PDA

View Full Version : Idea Farm: Alien: the Taken [NWoD]



Admiral Squish
2012-06-27, 03:35 PM
Hey, everybody! Me again, but this time I'm gonna take a step to the left from my usual work. I'm working on a project in the NWoD system. My brother actually came up with the idea, and I just got into the idea recently. The basic idea is to create a splat book based on the modern myths, the legends of the modern world. Aliens. Specifically, tales of UFOs and abductions. I've been doing a lot of research lately and it's all very interesting stuff.

Now, we've got a lot of good ideas, but nothing really concrete. Which is the perfect time to pitch it to you fine folks! We want to harvest as many ideas as we can, for as brilliant as we may be, we simply cannot come up with the sheer breadth of ideas we could get from all these minds working together. And while I normally would prefer to wait until we have more complete to post it, I think this is the best time to get new ideas, since the rule's aren't crystallized just yet and new ideas won't require us to rework the entire system.

Now, I'd like to be clear. This isn't the game itself. The more-finished product will be posted later, once we DO have more rules, in a much nicer thread with formatting and graphics and so on and so forth. This is intended to be much more casual. Group brainstorming, and discussion.

So, without further ado, here's some of the stuff we DO have:

Premise:
Aliens are real, and they want to preform twisted experiments on you. Simply put, that's how it works. But this is the tip of the iceberg. It's estimated that approximately 5% of the population has been abducted by aliens at some point, though most never remember the experience, or replace the experience with a memory screen, or even think it was a dream. But these vast majority of these abductions are exploratory, the aliens testing if subjects will be usable in their REAL experiments. You play as an abductee who has subject to the true experiments, your mind and body altered forever by the experience.

Abductors:
Through a great deal of research, we've narrowed the list of abductor aliens to four categories of offenders.

The first abductor species is the grays. These are the ones who do the most abducting, but they're also the most recent arrivals to the earth theater of operations, only making an appearance a few hundred years ago. They are your typical alien, gray skin, large head, featureless black eyes, with telepathic and telekinetic abilities. They kidnap humans and subject them to a wide variety of medical tests and mental probing. There are a few theories about why they do this. Some say they're trying to uncover the source of our emotion and individuality, which they lost long ago to cloning and their telepathic hive-mind. Others say that their cloning processes are beginning to break down, that they 'seeded' man with their DNA and they've come to refresh their supply. Some say they're actually benevolent, intending to bring about the next step of human evolution, though their methods are somewhat unsavory. Grays perform tech and psi experiments

Reptilians are possibly the most aggressively unpleasant abductors, and they've been dealing earth the longest, since prehistoric times. They actually have terrestrial bases deep underground, near the molten mantle of the earth. They are a predatory species of reptile-analogues from Draco. They are extremely strong and resilient, and they have a special taste for warm-blooded flesh. Cattle mutilations and mysterious human disappearances are their calling cards. Reptilians are much more advanced technologically than humans, but somewhat less so than other abductors. What technology they do have is usually aimed to make them stronger, faster, and more dangerous. Reptilian abductors seem to take great pleasure in the mental and physical anguish their abductions and tests cause on humans. They are even known to rape abductees once their business with them is finished. They perfrom org and tech experiments.

Nordics are considered by most to be the most benevolent abductors, but the truth is not so simple. The nordics take the form of very large and beautiful human males, about 7 feet tall, usually with light hair and eyes. Contact with them is usually quite pleasant, with abductees reporting a deep feeling of love and joy while in the presence of these otherworldly beings. Most of those into the truth of them, however, believe that the form that we see is a mental projection designed to be as pleasant and authoritative as possible. They believe that the Nordics want to rule us, but they don’t want just to rule, they want to be loved, worshiped. Some believe that the Nordics are the true identity of the beings identified as ’angels’ in biblical texts. Nordics perform Psi and Bio experiments.

‘Exotic’ is a catch all category to refer to a good number of other races with a smaller presence on earth, though each is no less dangerous or powerful than the others. A few examples include myconids, a semi-sentient fungal infection, robotics, a purely mechanical intelligence, and ‘lovecrafts*‘, beings which most closely resemble the great old ones from the stories of H.P. Lovecraft. They all have different reasons for being on earth, and they all have extremely strange, alien methods of accomplishing their goals. The myconids are simply driven to spread, and their ‘experiments’ are simply the changes they make to their hosts as they work to take over. Robotics have long since cast off the race that created them, and are interested in humans, hoping to somehow assimilate the human’s potential for creativity into their own designs. The lovecrafts do not exist in our universe, but even the tiny portion of their being that they can thrust through the barrier between realms is enough to drive some men to madness. Exotic ‘experiments’ can come in any variety.

*Not really sure about the name…


Support Groups:

Those taken by extraterrestrials have different ways of dealing with the traumatic experience. These support groups aren’t necessarily unified groups, but they do describe the usual reactions people have to the experience of an abduction, and more importantly, the knowledge we’re not along in the universe, and not everyone’s friendly.

Techies are those who believe that alien technology and knowledge is a valuable resource. If we can understand and unlock their secrets, how they tick, then we can turn their weapons against them, or use the technology to better ourselves, or even develop ways to counter it.

Reactionaries are those who, when pushed, decide to push back. They arm themselves, organize, and fortify, to defend their homes and lives against these otherworldly invaders. These are the ones who want nothing more than to see every extraterrestrial artifact and every alien blasted into space.

Survivors are those who realize that you can’t fight an enemy so much more advanced than us. They run, they hide, they lay low, they try to ignore, or better yet forget the aliens and the terrible knowledge they now carry.

Post-humanists are those who believe that the experience of abduction, though often terrible, made them better. They are stronger now, and they will use the very power the aliens gave them to fight back and raise themselves above their human weaknesses.

Reformers are those that believe the world has to know. The aliens are out there and we as a species can do nothing as long as nobody knows that. The reformers spread the word however they can, through TV shows and movies, tabloids, newspapers, or failing that, they sometimes simply shout it from the street corner to whoever will listen.


Experiments:

The players will be playing as not just those abducted by aliens, but as those changed by the experience. The aliens perform experiments, which are broken up into three categories. Each abductor will allow you to chose between two, or all three categories. Each abductor will have a certain universal benefit for each type of experiment they perform, which colors all their experiments in one way or another. There will be specific experiments within each group with their own little benefits, but we haven’t come up with any specifics yet.

Organic [Org]: These experiments are related to genetics, grafts, and symbiotes.
Psionic: [Psi]: These experiments are related to psychic, telekinetic, and other mental powers.
Technology [Tech]: These experiments are related to cybernetics, and alien technology.


Paranormal Abilities:

Paranormal abilities are different powers that you learned during or after your abduction. They’re gonna have tags based on the experiment groups that can learn them. So, a taken with a bio experiment can’t learn a tech PA, and so on. No specifics yet, but I’ll put down a few vague ideas we’ve got.

Tech:
Holography (illusions)
Medi-Bots (rapid healing/soak)
Tachyon Speed (Extra actions)
Teleport (Teleportation)
Technophilia (Sorta like resources, but for special alien tech.)
Electromagnetics (EMPs, electic shocks, and such.)

Org:
Regeneration (Rapid healing/soak)
Super-Strength (Self-explanatory)
Morphing (Shape change)
Contortionism (Bending/flexing/sliding)
Parasite (Bioweapons)
Medsense (Detect how injured a target is)

Psi:
Forced Viewing (Illusions)
Tactile Telekinesis (Super-strength)
Transposition (Teleportation)
Telekinesis (Self-explanatory)
Phasing (Walk through things)
Thermokinesis (Hot and cold)

Admiral Squish
2012-06-28, 06:46 AM
Let the ideas flow!

Seriously, though, I thought this was really cool. Nobody's a fan of nWoD? Or aliens?

SuperDave
2012-06-29, 08:42 AM
I'm interested! (Then again, I am a little biased.)

For those of you who don't know me (i.e., everyone), I'm Admiral Squish's aforementioned brother, the one who started this whole crazy idea.

Originally, I planned for Exotics to be more Lovecraftian than a catch-all category. Maybe alternative abductors could be worked in later, as mini-splats like Entitlements in Changeling: The Lost?

I'm not sure about the Reptilians being subterranean. I mean, I like the idea, and it challenges people's perspectives about aliens coming from above instead of below, but I find it a little hard to believe that if they've been preying on us since prehistoric times, they still haven't taken over or been discovered. What kept either of these things from happening? If we integrate it with the Hollow Earth Theory (http://www.unmuseum.org/hollow.htm), it might fly, but that might be asking a lot in terms of suspension of disbelief.

SuperDave
2012-06-29, 08:57 AM
I'd like to ask anyone reading this thread for their recommendations of fine literature and cinema dealing with the alien abduction phenomenon.

Here's a sampling of what I've thought of so far for inspiration. (Note: I haven't actually watched/read some of these, but they're all on the list!)


Fiction
Animorphs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animorphs) (series), by K.A. Applegate
The Lurking Fear and Other Stories, by H.P. Lovecraft
Resident Alien (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=user_review&id=4773) (series), by Peter Hogan and Steve Parkhouse
Trying Human (http://www.introducingemy.com/tryinghuman-r2/), by Emy Bitner

Nonfiction
The Mothman Prophecies, by John Keel
Impossible Physics, by Michio Kaku
Weird Science Generator (http://seventhsanctum.com/generate.php?Genname=weirdscience)

Online
Reptilian Research Page (http://stargods.org/ReptilianPage.htm)
UFO COVER-UP: ALIEN NATION OR CONSPIRACY THEORY? By William Cooper (http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread59953/pg1)
Conspiracy Theories (http://www.alien-ufos.com/conspiracy-theories/)
Watcher Website Global Government NWO Freemason New World Order Secret Society Mind Control UFO NASA Masonic Conspiracy Resources (http://www.mt.net/~watcher/conspir.html)
Alien Illuminati Conspiracy (http://www.ufo-blogger.com/2009/01/ufo-alien-illuminati-conspiracydenver.html)
Aliens & UFO's - A Summary of Theories: Government Involvement & Coverups (http://www.illuminati-news.com/ufos-and-aliens/html/gov_involvement.htm)
LA Times: The Road to Area 51 (http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/la-mag-april052009-backstory,0,5104077.story)
Area51.org (http://www.area51.org/)
Crystalinks Metaphysics and Science Website (http://www.crystalinks.com/extra.html)
Starborn Support, The Alien Abduction Support Group (http://starbornsupport.com/)
Real Alien Pictures, Photos, images, and Sightings (http://alien-ufo-research.com/alien_pictures/)


Movies
District 9 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6PDlMggROA)
Alien (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEVY_lonKf4) (series)
The Thing (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ftmr17M-a4)
Predator (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrDsvVKY_d4) (series)
The Terminator (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4Jo8QoOTQ4) (series)
Fire in the Sky (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9LhshgLJuuM)
The Fourth Kind (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTyyj0s2Dh0)
The Mothman Prophecies (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faF4PF3x5lU)
The Gate (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1SfwPPbkVI) (short film)

Video Games
Destroy All Humans!
Perfect Dark
Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of War
Portal (series)

T.V.
The X-Files
Stargate
Neon Genesis Evangelion
Torchwood
Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles

Leliel
2012-06-29, 02:46 PM
Uh, not Destroy All Humans.

Not unless you plan to satirize the nWoD even as you play it.

I would also suggest drawing both links and differences from abductees and changelings taken by alien-inspired True Fae, like the Three Androgynes from Autuum Nightmares: Given how "true" aliens return their subjects, it's even more confusing, since the Three mostly return their subjects as mortals after swiping something of vague emotional import (such as a picture of the subject's family), and even the ones that are taken to Arcadia are invariably returned, safe if not particularly sound, a year and a day later.

Perhaps changelings view them with both empathy and envy. Abuctees were at the mercy of something both far more powerful and far stranger than they ever could be, but at the same time, the only thing they did was tinker around with experiments, and they never created a fetch. There can even be a bit of arrogant contempt-abductees were returned, while most Lost had to escape.

Perhaps an abductee's power, while mysterious and strange in nature, also has a basis in real (pseudo)science. They can fiddle with gravity, for example, but if you had a hypothetical graviton detector, you could see they were altering how many of them were in the area-no making people fall sideways, only float.

EDIT: Oh, I forgot about the experiment explanation!

Obviously, a risk to improving your powers is that you have to deal with the abductors, and even the most benign extraterrestrial usually doesn't comprehend how painful their experiments can be. And that's lucky, because then you just have to communicate with them properly-most are pushing their own agendas as well.

This is also a good way to show the "antagonist" faction-Reptids are probably responsible for the tendency of humanity, as a species, to associate all things scaly with evil due to their half-remembered brutalization of their subjects. While people who were initially given their Experiment powers by reptilians are no better or worse then any other, they can probably guess from whatever memories they haven't repressed that whatever those things want, it's definitely not something that is going to result in any great good for humanity.

But their weapons can be so tempting...

Absol197
2012-06-29, 03:04 PM
Another good movie reference would be The Fourth Kind. It's really creepy. At least, I thought so.

So, if I've got this right, the type of alien that took you is analogous to clan/auspice/path, etc., while what experiments they performed on you determine what kinds of disciplines/gifts/arcana you can access?

I really like the idea. And I don't think that the reptilians being underground since pre-history is too out there. Yeah, they should have been able to complete a takeover by now...if that was their goal. That itself is really chilling to think about: they have all this technological power, and all that time to establish complete dominion over us. They obviously are malicious, so...why haven't they? What are they really after?

I believe that the lovecraftian's should be in their category all by themselves, and that, for consistency's sake with the rest of the NWoD line, you should come up with a fifth category. But that's just me. A possible 5th category could be something akin to the Mothman: an extradimensional race that exists in the past and future at the same time. Sort of like the Mothman Prophesies. Alternatively, you could go with the mechanical intelligence, sort of borg-esque, but not so overt, to give a bit more of a machine-type abductor.

EDIT: Maybe also up the number of experiment types, to give an expanded berth of "powers?" I can't really think of what other categories there could be. Maybe you could instead make several different kinds of each of the base categories? Like, organic experiments might be broken down into augmentation, mutation, and grafting, while Psychic experiments could be faculties (expanding or augmenting mental abilities), awareness (mind-reading and clairvoyance), and projection (telepathy, mind-control). That way, you'd end up with nine different categories, and each different adbuctor gives you access to five, with one being unique to that abductor. That could work.

I also really like the support groups. I think a change of name for that category is in order, but the idea is great, and right along the line of what I was thinking for the organizations for a game like this.

Pokonic
2012-06-29, 03:30 PM
As for the "Lovecrafts", I would go for the name "Starspawn". It gets the general idea's accross, and it's entirly reasonable that the name Lovecrafts are used in Hunter documents and such.

Also, one Org catagory could be Beastism: The general replacment of human organs/nerves/brain functions with things that bear resembalance to creatures seen as more primitive than man (and these may not nessisaraly be from earth.) Hearing may be tweaked, you might have pesudoeyes grafted to your inner thigh, you might have toes that for whatever reason are now in a contorted state that lets you shovel earth under you like a pro, ect.

Also, I would like to give a example antagonist to this wonderful little idea: the Mistakes. Each are abandoned examples of alien enginering that were sent to earth (or possibly the moon) so that they could be disposed of easly. These might range from humans or animals that got a bit too much cybernetics to remember there names (or fear of mankind), shoggothish horrors that are the end result of to much Bio bioenginering, and bloated Akiraish sins against nature that are the end result of a human not being able to withstand Psi energy, and paying the price for becoming...non human in mindset and apperance.

For some examples of Bio Mistakes, look at the puppies in this short film. (Warning, horror ahead, and a strangly Hunterish conversation.) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1SfwPPbkVI)

Science Officer
2012-06-30, 12:05 AM
Lovecraftian entities that would perform abductions, the two most obvious are the Mi-go, who will put your brain in a cylinder and fly it to Pluto/around the universe. And the Great Race of Yith who are in the habit of psychically possessing the bodies of humans across time and space. But these are just different kinds of aliens, not creatures from outside of reality.
Starspawn is a fine name for the category.

I've never played any WW games, but I like reading about them. I think something like this might fit in their style for character creation.

[Abductors][Experiment/Experience][Powers][Outlook/Group]

Threats:
Men in Black: A bit obvious, but perhaps necessary

Crusoes: Extra-Terrestrials stranded on Earth, many of whom will do anything to get off this rock.

Mistakes: Is a good one.

Missionaries: Some have come a long way to Earth to spread the good news. Unfortunately, the Earthlings don't always understand it when they hear it...

Anunnaki: Human beings who can count an Extra-Terrestrial as a distant ancestor. They're all a little bit crazy, see themselves as better than normal humans... who knows what they're capable of, or what they'd do if they knew you had been taken...

