Psychic Beguiler

[RFLS]

Hey playgrounders, I've got a build question for everyone. I'm not a strong optimizer, and I'm new to psionics (they've been forbidden in my group's campaigns for a while), but I've got a character I'd like to try. It's roughly a psionic beguiler, but more focused on combat deception than diplomancy. I was thinking Ardent 1/ Psion 1/ Ardent X. With the Psion level, I'd select the shaper school and pick up the minor creation manifestation for poison abuse. For ardent, I was thinking of using the deception, freedom, mental power, and time mantles.

My problems so far are
1. That Psion level seems like it HURTS overall, but I can't see a better way to get minor creation without blowing a whole mantle on it.

2. The mantles I've found so far seem to be lacking in the crowd control and mind effects that I want.

3. I have no clue what I'm doing with psionics in general.

So, does anyone have suggestions? I'm open to scrapping the whole build, I'm only attached to the character concept. I've got access to all the books, but Dragon magazine is out.
The only things that have to stay are a) battlefield control, and b) poison use. Aaaand....go!

[eggs]

Why are you using Ardent instead of Telepath? If it's for Dominant Ideal, which mantle are you planning on breaking choosing?

Hidden Talent gets a level 1 power known and some PP for a feat.
If you have trouble with the Ardent power list, Substitute Powers (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070629a) can add some customization (but that really seems to take out the point)

[Essence_of_War]

Combat Deception you say?

Have you considered the psychic rogue (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040723b) or the Lurk?

[Bloodgruve]

The Expanded Knowledge feat will give you Minor Creation.

Blood~

[RFLS]

I think playing a Lurk and taking the Hidden Talent feat is the way to go here. My only problem is a definite preference for 9th level manifestations over the sneak attack.

...I feel stupid. I should just play a telepath and take the Hidden talent feat, huh?

As a side note, following the "sneaky battlefield control" type of play, are there any good PrCs you can recommend?

[eggs]

Psychic Rogues and Lurks have serious endurance issues when used as primary manifesters (and for Lurks, that's pretty much the only way to play the class).

For stealth, most of the psion prestige classes are pretty bad. They typically mean losing a bunch of Manifester levels (like the Elocator, Psion Uncarnate or Psychic Assassin), theurging (Soul Manifester, Psychic Theurge, Cerebremancer) or relying on houseruled adaptation sections (Shadowmind, Mindbender, Anima Mage).

If you really want to emphasize stealth though, I'd lean toward putting 1 level in Feat Rogue (or Factotum/Psychic Rogue, but feats will be tight), plus the Able Learner feat to afford social, stealth and manifesting skills, followed by 5 levels Telepath for Telepathy (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070411a) and 10 levels Anarchic Initiate (mostly for the skill points). And, somewhere along the line, picking up Darkstalker, Mindsight and Practiced Manifester (both to make up the 1 ML lost and to crank up Schism). This would delay manifesting progression by a level, but would be a good skulk, a solid (if not absolute first-rate) manifester, and a strong face/mind controller.

[TuggyNE]

Combining Hidden Talent with a manifesting class may be a little dubious. Expanded Knowledge is likely to work better with less stares thrown your way.

[Psyren]

Incarnum - i.e. Soul Manifester (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12154024&postcount=29) - is a good way to make a sneaky psion; the bonuses last all day long and don't cost a single power point from you to maintain. Though Totemist has the better sneaky melds (e.g Worg Pelt, Kruthik Claws), you can still pick one of them up via feats if you prefer Incarnate as a starting point. And getting MoI approved opens you up to all the standard goodies like Psycarnum Infusion (great for when you really have some sneaking to do), Soul Crystal and Midnight Augmentation.

You can even be a pseudorogue with Theft Gloves (be an untrained master thief) and Mage's Spectacles, going so far as to gain Trapfinding and UMD. And while you're at it, check out the psionic soulmelds in that same article.

I personally prefer Soul Manifester on Wilders (UMD and UPD on a Cha-baed class? Yes please!) but it functions equally well on either, or Ardent.

[eggs]

I've always had Totemist skillmonkeys trip pretty hard over those Competence tags. But that's very campaign-dependent (the more restricted players are in choosing which magic items to spend allocate wealth toward, the more useful the melds become). YMMV.

[Psyren]

I've always had Totemist skillmonkeys trip pretty hard over those Competence tags. But that's very campaign-dependent (the more restricted players are in choosing which magic items to spend allocate wealth toward, the more useful the melds become). YMMV.

It's true - there's some overlap with the competence bonuses. But honestly, your WBL is better off improving your manifesting and survivability anyway. At levels where such sneakiness matters most, you can't afford all the competence gear even if it's available, but soulmelds are free.


Combining Hidden Talent with a manifesting class may be a little dubious. Expanded Knowledge is likely to work better with less stares thrown your way.

Why? The intent is clearly to make HT beneficial to primary manifesters too - the feat lets you manifest the free power with your own manifester level if you have one (and even your manifesting stat) rather than the parameters set by the feat.

[TuggyNE]

Why? The intent is clearly to make HT beneficial to primary manifesters too - the feat lets you manifest the free power with your own manifester level if you have one (and even your manifesting stat) rather than the parameters set by the feat.

Ehh, fair enough.