some kind of psionic full plate in that can be worn without proficiency. It might not have any ACP either, though it does have spell failure. It's in one of the two main psionic books IIRC.

Skin of Ectoplasmic Armor, MIC 170 - +8 and counts as light armor but is really a wondrous item; I think it is also in Complete Psionic, though I have not checked if that version differs at all.

There is also the halfweight armor enhancement in Underdark if setting-specific books are allowed. It is normally +3, though, so out of your price range unless you are crafting it yourself. Illithidwrought in the same book gives an Insight bonus, which is more broadly applicable than a straight Enhancement bonus.

Making your armor out of Wildwood (Races of the Wild 169) trades a point of armor for a point of max Dex, but does lower the ACP by one as well.

[kardar233]

I recall having a gestalt Bone Knight at one point who needed to get his ASF down to zero, but as a Bone Knight he had to use medium armor at minimum. I ended up using a Githcraft Feycraft Twilight Thistledown Padded Bonecraft Breastplate. I'm still not sure how he managed to get a Githyanki and a Fey in the same room long enough for them to help him forge something...

[JeminiZero]

In other news, Nimbleness looks like it gives me what I want. Unless someone knows of a better way to do it, I think I'm good to start with a +1 Nimble Mithral Breastplate.

Don't forget either Blushine (MiC +1,500 gp) or Durable (Dungeonscape +500 gp) to make sure it doesn't become ooze/rust monster snack.