Invader Species: Beings accidentally brought along and left behind by abductors. Like zebra mussels brought to the great lakes in the ballast tanks of ocean-going vessels.
Either there aren't too many of them and they're smart enough to hide, or perhaps they don't survive too long after being brought to Earth. Maybe there's not to much potential for realism.

Investors: Earth may be a technologically backward slimeball, but it is not without opportunity for profit. An import/export business might make a lot of money if they sold some beads and cut glass to the locals and kept it quiet.


@Reptilians: Maybe make them aggressively single minded, like the 'reptile brains' concept. They have great technology, but don't have too many ideas for how to use it.

Definitely check out Coast to Coast AM and conspiracy theory stuff for inspiration. There are a lot of strange ideas out there.

TheOneWhoWalks
2012-07-01, 12:46 PM
Ok, first of all, I want to say, this sounds Awesome! I love WoD, both new and old, and I'm alway interesting in new creepiness to stock the world with, although I don't really have anyone to play it with where I currently live...

One thing I wanted to point out is that all the nWoD games (with the exception of Changeling, which has 6, and Hunter, which has 6 at each tier, and I feel like kinda doesn't count, because you can play without any at all, if you want...) have 5 categories of basic thing you can be (5 Mage paths, 5 Vampire clans, 5 Werewolf tribes, ect.), so I think you need one more. The Exotics is nice "I have a concept but it doesn't really fit any of these..." option (I find myself missing the "caitiff" or "hollow one" options from oWod, for example...), but I feel like you need a fifth category.

Sadly, I don't know enough about UFO/Extraterrestrial lore to make a good suggestion as to what the 5th one might be, but maybe either expand the scope of one of the things you have classified under Exotics, or a plant-based intelligence, or maybe something like an intelligent world? Like, a planet who's civilization invented Nano-tech just a little too early in their technological development, and it got out of control and assimilated their planet, and achieved Strong AI/sentience in the process of breaking down and absorbing the minds of it's creators, but for some reason (I can't think of a good one right now... but one could perhaps be devised...) decided *not* to continue assimilating things, but instead to exist as a self-aware planet with the sort of collective consciousness of the planet's former population.

...Hey, I said I was unqualified to make good suggestions. :-P

Anyway, I really like what you have so far... I think I'm gonna do some poking around the internet/bookstore and do some reading, see if I can make useful contributions to this at some stage :-D in the mean time, keep up the awesome!

Faerieheart
2012-07-01, 07:34 PM
Ok, first of all, I want to say, this sounds Awesome! I love WoD, both new and old, and I'm alway interesting in new creepiness to stock the world with, although I don't really have anyone to play it with where I currently live...

One thing I wanted to point out is that all the nWoD games (with the exception of Changeling, which has 6, and Hunter, which has 6 at each tier, and I feel like kinda doesn't count, because you can play without any at all, if you want...) have 5 categories of basic thing you can be (5 Mage paths, 5 Vampire clans, 5 Werewolf tribes, ect.), so I think you need one more. The Exotics is nice "I have a concept but it doesn't really fit any of these..." option (I find myself missing the "caitiff" or "hollow one" options from oWod, for example...), but I feel like you need a fifth category.

Sadly, I don't know enough about UFO/Extraterrestrial lore to make a good suggestion as to what the 5th one might be, but maybe either expand the scope of one of the things you have classified under Exotics, or a plant-based intelligence, or maybe something like an intelligent world? Like, a planet who's civilization invented Nano-tech just a little too early in their technological development, and it got out of control and assimilated their planet, and achieved Strong AI/sentience in the process of breaking down and absorbing the minds of it's creators, but for some reason (I can't think of a good one right now... but one could perhaps be devised...) decided *not* to continue assimilating things, but instead to exist as a self-aware planet with the sort of collective consciousness of the planet's former population.

...Hey, I said I was unqualified to make good suggestions. :-P

Anyway, I really like what you have so far... I think I'm gonna do some poking around the internet/bookstore and do some reading, see if I can make useful contributions to this at some stage :-D in the mean time, keep up the awesome!

If he needs a fifth could always go with advanced AI/computers performing tasks given to them by someone else who has yet to enter the scene in person. Who or what they are, where they come from, and the goals purpose of the experiments the "AI" almost mindlessly does as it is what they are programmed to do could be a big mystery. This fits in well with the probe/robot theory that many claim are more likely for a species than coming here in person. (Not my beliefs mind you, I believe both are possible, likely and happening) Most fun part is, it truly is a mystery, as the robots do not need to know why they do what they do to follow orders so finding out the who and why involves either puzzle solving by putting together the pieces and making educated guesses or somehow finding a way to intercept their orders (assuming they are even still getting them) or even more unlikely finding a way to track them down and get to them yourselves.

Amechra
2012-07-01, 08:31 PM
Interesting...

I would like to suggest that there needs to be an extra-dimensional abductor group, because that does come up...

Idea for an antagonist group... Aliens that want to get in.

In other words, they don't see the whole point behind experimenting at all, and in fact wish to exterminate the little disgusting things that live on our world.

A mechanical abductor would be neat...

I would like to bring up the Wildcard virus. Please, go look it up.

Ooh, new experimental type! On top of superior technology, how about alternate tech? Like in 7th Sea, where one of the ancient races used clockwork while another used magnetic fields almost exclusively in their tech?

Or even just War of the Worlds, where the Martians never discovered the wheel?

Togath
2012-07-01, 09:31 PM
I feel a little silly for mentioning this, but, the Norse ones just dont seem like they make good villains, either being too subtle(they look like people, and act like people), Or it could be mistaken for racism(racism vs. tall people of Norse decent), The greys still need something to make them more of a threat somehow(they just seem too spindly to be able to take on humans, let alone not get killed/mauled/eaten by predatory animals), the reptilians and the ones in the misc category(especially the lovecraft inspired ones) seem like they are easier to use though(though keep in mind I've never played nwod, and dont know anything about it, so my advice may not be accurate if there's something in the setting which would change interactions)
edit; also i agree with amechra that those extra groups he mentioned could be interesting as well.

Amechra
2012-07-01, 09:46 PM
Part of me wants an abductor group that is an intelligent color.

You know at least one of the things that I'm referencing.:smallwink:

Pokonic
2012-07-01, 09:49 PM
I feel a little silly for mentioning this, but, the Norse ones just dont seem like they make good villains, either being too subtle(they look like people, and act like people), Or it could be mistaken for racism(racism vs. tall people of Norse decent), The greys still need something to make them more of a threat somehow(they just seem too spindly to be able to take on humans, let alone not get killed/mauled/eaten by predatory animals), the reptilians and the ones in the misc category(especially the lovecraft inspired ones) seem like they are easier to use though(though keep in mind I've never played nwod, and dont know anything about it, so my advice may not be accurate if there's something in the setting which would change interactions)
edit; also i agree with amechra that those extra groups he mentioned could be interesting as well.

The Greys have ubertech. They would only be near you if you are already under control. The Norse? Have you seen biblical depictions of angels? There hand puppets for a higher being. Half the horror of Changeling is that you could almost never deal with your tormenter face to face, and even if it was somewhat nice it wouls still warp you in strange ways.



I would like to suggest that there needs to be an extra-dimensional abductor group, because that does come up...

Bascily starspawn.

Faerieheart
2012-07-01, 09:50 PM
I feel a little silly for mentioning this, but, the Norse ones just dont seem like they make good villains, either being too subtle(they look like people, and act like people), Or it could be mistaken for racism(racism vs. tall people of Norse decent), The greys still need something to make them more of a threat somehow(they just seem too spindly to be able to take on humans, let alone not get killed/mauled/eaten by predatory animals), the reptilians and the ones in the misc category(especially the lovecraft inspired ones) seem like they are easier to use though(though keep in mind I've never played nwod, and dont know anything about it, so my advice may not be accurate if there's something in the setting which would change interactions)
edit; also i agree with amechra that those extra groups he mentioned could be interesting as well.

With advanced enough technology and psionic abilities greys don't need anything else to be a threat. I mean really. Compare humans to chimps and gorillas. We'd win a war with them easily because of advanced tech and intelligence despite their superior physical capeabilities. The greys would supposedly be in comparison to us just as more intelligent and scientifically advanced compared to us as we are to the chimps. If we could get our hands around one's throat we'd snap their necks like a twig, not much different than a chimp with us. Too bad for us and the chimp, that's really not as easy as it sounds.

Togath
2012-07-01, 11:20 PM
With advanced enough technology and psionic abilities greys don't need anything else to be a threat. I mean really. Compare humans to chimps and gorillas. We'd win a war with them easily because of advanced tech and intelligence despite their superior physical capeabilities. The greys would supposedly be in comparison to us just as more intelligent and scientifically advanced compared to us as we are to the chimps. If we could get our hands around one's throat we'd snap their necks like a twig, not much different than a chimp with us. Too bad for us and the chimp, that's really not as easy as it sounds.

Ah, that makes more sense, I wasn't sure if an alien race with supertech(including weapons) would fit into the setting or not(and from the sounds of it it could), and, if you dont need to worry about PCs being able to 1-hit-kill deities like in dnd, they are easier to make challenging as well(power level differences in systems is part of the reason i mentioned I dont know much about NWoD, which from the sounds of it is much lower in power then 3.5 dnd)

also, what is the sentient colour a reference to?, I cant think of anything atm, other then maybe something related to the green lantern franchise(referencing the colours of the vilains if i remember the random bits of things i know about it correctly, though i was pretty sure they mostly represented emotions, and the colours were secondary)

Pokonic
2012-07-02, 12:07 AM
also, what is the sentient colour a reference to?, I cant think of anything atm, other then maybe something related to the green lantern franchise(referencing the colours of the vilains if i remember the random bits of things i know about it correctly, though i was pretty sure they mostly represented emotions, and the colours were secondary)

The Color from out of space. It's a lovecraft thing.

TheOneWhoWalks
2012-07-02, 12:21 AM
The Color from out of space. It's a lovecraft thing.

I actually think it was a reference to Douglas Adam's Hitchhiker's Guide tot he Galaxy "trilogy", where there is an alien "race" which is a super-intelligent shade of blue.

Zale
2012-07-02, 01:15 AM
I like this idea.

Mind if I leave this here?

Greys

Some people underestimate the Greys. They're so small. So spindly. With their enlarged heads, they almost seem comical and child-like. Harmless.

Few survive this underestimation.

Greys are smarter than anything human could hope to be. They are pillars of intellect; pure and unstained by petty things like emotion or morals. The merest thought of a Grey could rip metal or break bone. The smallest whisper of their minds contain more knowledge than the whole of human scientific exploits.

Their technology can do things that we can only call miracles. The most meager of force-shields can deflect armor-piercing artillery rounds; the smallest of their weapons can reduce tanks to slag. With the press of a button, they can rebuilt a city.. or turn it to dust. If they decided to destroy humanity tomorrow, then nothing we could do would save us.

The Greys study humans to gain understanding of the strange vagaries of our psychology. These strange "Emotions" and odd, irrational thoughts. Their physiology is disturbing similar to theirs and this makes them... uneasy. This does not prevent them from using Humans as a useful test subject. Many abductiotees are subjected to rigorous and often invasive medical experimentation.

Reptilians


Aggressive, violent and driven by their impulses; Reptilians present the most immediate danger to a passing human. Though other Aliens may abduct or experiment, a reasonable percentage of them return their test subjects in.. fair quality.

Reptilians, on the other hand, delight in painfully disposing of their used abductees.

The Reptilians are a very physical species, compared to the intellectual Greys, the enigmatic Nords and the simply inscrutable Starspawn. They are by far the most rigorous and strong aliens. Many of them delight in chasing large game, livestock or a stray human for miles. The hormone pumping chase and the taste, the feel of warm blood.. they revel in it.

Their technology seems crude and rough, though advanced. Because many Reptilians prefer to be close and personal, their weaponry is rarely capable of a long range attack. This pandering of practicality to instinct is a common aspect of things they create. Reptilian experimental labs and holding cells often resemble medieval torture dungeons. They are generally used for similar purposes.

It's likely that Reptilians abduct humans simply to torture them, physically and psychologically, for as long as possible. If they use humans for experiments, these are generally as painful as they can possibly make them.



Nords

A Nord.. is.. seems.. wondrous. Their forms seem so human, so authoritative, so kind. Surely they come to protect us from the other aliens. They understand us so well.

Understanding humanity is they thing they are so good at.

No human knows what a Nord looks like. They variate their shapes frequently, changing through appearances and personalities like a person changing clothes for a new occasion. Nords are masters of Psychology and Sociology. They understand all too well how humans think. A Grey may be able to delve into your mind, but a Nord knows exactly how you feel. They know exactly what they need to say, to do, to seem like in order to get you to do whatever they want.

Nordic technology is rarely obvious. The most apparent aspect of it is the Nord's ability to change appearances. How much of this is psychic illusions and how much is real is anyone's guess. For a Nord, Appearances are merely one of many tools to open the proverbial vault that is the human psyche. Each and every aspect of how they look and present themselves is carefully tailored to provoke a certain effect. They can seem awesome and glorious, or benevolent and approachable. Nords have a good understanding of the motivations and urges of humans, and are very skilled at prodding human thoughts in the directions they wish. Their experiments in Social Engineering often end up shaping history itself.

For such a mysterious and deceptive species, Nords have a fairly straight forward reason for abductions. They want to understand how humans think, so stealing them away is the logical method. Most abductees remember their abductions as pleasant interviews with beautiful and kind people, regardless of what really happened.


EDIT:

Funny thing, now that I think about it, these three aliens line up nicely with the three categories of Attributes. Mental for Greys, Physical for Reptilians and Social for Nords.

radmelon
2012-07-02, 01:19 AM
I actually think it was a reference to Douglas Adam's Hitchhiker's Guide tot he Galaxy "trilogy", where there is an alien "race" which is a super-intelligent shade of blue.

Well, he said one of the things that he was referencing, so it was most likely both. I would also like to note that I picked up on both of them immediately, The guide is one of my favorite books, and The color out of space is my favorite lovecraft story.

Zale
2012-07-02, 01:21 AM
To be fair, the Hoovooloo spent most of the book as a free standing refracted crystal.

:smallsmile:

Amechra
2012-07-02, 01:23 AM
It was both, of course!

Admiral Squish
2012-07-02, 10:41 AM
Huzzah! Commentary! I was beginning to believe that this thread would simply die out.

Now, I'll get to each of you in turn, though since the posts are so large, I'll spoiler them for convenience. I’m trying to keep up, but I think I missed a few. I’ll get to your posts soon enough.

Leliel:


Uh, not Destroy All Humans.

Not unless you plan to satirize the nWoD even as you play it.

I would also suggest drawing both links and differences from abductees and changelings taken by alien-inspired True Fae, like the Three Androgynes from Autuum Nightmares: Given how "true" aliens return their subjects, it's even more confusing, since the Three mostly return their subjects as mortals after swiping something of vague emotional import (such as a picture of the subject's family), and even the ones that are taken to Arcadia are invariably returned, safe if not particularly sound, a year and a day later.

Perhaps changelings view them with both empathy and envy. Abuctees were at the mercy of something both far more powerful and far stranger than they ever could be, but at the same time, the only thing they did was tinker around with experiments, and they never created a fetch. There can even be a bit of arrogant contempt-abductees were returned, while most Lost had to escape.

Perhaps an abductee's power, while mysterious and strange in nature, also has a basis in real (pseudo)science. They can fiddle with gravity, for example, but if you had a hypothetical graviton detector, you could see they were altering how many of them were in the area-no making people fall sideways, only float.

EDIT: Oh, I forgot about the experiment explanation!

Obviously, a risk to improving your powers is that you have to deal with the abductors, and even the most benign extraterrestrial usually doesn't comprehend how painful their experiments can be. And that's lucky, because then you just have to communicate with them properly-most are pushing their own agendas as well.

This is also a good way to show the "antagonist" faction-Reptids are probably responsible for the tendency of humanity, as a species, to associate all things scaly with evil due to their half-remembered brutalization of their subjects. While people who were initially given their Experiment powers by reptilians are no better or worse then any other, they can probably guess from whatever memories they haven't repressed that whatever those things want, it's definitely not something that is going to result in any great good for humanity.

But their weapons can be so tempting...

Destroy all humans is more a reference for possible schemes/tech than the tone. Besides, from what I hear, most WoD games rarely follow the horror themes laid down in the source books.

There will definitely be parallels drawn between them. There are a lot of similarities, definitely, but at the same time, neither can really understand the other properly. Taken never understand what it's like to be replaced in your own home, and they don't have the whole escape thing. But at the same time, the changelings don't nessecarily understand the powerlessness of the experience. A changeling escaped, they beat their keeper in some way, at some point. For the taken, they're taken, tortured, experimented on, sometimes kept for decades, then simply returned at the whim of their abductor. They never get to take back the power.

I definitely intend for there to be a lot of pseudoscience involved in the abilities and powers. I will probably make up a few terms just to get some of the effects we have in mind.

