PDA

View Full Version : Arcane Focus (AKA Recharge Casting variant)



RedWarlock
2012-07-17, 11:03 AM
This is part of the rules I'm using for my major My-Edition rework of 3.5 (which I've decided needs a new name for common parlance, since 3.9 doesn't even begin to describe it any more, open to suggestions), specifically, it's the slot-recharge system I'm using for my Arcane casters (which will utilize a Words of Power-ish system of spell-component combination). The biggest difference is that I don't use 9-level spells, I use an active, spontaneous spell generation. You don't have spells slots, you focus yourself each round and have X caster levels to create an effect with with.

At the start of your turn, roll the focus die and modifier listed for your current level. You gain usable caster levels equal to the roll result, to a maximum of your actual caster level. A result of 0 allows you to use a cantrip-level effect, while a negative result doesn't allow you to cast at all. You can choose to charge up for a spell of a higher level than your result, saving this round of focus as a modifier to your next round's focus roll, equal to half the die size without the listed modifiers. (in the case of a neg focus result, you would have to save it, but you get that extra +plus from the charge for next round.)

So, for example, I'm a 5th level caster. I roll 1d4, get a 3. That's not enough for the spell I need to cast, so I let it charge (taking another action in the meanwhile), and try again. Next round, I get a 3 on the d4, add 2 from the charge last round, and cast my spell at 5 CL.

Spells with a duration require some of your focus to maintain, preventing you from refocusing your energy as quickly. Every spell you are currently maintaining (as described below) subtracts half the spell's caster level (round down) from your focus roll. You can still take some time and charge it up to your full CL, but it'll take longer with the active spell being maintained.

(One significant change to the function of magic is that, because there is often unlimited casting from at-will and recharge mechanics in play, most spells with a non-permanent duration, including buffs, summons, and curses, can only create a single effect, create a single creature, affect a single target, at a time. Any time you cast, let's say, bulls strength on one ally, that spell will last as long as you want it to, BUT, as soon as you cast it on a different ally, the first's ally's casting ends. So, to get multiple allies in, you have to use for instance, a mass bull's strength instead. Or I might have 'add a second target' type meta-words, but the same base concept stands.)

{table=head]Level|Focus Roll
1st | 1d3-2
2nd | 1d3-1
3rd | 1d3
4th | 1d4
5th | 1d4+1
6th | 1d4+2
7th | 1d6+1
8th | 1d6+2
9th | 1d6+3
10th | 1d8+2
11th | 1d8+3
12th | 1d8+4
13th | 1d10+3
14th | 1d10+4
15th | 1d10+5
16th | 1d12+4
17th | 1d12+5
18th | 1d12+6
19th | 1d12+7
20th | 1d12+8
[/table]

I know this is kind of out-of-nowhere, and without actual info on how spells are constructed, it's not easy to make judgement calls. I'm more looking for opinions on the recharge mechanic, the numbers, involved, and the idea of the spell-maintenance penalty. The spell construction concept is still pretty embryonic, I'm up for suggestions.

The main idea is that you choose the actual effect, then apply modifiers based on range, components (V/S/M), secondary effects, or other variables within the effect (along the line of psi augmentation). Then after applying those modifiers, you get the post-modifier left-over CL, and that's your actual effect potency.

So the archetypical example is a fireball (sort of). Choose a flare effect (d12/CL of sudden fire damage with no explosive effects or light-on-fire aftereffect), add a -2 modifier to make it a 20ft burst effect, with a +1 bonus for indiscriminate (harmful) targeting, then another -2 for a reach origin point. Adding that up gives you a -3 penalty, applied to your 5 CL, gives you 2d12 fire damage over there in a 20ft burst. Now there might be other modifiers in play, like an elemental affinity that gives bonus CL or an ability mod thrown in there somewhere, but that's the rough concept. (maybe flare has a base X required CL, equivalent to a spell level, and a few free starter dice on such an effect..)

Like I said, embryonic.

Dante & Vergil
2012-07-18, 01:03 AM
The rolls going to level 4 from 3 get worse, and you might want to switch them around.

jojolagger
2012-07-18, 02:10 AM
One way to smooth out the increase in power would be to have it just increase in d3's, resulting in a fairly stable roll (this muddles up the 1/2 die size for charging thing, which I would suggest be replaced with 1/2 average roll)
{table]Level|Focus Roll|Average
1|1d3-1|1
2|1d3|2
3|1d3+1|3
4|2d3-1|3
5|2d3|4
6|2d3+1|5
7|3d3-1|5
8|3d3|6
9|3d3+1|7
10|4d3-1|7
11|4d3|8
12|4d3+1|9
13|5d3-1|9
14|5d3|10
15|5d3+1|11
16|6d3-1|11
17|6d3|12
18|6d3+1|13
19|7d3-1|13
20|7d3|14
21|7d3+1|15[/table]
If you say that charging gives you 1/2 the average roll (without modifiers), then every level you don't gain an increase in average is a level you gain an increase in charge (Charge value being equal to the number of dice). At level 20, charging for a round gives you 7d3+7, which averages 21, allowing for spells to be reliably cast every second round by the time you hit that level.


