Being a necromancer and avoiding pitchforks

[A_S00]

Hey, y'all.

One of the players in a campaign I'm going to be starting up said he wanted to play a necromancer. I told him that was fine, but that necromancy was heavily stigmatized in the setting I'd be running, so he should expect to have to put some effort into either concealing his habits, or into fending off angry pitchfork-wielding mobs. He eventually decided to go with a different character archetype.

That's fine for this campaign (he ended up going with an old lady Binder who I think is going to be a wholesale ripoff of Nanny Ogg from the Discworld novels), but it got me thinking about how to play a necromancer in a real game, and how to handle the social troubles that can go along with it. I came up with a few potential solutions:
Play in settings where necromancy isn't stigmatized. This is all well and good, but it relies on your DM to be running a campaign in such a setting. While worlds like that can be fun, it's not necessarily something you'd want to be true in every game you run.
Leave your minions at home when you go to civilized areas. Yeah, okay, but that's a pretty big nerf to your power in some scenarios, unless you've got some kind of gentleman's agreement with your DM like "you won't get attacked in town," which is bad for storytelling.
Don't focus on minionmancy. Lame. Who wants to play a necromancer but not control hordes of the undead?
Conceal your minions, or disguise their true nature somehow. This one seems like it has the most potential for fun.
In the spirit of that last one, I started thinking about what kind of character would be good at controlling the undead but preventing it from being obvious that they did so. The most promising thing I've come up with so far is a Beguiler/Cleric theurge. Here's the build I've been working on:

Human

Neutral

1 - Beguiler 1 - Versatile Spellcaster, Able Learner
2 - Dread Necromancer 1
3 - Cloistered Cleric 1 - Southern Magician (Domains: Death, Travel [Devotion], Knowledge [Devotion]), Lightbringer Cleric ACF
4 - Mystic Theurge 1
5 - Mystic Theurge 2
6 - Mystic Theurge 3 - Spell Focus (Necromancy)
7 - True Necromancer 1
8 - True Necromancer 2
9 - True Necromancer 3 - Divine Defiance
10 - True Necromancer 4
11 - True Necromancer 5
12 - Contemplative 1 - Extend Spell (from Planning domain), Persistent Spell
13 - Mystic Theurge 4
14 - Mystic Theurge 5
15 - Mystic Theurge 6 - Divine Metamagic (Persistent Spell)
16 - Mystic Theurge 7
17 - Mystic Theurge 8
18 - Mystic Theurge 9 - Planar Touchstone (Sun)
19 - Mystic Theurge 10
20 - Contemplative 2

(all arcane PrC spellcasting advances to Beguiler, not DN)

Gets level 7 Beguiler spells (which can be Versatile Spellcaster'd into 8's) and level 9 Cleric spells. Three different turning pools for plenty of counterspelling and DMM. Southern Magician, in addition to helping out with early MT entry, lets you DMM(Persist) a few Arcane spells each day (e.g., Greater Invisibility).

The Zone of Desecration should help you command a reasonable number of minions, and Beguiler has plenty of tricks to keep them hidden (Invisibiliy [Sphere], Seeming, all the Enchantments to mess with people's minds if they find you out). I also imagine sinking quite a few skill points into social skills to smooth over potentially awkward situations.

Bad news: 3-way MAD on mental attributes, slow early spellcasting progression, and crappy HP. Oh, and Wizards are better at everything.

So, Playground, what I'm looking for in this thread is a discussion of:
Players, how did you handle the problem of people objecting to the undead walking around? What worked? What didn't? Was the thrill of maybe getting found out fun, or just tiresome?
DMs, if you've run a game with a necromancer in it, how did you handle this issue? When/if your necromancer players got caught, did it lead to fun storytelling, or did it just make DMing for them a pain?
What do you think could be done to improve on the build I laid out above? Has anybody tried playing a pro-social necromancer? How'd it go for you?

Cheers!

[Toliudar]

Whenever I've used a ton of undead minions, I've found the Enveloping Pit (Magic Item Compendium) handy. You can stack dozens, if not hundreds, of the little buggers in there. They don't breathe, they don't age, they don't smell up the place, and they fit into an inside pocket. This is, at the very least, useful for those odd critters that don't disguise easily as other things.

An extended Seeming spell helps tremendously with making your gang of wights look like your extended family, personal servants, troupe of jugglers, athletic team of a sport of your choice, or whatever you like. Prestidigitation to take care of any telltale odors.

[AmberVael]

One of the simpler solutions I've considered is simply to focus on have one or two really potent minions instead of a horde. If you can manage that, you can generally find easier ways to disguise your minions- if they're humanoid of some kind, concealing garments and masks will do a lot. If they're not, find a bit of illusion or shapechanging, and it'll work out.

Another really fun one I've heard of? Keep your horde in your pocket. Invest in extra dimensional storage, anything from bags of holding to enveloping pits and portable holes, and just shove all your undead inside. When it comes time to battle, out comes the army out of nowhere! Priceless.