Actually, the idea was that learning new PAs or upgrading current abilities would be more like unlocking new aspects of your existing experiment. The abductors make a point of making it hard to find them, so communicating with them would be extremely difficult. Grays and nordics are in space, reptoids in their deep, subterranean lairs. Unless they're out hunting.

Definitely an aspect of reptilians I'd love to explore. Part of the reason I said they should have been there since prehistory. You know, an old term for the devil is 'the dragon'. One theory I put forth was that the whole war in heaven was actually a primitive interpretation of a sizable battle between nordics and reptilians that took place around earth.


Absol179


Another good movie reference would be The Fourth Kind. It's really creepy. At least, I thought so.

So, if I've got this right, the type of alien that took you is analogous to clan/auspice/path, etc., while what experiments they performed on you determine what kinds of disciplines/gifts/arcana you can access?

I really like the idea. And I don't think that the reptilians being underground since pre-history is too out there. Yeah, they should have been able to complete a takeover by now...if that was their goal. That itself is really chilling to think about: they have all this technological power, and all that time to establish complete dominion over us. They obviously are malicious, so...why haven't they? What are they really after?

I believe that the lovecraftian's should be in their category all by themselves, and that, for consistency's sake with the rest of the NWoD line, you should come up with a fifth category. But that's just me. A possible 5th category could be something akin to the Mothman: an extradimensional race that exists in the past and future at the same time. Sort of like the Mothman Prophesies. Alternatively, you could go with the mechanical intelligence, sort of borg-esque, but not so overt, to give a bit more of a machine-type abductor.

EDIT: Maybe also up the number of experiment types, to give an expanded berth of "powers?" I can't really think of what other categories there could be. Maybe you could instead make several different kinds of each of the base categories? Like, organic experiments might be broken down into augmentation, mutation, and grafting, while Psychic experiments could be faculties (expanding or augmenting mental abilities), awareness (mind-reading and clairvoyance), and projection (telepathy, mind-control). That way, you'd end up with nine different categories, and each different adbuctor gives you access to five, with one being unique to that abductor. That could work.

I also really like the support groups. I think a change of name for that category is in order, but the idea is great, and right along the line of what I was thinking for the organizations for a game like this.

Well, it's not QUITE like any other WW system. The abductor determines the types of experiment, and by exension, PAs available to you, but it also gives you a abductor-specific benefit and drawback for each type of experiment. For example, a reptilian organic is gonna be significantly different from a nordic organic. Overall, four categories of abductors becomes 9 mechanically distinct 'groups' of benefits and drawbacks.

That’s my take on it, at least. I was intending to semi-include the hollow-earth theory. Perhaps not a hollow planet, but a network of deep-crust tunnels and catacombs.

There seems to be a lot of support for starspawn being their own catgory. You know, in the original version my brother was working on, there were going to be six abductors. I just balled the three I didn’t find many reports about into the exotic category. Would you guys rather we made it into six (or seven if we still want an ’other’ category) abductors?

I was intending to break up the experiement types into three subcategories each, but I was having trouble coming up with subcategories that were distinct enough from each other.

I’m glad you like the support groups. That one’s all my brother’s idea, but I do really like it.


Pokonic


As for the "Lovecrafts", I would go for the name "Starspawn". It gets the general idea's accross, and it's entirly reasonable that the name Lovecrafts are used in Hunter documents and such.

Also, one Org catagory could be Beastism: The general replacment of human organs/nerves/brain functions with things that bear resembalance to creatures seen as more primitive than man (and these may not nessisaraly be from earth.) Hearing may be tweaked, you might have pesudoeyes grafted to your inner thigh, you might have toes that for whatever reason are now in a contorted state that lets you shovel earth under you like a pro, ect.

Also, I would like to give a example antagonist to this wonderful little idea: the Mistakes. Each are abandoned examples of alien enginering that were sent to earth (or possibly the moon) so that they could be disposed of easly. These might range from humans or animals that got a bit too much cybernetics to remember there names (or fear of mankind), shoggothish horrors that are the end result of to much Bio bioenginering, and bloated Akiraish sins against nature that are the end result of a human not being able to withstand Psi energy, and paying the price for becoming...non human in mindset and apperance.

For some examples of Bio Mistakes, look at the puppies in this short film. (Warning, horror ahead, and a strangly Hunterish conversation.) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1SfwPPbkVI)

I like the name starspawn a lot, actually, though I’m not sure if it would count, since they’re supposed to be actually from another dimension.

Beastism… I don’t know if it would serve as a org category on it‘s own, but it’s a group of ideas I’ll definitely think about. I was intending for a graft category of some sort, and I’ll add in some of these ideas.

Oooh, I like the idea of Mistakes. I’m not sure of them being dumped, the aliens are interested in secrecy, after all. But I definitely like the idea of experiments that went too far and lost their humanity.

I watched like the first few minutes of that, but after Marble Hornets, I have a policy against watching horror of any sort to completion. What I did see looks cool, though.


Science Officer

Lovecraftian entities that would perform abductions, the two most obvious are the Mi-go, who will put your brain in a cylinder and fly it to Pluto/around the universe. And the Great Race of Yith who are in the habit of psychically possessing the bodies of humans across time and space. But these are just different kinds of aliens, not creatures from outside of reality.
Starspawn is a fine name for the category.

I've never played any WW games, but I like reading about them. I think something like this might fit in their style for character creation.

[Abductors][Experiment/Experience][Powers][Outlook/Group]

Threats:
Men in Black: A bit obvious, but perhaps necessary

Crusoes: Extra-Terrestrials stranded on Earth, many of whom will do anything to get off this rock.

Mistakes: Is a good one.

Missionaries: Some have come a long way to Earth to spread the good news. Unfortunately, the Earthlings don't always understand it when they hear it...

Anunnaki: Human beings who can count an Extra-Terrestrial as a distant ancestor. They're all a little bit crazy, see themselves as better than normal humans... who knows what they're capable of, or what they'd do if they knew you had been taken...

Invader Species: Beings accidentally brought along and left behind by abductors. Like zebra mussels brought to the great lakes in the ballast tanks of ocean-going vessels.
Either there aren't too many of them and they're smart enough to hide, or perhaps they don't survive too long after being brought to Earth. Maybe there's not to much potential for realism.

Investors: Earth may be a technologically backward slimeball, but it is not without opportunity for profit. An import/export business might make a lot of money if they sold some beads and cut glass to the locals and kept it quiet.


@Reptilians: Maybe make them aggressively single minded, like the 'reptile brains' concept. They have great technology, but don't have too many ideas for how to use it.

Definitely check out Coast to Coast AM and conspiracy theory stuff for inspiration. There are a lot of strange ideas out there.

I was thinking the creation would be more like [Abductor/experiment type][Experiment][Outlook/Group][PAs]

Men in Black are definitely going to be included. My brother’s take on them never made it to the notes, so I forgot to include it in the first post. His idea was that they’re not really government, they just sorta act like it and nobody asks questions. Perhaps they’re a hunter organization, perhaps they’re something else entirely. They use a lot of weapons and tools based of alien technology, and may even have their own experiments. For a moment I was considering having them be an ‘abductor’.

Crusoes sound pretty awesome. A gray living in it’s crashed spaceship, trying to repair it with earthly parts, or a Nordic who has decided the grand takeover plan is going too slowly and decides to come down to earth to step it up.

Where’d you get the word anunnaki? I’m not sure about aliens interbreeding with humans, since there is supposed to be a veneer of pseudoscience on this thing. But I could see genetic experiments blending the genetic traits of the aliens with human stock.

I saw something like this in one of the sources I looked at. I definitely like the idea. And they don’t necessarily have to be either one. If we have an MIB, that should be enough to keep most of their actions out of the public eye, and if it doesn’t, then those who report it will just be branded crazy.

Investors. This seems like an interesting idea, though with an MIB agency it seems like it would be difficult to pull off. Especially since the aliens likely wouldn’t want consumer goods, they would probably be more interested in resources. Reptilians would possibly like a steady supply of pets to devour.

Reptilians are gonna be thoroughly unpleasant creatures, you can rest assured. I don’t know if I can reconcile the needless cruelty and violence with a single-minded, goal-driven theme. Still… One source says reptilians are actually two races. The original draco-based life forms, and velociraptor-like dinos the dracos uplifted to become a servant race. It could be that the uplifted raptors are the needlessly cruel and violent ones, and the true reptilians are the truly single-minded ones.


The One Who Walks

Ok, first of all, I want to say, this sounds Awesome! I love WoD, both new and old, and I'm alway interesting in new creepiness to stock the world with, although I don't really have anyone to play it with where I currently live...

One thing I wanted to point out is that all the nWoD games (with the exception of Changeling, which has 6, and Hunter, which has 6 at each tier, and I feel like kinda doesn't count, because you can play without any at all, if you want...) have 5 categories of basic thing you can be (5 Mage paths, 5 Vampire clans, 5 Werewolf tribes, ect.), so I think you need one more. The Exotics is nice "I have a concept but it doesn't really fit any of these..." option (I find myself missing the "caitiff" or "hollow one" options from oWod, for example...), but I feel like you need a fifth category.

Sadly, I don't know enough about UFO/Extraterrestrial lore to make a good suggestion as to what the 5th one might be, but maybe either expand the scope of one of the things you have classified under Exotics, or a plant-based intelligence, or maybe something like an intelligent world? Like, a planet who's civilization invented Nano-tech just a little too early in their technological development, and it got out of control and assimilated their planet, and achieved Strong AI/sentience in the process of breaking down and absorbing the minds of it's creators, but for some reason (I can't think of a good one right now... but one could perhaps be devised...) decided *not* to continue assimilating things, but instead to exist as a self-aware planet with the sort of collective consciousness of the planet's former population.

...Hey, I said I was unqualified to make good suggestions. :-P

Anyway, I really like what you have so far... I think I'm gonna do some poking around the internet/bookstore and do some reading, see if I can make useful contributions to this at some stage :-D in the mean time, keep up the awesome!

Lot of people saying we need more abductor types. I mentioned in an above rply, I could return to the original design which featured six abductors. I just snowballed the three I couldn’t find reports on into a single catch all category, but I could break It up again with relative ease.

The problem with the intelligent world idea is how would it remain hidden. You can’t hide a second moon looming in earth orbit, really.

I look forward to hearing what else you come up with! Seems like you have an interesting take on the whole thing. And don’t worry. I’m always this awesome.:smallcool:

Zale
2012-07-02, 10:45 AM
Here's a Weird Science (http://seventhsanctum.com/generate.php?Genname=weirdscience) generator.

If you need techno-babble names for anything.

Science Officer
2012-07-02, 03:14 PM
Annunaki is a term from Babylonian mythology, I've heard it used in the whole Ancient Aliens type of stuff. They don't need to be actually descended from Aliens or from those experimented on. They could just be immoral crazy people with strange ideas about extra-terrestrials and bloodlines.

Crusoes aren't necessarily crashed, some of them might have been left behind for various reasons...

If you want to cross over with other WW fan-games, Geniuses would probably be very interested in all these goings-on.

I personally would like to see more abductors, I think Starspawn, Robotics, and/or Insectoids would be worthwhile.

When it comes to Lovecraftian aliens, there is something of a scale. Some are remarkably human-like in mind if not body, others are inscrutable, some seem like gods, and some have forms that cannot be comprehended by the minds of humans. Their technology often seems magical, although whether or not there is any magic in the Mythos is a point of some contention. Clarke's Law and such.

So there are Starfish Aliens (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/StarfishAliens) like the Yithians, the Elder Things, the Mi-go, the octopoid Starspawn of Cthulhu.
And then there're some which are less comprehensible, and possessed of greater powe (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SufficientlyAdvancedAlien)r, who are more likely to be called gods than aliens, like Cthulhu himself and other Great Old Ones.
This probably only mostly true.

Crop-circles: What do they mean?

Moon-base? Secret Astronaut Corps?

Amechra
2012-07-02, 06:29 PM
So...

How you gonna handle the electricity negation thing that UFOs do as they fly over-head? You know, where the abductee reports that their car or whatever stopped working, suddenly stalling in the middle of the road?

As for antagonists...

I had an idea for an insane fringe group that abducts aliens (ambushes them, or something to that effect), and figures out some of the tech, using it to basically form Area 51, which could act as an abductor.

The technique for abduction would be different, too; a black, unmarked car pulls up to the curb while you are walking along, and whisks you away. You wake up in some facility somewhere in an ice-bath, where Area 51 took out your liver and replaced it with one they took from a Grey.

Why? Because those damn aliens ain't gonna pass us by in the tech race, dangnabbit!

This group could have even started doing crop circles and the like as a way to discredit aliens; after all, when people are obviously the ones doing the crop circles...

Of course, that begs the question: are the Area 51ers fully human? Or are they one of those Pod People things...

Elricaltovilla
2012-07-02, 08:58 PM
So what's your Morality/Sanity/Empathy/Synergy meter going to be called?

SuperDave
2012-07-03, 06:18 PM
So what's your Morality/Sanity/Empathy/Synergy meter going to be called?

I was thinking "Façade" or "Normalcy". Basically, it would measure how well you pass yourself off as an average, law-abiding citizen. It would decrease with any action which made Muggles aware of your otherness, or brought the attention of the Men in Black, Torchwood, the Illuminati, Freemasons, or whoever your campaign's secretive international alien police-force du jour might be.

In a way, it would be similar to the "wanted rating" of the Grand Theft Auto games, only you'd want to keep this as high as possible. It would fall when you did things like talking about your Abduction publicly, when you used obviously unnatural abilities in front of a member of the general populace (especially a law enforcement officer or government official), or if you get certain biological grafts, use certain potent alien technologies, or have prolonged or intimate contact with members of the Abductor races.

Pokonic
2012-07-03, 06:30 PM
Well, a idea: the Starspawn will inflict all three experement types on creatures, but they are...strange, to say the least.

There Org ability is Adaption. Your main issue is stopping yourself from growing hair all over when it is cold and keeping yourself from getting webed hands when swimming, ect. You can adapt to almost any hostile situation, but you have to surpress it to live a normal life.

There Psi ability is called Veil Unlifting. You can now see strange things using this universe as a rest-stop of sorts, and they mostly hate mankind. While you may be driven mad by these unending visions alongside normal reality, you, will some willpower, can force others to see them too. At the top tiers, you might be able to shove foes into the alternet plane proper.

There tech ability is Unmaking. Things break under your touch. Lie detectors crumble and short out. Cameras show you as a black void. You are athema to technology, and you know it. At higher levels, you basicly become the antichrist of computer programers.

radmelon
2012-07-03, 06:56 PM
Unmaking sounds like it could be really fun, assuming you can keep it from screwing up tech you want to keep.

Elricaltovilla
2012-07-03, 11:23 PM
I was thinking "Façade" or "Normalcy". Basically, it would measure how well you pass yourself off as an average, law-abiding citizen. It would decrease with any action which made Muggles aware of your otherness, or brought the attention of the Men in Black, Torchwood, the Illuminati, Freemasons, or whoever your campaign's secretive international alien police-force du jour might be.

In a way, it would be similar to the "wanted rating" of the Grand Theft Auto games, only you'd want to keep this as high as possible. It would fall when you did things like talking about your Abduction publicly, when you used obviously unnatural abilities in front of a member of the general populace (especially a law enforcement officer or government official), or if you get certain biological grafts, use certain potent alien technologies, or have prolonged or intimate contact with members of the Abductor races.

That's really good. I like that a lot. I think this game could be a lot of fun to play. Can you come up with some sample Experiments to show us?

Pokonic
2012-07-04, 12:36 AM
Unmaking sounds like it could be really fun, assuming you can keep it from screwing up tech you want to keep.

The Psi ability is supposed to represent being like the protagonist of From Beyond, exept he can shift other people into the other world. The Org ability is supposed to be a full-on body horror thing that's realy, realy useful if you know what your doing, but can realy hurt social interaction if you are, for instance, constently biting your nails to keep them from turning into claws, or ripping out your own hair to keep yourself from becoming a living shag carpet.

Also, I like Reptiods as much as the next person, but if I ever run a game with them this is how there going to look like.
http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/2503/3990140gs.jpg

Amechra
2012-07-04, 02:13 AM
Hmmm...

Unmaking reminds me of the antagonist faction in Genius: The Transgression, with how they make technology of a given amount of advancement simply disintegrate...

Take some pointers from that game, my friends.

SuperDave
2012-07-04, 11:01 AM
There seems to be a fair bit of interest in additional other Abductor races, so I'm just going to post my original pitches for the two Abductors that didn't make the cut. Let us know if you think they should be added, or if they would just clutter up the system.


● ● ●

Robotics began as a system of interstellar exploration for a long-dead race. A probe would land on a planet, replicate itself, and build a factory/launching-pad for more probes. As the probes encountered more and more alien technology, they began to assimilate such technology into their own designs, in order to advance their mission of exploration and expansion. Eventually, the need to assimilate new technology superseded the need for exploration.

