How to make a 22nd level Copper Dragon a good crowd control character?

[Pika...]

So I need a new character for an epic level game. I am going to use the Copper Dragon racial progression from Dragon Magazine #320 up to level 20, and for the second two levels I think I will be going rogue (not 100% sure).

The group does not need anymore heavy hitters, nor a healer, so I figured a crowd control character would be fun for a copper. Especially if the goal is to prank/hinder the enemy in fun and amusing ways. :smallbiggrin:

I was thinking to go heavy on the wands with a pair of wand bracers, as counting as both sorcerer and cleric he can use wands with no need for UMD checks. What wands would you suggest for fun on the battle field?

Also, what else would you suggest . I dislike making such high level characters, so any help would be appreciated.


Many pikas in advance!

[Urpriest]

Entangling Exhalation is a feat from Races of the Dragon that will give your Breath Weapon some automatic crowd control abilities.

[VGLordR2]

Dragon Magazine introduces a bunch of Dragon Psychoses. One of them (I think it's called Ravening) allows you to use your breath weapon three rounds in a row in between cooldowns. Also, there is a Sovereign Archetype that gives Fighter bonus feats every few HD. This can be useful for picking up feats like Improved Initiative for free, and possibly doing a DCFS if you can't make use of any Fighter bonus feats.

[Pika...]

Entangling Exhalation is a feat from Races of the Dragon that will give your Breath Weapon some automatic crowd control abilities.

Oh yeah!

But will this be worth it at epic levels?



Dragon Magazine introduces a bunch of Dragon Psychoses. One of them (I think it's called Ravening) allows you to use your breath weapon three rounds in a row in between cooldowns. Also, there is a Sovereign Archetype that gives Fighter bonus feats every few HD. This can be useful for picking up feats like Improved Initiative for free, and possibly doing a DCFS if you can't make use of any Fighter bonus feats.

Sovereign Archetype? DCFS? Please explain.

[VGLordR2]

I think Sovereign Archetypes are from Dragons of Eberron. I think they trade the Cleric casting that you get for various benefits (such as War Wyrm, which grants bonus feats). DCFS stands for Dark Chaos Feat Shuffle. It combines the spells Embrace the Dark Chaos (http://dndtools.eu/spells/fiendish-codex-i-hordes-of-the-abyss--66/embrace-the-dark-chaos--1163/) and Shun the Dark Chaos (http://dndtools.eu/spells/fiendish-codex-i-hordes-of-the-abyss--66/shun-the-dark-chaos--1146/) to trade any feat that you have for any other feat for which you qualify. So, if Fighter bonus feats are useless to you, you can spend 4,900 GP to get an NPC spellcaster to cast both spells on you, trading a useless feat for something awesome, like Metabreath feats.

[Urpriest]

Oh yeah!

But will this be worth it at epic levels?


Well, it doesn't offer any save beyond the normal one for the Breath Weapon, so that scales (though not that amazingly, if the Dragon Magazine progression is close to the MM benchmarks). That said, Entangled isn't that amazing a debuff at Epic levels, you're correct about that. Mostly it just means you're getting an extra effect on your breath weapon, so if you're using it anyway you might as well...but yeah, you probably have better uses for your standard actions, and even if you don't your Slow Breath will probably be better.

The trouble with doing crowd control with wands is that you're casting at max 4th level spells, which aren't really level-appropriate at epic. Maybe a staff...

[Downysole]

Having never gotten to epic levels, my question would be "what kind of mooks do you end up having to control at epic levels?"

That'll tell you what you need to do to prepare yourself to control them. Also, those things can be pretty specific to a campaign if you know where most of your action is going to be.

[Gavinfoxx]

Well, let's see...

Wyrmling Copper Dragon is 5 RHD/ +3 LA. With LA Buyoff, you can get 3 LA down to 0 by level 20, I believe. With Level Draining, you can remove the pesky racial HD.

Now just be a Wizard/Incantatrix, take Epic Spellcasting.

/Thread.

[VGLordR2]

Ooh, don't forget to use Bestow Curse to advance your dragon. :smalltongue:

[Pika...]

You people are evil...

[Thump]

Well, let's see...

Wyrmling Copper Dragon is 5 RHD/ +3 LA. With LA Buyoff, you can get 3 LA down to 0 by level 20, I believe. With Level Draining, you can remove the pesky racial HD.

Now just be a Wizard/Incantatrix, take Epic Spellcasting.

/Thread.

5 RHD, 9 levels for ECL 17 is when it starts, -1 for ECL 16. Six more for ECL 22, then buy off for ECL 21. Then three more at ECL 24, and then buyoff. So not quite. Almost, though.

[Gavinfoxx]

What if you do the level draining immediately after getting your first class level?

Leaving you as a Wizard 1 + 3 LA, ECL 4, with buyoffs at class levels 9, 15, and 18.

[Pika...]

Eh, unfortunately I can't seem to make this PC work at 22nd level.

Coppers are fun at low/mid levels, maybe even high, but in Epic it seems like it is useless. Can't fight, can't use it's spells for much, can't crowd control. Even too small (Juvenile) for a fellow PC to ride. :smallfrown:

[Gavinfoxx]

What did you think of my idea, instead, then? Go alllll the way down to Wyrmling, Level Drain the HD as soon as you get your first level of Abrupt Jaunt Conjurer or Sorcerer or whatever...?

[VGLordR2]

You could always expose your Dragon to a Phane (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Phane)'s Time Leech ability for a few hundred rounds. This will almost put you on par with ECL 22 adventurers.

[Pika...]

My DM/group would not allow such tricks sadly.

However, I think I came up with a plan. Bluffomancer/Diplomancer Copper Dragon anyone? :smallbiggrin:

[Fouredged Sword]

Warweaver maybe. Still better off being low on the dragon HD and taking abjurant champion levels and all of warweaver.

You are good, so be exalted good. Greater Luminous armor will grant something like +20 to defense, swift action dispelling with greater dispel magic. Swift action prismatic sphere for crowd control.