You might also try playing just a really charismatic guy. Maybe they lie or perhaps they believe it, but have them spin some fabulous vision about how their undead and necromancy really will help everyone- toss out the usual dark and creepy stereotypes, and take steps to make the undead seem less frightening. Make them wear outfits that distance them from the disturbing image they normally present (if you're feeling silly, give them tophats and canes), and try and make your case before people see them. Some people might not be persuaded, but if you get most people on your side, that's enough.

[Dr.Epic]

Just play a non-good cleric and focus on undead.

[A_S00]

Just play a non-good cleric and focus on undead.
Do people typically not object to undead if they're controlled by Clerics in some settings or something? Or do you mean if you're in a generally evil party where it's less of a problem for the game if you seem nefarious to everybody you meet?

[Stallion]

I once played with a guy that went around with his incorporeal undead floating beneath our feet at pretty much all times and kept robes on all of his corporeal undead. At one point we had pretty much set up in this large city for a good 2-3 sessions, taking care of a few major plot points. He managed to keep his undead "under wraps" by registering them as a construction company, using awakened and other sentient, intelligent undead as foremen and contractors. It was pretty hilarious and allowed him to rake in a pretty large profit.

[Amidus Drexel]

@Stallion
that's hilarious! :smallbiggrin:

@OP
Hm... the only party I was in that had a minionmancer was in a party of (mostly) chaotic evil characters (and a very lenient DM). His undead were routinely killed by the guards, or (when we were high enough level) routinely killed all the guards :smallbiggrin:. If we ever needed any kind of stealth, he just left them outside the city.

[Dimestoretiamat]

Actually I built a necromancer before, psych profile and all. I never got to play him but there is hope. I had a plan to work out all the social kinks of having such a profession.

First, get the honorbound one of the group (there is at least one) to swear to protect you. You are just a feeble sorcerer after all. The big strong paladin will have no problem seeing to my safety (cue interparty conflict).

Second, make the argument that you raise undead to put resources that would be wasted to good use. My necromancer had a hatred for liches and vampires, especially if they became that way to escape death (served the Raven Queen).

Third, have your undead bury themselves. Horde in a pocket is fun but this method is more practical for lower level necro's

Fourth, abandon the party. Leave if you get in a fight and your horde is outside of town. Or just command the horde in if they aren't buried for some reason (a convenient cave or ruin for them to haunt).

Fifth, patience. Just raise the dead of the enemy. The warrior is bound to kill someone eventually.

[Dire Panda]

For the low-level necro with only a few skeletons, have them curl up and stick 'em in the party's backpacks. Make up some story about transporting the remains of your fallen comrades for an honorable burial. Then when you enter the empire's capital and learn that the city watch are all paladins, you'll have tons of fun trying to explain why you're all carrying evil backpacks.

...at least that's what happened in my case. If the PCs hadn't allied with a devil who moonlighted as a lawyer, they'd have been convicted and put to death for necromancy. So, yes, getting caught can be fun if you're into roleplaying Phoenix Wright-style courtroom shenanigans. Your mileage may vary.

[QuidEst]

My approaches.

Disguise:
I'm fond of scarecrows. Put a big cloak, gloves, and cloth mask on each minion, add a little straw, and get a large stick for them to hang from, then stick them out in the fields. Bonus points if somebody sees one catch a crow and snap its neck. :smallamused: Why scarecrows? Well, it's a human-shaped disguise that lets them stay stock still without attracting attention. Plus, when you have to use them, nobody guesses "necromancer" right off the bat- they think of constructs. They'll try and set fire to them, bog them down with water, and other ineffective things. Plus, they're creepy. If things go south, you can…

Pin the Blame:
Sure, the townspeople know there are undead. But if you've been a clever necromancer, they don't know whose undead. Set up a secret communication system of some sort with your minions to pass instructions, or just use Ventriloquism. Have them "return" to their "master", some witch, wizard, or other magic user who you want to take the fall. The townspeople follow, leaving your target with limited options. Chances are he'll give an order to prove they're not his undead- obviously, you should make them obey it. The next obvious step is to order them to dismantle themselves. You order them to obey by falling prostate in front of your target and then collapsing. (Most dramatic with skeletons, obviously.) Mob mentality will consider this sort of thing perfect evidence.

Acceptance:
Make the townspeople need you. It has to be a small town. Raise the dead in secret, and have them hang around until needed. "Needed" being the next time some goblins come raiding or whatever. You might have to encourage this along. Make a show of raising dead warriors to give them the chance to once again defend their home.

Alternatively, get permission to use the bodies of executed criminals for hard labor. Surely after what they've done (possibly after a small Suggestion…), death is only punishment- justice would demand they pay back for what they've taken!

Page from "Pirates"
Keep 'em in the river! I mean, really, who's going to check there? Most towns are going to have some sort of water source on hand, and you can just store your minions there until you need them. (Assuming they're not the sort to have an issue with running water, of course.)