While the Robotics themselves are utterly without emotion of any kind, they do possess a rudimentary understanding of such feelings, and are willing to manipulate the emotions of organic life-forms when it suits their purposes.

The Robotics are not yet certain whether Terran technology is a threat or an asset. Certain AI factions advocate waiting a few decades before Assimilation, in order to allow our technology time to “ripen”. Others insist that in such time, Terra may become a true threat to the Cluster, and should be Assimilated or destroyed immediately.


● ● ●


Myconids are so diverse that they seem st first to defy classification, but upon closer examination, one discovers the filaments which bind them to one another. Though they appear to be many different types of animals (and insects, and amphibians, and even plants), the Myconids are in fact a phenomenally-successful fungal infection, which rapidly attacks and bonds with the nervous system of its host-creature (or creates a new nervous system where none existed).

Myconids are one of the rare Abductor-races which rarely take their captives anywhere off-planet, and the only ones whose invasion of Terra may be unintentional. It’s not part of a grand scheme or plan for galactic conquest; it’s just a product of their biology.

However, this does not make their continued expansion any less sinister. They have been compared to an aggressive bacteria, a drug-resistant virus, or a timorous cancer. Once it infects a host, it immediately attaches itself to the nervous system in such a way that it becomes indispensable to the operation of its host’s unconscious bodily functions.

Myconids, if they are aware of us in any way we might understand, see Terrans as potential additions to the Swarm, and see Terra’s bio-diversity as a highly valuable commodity for their campaign of endless expansion.

SuperDave
2012-07-04, 11:13 AM
Hmmm...

Unmaking reminds me of the antagonist faction in Genius: The Transgression, with how they make technology of a given amount of advancement simply disintegrate...

Take some pointers from that game, my friends.

This actually brings up a point I wanted to discuss.

Would it be acceptable to lift other Disciplines/Gifts/Contracts/Whatever directly from other World of Darkness games? I know that it's not really kosher, and smacks of poor design, but some of them are just to perfect not to include. Amechra just pointed out that Genius: The Transgression could be an excellent source of inspiration for Mecha-based powers, and there are many Disciplines that I more or less copied from other sources to give myself a starting-point during the initial design phase.

For example, Cainite disciplines like Vicissitude (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Vicissitude) are perfect for Orga experiments, as would Contracts of Mirror (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Mirror) be perfect for a "Morphing" Paranormal Ability. There's even a rarely-discussed Discipline from one of the later Vampire books, called Temporis (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Temporis), which gives the invoker power over time itself. If that's not appropriate to this setting, I don't know what is!

...But then again, a game should have its own rules. Stealing them from other sources can kind of be a forth-wall breaker for anyone who's played any of the games that were stolen from, and can make the overall game appear hackneyed and cobbled-together without much hard work or love.

So, what do you think? To steal, or not to steal?

Pokonic
2012-07-04, 12:17 PM
No steal. However, it comes to mind, what would happen if a Alien abducts a Vampire....

Admiral Squish
2012-07-05, 11:06 AM
Alright, here I am once more!

Science Officer:
Another vote for more abductors, huh? Looks like we're going to splinter the exotics category after all. I don't know about insectoids. Seems like it's overdone in pop culture. I'll either use the myconids for the org species, or come up with something new.

I still prefer my brother's view of maddening beings of immense power from beyond our dimension, beings who are barely able to touch our dimension because they are so utterly alien to everything we know. Perhaps the 'human-like' aliens are actually humans, twisted by exposure to the starspawn's power.

Not sure what we're gonna do about crop-circles.

Amechra:
Hmm... Well, one of the things we were thinking about was an energy resource by the name of 'Aether'. Aether is to conventional energy as gasoline to crude oil, or brandy to wine. It's refined, concentrated, and is apparently the power of choice for all space-faring races. Any energy can be converted into aether with the right tech/organs. You can gain a point or two by sucking electricity out of a wall socket, but you could get a whole recharge by tapping a transformer.

the energy-disruption could be energy draining. Perhaps the ships constantly drain aether from the world around them, refueling as they travel.

I definitely like the idea of area 51ers. I mentioned in an earlier post we were gonna do something with the MIB, and that I had been considering using the MIB as an abductor. Not sure how to work it in though. At 6-7, we're already on the heavy end of the scale. Adding MIB would make it 8 if we want to keep the 'other' option.

Pokonic:
I don't know about all three. I like your first two ideas, but I think I like the starspawn being powerful enough by themselves that they don't need to use tech.

Your thing on higher levels of the psi ability brings up something else I'm thinking about. I was considering making it so experiments can either be invested in with dots, or they simply scale with your xenophilia. Not entirely sure if it would work, but it's an idea to think about.

Also, when an alien abducts a vampire, they'd probably be interested, but none of the experiments would likely take.

TheOneWhoWalks
2012-07-05, 04:42 PM
So I know the list of potential abductors has grown substantially, but I still want to toss one out for consideration. What about a sentient virus?

Not in a silly, Sinestro Corps, single-cell-organism-with-full-sentience way, but a virus who's individual cells can communicate in some really basic way, such that when enough of them are within proximity to one another, they constitute a mind. So the virus would infect an organism, and as it reproduces, eventually it's population reaches a sort of critical mass, and "wakes up". This could explain some of the people with voices in their heads and such. This virus wouldn't "abduct" in any traditional sense, but rather it would be kind of a body-snatchers thing; they would infect people, and once it wakes up, begin changing them, to make them a more able host for it's intellect, and eventually entirely supplant the host's mind, and take over their body altogether. This would mean they would be resemble a human (or really, anything with enough body mass to support enough of the virus to initially gain sentience...) perfectly, but would be more intelligent (possibly with encoded genetic memory...?), and have distinctly in-human behavior and goals. (For bonus spooky factor, they have no real use for human grey matter, and so retain the brainstem to keep the body working, but just break down the rest into more of itself. Which allows such a converted "person" to loose it's head, and go on functioning more or less indefinitely, as long as the virus colony retained sufficient population to maintain its intelligence.) They might even have a Yerk-like empire floating out there someplace, and Earth is just another planet they use to acquire hosts and/or new ideas (I feel like they would have individuality and creativity issues, particularly is they have any significant genetic memory that is carried when one "colony" spawns one more more new ones, because that means each one starts as basically an identical intellect to their "parent" at the time of infection...)

PCs would be people who were infected, and the virus got to the point of waking up and making modifications to them, but they were somehow able to fight it off after the fact, perhaps due to some natural resistance that allows their immune system to combat the virus, but doesn't register it as a threat in it's nascent stage.

...ok, that ended up being a lot longer than I'd planned, so maybe this is a needlessly complex concept... but I kinda like it.

Pokonic
2012-07-05, 05:38 PM
Pokonic:
I don't know about all three. I like your first two ideas, but I think I like the starspawn being powerful enough by themselves that they don't need to use tech.

Your thing on higher levels of the psi ability brings up something else I'm thinking about. I was considering making it so experiments can either be invested in with dots, or they simply scale with your xenophilia. Not entirely sure if it would work, but it's an idea to think about.

Also, when an alien abducts a vampire, they'd probably be interested, but none of the experiments would likely take.

Well, considering each of the three main races so far have sets of two, I thought it would be interesting to have one with limited access to all three. Also, I can see the Taken slowly becomeing more used to there abilities, hence slowly becomeing more powerful in there useage.

Also, I just want to see the look on a Grey's face when the human they just kidnapped transforms into a giant wolf man on the table and rampages across the ship, presumably leaving a single earth-bound survivor looking in utter shock as the ship explodes in mid-air. Now, thats how a Crusoe is made.

Eldan
2012-07-05, 05:52 PM
Might I make a suggestion for hte Nordics? First of all, I don't like the name much. But that's another thing.

My suggestion is that behind their projected human facade, they are mind-boggingly weird. Biblical description of angels weird. Wheels covered in eyes and seven wings and four faces.

Zale
2012-07-05, 05:52 PM
Also, I just want to see the look on a Grey's face when the human they just kidnapped transforms into a giant wolf man on the table and rampages across the ship, presumably leaving a single earth-bound survivor looking in utter shock as the ship explodes in mid-air. Now, thats how a Crusoe is made.

"A3X7, why is a large creature ripping X6R9 apart?"

"I am not certain, Y6E2. Perhaps we should consult our databases?"

"Y6E2?"

"Oh my. It appears I am alone." (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DullSurprise)

Leliel
2012-07-05, 06:26 PM
On Amercha's idea:

Don't make them abductors. The myths say the MIBs show up to eliminate any evidence and spook people into silence after an otherworldly event. In fact, in Mage, this can already happen: One of the examples of entities from the Outer Reaches (universes that are entirely separate from the NWoD cosmology as far as the mages can tell) are classic Men In Black, super strong imitation humans who have a tendency to show up after particularly public and destructive Manifestation Paradoxes and make sure that (A) word of it doesn't get out, and (B) attempt to ensure the mages responsible can never do that again.

Of course, we also have perfectly human MIBs in the form of Task Force VALKYRIE, their non-American equivalents, and Division Six. Why not add more?

The idea is that the True Alien MIBs are actually more human that the typical abductor, though it doesn't exactly diminish the Uncanny Valley effect due to their weird appearance and mannerisms. Most of the time they prefer to erase memories and be done with it when covering up eyewitness accounts, but for some reason they occasionally don't do anything other than their weird, disconcerting warnings-the theory is that they want enough knowledge to get out so that humans avoid the aliens, but that's enough. That being said, it often takes a lot for them to actually show up, even to the point where we might have a dice system to determine how likely it is they send a team, with varying degrees of ruthlessness and thoroughness-one success indicates a few drones (the robotic kind) patrol the area for a day to a week, while Exceptional Success indicates a full-scale sweep-and-clear, and if you get in their way, too bad. Why they feel they must do this is anyone's guess, but the dominant theories (depending on how optimistic or pessimistic the Taken hawking the theory is) is that they are a galactic peacekeeping force who wish to protect humanity's evolution from extraterrestrial interference, or that this planet is an outpost of their empire and they don't like having sensory organs stuck in their business.

For a plot hook, the Taken "focused hunter group" could be AFSAC (Air Force Special Activities Center), a real-world theory for the "actually yes, they do work for the government" Men In Black. The guys who actually built Area 51 in other words, and very interested in the potential alien technology has. In other words, the Actually Men In Black-what they lack in raw power, they make up for in the ability to actually blend in to the populace.

Pokonic
2012-07-05, 06:44 PM
On Amercha's idea:

Don't make them abductors. The myths say the MIBs show up to eliminate any evidence and spook people into silence after an otherworldly event. In fact, in Mage, this can already happen: One of the examples of entities from the Outer Reaches (universes that are entirely separate from the NWoD cosmology as far as the mages can tell) are classic Men In Black, super strong imitation humans who have a tendency to show up after particularly public and destructive Manifestation Paradoxes and make sure that (A) word of it doesn't get out, and (B) attempt to ensure the mages responsible can never do that again.

Of course, we also have perfectly human MIBs in the form of Task Force VALKYRIE, their non-American equivalents, and Division Six. Why not add more?

The idea is that the True Alien MIBs are actually more human that the typical abductor, though it doesn't exactly diminish the Uncanny Valley effect due to their weird appearance and mannerisms. Most of the time they prefer to erase memories and be done with it when covering up eyewitness accounts, but for some reason they occasionally don't do anything other than their weird, disconcerting warnings-the theory is that they want enough knowledge to get out so that humans avoid the aliens, but that's enough. That being said, it often takes a lot for them to actually show up, even to the point where we might have a dice system to determine how likely it is they send a team, with varying degrees of ruthlessness and thoroughness-one success indicates a few drones (the robotic kind) patrol the area for a day to a week, while Exceptional Success indicates a full-scale sweep-and-clear, and if you get in their way, too bad. Why they feel they must do this is anyone's guess, but the dominant theories (depending on how optimistic or pessimistic the Taken hawking the theory is) is that they are a galactic peacekeeping force who wish to protect humanity's evolution from extraterrestrial interference, or that this planet is an outpost of their empire and they don't like having sensory organs stuck in their business.

For a plot hook, the Taken "focused hunter group" could be AFSAC (Air Force Special Activities Center), a real-world theory for the "actually yes, they do work for the government" Men In Black. The guys who actually built Area 51 in other words, and very interested in the potential alien technology has. In other words, the Actually Men In Black-what they lack in raw power, they make up for in the ability to actually blend in to the populace.

Of course, it could be all of these groups are branch's of a single group...Dun dun dun!

Amechra
2012-07-05, 08:32 PM
Well, I was thinking of something more like the Canadian government in the X-Men comics, where they grab people and modify them under the pretense of medical tests...

Ah, Deadpool, we at least got you out of it.

SuperDave
2012-07-05, 09:52 PM
Might I make a suggestion for hte Nordics? First of all, I don't like the name much. But that's another thing.

My suggestion is that behind their projected human facade, they are mind-boggingly weird. Biblical description of angels weird. Wheels covered in eyes and seven wings and four faces.

That was actually my plan from the beginning. Either our entire perception of them as humanoids is just memory- or sensory-modificaiton, or they're just using beautiful possessed humans as their public face (think of Capt. Picard as Locutus of Borg (http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Locutus_of_Borg)).

Their tendency to appear as tall, blond, fair-skinned caucasians may be either an erroneous assumption on their own part about the "leaders" of human society, based on frequency of their depiction in the dominant forms of visual media, or (perhaps more disturbingly) a cynical exploitation of humanity's actual attitudes towards the social politics of race. Either way, I can see the Nordics being very, very evil. They might even be interested in eugenics and other nasty ideologies.

... but on the surface, they're so very kind. Sweet, even. So wise, and so beautiful, and they came all this way to share the wisdom of the stars with our little green speck, so that our voices might join the Endless Choir of the Cosmos. And all they ask is so very little! All they want you to do is open the minds of your fellows to their wisdom.

Some minds just need to be... pried open a bit. To let the truth in, you see. It's a very big truth, after all.

Science Officer
2012-07-05, 10:28 PM
Science Officer:

I still prefer my brother's view of maddening beings of immense power from beyond our dimension, beings who are barely able to touch our dimension because they are so utterly alien to everything we know. Perhaps the 'human-like' aliens are actually humans, twisted by exposure to the starspawn's power.


When I say "human-like" I mean psychologically and sociologically. The Elder Things had goals and desires understandable to humans. They built cities, lived in "families". The Yithians had libraries, writing. The Mi-go built towers, mined metals. They looked like this (http://www.elfwood.com/art/i/t/itosaithwebb/concept__elder_thing_by_king_rastel.jpg), this (http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs50/f/2009/271/4/b/Yithian_by_hazi_b.jpg), and this (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/db/Migo.jpg)respectively.

Maddening beings of immense power which move in more dimensions are good too. They would (probably) not be "human-like" in form or mind. "Starspawn" might be a misnomer for them, but it might be good enough.

Leliel
2012-07-05, 11:37 PM
When I say "human-like" I mean psychologically and sociologically. The Elder Things had goals and desires understandable to humans. They built cities, lived in "families". The Yithians had libraries, writing. The Mi-go built towers, mined metals. They looked like this (http://www.elfwood.com/art/i/t/itosaithwebb/concept__elder_thing_by_king_rastel.jpg), this (http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs50/f/2009/271/4/b/Yithian_by_hazi_b.jpg), and this (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/db/Migo.jpg)respectively.

Maddening beings of immense power which move in more dimensions are good too. They would (probably) not be "human-like" in form or mind. "Starspawn" might be a misnomer for them, but it might be good enough.

Precisely my definition.

That's why I said the MIBs are more humanlike-they actually have things humans would recognize as emotions and personalities, it's just that they're...cold. Cold and strange. Almost like they just don't care about anything except their "job", whatever that actually entails, and they've been at it so long, they've forgotten how to act normal. Or perhaps, they never learned.

Admiral Squish
2012-07-08, 12:09 PM
The One Who Walks:
A sentient virus is one of the options that's showing on the table, definitely. Not necessarily the one you're describing, but something along those lines is on the table. Myconids are essentially a fungal infection, though it's not properly sentient. The wildcard virus has been suggested. Otherworldly bacteria/viruses show up a lot in fiction. In the Andromeda Strain, there was a theory that a spacebourne bacterium could be used as a messenger of sorts, a herald of otherworldly intelligences. It could also be used to prepare the residents of the planet for the invasion of it's creators.

Pokonic:
I don't know. I really don't want us to reach with the experiment types. I'd much prefer we stick to the themes that fit well, rather than trying to make themes that don't quite feel right fit. There's no 'limited' access in this arrangement, they either do tech experiments, or they don't.

The vague plan I'm thinking along the lines of:
Grays: Tech/Psi
Nordics: Psi
Reptilians: Org/Tech
Robotics: Tech
Starspawn: Psi/Org
???????: Org
Other: Org/Psi/Tech
(Possibly MiB?): Tech/Psi/Org

Also, the growing power as you embrace the changes was why I was thinking it could scale with xenophilia. Also goes along with the idea that as you embrace the changes made by your abductor, you become more susceptible to their influence over you.