One interesting option would be to have multiple methods of calculating your focus roll. Each level, you may increase die size at the cost of a -1 modifier, get a +1 modifier, or split a dice (d6->2d3,d8->2d4,d12->2d6) (2d3 sized up should size up to d3+d4, to avoid exponential returns for size up and splitting over other options.)
This allows for a Wizard who can cast very reliably (1d3+19; average 21), but has almost no ability to preform above standard and little incentive to focus, along side a sorcerer (3d12-1; average 18.5), who is far less consistent, and on average slightly weaker, but for whom spending a turn to build up his mana provides a greater bonus.

One other idea would be to have excess points (over your actual CL) enter a temporary pool that boost your next round but in a degraded manner (1/2 the amount by which you beat the cap?), or an option to act beyond your actual CL, but take penalties for doing so (damage, de-buffs, reduced casting, "burning out"(Temporary loss of magic)) Combining the two would force casting between risking harm or letting a charge of mana fade to nothingness.

RedWarlock
2012-07-18, 12:13 PM
The rolls going to level 4 from 3 get worse, and you might want to switch them around.

Ah, yes, you're right. Fixed.



One way to smooth out the increase in power would be to have it just increase in d3's, resulting in a fairly stable roll (this muddles up the 1/2 die size for charging thing, which I would suggest be replaced with 1/2 average roll)
Eh, I'm actually more interested in keeping the die changing. For one, it improves the use of varied dice, and d3s are hard to find and not always simple to figure off of d6s. Plus this keeps it down to one die at a time rather than escalating into a ton of rolled dice, when they're going to be rolling dice for their spell effect too.


If you say that charging gives you 1/2 the average roll (without modifiers), then every level you don't gain an increase in average is a level you gain an increase in charge (Charge value being equal to the number of dice). At level 20, charging for a round gives you 7d3+7, which averages 21, allowing for spells to be reliably cast every second round by the time you hit that level.
That reliably is actually something I'm working to avoid. I want it to be a little more variable, something that should keep casting more on-par with fighter-types.


One interesting option would be to have multiple methods of calculating your focus roll. Each level, you may increase die size at the cost of a -1 modifier, get a +1 modifier, or split a dice (d6->2d3,d8->2d4,d12->2d6) (2d3 sized up should size up to d3+d4, to avoid exponential returns for size up and splitting over other options.)
This allows for a Wizard who can cast very reliably (1d3+19; average 21), but has almost no ability to preform above standard and little incentive to focus, along side a sorcerer (3d12-1; average 18.5), who is far less consistent, and on average slightly weaker, but for whom spending a turn to build up his mana provides a greater bonus.
I'm actually killing wizard/sorcerer, in favor of mage (who uses this system, and subdivides into conjurer/beguiler/warmage/necromancer) and warlock/DFA, who take over the innate casting concept with entirely different mechanics.

As for the splitting, I'll consider it, but it might be more suited for feats, rather than build into the base arcane magic system.


One other idea would be to have excess points (over your actual CL) enter a temporary pool that boost your next round but in a degraded manner (1/2 the amount by which you beat the cap?), or an option to act beyond your actual CL, but take penalties for doing so (damage, de-buffs, reduced casting, "burning out"(Temporary loss of magic)) Combining the two would force casting between risking harm or letting a charge of mana fade to nothingness.
I really don't want to pool this, it's not a point system of mana. Think of it more like a concentration roll, or even a fighter's attack roll.

I am considering having an overcharge penalty, some kind of over-focus mana-burn-like-effect when you charge and get a focus roll over your class level+something.

I want to keep casting challenging, and keep the system fairly simple.

Edit: Also, keep in mind this is also for non-combat as well. That's part of my challenge, keeping it viable so they don't overcharge when they have plenty of free time and bypass the spell-maintenance focus penalty. Adding damage or the like makes it risky to try to do so.

corran_132
2012-07-18, 05:09 PM
Quick thing:

I think you have a neat idea, charging up for powerful spells.

How would it work in non-combat situations? Would people be able to see your gathering energy? Would you have to stop talking?

Let's say that fireball spell you mentioned is one you end up going with. You take two turns to charge it (reliably that's what it's going to take), and does an average of 13 damage. Even keeping in mind that that is done to an area, that's not great for a spell at level 5. A fighter with Cleve probably does more. I see what your trying to say about keeping fighters on par with mages, but if they only attack every second turn they need to have the ability to really hit when they do.

How many add-on effects are you going to have? Are they all going to be balanced? How long is it going to take players to look through this list to determine what they are casting?

Do you have to spend all your focus? Could I use this once, then cast weak spells for eight turns in a row? Tied to that, do you start the battle with all your focus, or none?

I also kind of disagree with you on the casting dice. yeah, you don't want things to be exact, but you also don't want a player doing nothing for four turns because he's having bad luck and can't buff his spells. Let me rephrase: your players don't want to be sitting for four turns doing nothing.

RedWarlock
2012-07-19, 12:53 PM
Actually, charging your focus doesn't take an action (though you're limited to doing so 1/round). You're still free to make another action, including attacking with the Eldritch-blast-like ability that Mages will have, which is distinct from Focus. (Right now I have a few main concepts, four/five elemental ones, a necrotic one, and a distracting illusionary one. Roughly corresponding to warmage, necromancer, beguiler.)

You won't spend four turns doing nothing, because the charge effect is going to give you a significant bonus right off the bat, and you don't have to pre-construct your spells, you can choose to use what you have and just drop some ancillary metas for a lower modifier.

The number of meta effects isn't set yet, because I haven't figured them all out yet. They're learned, as part of your class progression. (I haven't decided if they're part of the same progression as core spell effects, or a separate progression. Favoring same right now.)