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View Full Version : [3.5] Sorcerer Gish Build Direction Help



KingKamor
2012-07-11, 09:25 PM
So, I have this idea in my head about a magical warrior who wears light mithril armor and has Two-Weapon Fighting to wield a pair of Thunderlances, plus using the Channel Spell class feature of Spellsword to use touch attack spells at a distance of up to 20 feet with said Thunderlances.

However, what I need help on is deciding whether to go with the version of Thunderlance that bases my attack off of BAB+Cha, caster level+Cha (my DM doesn't care which version I choose, FRCS or SpC). Depending on which one I choose, I go in an entirely different direction, going for either BAB or caster level. I'm sure that I can get Abjurant Champion's Martial Arcanist class feature shoved in there somewhere, but that class is pretty much a given with most gish builds.

The game that I'm playing in isn't exactly catered for power gamers, but it's no cakewalk, either, so I'd call it "Hard" on a scale of "Core(normal) -> Hard -> MinMaxErrythang."

Any tips are appreciated, up to and including other weaponlike spells that I might be able to use, since they seem to be almost evenly divided between using BAB or caster level on attack rolls.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2012-07-11, 10:14 PM
Let's look at what you want:
Sorcerer Gish
Spellsword 4+ (5)
Thunderlances (better off using one two-handed)

Things you should consider:
BAB (+16 by 20th for iteratives)
Spellcasting (9th level spells by 20th, so 18/20)

Gish staples:
Power Attack + Arcane Strike (thus two-handing your weapon)
Combat Reflexes (especially good with Thunderlance)
Persistent spell cheese (especially good with Thunderlance, and don't forget about Greater Magic Weapon)

Forget about using light armor. Be good-aligned and take the feat Arcane Preparation, and you can cast (Greater) Luminous Armor (BoED) every day. Note that this is the only armor-bonus spell that benefits from Abjurant Champion, and you can prepare and cast it without even spending a spell known on it.

With Spellsword 5 in a Sorcerer build, you're stuck going either Kobold with the Greater Draconic Rite of Passage (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060420a), or using a build that doesn't include even a single class level that doesn't advance spellcasting apart from Spellsword. Without sticking to one of those, you won't get 9th level spells before the epic levels. Something like Kobold Fighter 1/ Sorcerer 6/ Spellsword 5/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Sacred Exorcist 3 with the GDRoP gets 9th level spells and +16 BAB at 20th, which means a caster level of 20 with Practiced Spellcaster. However, you're missing out on Persistent spell cheese, it will be hard to qualify for Power Attack, and your melee capabilities are extremely weak until you get Polymorph and/or Thunderlance.

An alternate build would be something like Sorcerer 6/ Incantatrix 4/ Dragonslayer 1/ Spellsword 5/ Abjurant Champion 4, which gets only a +15 BAB but 18th level spellcasting capability and the best kind of Persistent spell cheese. It's not a gish until extremely late, but it's probably one of your strongest late-game choices.

You could also consider something like (fractional BAB) Fighter 1/ (martial) Wizard 5/ Incantatrix 3/ Spellsword 5/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Dragonslayer 1, which gets +16 BAB, 9th level spells at caster level 20 with Practiced Spellcaster, the required number of Spellsword levels, and Incantatrix for Persistent spell cheese.

I would strongly advise you to just skip Spellsword 2+ completely, as it's not really worth losing so many levels of spellcasting for an ability with not even enough uses to do it once per encounter. Just to note, you can use any spell with Spellsword's ability and it becomes a targeted effect, so for example a Cloudkill spell channeled through your weapon will deal 1d4 Con damage per round for ten rounds per caster level to the target of your attack. Even then, it's not worth stalling your spellcasting progression to gain that ability.

Go with a more standard Sorcerer gish build, Paladin (or other full BAB with proficiencies) 2/ Sorcerer 4/ Spellsword 1/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Sacred Exorcist 8. Use Illumian with Naenhoon and you can Persist two spells each day once you hit Sacred Exorcist 1, one of which can be Thunderlance. Between casting Shield and (Greater) Luminous Armor with Abjurant Champion increasing both spells' bonuses, you'll be much better off not even wearing any armor at all. Be sure to get a custom Runestaff (MIC) with all your favorite 1/day buffs on it to save yourself tons of spells known, and you're guaranteed exactly the spells you want on it if you make it a Sacred Relic (BoED).

Oscredwin
2012-07-11, 10:16 PM
Go for the caster level. Maximizing that gets you get more spells, and you can still get 16 BAB with 18th level casting (Practiced Caster gets you back the first four CL you lose).

KingKamor
2012-07-11, 10:45 PM
I think that this will give me an idea of what I should shoot for with this build. Thank you both for the help!