Leliel:
Well, of course MIB is gonna be the cleanup crew. Memory wipes, bribes, discrediting, removing 'problem' taken. All the good stuff. But they also abduct, or perhaps recruit, normal people and try to replicate alien experiments or perform experiments of their own. Super-soldier serums and the like. Think every shadow-government-spawned superhero.

I like the idea of a dice pool for determining if/how many MIB show up. Perhaps a pool of 10 minus facade? Then a chart based on the number of successes. One is an agent, or a pair of them. Two is a full team of five or six. Three is a dozen or so. Four is a full mobilization or something along those lines.

I like the idea of them starting as proper humans, but the job changes you, literally and figuratively. New agents get slowly brainwashed.

General Patton
2012-07-08, 05:30 PM
The Reptilians living underground and being around since prehistoric times reminds me of X-COM: Terror From The Deep. Were they forced into some kind of hibernation or stasis to prevent them from already controlling the planet? Going with the Angel vs Demon symbolism of Nordics vs Reptilians could give a decent explanation for it. That could even be a deliberate action to reinforce their social engineering by saving us from something that they were never really enemies with in the first place.

Admiral Squish
2012-07-10, 07:28 AM
The Reptilians living underground and being around since prehistoric times reminds me of X-COM: Terror From The Deep. Were they forced into some kind of hibernation or stasis to prevent them from already controlling the planet? Going with the Angel vs Demon symbolism of Nordics vs Reptilians could give a decent explanation for it. That could even be a deliberate action to reinforce their social engineering by saving us from something that they were never really enemies with in the first place.

I'm glad you like the idea! Hibernation or cryostasis would fit, definitely, but perhaps they were just laying low? The nordics defeated them, and the surviving reptilians moved underground. In the thousands of years since, they've been rebuilding their numbers, rebuilding their technology, and connecting their new, subterranean lairs. So, just recently they've begun to return to the surface.

SuperDave
2012-07-11, 10:22 PM
The One Who Walks:
A sentient virus is one of the options that's showing on the table, definitely. Not necessarily the one you're describing, but something along those lines is on the table. Myconids are essentially a fungal infection, though it's not properly sentient. The wildcard virus has been suggested. Otherworldly bacteria/viruses show up a lot in fiction. In the Andromeda Strain, there was a theory that a spacebourne bacterium could be used as a messenger of sorts, a herald of otherworldly intelligences. It could also be used to prepare the residents of the planet for the invasion of it's creators.

Huzzah! Interest in the Myconids has become resurgent!



Leliel:
Well, of course MIB is gonna be the cleanup crew. Memory wipes, bribes, discrediting, removing 'problem' taken. All the good stuff. But they also abduct, or perhaps recruit, normal people and try to replicate alien experiments or perform experiments of their own. Super-soldier serums and the like. Think every shadow-government-spawned superhero.

I like the idea of a dice pool for determining if/how many MIB show up. Perhaps a pool of 10 minus facade? Then a chart based on the number of successes. One is an agent, or a pair of them. Two is a full team of five or six. Three is a dozen or so. Four is a full mobilization or something along those lines.

I like the idea of them starting as proper humans, but the job changes you, literally and figuratively. New agents get slowly brainwashed.

I like how you describe it here. I'm becoming more open to the idea of MiB as Abductors. I think that they could be one of the NPC splats, like the Pure Tribes in Werewolf: The Forsaken.

I especially like the mechanic for determining how many MiB show up. Brilliant! I want to keep that for the final version. (How long would it take them to arrive? Would they pursue, and/or investigate the crime scene?)


The Reptilians living underground and being around since prehistoric times reminds me of X-COM: Terror From The Deep. Were they forced into some kind of hibernation or stasis to prevent them from already controlling the planet? Going with the Angel vs Demon symbolism of Nordics vs Reptilians could give a decent explanation for it. That could even be a deliberate action to reinforce their social engineering by saving us from something that they were never really enemies with in the first place.

Also good. But how did they get all of the Reptilians to fall asleep? If the Nords didn't get all of 'em, what did the ones who were awake do for all that time, and why didn't they try wake their brethren? Did too many of the ones who knew how to build the cool toys go into hibernation?

radmelon
2012-07-11, 10:34 PM
Of course Myconids have support, they're awesome! (See: My avatar)

Chronologist
2012-07-11, 10:53 PM
Concept-wise, all of these abductors seem really interesting, and it would be great to, say, create 10 different types and maybe 10 different versions of "monsters" for each type. Having concrete stat blocks for threats the party would face would be excellent. The core WoD book has enough material to fill in the MIB, and you can always bring Hunter into the mix.

Mechanic-wise, this basically all feels like the themes and backstory of Changeling: The Lost (you were abducted by a supernatural force, you managed to escape somehow or were set free, and you will do anything to avoid your captors. Plus you got superpowers depending on who took you and what they wanted you to do).

Then, the actual abilities and player factions are taken from Genius: the Transgression (the fan-made book for WoD, it's incredible). You've got mind control, death beams, biological amplification, all that good stuff. You could probably get away with making some of the Biological stuff ripped from Changeling's ability list, mostly the Ogre and Beast-related abilities.

The last parts are the Morality rating, the Potency, and the Power Supply, so to speak. For Morality, I like the idea of Normalcy, blending in with the crowd, keeping to yourself, not stealing and murdering or using your abilities in front of others. You could combine it with a bit of Changeling's Clarity, giving low-Normalcy characters nightmares and fits of paranoia and hallucinations of their time abducted.

Potency can be covered with Attunement, how much your character has "attuned" to his grafts/implants/psychic powers.

For your power source, the points you spend to fuel your abilities, I'd go with Stamina. It sounds lame, but remember that all of your abilities are fueled by your own calories and reserves of strength. Anything spliced into your body or mind was designed specifically to see if you, an ordinary human, could handle it without going mad or dying. Plus, having a resource that requires you to act abnormally (like blood or glamour) would force a Taken to blow their cover.

This all looks excellent, I'll check back when the mechanics start getting set up. Excellent work guys!

General Patton
2012-07-12, 12:48 AM
For your power source, the points you spend to fuel your abilities, I'd go with Stamina. It sounds lame, but remember that all of your abilities are fueled by your own calories and reserves of strength. Anything spliced into your body or mind was designed specifically to see if you, an ordinary human, could handle it without going mad or dying. Plus, having a resource that requires you to act abnormally (like blood or glamour) would force a Taken to blow their cover.

Maybe the means of restoring your power source should vary with the abductors or experiments you've got. Everyone would recover their Stamina by normal human physiology as a default. Additionally, some characters would be able to drain electricity, some would gorge themselves on ridiculous amounts of food (hyper metabolism) or consume chemicals (chemosynthesis), some would drain mental energy. This provides you with some abnormal behavior you need to conceal unless you can go without.

Chronologist
2012-07-12, 09:39 AM
Maybe the means of restoring your power source should vary with the abductors or experiments you've got. Everyone would recover their Stamina by normal human physiology as a default. Additionally, some characters would be able to drain electricity, some would gorge themselves on ridiculous amounts of food (hyper metabolism) or consume chemicals (chemosynthesis), some would drain mental energy. This provides you with some abnormal behavior you need to conceal unless you can go without.

That's not a bad idea, actually.
1) Gorging yourself on food is the easiest, and thus grants the lowest rewards. It takes a lot of food to recharge you to 100%, and you can't eat it all at once (the human stomach is only so big)
2) Draining electricity or mental energy would be a lot like a Changeling's harvesting of Glamour, i.e. it takes a powerful source to recharge you to full, weaker sources give smaller returns.
3) Feeding on specific kinds of materials and chemicals reminds me of the Folding Men from Supernatural, who were addicted to a drug made out of Gold. You could have a Taken who recharges faster when they consume a specific material, which would give the largest bonuses as it is the method of harvesting that is most "overt".

Im interested to see where this goes.

Admiral Squish
2012-07-12, 01:46 PM
Okay, here's a few ideas for the different abductor benefits/compulsions. I'm not sure if I've covered compulsions, but the general idea is that each abductor gives you a compulsion, a behavior that gets activated when you are under extreme stress. I'm thinking whenever a derangement gets activated, you'd have to roll your xenophilia score. If you get a success, the compulsion becomes activated. Not entirely sure about it, though. The idea is that as you embrace the changes your abductor made, you become more susceptible to the negative side.

Keep in mind, I'm used to writing D&D mechanics, so some of this is going to be wierd. Also, this is NOT a final draft, these are ideas I came up with during class, and they are fully open to change.

Grays:
Compulsion: Brain-drain: When this compulsion becomes activated, the gray taken broadcasts psychic waves for the duration of the scene, that weaken the resolve of those around them. The taken and all creatures within 20 meters take a -1 penalty to intelligence, wits, and resolve rolls while they continue to broadcast. Affected creatures feel a highly unpleasant fuzziness in their mind.
Tech Benefit: ????
Psi Benefit: Thought-speak: A psionic gray taken can communicate back and forth telepathically with nearby creatures, as easily as speaking. This communication does not require a common language, but it does require language. This communication has a range of 20 meters. Responding requires you to sub-vocalize.

Reptilians:
Compulsion: Gnawing Hunger: When this compulsion becomes activated, the reptilian taken becomes overcome with a powerful craving for flesh. Cooked meat won't satisfy it. Raw meat will help, but the only way to truly satisfy it is to kill and eat a mammal while the blood is still warm. Until the hunger is satisfied, you take a -2 penalty to composure rolls due to the distracting hunger.
Org Benefit: Adrenal Rush: An organic reptilian taken can spend Aether to supercharge their body with a rush of energy. This energy rush adds one die per point of aether spent to strength and dexterity rolls for the remainder of the scene.
Tech Benefit: Battle Instincts: A tech reptilian taken is instilled with an intuitive understanding of weaponry and battle. They gain a +1 to all weaponry and firearms rolls.

Starspawn:
Compulsion: ????
Psi Benefit: ????
Org Benefit: ????

Nordics:
Compulsion: When this compulsion becomes activated, you become driven to proselytize about the glorious, benevolent beings from beyond the stars. A taken suffering from this compulsion will not neccesarily endanger themselves, but they will seek out whatever place or media will allow their message of interstellar peace and love to reach the most people. This may mean shouting the message to a busy intersection, or it could mean a radio host takes an hour-long break from DJing to talk about love from beyond the stars.
Benefit: Messenger's Aura: You radiate psychic waves that make others more susceptible to your message. You gain a +1 on all presence and manipulation rolls, as long as those being affected are in your physical presence. For example, you would not gain this bonus over the phone or over a television broadcast.

Robotics:
Compulsion: Disassembly: When this compulsion becomes active, you become increasingly twitchy and fidgety, and begin to disassemble whatever technology you can get your hands on, the more advanced the better. It starts with just playing around with the device, but soon enough you've got the battery and sim card out and are trying to pry out the motherboard. Cell phones are most often the first to fall to this, but any gadget is a viable target. Even cars can come apart under the influence of this compulsion. Most often, these things can be reassambled, but it takes time and the appropriate use of the craft skill.
Benefit: ???

Myconids:
Compulsion: Spores: When this compulsion becomes activated, you begin to shed spores involuntarily and almost unnoticeably. These spores, if they settle into appropriately dark, moist, food-rich environments, grow into a reddish mold that spawns myconid infectors. (I'm picturing little motile puffballs that seek out and infect suitable animal hosts.
Benefit: Resilience: A myconid taken find their body surprisingly resilient. The fungus makes them hard to kill, and helps heal wounds. Your health increases by 1. You also heal faster, removing one point of bashing damage in five minutes, one point of lethal damage in one day, and one point of aggravated damage in three days.

MiB:
Compulsion: ????
Tech Benefit: ????
Org Benefit: ????
Psi Benefit: ????

Admiral Squish
2012-07-12, 02:20 PM
Chronologist:
the similarity to changeling keeps getting brought up. I've gone over a few differences elsewhere in the thread, but I suppose the main point is that yes, the two are quite similar, but I think they're going to be different enough that they can stand separately. I think the real separation's going to be the mechanics. The abilities you get in alien are going to be stronger and they're going to feel a lot less weird, random, and magical.

The morality is going to be Facade, which is essentially what you discussed there, but it's also got a hand in determining the MiB's response to your shenanigans. The lower your facade, the bigger and meaner the team they send after you.

Potency is Xenophilia, which is essentially, again, what you were talking about. Some other features, but mostly the same.

Power source is going to be Aether, which is a sort of super-distilled energy that can be harvested from a variety of sources.

General Patton:

I definitely like this idea. Since aether can be harvested from multiple sources though, I'm thinking that perhaps you can gain a little aether from any source, but you only get a total refill out of the specific energy type your experiment uses?

Like, bio experiments work off your metabolism. You can convert a little electricity into aether, but you get a lot more out of a feast. Tech experiments can tap your metabolism, but they're gonna get the most out of electrical. Not sure what psi experiments would use though...

SuperDave
2012-07-15, 10:07 AM
I've been reading a nonfiction book on the history of Area 51, and I really wanted to share this passage with everyone:


The Manhattan Project employed two hundred thousand people. It had eighty offices and dozens of production plants spread out all over the country, including a sixty-thousand acre facility in rural Tennessee that pulled more power off the grid than New York City did on any given night. And no one knew the Manhattan Project was there. That is how powerful a black operation can be.

After the war, Congress - the legislators who had been so easily kept in the dark for two and a half years - was given stewardship of the bomb. It was now up to Congress to decide who would control its "unimaginable destructive power." With the passing of the Atomic Energy Act of 1946, a terrifying and unprecedented new system was governed by presidential executive orders regarding national security information. But the newly created Atomic Energy Commission, formerly known as the Manhattan Project, was now in charge of regulating the classification of all nuclear weapons information in a system that was totally separate from the president's system. In other words, for the first time in American history, a federal agency run by civilians, the Atomic Energy Commission, would maintain a body of secrets classified based on factors other than presidential executive orders.

It just really struck me as powerful stuff. The Manhattan Project is something which actually happened. It's not the deluded online ravings of a semi-literate psych-ward outpatient who insists "the Gummint" is spying on his teeth; it's a matter of historical record.

Imagine how much stranger and more fantastic the truth would need to be in the World of Darkness.

Jacobsen, Annie. Area 51: An Unscensored History of America's Top Secret Military Base (http://www.amazon.com/Area-51-Uncensored-Americas-Military/dp/0316132942). New York: Little, Brown and Company, 2011. pp. xiii-xiv

Science Officer
2012-07-15, 10:25 AM
Not sure what psi experiments would use though...

Mental vampirism? Rest and meditation? Creative self-expression? A bizarre concoction made from over-the-counter medication, paint chips, and string cheese?

EDIT: Useful wiki links for new-comers to this thread:
Alien Abduction Entities (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abduction_phenomenon_entities)
Abduction Phenomenon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narrative_of_the_abduction_phenomenon)
List of Alleged E.T.s (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_alleged_extraterrestrial_beings)

I think the only prominent variety unrepresented so far is energy beings.

SuperDave
2012-07-15, 10:48 AM
the similarity to changeling keeps getting brought up. I've gone over a few differences elsewhere in the thread, but I suppose the main point is that yes, the two are quite similar, but I think they're going to be different enough that they can stand separately. I think the real separation's going to be the mechanics. The abilities you get in alien are going to be stronger and they're going to feel a lot less weird, random, and magical.

I really like how you wrote this, Admiral Squish! It's basically what I've been thinking for a long time, but was never quite able to put into words as well as you have.


I definitely like this idea. Since aether can be harvested from multiple sources though, I'm thinking that perhaps you can gain a little aether from any source, but you only get a total refill out of the specific energy type your experiment uses?

Like, bio experiments work off your metabolism. You can convert a little electricity into aether, but you get a lot more out of a feast. Tech experiments can tap your metabolism, but they're gonna get the most out of electrical. Not sure what psi experiments would use though...

I like this idea a lot as well. It seems very thematically appropriate, and helps the various Experiment-types actually play differently from one another. I vote to include it in the next draft.

In answer to your final question, Admiral Squish, isn't it obvious? The Psi-Taken would feed off of human thoughts and intelligence, leaving their victim's mind a disheveled wreck for hours, or perhaps days at a time.

Admiral Squish
2012-07-16, 12:29 PM
Superdave:
First of all, that little section about the manhattan project has gone a long way toward helping me mentally legitimize the existence of the MIB, and even bigger secrets.

On the subject of MiB, I think we should call their organization Majestic, based off the 'Majestic 12', an organization the conspiracy theorists believe is a group of 12 high-ranking individuals of all different fields who were assembled to deal with extraterrestrial matters.

