Weather in combat (heroic tier)

[malachi]

I am putting on my DM hat, and have a question for you guys:
Unless I change my mind (again), the next time I DM a short arc for my group, I'm planning on weather being an impact on the players. I'm pretty sure that this will come up on Tuesday.

The party will have to deal with the heavy winds, harsh rain, and occasional lightning of a thunderstorm. There is a decent chance that they will engage in unprotected combat during this storm. What are some interesting ways to factor in the storm to combat? I mostly want it to feel different than combat during the middle of the day.

I've considered
a) Making ranged attacks less effective (lowering range and/or accuracy). Seriously considering scrapping this, since the only person affected would be the bow ranger.
b) Chance to fall prone due to slippery terrain (haven't had the idea for long enough to come up with any decent ways to implement it)
and c) Coming up with better ideas. :smallwink:

Anyways, the party is a group of 4 (possibly with a 5th player), and everyone is level 5 (possibly 6th? I don't have their current experience total on me):
Shifting Ranger (uses a longbow, might be upgrading to a greatbow)
goliath barbarian (charisma based, I think)
human fighter (the man with the lucky dice)
half-elf cleric (pacifist)
(Possibly) eladrin avenger (retribution)

Thanks!

[Ashdate]

Some ideas:

If the weather is severe enough (and perhaps if it's dark out), you might consider that creatures (enemy or otherwise) that are more than X spaces away have concealment, and enemies that are X times 2 spaces away have total concealment (i.e. 5/10 squares).

You could also universally hamper movement; perhaps the wind and rain reduce everyone's speed score by 2.

The rain, combined with grassy terrain and wind has also made keeping balance difficult. Add one to any forced movement.

Perhaps the weather is so bad that ALL attacks (from both sides!) are made with combat advantage. Alternatively, combat advantage is impossible to get, even if a power says to grant it.

Finally, you can outright lie to your players. Tell them that all their attacks are taking a -2 penalty. Reduce all monster defenses by -2. They'll never know!

[Kurald Galain]

How about this: at the start of each character's turn, he slides 1d3 squares in the direction the wind is blowing.

[malachi]

Some ideas:

If the weather is severe enough (and perhaps if it's dark out), you might consider that creatures (enemy or otherwise) that are more than X spaces away have concealment, and enemies that are X times 2 spaces away have total concealment (i.e. 5/10 squares).

You could also universally hamper movement; perhaps the wind and rain reduce everyone's speed score by 2.

The rain, combined with grassy terrain and wind has also made keeping balance difficult. Add one to any forced movement.

Perhaps the weather is so bad that ALL attacks (from both sides!) are made with combat advantage. Alternatively, combat advantage is impossible to get, even if a power says to grant it.

Finally, you can outright lie to your players. Tell them that all their attacks are taking a -2 penalty. Reduce all monster defenses by -2. They'll never know!

I really like the concealment/total concealment idea, but I'm not sure what a good number would be. 2 characters are ranged, and the monsters don't really have ranged attacks (close blasts and area bursts, though). Maybe it should be cover, as the wind makes even explosions less likely to hit? I also don't know what a good idea for the distance would be. Maybe 3?

I like the idea to remove CA. It's too dark and windy, so they can't see well enough. Not sure if I'd want to use that or use the penalty to attacks. Doing both might make them feel too hampered.


How about this: at the start of each character's turn, he slides 1d3 squares in the direction the wind is blowing.

I like the idea, but with the wind in initiative (maybe have it change order in initiative randomly, so it can't be expected? What would be a good way to do that without screwing the rest of the initiative order up? I'm using index cards), and have it roll attacks vs Fort. On a hit, it pushes 1d3 squares, less if the target is prone.

... Would a (small) snake be more or less likely to be affected by wind than a medium humanoid?

I'm thinking of using this list:
All speed lowered by 2.
Shift distance lowered by 1.
Creatures more than ? squares away have cover. Creatures more than ?? squares away have total cover.
No one can gain combat advantage.
Occasionally, the wind will blow, attacking everyone's fortitude. Hit creatures are pushed 1d3 squares.

Thanks for the help!

[Ashdate]

Perhaps 3/6 for concealment (-2 to hit) / total concealment (-5 to hit)? That will get your range standing a bit closer than they might feel comfortable, bu far enough that the enemy can't simply shift and attack them.

Perhaps you can use the weather as an excuse to get some skill checks in too?

A Nature check will warn them of how severe the incoming storm will be, and with that knowledge an appropriate Heal check will let them prepare for the storm, reducing the movement penalty to one.

Once in combat, an Endurance check as a minor action will give them a +5 bonus to their fortitude against the fierce winds as they gird themselves against it (alternatively, reduce the distance they would be pushed by one), while a successful Perception check as a minor action will increase their visible range to 4/8 or 5/10.

If you're feeling really wild, maybe allow classes to use an appropriate skill check to reduce their penalty on attacks temporarily. Athletics = martial characters, Arcana = arcane characters, religion = divine characters, etc.

You could probably have a lot of fun. You've inspired me to try something similar in my game!