[rel]

After a certain level (I find 5 to 7) you just walk into a town and tell anyone who complains to take a hike. By this point you can handily dismantle the defenses of the average town so if they really want to start a fight you can finish it.

[Vizzerdrix]

Something that I'd like to try is this: Be any sort of necro you want, but worship Cas (the angry moose god from Frostburn). Now as a devout follower, your duty is to assist others in getting Justice (or revenge!). When you enter a city, you can claim that the two large zombies have employed you to help them seek out the the wicked persons that <Insert heart wrenching sob story here> them in life so they can rest in peace. Bluff and/or forged contracts may be required for this.

You could also put them in armor and claim they are golems, or sew them up into giant stuffed animals.

[LordBlades]

I'm currently playing a necromancer(necropolitan Dread Necromancer 8) in a Dragonalnce campaign and I have amassed quite a sizable undead horde: 2 Juvenile Silver Dragon Zombies, a 10-headed Hydra Zombie, 2 Spellwarped Ettin Skeletons and about 40 or so humanoid skeletons. The party is also mostly undead (3 undead and 1 warforged) I mainly use 3 approaches to inter-human relations:

-Authority. Not all authorities are good-aligned and/or adverse to having a decently powerful spellcaster and his horde of undead on their side. I've made myslef a known ally of one such authority in game (the Knights of Neraka for who's familiar with the setting) so I'm officially welcome in places they control. Even if people might not like it, there's little they can do.

-Intimidation. Not too many settlements can face the force my undead horde (together with the rest of the party) can bring to bear, so they're kind of forced to let us in (most of my humanoid skeletons come from such an altercation with a town's population).

-Subterfuge. Some times the cities I'm trying to get in are too big for brute force approach and/or I don't really want to march in as a conqueror (and thus letting everybody and their dog know I've arrived). For such circumstances I have a Hat of Disguise and an Enveloping Pit.

[HunterOfJello]

Bluff and Diplomacy!

Play your character Diablo III style. Keep your undead horde generally out of sight and if anyone asks you about it, tell them you're building up an army of already dead creatures in order to hold off a massive horde of Demons from destroying their kingdom. Nobody complains about the Witchdoctor PC or Necromancer NPC in Diablo 3. What peasant cares if someone is bringing back the dead if there are already demons on their doorstep?

People will forgive a lot once they're convinced you're going to save them from being killed by a massive horde of demons.

[hoverfrog]

Be nice to people. I've got a necromancer (NE Human Cleric 5 (The Keeper (Eberron)) from Karrnath) in my group and he regularly saves innocent people, asks their names, checks up on them after the fight, even donates some cash to help them out. The city guard love him for his help in fighting off attacks on the city and turning their undead minions against them and the common people love him for the reputation that he has built as a positive force for the community. A reputation enhanced by clever spin from the local bard, paid well for his trouble.

How is this evil? He is doing these nice things for his own benefit. Having a town that loves him means having a town that will protect him. It means having a town that won't believe the scandalous rumours about torturing kittens and animating their bodies. They'll do the work of justifying why he has a giant skeleton bodyguard (to protect him from the town's enemies) and as long as the zombies he uses aren't the remains of Uncle Fred then they tolerate the hoard that he keeps out of town ready to defend it.

Objections are handled reasonably, by the authority figures in the town. If the mayor accepts that a zombie army has to be camped outside then how is that different from lord bringing his retinue and camping them nearby? Except that a soldier will get drunk, start fights and seduce the town's women folk while the zombie minions will just stand there waiting for orders.

--

In your game you might try visiting the town council for permission to bring your "bone golems" into town. People hate being lied to so being open about it means that the worst reaction is likely to be a refusal.

Also start with a small request. People are more likely to agree to something small than they are to something big. You can then increase the requests. Eventually you'll be marching through town with an undead army and having the dead brought to you for animation by a grateful populous who won't have a clue how they got there from agreeing to allow a necromancer to shop in the market.

[Psyren]

Be a Vivicarnate - Neutral Good Necromancy! Since you're given freedom to refluff, just edit out the typical zombie turn-offs e.g. odor and scavengers.

[Wookie-ranger]

the earliest way to get Animate Dead is at level 5.
With Cha 18 (+4), full ranks (+8), Synergy from Bluff (+2), a Disguise Kit (+2) and you take 20 you get a result of 36
Adjust for different race (-2) and different age (-2) you get a final check result of 32.
That means that your undead are impossible get noticed by anyone with a spot skill of 11 or lower. (excluding magic items and racial bonuses).
If taking 20 is not allowed for this skill in your game, talk to your DM about it, seriously, you know when something does not look dead anymore.

If you give all of them full plat armor and heavy robes a reasonable DM would give you anywhere from +5 to +15 depending on the situation. May be even deny NPCs from making a spot check all together, since they cannot see who/what is in the armor. (think 'full metal alchemist')

[hamishspence]

Something that I'd like to try is this: Be any sort of necro you want, but worship Cas (the angry moose god from Frostburn).

From Heroes of Horror actually- but the Lost of Spite might be an interesting deity to choose.