As for aether. I'm thinking we come up with a list of three or so examples for each energy type. The lowest grade gives you one aether, the next gives you two, and the biggest gives you three. If the energy type matches your experiment type, the gain is doubled.

I'm not fond of the psi-mind-vampirism thing. All the other energy types are relatively harmless. You might blow a fuse tapping a electrical socket, but reducing another person to a gibbering zombie is a lot more aggressive. Maybe that's an option, but they can harvest it in other ways? Attention, maybe? Perhaps the act of paying attention to a psi taken allows them to harvest some of your brainpower? Or strong emotions? That seems a lot like changeling territory though. In Destroy All Humans, you regained a little psychic energy by reading surface thoughts from passer-bys.

General Patton
2012-07-16, 04:32 PM
I was thinking a scale from 1-5 points would be a bit more precise. Perhaps each experiment type should get double from their preferred type and come with extra protections that especially help them with their type.

Tech:
1-Handful of random assorted household batteries
2-Car battery
3-Electrical Socket
4-Fusebox, power lines
5-Alien power systems
Tech characters have moderate protection from electricity and significant protection when they intentionally drain something.

Should Org characters be capable of chemo-synthesis?
Org:
1-Average meal
2-Raw meat
3-Violently reactive chemicals (baking soda and vinegar)
4-Violently reactive overtly toxic chemicals (bleach and ammonia)
5-Bizarre, chemically rich and/or virulent alien flesh
Org characters have moderate protection from poisoning, acid and disease and significant protection when consuming them.

Maybe Psi characters use pharmaceuticals/drugs to affect their nervous system or mental state to sync up with whatever causes psychic phenomena.
1-Cheap, over-the-counter, no questions asked
2-Over-the-counter, suspicious (Sudafed, other street drug ingredients)
3-Cheap street drugs
4-Morphine, hardcore street drugs, heavily regulated substances
5-Alien drugs, plutonium nyborg, etc
Psi characters have moderate protection from mental or nervous system effects and significant protection when being dosed with drugs.

The general scale should be:
1-Cheap, easily obtainable, harmless to all characters and not suspicious
2-Semi-cheap, slightly harmful to the wrong characters and slightly suspicious if handled wrong
3-Fairly harmful to the wrong characters, barely harmful to the right characters, suspicious
4-Highly dangerous to the wrong characters, slightly harmful to the right characters, highly suspicious/illegal
5-Alien in origin (comparable to drinking Elder Vitae in VtM: Bloodlines), lethal to the wrong characters, moderately harmful to the right characters

Pokonic
2012-07-16, 04:50 PM
Starspawn:
Compulsion: Lore-search: You have a need to look for evidence of your kidnappers in normal life. This might mean you cannot look at certent things without seeing Shubby herself looking down at you, or cannot go into a library without wishing to break into the restricted section to look at the oldest books. You take a -2 to will when you are in the presance of such bodies of information and do not fervently search for "the truth".
Psi Benefit: Veil: Theres a whole wide world out there that others cannot see. Well, most others. They cannot touch you, and you cannot usualy see them. But you can make others see. When you make others suffer under a illusion-based effect, they take a -1 to there checks to break free because of the extra omph of the visions.
Org Benefit: Say what you will, but the outer gods have some cool toys. You now have a +1 to your checks determening the effectivness of your organic parts. Your body bends to your will easier than others, and you can make funny sounds with organs that are normaly not used for making sounds. Tekili?

erikun
2012-07-17, 02:02 AM
I haven't read anything past the first post, so do pardon me if some of this has been mentioned already. I'm just putting my thoughts down for now.

Abductors - Reptilians: This sounds a bit like the Dinosauroid (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinosauroid#The_.22Dinosauroid.22) idea. I think it might be more interesting if they were dinosaur-evacuees who have now returned to the planet and are experimenting with the current life forms, rather than mutant turtles from the planet Dinotopia. It would give them more identifable motives than just reptile-Greys.

Now that I think about it, what are the Abductors used for anyways? If it is supposed to be what grants the Taken their abilities, then I'd think that we'll want far more specific categories that 'exotic'. For that matter, it doesn't necessarily need to be aliens taking and modifying people - the idea of a worldwide sentient AI kidnapping people and experimenting on them fits the theme as well, as might a secret government organization that's just taking random bits of alien technology and putting them to use on the homeless (your grab-bag organization).

Just out of curiosity, what is the point of Support Groups in the game? They don't seem related to the abductors, and I'd assume that powers granted are through the abductors rather than the support groups. Are they some sort of social-network? Or just working out the base setting and how Taken generally interact with each other?

Pokonic
2012-07-17, 02:48 AM
Just out of curiosity, what is the point of Support Groups in the game? They don't seem related to the abductors, and I'd assume that powers granted are through the abductors rather than the support groups. Are they some sort of social-network? Or just working out the base setting and how Taken generally interact with each other?

It's a thing which shapes the charecters world view. It's the differance between a group who crys softly into eachothers laps and one who helps others pay for training with heavy weapons. The players got kidnapped, and they (the Support Groups) help color there perceptions on how they view the whole thing.

Admiral Squish
2012-07-18, 07:29 AM
General Patton:
That looks pretty good! I definitely like the scale, and it seems pretty fair across the board. I'm not entirely sure about drugs, though. I mean, each drug gives you a different effect. If you chug cough syrup it's going to be a totally different experience than crack. If they're trying to reach a specific state of mind, then you would be heading the wrong way half the time. Or perhaps it's just getting out of your own mind that lets you recharge?

Pokonic:
Looks pretty good. I'm not immediately sold, however. I'll mull it over a couple times today and see what come out.

Erikun:
Dinosauroids are a cool idea. I don't know, though. The question is how would they 'evacuate'? When the ELE came, they certainly weren't capable of space travel, even if they were clever little beasties. One idea that had been mentioned in my research was the idea the draco aliens 'uplifted' troodonts to a sentient lifeform to serve as their 'working class'.

Abductors determine what types of experiments are available to you, they also install a compulsion and benefit that makes you a bit different from other taken, even if they're the same experiment type. Currently, the exotic category got broken up into it's three component aliens and I'm considering adding an MiB abductor category, though in my mind they are more keen on 'recruiting' than just grabbing homeless.

Support groups are basically what pokonic described. It's more of a tool to help describe how you react to the abduction experience and the other taken you come to hang out with than anything. Some react with fear and paranoia, others lash out violently. There's a certain degree of social networking involved, but we're talking, like, .01% of the population. (Though as much as 5% have been in contact with aliens at some point, most don't remember anything, and those that do tend to write it off as a dream or repress it and go about their lives. It's rare to see people really respond to the experience.) They're pretty spread out.

Chronologist
2012-07-18, 05:38 PM
Comparing the Taken and Changelings isn't perfect, and I wasn't implying that they would share the same mechanical abilities. What I meant was that the THEMES are similar, with both groups being normal people who are taken against their will, changed against their will at a fundamental level, then are released/escape from said captivity, and that their greatest fear is being recaptured by their abductors.

One thing I always liked from Changeling was how the nature of the abductors altered the character is specific ways, both mentally and physically. Ogres are huge brutes who had to survive their abuse by becoming abusers themselves. Fairest were crafted into beautiful forms and treated like objects - and sometimes became them.

I don't get the same vibe from the Aliens, or the Taken. The aliens themselves are incredibly interesting, but how they interact with their subjects isn't always as clear. It would be nice if certain psychological traits were linked with the Alien types.

Maybe my view is skewed, if so it might be due to the scattered nature of this thread. A compiled list of all aliens and their influences would be great.

I really like this concept, if I sound harsh at all I apologize for that.

SuperDave
2012-07-19, 09:42 PM
Erikun and Pokonic actually bring up a pretty good point: we really haven't discussed the Support Groups, or the benefits they would confer on their members.

I was thinking that, for the most part, Support Groups would give bonuses to mundane (non-extraterrestrial) skills. I.E., things that normal human beings can grant or train each other in. Things which don't require Æther to use.

Techies would, of course, get bonuses to Computers and/or Crafts (maybe a simple +1 or +2, or access to the 9-again quality), but they'd also be good at bypassing security systems to get at that information, so bonuses to Larceny and/or Investigation would be appropriate too.

Reformers would get bonuses to Expression and Persuasion, and maybe Empathy to help spot those who might be more receptive to The Truth than most people.

Reactionaries gain bonuses to Firearms and Weaponry (natch), and Science, as it relates to breaking things and building homemade bombs. Intimidation would fit right in, too.

Post-Humanists benefit from a preternatural understanding of Science (especially Biology) and Medicine. Crafts, especially as they relate to the human body (grafts, piercings, amputations, etc.) are primary as well.

Runners are great with Subterfuge and Larceny. When all else fails, mundane skills like Drive and Athletics can make the difference between capture and freedom.

Pokonic
2012-07-19, 09:56 PM
On Support Groups: It would seem that the party itself could be one proper, with the whole group going to regular sessions along with a few NPC's. Or we could look at them like werewolf Lodges and consider them another thing to modify your charecter. Either interpritation has merit.

Admiral Squish
2012-07-21, 10:53 PM
Chronologist:
Sorry, I didn't mean to give the impression I was angry. I was a bit annoyed at getting the changeling comparison again, but I didn't mean to actually sound angry.

there are definitely going to be differences. It's not going to be specific, getting taken by a gray affects you like X, since people respond to input in vastly different ways. However, the experience of each is going to be drastically different. Reptilians are brutal and malicious to their taken. The greys are cold and clinically detached. I'll try to link the abduction experiences to psychological traits, but I don't want to limit people from choosing how their character responds to the event.

Superdave:
Definitely liking this take on support groups. I just thought the support groups were going to function like courts, allowing access to certain things and such. I like this take on it better. Combined with abductors and experiment types, character creation is going to be VERY fluid.

SuperDave
2012-07-22, 10:30 AM
General Patton, your list of potency of different sources of Æther (sorry, I just love writing it that way!) is perfect for this game! Would you mind if I reposted it in the Alien: The Taken thread on the White Wolf Forums (http://forums.white-wolf.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=63606)?

Admiral Squish: When you say you'll "try to link the abduction experiences to psychological traits," are you referring to the psychology of the Abductors, to the people they seek out for Experiments, or to the psychological changes which commonly occur after being Taken?

Meanwhile, over on the While Wolf Forums:


Indeed.

Well if that's the case then the themes for this game should be weakness and violation [emphasis mine], not conspiracy and paranoia. (not to say they wouldn't be major aspects, that just that player's main concern isn't a shadowy bureaucracy but rather their own sense of powerlessness) That would also mean that mean that your selective splat will probably have to change reflecting the idea that the ultimate goal is to regain the lost sense of control and power [emphasis mine]. Meaning that Support Groups should be well support groups, perhaps one where they just want to return to the life they knew and forget the whole mess, another who want to understand the who and why this happened to them ect...

This, I think, is a much better idea than my original plan for "A Storytelling Game of Paranoid Conspiracy". The Taken will be on the receiving end of these conspiracies, not actually taking part in them (at least, the player-characters won't), so the game's tagline should focus on what the players' experience will be.

So, we need a noun (most likely an abstraction) to describe the focus of the game, and an adjective to modify that noun. Any suggestions?

General Patton
2012-07-22, 02:22 PM
General Patton, your list of potency of different sources of Æther (sorry, I just love writing it that way!) is perfect for this game! Would you mind if I reposted it in the Alien: The Taken thread on the White Wolf Forums (http://forums.white-wolf.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=63606)?

Please, go ahead. :smallbiggrin:

Admiral Squish
2012-07-25, 03:34 PM
Secifically the last two. I don't want to go too much into detail about the abductors, though I will admit I'm naturally fascinated by that aspect, to preserve their mysterious nature. Like, reptilians prefer to take those living alone with few social contacts, since their methods aren't very subtle. But then, a nordic's abduction experience might make them more open to religion.

Amechra
2012-07-25, 04:57 PM
How about "Recovering Strength"? That sound valid?

General Patton
2012-07-26, 12:27 PM
Retaking Control?

Admiral Squish
2012-07-29, 10:50 AM
Power and Weakness? To emphasize how you have a great deal more power than the average person, but compared to the abductors you're still impotent.

Faerieheart
2012-07-29, 11:22 AM
Comparing the Taken and Changelings isn't perfect, and I wasn't implying that they would share the same mechanical abilities. What I meant was that the THEMES are similar, with both groups being normal people who are taken against their will, changed against their will at a fundamental level, then are released/escape from said captivity, and that their greatest fear is being recaptured by their abductors.

One thing I always liked from Changeling was how the nature of the abductors altered the character is specific ways, both mentally and physically. Ogres are huge brutes who had to survive their abuse by becoming abusers themselves. Fairest were crafted into beautiful forms and treated like objects - and sometimes became them.

I don't get the same vibe from the Aliens, or the Taken. The aliens themselves are incredibly interesting, but how they interact with their subjects isn't always as clear. It would be nice if certain psychological traits were linked with the Alien types.

Maybe my view is skewed, if so it might be due to the scattered nature of this thread. A compiled list of all aliens and their influences would be great.

I really like this concept, if I sound harsh at all I apologize for that.

Abductions last for life though. I'd think the difference is. It changeling you're goal is to blend in and not be found. Where as in taken you would know "disappearing" is not possible and no amount of hiding will make them not come for you. The goal in taken seems more to find a way to make them stop, learn to cope with what's happening, try to learn to prevent them from taking your memories and thus control, and doing this all in a world that doesn't believe you.

In changeling its a fear of what might happen again. In taken it's how can we/I make it stop. Very different concepts.

SuperDave
2012-07-30, 02:00 PM
Abductions last for life though. ...

In Changeling, it's a fear of what might happen again. In [Alien: The] Taken it's how can we/I make it stop. Very different concepts.

I agree, Faerieheart. I feel like emphasizing this aspect of the Taken experience is key to making the game truly feel separate from Changeling: The Lost.

By the way, I've been thinking that the Taken are up against a lot of stuff, with not very many resources. I'm not even sure that they have a hope of making serious strides against either the MiB or their Abductors. Do we want them to be able to turn the tides and thwart the Aliens plans? Or will this be a fatalistic game of cat-versus-mouse?

I want the players to be afraid of the conspiracies, both Terran and Extraterrestrial, but I don't know if it would be fair to to the players if we make this game impossible to win. How do we strike a balance between difficulty and playability?

SuperDave
2012-07-30, 02:50 PM
How about "Recovering Strength"? That sound valid?


Retaking Control?


Power and Weakness? To emphasize how you have a great deal more power than the average person, but compared to the abductors you're still impotent.


While these do all reflect the game's themes, I feel like they're a little vague, and not specific to the setting. I think we need to look to the other gamelines for inspiration:

A Modern Gothic Storytelling Game
A Storytelling Game of Savage Fury
A Storytelling Game of Modern Sorcery
A Storytelling Game of Stolen Lives
A Storytelling Game of Beautiful Madness
A Storytelling Game of Light and Shadows
A Storytelling Game of Second Chances

A Storytelling Game of Terrible Majesty
A Storytelling Game of Forbidden Science
A Storytelling Game of Fighting Fear
A Storytelling Game of Forgotten Glory
A Storytelling Game of Destiny and Dissonance
A Storytelling Game of Infernal Power

Jallorn
2012-07-31, 10:41 PM
And Subscribed.

SuperDave
2012-08-01, 02:09 PM
So, one of the posters in the other thread recently introduced a really innovative approach to Experiment-types, and I thought I should share it here. I know that General Patton's excellent chart for different sources of Æther would need to be heavily modified or scrapped if we adopted this approach, but hey, isn't that the point of an idea-farm thread anyway?

I've intermixed zalrein's ideas for the different types of Augments with a few ideas I've come up with on my own. Feel free to suggest more of them!

Endocrine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endocrine): Enhancements to metabolism, allowing quicker reactions and greater control over motion.
- Super-Speed (a.k.a. Celerity (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Celerity_%28VTR%29))
- Bull's Endurance
- Fortitude (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Fortitude)
- ability to go weeks without food or days without water
- hibernation/feign death
- photosynthesis
- the ability to lie with what appears to be utter conviction
- gills/water-breathing

Excretory (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excretory_system): Covers a broad range of expanded excretory abilities, as well as enhanced ability to combat poisons, diseases, and other foreign substances/objects.
- poison spit
- acidic blood
- poison spines
- iron constitution
- poison-resistance
- disguise scent
- remain comfortable in extreme temperatures

Integumentary (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integumentary): Transforms the human body from a flimsy sack of bones and blood into veritable fortress against intrusion. Also deals largely with the skin and its appearance.
- Morphing
- (something similar to Contracts of Mirror (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Mirror))
- Bone-armor
- something similar to Vicissitude (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Vicissitude)
- boneless body

Neural (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nervous_system): Allows for leaps and bounds in reasoning and deduction, as well as drastically increasing the raw processing power of the subject's brain.
- Comprehend Languages
- Untrained Expertise
- Doublethink
- Improved Reflexes
- Reflexive Parry
- Comprehend Machines
- "Speak" with Machines

Psychikos (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_psychic_abilities): Grants feats of mental power which are unachievable for normal humans.
- mind reading
- aura viewing
- precognition
- telekinesis
- thermokinesis
- Illusions/Holography (similar to Chimerstry (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Chimerstry))

SuperDave
2012-08-01, 02:15 PM
Zalrein has also posited an interesting method for structuring the Support Groups, based on the Kübler-Ross model (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K%C3%BCbler-Ross_model), commonly known as The Five Stages of Grief:





Kübler-Ross added that these stages are not meant to be complete or chronological. Her hypothesis also holds that not everyone who experiences a life-threatening or life-altering event feels all five of the responses nor will everyone who does experience them do so in any particular order.