[Silma]

My opinion is:

~No speed penalty.
~All squares are treated as difficult terrain (this covers the -1 to speed and shift)
~Everyone must make an Endurance Check at the end of their turn. If they fail they grant combat advantage until the end of their next turn.
~Everyone has partial concealment.
~If someone moves more than 3 squares in a single action, they must make an Acrobatics Check. If they fail they fall prone and the move ends there.
~The wind has no initiative. Instead it attacks against Fortitude at the start of each creature's turn. On a hit the creature is pushed 1 square in a random direction (roll a d8 to determine direction). If the path to the (randomly) selected direction is blocked, the push is negated. On a crit, the target is instead pushed 1d4 squares and knocked prone.
~Each creature must make a Perception Check at the start of their turn. If they fail, it treats all creatures more than 3 squares away as having total concealment for that round.

[malachi]

Perhaps 3/6 for concealment (-2 to hit) / total concealment (-5 to hit)? That will get your range standing a bit closer than they might feel comfortable, bu far enough that the enemy can't simply shift and attack them.
Those numbers sound good.


Perhaps you can use the weather as an excuse to get some skill checks in too?
I was planning on having some outside of battle, but having more in combat will make it more interesting.


A Nature check will warn them of how severe the incoming storm will be, and with that knowledge an appropriate Heal check will let them prepare for the storm, reducing the movement penalty to one.
I guess the Heal check would be them eating particularly invogorating? I'm not really seeing how that would work.


Once in combat, an Endurance check as a minor move action will give them a +5 bonus to their fortitude against the fierce winds as they gird themselves against it (alternatively, reduce the distance they would be pushed by one), while a successful Perception check as a minor action will increase their visible range to 4/8 or 5/10.
I'd change it to a move action, for the irony. They spend their move the make themselves move less far. Or maybe work it some other way. It would be kind of weird for someone to ready themselves to not get moved, and then charge something 4 squares away.


If you're feeling really wild, maybe allow classes to use an appropriate skill check to reduce their penalty on attacks temporarily. Athletics = martial characters, Arcana = arcane characters, religion = divine characters, etc.
That seems a little arbitrary to me (and probably would to my group as well).


You could probably have a lot of fun. You've inspired me to try something similar in my game!

Woot! I am a muse today!


My opinion is:

~No speed penalty.
~All squares are treated as difficult terrain (this covers the -1 to speed and shift)
~Everyone must make an Endurance Check at the end of their turn. If they fail they grant combat advantage until the end of their next turn.
~Everyone has partial concealment.
~If someone moves more than 3 squares in a single action, they must make an Acrobatics Check. If they fail they fall prone and the move ends there.
~The wind has no initiative. Instead it attacks against Fortitude at the start of each creature's turn. On a hit the creature is pushed 1 square in a random direction (roll a d8 to determine direction). If the path to the (randomly) selected direction is blocked, the push is negated.
~Each creature must make a Perception Check at the start of their turn. If they fail, it treats all creatures more than 3 squares away as having total concealment until the start of their its turn.
Your idea for difficult terrain works much more simply than what I had said (which is always a plus), but I feel that it lowers speed too much (a human in heavy armor can now move only 2 squares, whereas he'd move 3 if his movement was only lowered by 2). I'll think about it, though; it definitely has its merits.
The main reason I want the wind to have a random initiative is so that it is unpredictable as to when it will hit. The wind isn't constantly blowing super strong, and the gusts aren't consistently every 6 seconds. Also, the wind is blowing consistently in 1 direction (closer to hurricane than tornadoes).
I like the idea of making checks to reduce penalties, but I'm not certain yet what sort of check, what kind of action to make it, and stuff like that.

[Leewei]

Torrential rains grant concealment to creatures more than 5 squares away, total concealment after 10 squares.

Rain-slick pavement is difficult terrain.

Gusts of wind attack every creature on the map (d20+5 vs Fort; push 1 square on a hit; prone on a crit).

[Ashdate]

I guess the Heal check would be them eating particularly invogorating? I'm not really seeing how that would work.

Sorry, I should have elaborated more. I take a bit more of an expansive view of the "Heal" skill to try and make it more useful than the typical PHB uses. I was thinking about it as sort of the second part to help prepare them for the coming storm. The Nature check lets them identify it, the Heal check lets them prepare for it.

The idea would be to allow Heal to properly outfit them with more rain resistant clothing, to understand the value of leaving particular items temporarily behind (or to drop once combat started) in order to not be overburdened, stuff like that. Nature would usually be a more appropriate skill, but I like spreading this kind of stuff out when possible.



I'd change it to a move action, for the irony. They spend their move the make themselves move less far. Or maybe work it some other way. It would be kind of weird for someone to ready themselves to not get moved, and then charge something 4 squares away.

I figured it would be important for them to give up something to help defeat the weather, but that a move action might be too much. But whatever you think is best.


That seems a little arbitrary to me (and probably would to my group as well).

Well, if your character was trying to compensate for the weather when making an attack, what would skill would they use? You could use Endurance, but I figure it would be more flavourful to use a wider variety of skills.

The idea would be physical exertion could be tied to Athletics, compensating for the weather when casting a spell could be tied to Arcana, channeling divine energies to properly respond in the storm could be tied to Religion...

It is a bit arbitrary, but the idea would be to reward characters for investing in skills that they probably have. Certainly, don't use it if you (or your group) can't gronk it.

[Kurald Galain]

I would recommend not to overdo it: don't put three or four effects in the same combat, it's distracting.