The thing that I was suggesting, and as always feel free to ignore and/or pimp slap me, is that this represents the character's initial response to the realization to what happen to them, and in turn flavors how they view and behave.
I.E: (side note: I'm using a rather silly naming scheme at the moment so feel free to use your own)

The Stubborn: Denial aspect; these would be the ones who think they gone insane or more likely that the one informing him are insane, and even when confronted with overwhelming evidence still hold on to some form skepticism (think Agent Scully) as such should possess some ability to interfere with special powers. (if you're wondering how after a cyberman attack they still can't believe well their unconscious simply refuses to listen)

The Scorned: Anger aspect; pretty straight forward when they figured out what happened they got pissed, not say they are all revenge seeking thug, in fact, they more likely to fierce protectors and dedicated investigators (mostly revenge seeking thugs tend to disappear mysteriously or are in jail).

The Hopeful: Bargaining aspect; these can be the most diverse of the Returned ranging form the manically reactionary to depressingly inactive, all depending on weather they are trying to reclaim their former lives, or just to simply forget what happen to them. Whatever their provocation they all share the same desire, "I wanna go home again".

The Lost: Depression aspect; pure melancholia though not necessarily true depression, these characters tend towards introspection, and given them a perpetuation towards towards sloth ( being lost in thought) or investigatory action (seeking answers to what happen to them). I'm pretty sure Agent Mulder is akin to the latter.

The Calm: Acceptance aspect; the "alright now what?" These are the most odd in that they accepted what happened to them and in refused to be victims displaying considerable willpower, but they can also can be the polar opposite, viewing what happened to them as something that they deserve, either way they tend to have an easier time using their abilities.

I really to think the abductor innate splat is going to limit your games potential, if for no other reason then it will restrain the kinda stories that a GM can tell, the aliens become tangible and defined not to mention limited.
After all part of what makes what happen terrifying is the mystery, a lack of why is often more of a mind-killer then the lost of control is, and this sense of mystery opens up what the GM can do with the players, perhaps their are intended to be sleeper agents and a prelude to an invasion, or maybe unknowing foot soldiers in a underground war, hell maybe some sufficiently advanced aliens got bored and decided to screw around with the natives.

But as always feel free to ignore and/or pimp slap,
-Zalrein

SuperDave
2012-08-03, 03:01 PM
How do we feel about these phrases as possible taglines for the game?

- A Storytelling Game of Personal Invasion
- A Storytelling Game of Stolen Innocence
- A Storytelling Game of Stolen Ignorance

SuperDave
2012-08-06, 10:42 AM
I've been wondering about whether "Thermokinesis" should be unique to a particular Augment/Experiment, or something that all Taken can do.

Abductees often report sudden and violent shifts in ambient temperature, both hot and cold, in the presence of aliens and/or their craft. Thermokinesis would therefore be thematically appropriate to Alien: The Taken, but I wonder if it should a a power that certain Taken possess, or something that any Taken with a little experience can do.

I believe I suggested earlier that Æther could be harvested from ambient heat energy in the environment. What if any Taken could just suck the heat out of their surroundings at will for an easy boost in Æther? Or, conversely, make their opponents very uncomfortable by flooding their surroundings with intense heat? What if the Æther could be deployed in other ways, such as electromagnetic pulses, or even visible light/radiation?

Would this be over-powered if everyone has access to it? I think that it would be a cool ability, and uniquely Alien, but tell me if you can think of any obvious ways that this might break the game?

General Patton
2012-08-06, 02:55 PM
Sucking heat out of the atmosphere is a blatant violation of thermodynamics. However, consider the Maxwell's Demon thought experiment (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_demon). Because thermodynamics could hypothetically be violated by an intelligent entity capable of acquiring information without expending energy, depending on how psionics works in your setting, it might be believable for subconscious psionic perception to enable that kind of ability without the psion being directly aware of every molecule's velocity. So psionic taken might be able to break thermodynamics while neither suffering information overload nor being given overpowered senses.

Admiral Squish
2012-08-07, 11:11 AM
Sorry I been silent for a while, lost track of the thread.

New source suggestion: Alphas (TV show) Caught an episode on syfy and it seems like it would work really well. The powers they mention/use in the show all have highly scientific explanations and seem quite fitting. One of the team has super-strength, another has the ability to 'push' people and implant suggestions, a third has super-powerful senses, and another one can perceive and interact with radio/electromagnetic frequencies.

On the balance between playability and difficulty:
I like that we were making the taken significantly powerful. But I want to emphasize that they're facing entities and organizations much more powerful than any ragtag team could be. They should be significantly more powerful than a human of equivalent experience, but the alien-foes and MIB should keep pressure on them. Like with the MIB response roll idea.

On the new take on experiment types:
It's an interesting take on it, but this system really seems to emphasize organics, and psionics to a lesser degree, but I can't see where tech would fit into this breakdown, and even if we did fiddle with it to make tech fit in, it would be a much narrower field than the three, equal branches we were talking about. I could see using some of the systems mentioned as guidelines for the kind of bio experiments we come up with. Like, making sure each experiment only affects one system?

On the kubler-ross:
So, the suggestion is that instead of choosing the abductor that took you, the experiment, and the support group, you'd choose your kubler-ross reaction, the experiment, and the support group? I'm really edgy on this one. I want to be open to new ideas, but I really think this is a drastic departure from the idea we were working on. If the intent is to avoid identifying/defining/limiting abductors, I don't think that works with the game concept. I mean, real-world abductees DO remember and identify their abductors. That doesn't mitigate how powerless they are, or how powerful and mysterious the abductors are. We could endeavor to keep the initial abductor-descriptions vague and terrifying, but the abductors are an integral part of the abduction experience. You can't write them out entirely. Besides, I think it would definitely be important to describe the abductor's influence on the experiments to a certain degree.

Thermokinesis:
Not really sure on this one. If everyone can just suck the heat out of a room for a quick boost, wouldn't it just be way too easy to restore lost aether? What's to stop somebody from taking a walk on a hot summer day and completely refilling? Perhaps, however, we can work this. Experiments would, theoretically, require at least a little energy constantly. Perhaps they get their 'running energy' by absorbing ambient heat energy? Perhaps not noticeable usually, but if you get a group of taken together they'll chill a room by a few degrees, or a single taken in a confined space leaves the area cooler after a while.
I do like the idea of aether being usable to do a number of things, though. Perhaps it's collateral damage? Like, using aether at all produces low levels of radiation that can be traced with a geiger counter? Or perhaps a taken using aether disrupts nearby electronics?

SuperDave
2012-08-08, 09:45 PM
New source suggestion: Alphas (TV show)
Sounds a lot like Heroes. Are they alien-influenced, or just paranormal?


On the balance between playability and difficulty:
I like that we were making the taken significantly powerful. But I want to emphasize that they're facing entities and organizations much more powerful than any ragtag team could be. They should be significantly more powerful than a human of equivalent experience, but the alien-foes and MIB should keep pressure on them. Like with the MIB response roll idea.

I agree. But isn't that how pretty much all the different splats function? Changelings are more powerful than humans, but not as strong as the True Fae. Vampires are tougher than mortals, but they're all pawns in the Great Jyhad of the Antediluvians. There's always a bigger fish.


On the new take on experiment types

I think that the new system would actually be compatible with the original one. What if, within each Experiment type, there were four or five sub-types (i.e., Disciplines, Contracts, etc.) which the players could choose from? I'm not sure how we'd break down Tech, but Psi could be divided into Telepathy, Telekinesis, Precognition, Remote Viewing/Scrying, etc. I think that the idea has merit, because it would allow players (especially those whose Abductors can perform more than one type of Experiment) to really customize their character's abilities.

On a related note, I was thinking about how to deal with the Abductors who only perform one type of Experiment. Perhaps, as a way to reflect their Abductors' level of specialization in their given Experiment, players who only know one Experiment Type might benefit from the 9-again rule on ability-activation? This doesn't make them more likely to be successful than anyone else, but they they are successful, they'll do better than those whose focus is divided.


On the kubler-ross:
So, the suggestion is that instead of choosing the abductor that took you, the experiment, and the support group, you'd choose your kubler-ross reaction, the experiment, and the support group? I'm really edgy on this one.

Well, not quite. I was actually thinking that instead of the current Seasonal Court knockoffs, we would divvy up the taken along the lines of actual psychological stages/classifications. The Support Groups I put forward don't really come out from the shadow of my own dyed-in-the-wool Changeling experience, and I think that zalrein's idea breaks free of my old constraints. If we want this to feel like its' own game, then I feel like it can't follow in Changeling's footsteps.

That said, I don't know if this is the final version: I'm not convinced that the Five Stages of Grief are really thematically appropriate here, since we're actually looking at responses to traumatic stress, not loss and grief per se.

But hey, we're free to experiment here. That's the point of an idea-farming thread, right?


Thermokinesis:
Not really sure on this one. If everyone can just suck the heat out of a room for a quick boost, wouldn't it just be way too easy to restore lost aether? What's to stop somebody from taking a walk on a hot summer day and completely refilling? Perhaps, however, we can work this. Experiments would, theoretically, require at least a little energy constantly. Perhaps they get their 'running energy' by absorbing ambient heat energy? Perhaps not noticeable usually, but if you get a group of taken together they'll chill a room by a few degrees, or a single taken in a confined space leaves the area cooler after a while.

Hmm, good point. Considering that other argument about this method of harvesting being a blatant violation of the Second Law of Thermodynamics, I think that maybe we shouldn't allow this. If we're going to build a sci-fi setting, then we've got to at least give nominal respect the the laws of physics.

(P.S. Does anyone know a good physics resource for writers of science fiction?)


I do like the idea of aether being usable to do a number of things, though. Perhaps it's collateral damage? Like, using aether at all produces low levels of radiation that can be traced with a geiger counter? Or perhaps a taken using aether disrupts nearby electronics?

These are some of the drawbacks that I had in mind for this type of Æther-harvesting. It might not be obvious where the heat is going, but anyone in the know will realize that there must be one or more Taken in the vicinity.

SuperDave
2012-08-13, 08:37 PM
I was poking around online, and I came across a bit of ranting which more or less answered several of the questions I've been mulling over, such as the purpose of the alleged alien-human hybrid breeding program.

We haven't really discussed the breeding program so far, but I've been doing some research (http://www.amazon.com/They-Know-Better-Than-Ourselves/dp/0814799221) lately, and I've found that reproductive matters are absolutely central to the alien-abduction narrative. There's hardly an account which doesn't involve nudity at the very least, and forced harvesting of sperm and ova, as well as forced impregnation and "harvesting" of hybrid fetuses (the "lost baby" phenomenon), are extremely common experiences among abductees.

I've quoted one of the more pertinent sections below, but I recommend reading the whole article (don't worry, it's not too long). While some of the arguments don't really stand up under scrutiny, at least the author's sentences have clear beginnings and ends, and the logic is internally consistent, for the most part.



How do alien forces plan to counter the problem of “human nature”?

Einstein once said that a problem’s solution cannot come from the same level where the problem originated. If human nature is the problem, then only a non-human element can be the solution.

At present, the problem resides in the inevitable failure of both the secret government and future humans to maintain unconditional obedience to their alien masters due to fundamental genetic and metaphysical differences and the fact that we are individualistic and opportunistic by nature.

Once the New World Order is initiated, their solution is to place humanity under the leadership of a genetically engineered “master race” of alien-human hybrids. These hybrids surpass us in intellectual and psychic abilities, and they do not “suffer” from the “weaknesses” of human nature such as empathy and the longing for individual freedom.

While maintaining control, they will then interbreed with the human population to infuse these genetic characteristics into humanity at large. Thus, in the end mankind will be biologically predisposed toward subservience to the alien empire, alleviating the empire of having to expend unnecessary resources enforcing their control.

At that point, we will be locked into bondage and the alien agenda will have reached its conclusion.

We are seeing evidence of this already. For example, we are being culturally pre-conditioned to eventually accept the policy of interbreeding between humans and hybrids. Standards of physical beauty embodied in supermodels and actresses increasingly move toward emphasis upon features typical of hybrids: low forehead, small chin, triangular face, large eyes, and slim androgynous bodies.

It wasn’t too long ago that the “hybrid” look would have been considered disturbing and unhealthy, but today the trend has been toward the sexualization of these characteristics.

Source: Synopsis of the Alien Master Plan: The Hybrid Breeding Program and the Impending Enslavement of Mankind (http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vida_alien/esp_vida_alien_18zt.htm)

Furthermore, the article brings up semi-plausible explanations for several Alien behaviors, such as the idea that they "require psychic or etheric energy to project themselves into our three dimensional environment" (Æther, in game-terms). While this might not be a requirement for all Abductors (I'm mainly thinking that this would apply mainly to the Starspawn, and perhaps the Nordics), it does provide a practical reason why they don't just waltz in and start blasting everything with death rays.

SuperDave
2012-08-13, 08:58 PM
In a related note, I recently came across a contemporary account of the aftermath of Native Americans' first contacts with Christopher Columbus' men. I feel that it makes an excellent illustration of the type of horrendous barbarism which even members of a "civilized" race can visit upon those they see as less than themselves. This could provide a rich vein of inspiration for the Reptilians, as well as how the Abductors in general view their captives, and humanity at large.

Many of the Taken find themselves asking, constantly: "Why do the Aliens abduct so many people, and subject them to such cruel an inhumane Experiments? What could they possibly need with such huge numbers of captives, subjects, and sleeper agents?" Well, usually, they do it to advance their Master Plan(s), and maybe sow a little chaos to reduce humanity's resistance. But sometimes, it's just because they can. They don't need to have a reason for everything they do.

(Be ye warned; the following descriptions are graphic!)


They [the Spanish] laid Wagers among themselves, who should with a Sword at one blow cut, or divide a Man in two; or which of them should decollate or behead a Man, with the greatest dexterity; nay farther, which should sheath his Sword in the Bowels of a Man with the quickest dispatch and expedition.

They snatcht young Babes from the Mothers Breasts, and then dasht out the brains of those innocents against the Rocks; others they cast into Rivers scoffing and jeering them, and call'd upon their Bodies when falling with derision, the true testimony of their Cruelty, to come to them, and inhumanely exposing others to their Merciless Swords, together with the Mothers that gave them Life.

They erected certain Gibbets, large, but low made, so that their feet almost reacht the ground, every one of which was so order'd as to bear Thirteen Persons in Honour and Reverence (as they said blasphemously) of our Redeemer and his Twelve Apostles, under which they made a Fire to burn them to Ashes whilst hanging on them: But those they intended to preserve alive, they dismiss'd, their Hands half cut, and still hanging by the Skin, to carry their Letters missive to those that fly from us and ly sculking on the Mountains, as an exprobation of their flight.

Source: A Brief Account of the Destruction of the Indies (http://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/20321/pg20321.html), by Bartolomé de las Casas (1689)


For more on how the invasion might go poorly for humans, check out "When Worlds Collide: The Untold Story of the Americas After Columbus (http://www.pbs.org/kcet/when-worlds-collide/)".

Pokonic
2012-08-14, 03:58 AM
We haven't really discussed the breeding program so far, but I've been doing some research (http://www.amazon.com/They-Know-Better-Than-Ourselves/dp/0814799221) lately, and I've found that reproductive matters are absolutely central to the alien-abduction narrative. There's hardly an account which doesn't involve nudity at the very least, and forced harvesting of sperm and ova, as well as forced impregnation and "harvesting" of hybrid fetuses (the "lost baby" phenomenon), are extremely common experiences among abductees.

Would be interesting if one or more of the social groups have more of these victems than others.

As for possible conditioning for our alien overlords, both Nord's and Grey's fit the bill, with Nord's doing it "for the good of man" and greys for some experiment or another. Nord hybrids would probably end up being cult leaders or "spokesmen" for there celestia daddies while Grey hybrids end up being strange children and even stranger adults, having some degree of mental powers.

SuperDave
2012-08-14, 02:48 PM
Neter (Grey Hybrids)

Hairless, pale-skinned children with large dark eyes and unsmiling features. Many are mistaken for being autistic or emotionally disturbed.

They typically exhibit signs of psychic awareness and mechanical aptitude from a young age, though their social development lags far behind that of their peers. They often do not begin to speak until five or six, and even then, only as many words as are strictly necessary to get their point across.

From infancy onwards, the Neter rarely cry.

http://www.alienresistance.org/alien-hybrid.jpg

Vril (Reptilian Hybrids)

Vril are the most overtly psychopathic of the Hybrids strains, and their freakishly-strong bodies only assist them in the pursuit of their desires. Many are stunted and short, others are abnormally tall, but all seem to possess some strange feature which, while not overtly freakish, sets them apart from their supposed peers.

The Vril can be of any skin tone, though when they are in extreme emotional states it can shift color unconsciously. Some have learned to master this latent ability to help disguise themselves. Regardless of their skin's current color, it often appears dry, flaky, and somewhat loose-fitting.

https://sites.google.com/site/topsecretresearch/Alien-Images/rept_hybrids.jpg

Annunaki (Nordic Hybrids)

Unlike their celestial parents, Nordic Hybrids can be of any human racial profile, though they often try to explain away their unusual features by claiming some strain of exotic ancestry, which may change depending on where they are at the moment. For example, a Nordic Hybrid living in China might claim to have a Native American ancestor somewhere down the line, but while traveling in the American Southwest, the same Hybrid might claim a touch of Polynesian ancestry.

http://www.floating-world.org/images/inbox/3rdDimenionalPleiadian.jpg

Talosoi (Robotic Hybrids)
Should the Robitics even create Hybrids at all? It would make sense if they didn't, and even these creatures seem basically the same as regular Taken. If the Talosoi get their own mini-template, then they need to have something that sets them apart from the regular Taken. Maybe they were raised from birth to be part of the Cluster, like the Borg?
The Robotics recognize that the human brain has a considerable amount of processing power, and therefore that it has value for the Cluster. However, it does require a few "tweaks," so that it can keep up with the rest of the AIs.

Basically, they're a lot like The Borg, but instead of serving each other as equals, they serve the Cluster, as its tools.

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSI4QFVLFWCnixSol6UwrcDLjoTMZSjW V1tVrBt7uRu9KHoel_fOgOLz-0R

Nymphae (Myconid Hybrids)
I'm not sure if this should be a true Hybrid template, or just the standard model for all player-character Myconid-abductees (i.e., you can only play as the ones who were lucky enough to subdue and overcome their parasites; all the rest are basically pod-people).

These beings are called "hybrids" only by analogy. Actually, they are humans who, through some quirk of their genetics, have bodies which form a symbiosis with their invaders, rather than the Myconid strain simply becoming parasites.

http://images.wikia.com/animu-mango/images/e/e7/Parasyte.jpg

Deep Ones (Starspawn Hybrids)

Whether they are wet, heavy-breathing hulks of slime and boneless muscle, or sickly, underfed wretches with pallid, cold skin, the Deep Ones are highly unnerving to all humans who encounter them. Many are only barely able to pass for human, and only then by claiming to have rare genetic disorders or deformities.

http://www.zbrushcentral.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=308389

willpell
2012-08-16, 10:21 PM
You know, it occurs to me that a simple way to avoid the Changeling comparisons is just to turn that N in the thread title into an O....

Lord_Gareth
2012-08-16, 10:45 PM
You know, it occurs to me that a simple way to avoid the Changeling comparisons is just to turn that N in the thread title into an O....

Speaking as someone who once played and loved oWoD - oWoD was a sin before every god ever worshiped by mankind, mankind itself, and mother nature. Let us not dig up is foul grave and inflict it upon this project.

SuperDave
2012-08-18, 12:39 PM
Speaking as someone who once played and loved oWoD - oWoD was a sin before every god ever worshiped by mankind, mankind itself, and mother nature. Let us not dig up is foul grave and inflict it upon this project.

I think the harsh assessment is a little extreme, but I would definitely prefer to work within the New World of Darkness. The system is much more fluid, and crossovers are far easier to balance. Plus, it's the system I'm more familiar with (of all the oWoD game-lines, I've only ever really played Vampire: The Dark Ages extensively).

Though out of curiosity, willpell, why the oWoD suggestion? Is there some feature of the setting which you think would make this game seem less like Changeling: The Lost?

willpell
2012-08-19, 08:40 AM
Though out of curiosity, willpell, why the oWoD suggestion? Is there some feature of the setting which you think would make this game seem less like Changeling: The Lost?

Only the fact that the OWOD universe doesn't contain Changeling: the Lost. In NWOD it's assumed that (some at least) alien abductions are caused by the Gentry playing the role of the modern boogeyman, so actual alien abductions have to compete with that. In OWOD, however, there isn't much of an explanation for aliens (what little there is goes into Mage: the Ascension, where the aliens are either Technocracy creations gone rogue or allies of the Nephandi from beyond the Horizon, but in any case it's a fair bit less front-and-center than the "grays"-as-True-Fae thing which is right in the CTL corebook). Plus the whole "reclaiming the life that you were stolen away from" thing is NOT a central theme for any OWOD splat, so your guys would be the only thing speaking to that narrative space in an OWOD context.

To Lord Gareth's assement, I can say only "Take a look at V20"; they've been working on improving the OWOD rules somewhat, and are talking about publishing new material for it (under alternate names, either "Classic WOD" or the even more unnecessarily-cryptic "Onyx Path"). I do think NWOD has a better rules system overall, but the two aren't THAT different, and it's not impossible to play the OWOD setting under NWOD rules - they even publish Translation Guides aimed at making it possible to splice the two in either direction.

PS, @ SuperDave - I love the pictures you came up with for the Hybrids, although I can't figure out what the Myconid one is from. But I have to say I am hugely not a fan of the name Nephilim for the reptilian hybrids. It's a fairly specific myth that has nothing to do with them as far as I can see; it seems like it would fit better with almost any of the others (probably not the Robotics). Why not call the half-reptilians Vril or Gorns or something?

Lord_Gareth
2012-08-19, 09:51 AM
To Lord Gareth's assement, I can say only "Take a look at V20"; they've been working on improving the OWOD rules somewhat, and are talking about publishing new material for it (under alternate names, either "Classic WOD" or the even more unnecessarily-cryptic "Onyx Path"). I do think NWOD has a better rules system overall, but the two aren't THAT different, and it's not impossible to play the OWOD setting under NWOD rules - they even publish Translation Guides aimed at making it possible to splice the two in either direction.

While the mechanics of oWoD can only be described as deliberate acts of malice, my primary objection is actually with the fluff assumed in oWoD, in addition to the non-option, incredibly shoddy meta plot. Remember the Skinner? Yeah. So do I.

willpell
2012-08-19, 10:07 AM
Sam Haight has never appeared in any of my OWOD games and his absence didn't inconvenience me in the slightest.

SuperDave
2012-08-19, 05:50 PM
I think that, despite the fact that I may indeed be moving into Changeling's territory, I'd rather stick with nWoD rather than oWoD. I feel more comfortable with the setting, and there are more people out there who play it and could offer advice. Besides, each WoD game is basically designed to stand on its own, so if the Storyteller feels that there's too much overlap with Changeling, they're free to keep the fae out of their campaign.

Plus, I feel that Alien: The Taken differs significantly from Changeling: The Lost and the rest of the nWoD by incorporating a pervasive apocalyptic sense of foreboding reminiscent of the oWoD. This is not a stable setting; it's a world heading inexorably towards a large number of violent and fundamental changes, one way or another. There's really no way that this setup can persist, short of a complete stalemate between the Taken and the various terrestrial and extraterrestrial agents of the so-called New World Order (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_World_Order_(conspiracy_theory)). Even if there was a stalemate that the Abductors felt they couldn't overcome, they would just go to "Plan B" and start dropping their landing pods in the middle of Times Square.

@willpell: The photo I found for the Nymphae is from Parasyte (http://www.onemanga.com/Parasyte/) by Iwaaki Hitoshi; it's a Japanese body-horror manga about head-eating alien parasites that are insinuating themselves into the human race, and have a tendency to eat other, non-host humans in rather messy ways. The main character got his right hand eaten instead of his head, so he actually formed a (slightly unwilling) symbiosis with the creature. It's a lot like a manga version of John Carpenter's The Thing. Feel free to look it up, but be prepared for some really effed-up imagery.

SuperDave
2012-08-19, 08:25 PM
I think I've found a nearly pitch-perfect summary of the history of the Alien: The Taken setting. Or at least, this could be just one of the "Secret Histories" which are most commonly believed by the Taken. But I think that this is one of the clearest, most concise explanations of what conspiracy theorists believe actually happened.



[John] Lear [son of Lear jet inventor William P. Lear] reports in [his book] "Matrix" that after years of frustration over unregulated alien activity within U.S. borders, on 25 April 1964 at Holloman Air Force Base, "a meeting was held between elements of the U.S. government and the species known as the Greys." According to Lear, the terms of that treaty are as follows: first, the United States would allow the aliens to maintain underground bases. "The Atomic Energy Commission's underground facilities were offered, and larger facilities were built around the Southwest. Second, "the United States would allow the aliens to abduct its citizens on a periodic and limited basis for medical examination, providing that the people were returned unharmed and without memory of the interaction." And third, in exchange for access to human bodies the aliens would provide the United States with technology in "beam weaponry, gravitational propulsion, stealth technology, mind control, and implant technology."

According to abductee Cynthia Crowell (also in "Matrix II"), such a treaty was not difficult in the United States, "for the people had assigned the power to make such treaties on their behalf to a small group of elected officials." As she understands it, "the aliens would share technology with the Earthlings, and in exchange, all they requested was the right to collect biological samples, conduct experiments, and live in peace. Our technocrats found this offer irresistible - a small price to pay for advanced technology." In Crowell's account, as in those of Mario and others, the powers that be blur into one another, and are understood to be interconnected and colluding against "regular citizens".

...

The Dark Side Hypothesis locates the abuse of citizens by aliens and human cohorts not only on spaceships, but also within American borders, inside an intricate web of top-secret or abandoned military bases and underground tunnels. These Underground Bases are sites in which citizens are purportedly experimented on, mutilated, sacrificed - treated like guinea pigs for the advancement of alien races and other complicit terrestrial elites. Demonized human scientists and technicians are rendered working alongside aliens in these luridly reanimated underground laboratories.

Brown, Bridget. They Know Us Better Than We Know Ourselves: The History and Politics of Alien Abduction. New York: New York University Press, 2007.

SuperDave
2012-08-24, 07:42 PM
I'm just gonna leave these here...

Holography (Tech)
● – Pattern: continue the surrounding shapes and colors, to hide a discontinuity, such as a crack, a cave mouth, a doorway, etc.
●● – Illusory Object: create an image of a solid, 3D object. It feels solid and casts a shadow, but it cannot move, and it makes no sound.
●●● – Object in Motion: object is solid, and appears real to sight, touch, and sound (though not taste or smell).
●●●● – Gallery: Create multiple moving, solid objects, at the same time.
●●●●● – Holodeck: Create an entire environment, which is entirely convincing to a single subject.
●●●●● ● – Holodeck Excursion: As above, but with multiple subjects.

Auto-Healing (Tech or Org)
Nanobots in your bloodstream (or your own advanced metabolism) instantly begin repairing your body whenever you are damaged. Each dot allows you to automatically soak one point of bashing damage per turn. Every two dots allows you to soak one point of lethal damage. E.g., at ●●●, you can heal a point of bashing and a point of lethal, or three points of bashing. (Is this too powerful? The Uratha can do it, but that's kind of their shtick...)

Tactile Telekinesis (Org or Psi)
Each dot grants an extra point of Strength for the duration of the scene.

Tachyon Boost (Tech or Psi)
When activated, each dot allows you to purchase one extra action (other than a move action) on your next turn.

Transvection (Tech or Psi)
● – Flicker: You flicker in and out of your present location, making you harder to see and hit.
●● – Ethereal Jaunt: you step sideways into an alternate reality, allowing you to travel unhindered through space. You must move at walking speed, and it takes just as long as it normally would, assuming no hindrance.
●●● – Ethereal Jump: you appear (your Speed) away from where you started, instantaneously.
●●●● – Tesseract Passenger: You can send one other person or object on an Ethereal Jaunt. Does not include yourself.
●●●●● – Borrow Self: You “borrow” yourself from microseconds into the past or future, allowing yourself double actions in a turn (without splitting your dice pool), but you lose lots of Willpower when it’s over.

Temporal Manipulation (Psi or Tech)
● – Time Attunement: Sense the passage of time exactly, as well as temporal instability.
●● – Internal Recursion: Cause a single target to repeat events over and over.
●●● – Lapse: Cause a target to move slower in time.
●●●● – Subjective Suspension: Temporarily remove subject from the timestream.
●●●●● – Clotho’s Gift: Accelerate your time frame to take several actions per turn.

Morphing (Org)
● – Face of a Stranger: Appear as someone else. Not someone specific, just someone else.
●● – Change one part of your body to resemble someone else’s. Can be used several times to achieve a more complete disguise.
●●● – Z-Space Mass Dispersal: Grow or shrink by one Size category per success.
●●●● – Sudden Mutation: Add an extra bodily feature, which grants you ONE of the following: natural weapon, natural armor, initiative bonus, speed bonus, or immunity to wound penalties)
●●●●● – Chrysalis – Each animal you consume allows you to become that animal. You have to eat it alive (and still warm).
OR
As the Animorphs series.

Telekinesis (Psi)
● – Jiggle/Rattle
●● – Turn/Spin
●●● – Push/Pull
●●●● – Lift
●●●●● – Throw/Flip

Phasing (Psi) (require Stamina or Resolve rolls?)
● – Lightwalk: pass through light-admitting barriers, such as glass or clear plastic.
●● – Fleshwalk: phase through organic matter (get past a person blocking your way, avoid a punch, escape from ropes and leather cords, etc.)
●●● – Earth Step: pass through up to 5cm of solid metal, or 10cm solid stone.
●●●● – Shadowcat: partially phase through solid matter, allowing you to climb on (or inside) solid structures). Must hold your breath.
●●●●● – Fluid Body: Allow foreign objects to pass harmlessly through you. Bullets are much harder to deal with than knives, because they're moving much faster.

Contortionism (Org)
● – Slither: Squeeze through tight places and escape from bonds or restrictive clothing.
●● – Unnatural Suppleness: You gain +2 to Dodge.
●●● – Perfect Grip: You gain +3 to Grapple.
●●●● – Motile Organs: Your organs subconsciously shift themselves out of the way of incoming attacks, making you nearly immune to exceptional successes on damage rolls.
●●●●● – Boneless: Given enough time, you can squeeze through virtually any opening, as long as it is roughly as large as your fist.

Thermokinesis (Psi)
● – Cooling/Warming Breeze: Return a room-sized area to a normal, comfortable temperature
●● – Grip-Breaker: Heat (or cool) a small metal, glass, or plastic object, making it impossible to hold.
●●● – Universal Thermostat: Lower or raise ambient temperatures by ~20ºC per success.
●●●● – Cold-Snap: Freeze a small body of water, or a large body of air.
OR, Heat and cool an object at the same time, causing it to crack and rupture.
●●●●● – Spontaneous Combustion!

Technophilia (Tech)
● – Universal Remote: Turn a device you can see on or off (requires a power source)
●● – Static Discharge: Cause any electronic device currently in use to go haywire for one scene
●●● – Interface: gain +2 on all Hacking rolls for one scene, involving one computer that you can physically touch
●●●● – Static Storm: Everything nearby goes haywire (roll to determine range)
●●●●● – Torrent: Download everything on the computer instantly (including viruses and security programs, which may cause Willpower damage)
OR
●●●●● – Cyber-Combat

Parasite (Org)
● – Infra-Vision/Blindsense
●● – Poisonous Spines/Skin (aggro?)
●●● – Boneless Fluidity (+2 Defense, squeeze thru tight spaces)
●●●● – Bony Carapace (Zulo form, natural armor)
●●●●● – Full-on Yog-Sothoth transformation (provokes Lunacy?)

Medsense (Org)
● – Diagnosis: indentify a number of the subject’s diseases and medical conditions equal to successes on a Medicine + Xenophilia roll.
●● – Deathwatch: Find out how many health boxes a target possesses, how many are full, and of which kinds of damage.
●●● – Lifesense: Identify how many life-forms are in your area, and what kinds (human, alien, supernatural, etc.), but not where they are or how fast they’re moving.
●●●● – Panacea: convert aggravated damage to lethal, or lethal to bashing.
●●●●● – Spark: return life (but not necessarily stability) to a subject which has died in the past 30 seconds.

Elecromagnetism (Tech)
● – Compass: find north, never get lost, and determine altitude / elevation.
●● – Surge: Damage the Structure of all nearby electronic devices.
●●● – Pulse: overload and/or permanently damage all nearby electronics.
●●●● – Static Shock: Convert Æther into aggravated damage.
●●●●● – Thunderbolt: Convert Æther into aggravated damage at a distance.