Rouge/SW/IB/MT

[Mythril]

(Sorry if its too long)
I know there has been a few post about Swash.B/Invis.B set up. So i thought I'd add what path i went down. Sure i know there is few good ones to hit up but for my play style i went this route. So please, feel free to add any comments ^^

The sneaky type class is different from what i am use to. Semi power house. ( aka dusk blade) Yes i do know they changed the pre reqs for invis blade, but since the people i play with go by whats in the books we have to use them.

Human: using Kukir
Rouge- 2 levels for SA and evasion along with trap finding and for the major skill list you get!

Swash/B- 3 levels. Picked up Weapon/F(free feat), Grace, and Insightful/S. Still able to level up Sneak Attack as i gain levels.

Invisible/B- 5 levels. able to maintain S/A, bleeding wound, uncanny feint-faint master.

Master/T- level 2 levels Quick Draw ( Free feat ) Thrown weapon trick (picked up palm thrower) and evasion again to make improved evasion. I can either throw my daggers or use a cross bow and not worry to much about firing into combat.

At this point you are level 12. Your feat list will consist off:
Weapon fen, weapon focus, two weapon fight, point blank and far shot, Quick Draw.
Now there is room for two more feats. For my self i picked up Tumbling Feint and Flick of the wrist.

With this set it, It seems i am able to tumble in to avoid an AoO, gain plus 5 to my bluff to feint. ( which guys/gals, well stacked i range 25+) Use my uncanny feint from invis.B and then proceed to SA them to the face providing i pass my bluff check. (fyi, rules state i can try that again since its during combat. PHP, pg.68) All of that coasted me a swift action to tumble, free action to feint then i hit once. Now correct me if i am wrong.. i think i still have a semi action left to do. not sure so please verify for me.

There is all so flick of the wrist which is set along with bluff to try for another SA. and this one you can use your slide of hand instead vs animals of low Int.

Now that i am passed that i am really thinking i will stick to swash.B to level 20 to finish it out. Not to sure on the feats i will be getting just yet. Have a few in mind. But for what i like to do, Swash.B seems to have it. ( example )
Dodge bonus 1 and 2, Acrobatic Charge(very handy), Improved Flanking( very nice) and one more to my grace bonus.

For me; this allows me to have a few option during combat. I can attempt a solo depending on what we are doing or flanking with the group. Imo, a rouge that's able to sneak attack with out a flanking buddy is a good option. Good close in combat options with a decent range option.

If i missed anything please let me know. I am still learning my self and i do look forward to some constructive criticism. TYVM for your time in reading this.

[Mythril]

(Sorry if its too long)
I know there has been a few post about Swash.B/Invis.B set up. So i thought I'd add what path i went down. Sure i know there is few good ones to hit up but for my play style i went this route. So please, feel free to add any comments ^^

The sneaky type class is different from what i am use to. Semi power house. ( aka dusk blade) Yes i do know they changed the pre reqs for invis blade, but since the people i play with go by whats in the books we have to use them.

Human: using Kukir
Rouge- 2 levels for SA and evasion along with trap finding and for the major skill list you get!

Swash/B- 3 levels. Picked up Weapon/F(free feat), Grace, and Insightful/S. Still able to level up Sneak Attack as i gain levels.

Invisible/B- 5 levels. able to maintain S/A, bleeding wound, uncanny feint-faint master.

Master/T- level 2 levels Quick Draw ( Free feat ) Thrown weapon trick (picked up palm thrower) and evasion again to make improved evasion. I can either throw my daggers or use a cross bow and not worry to much about firing into combat.

At this point you are level 12. Your feat list will consist off:
Weapon fen, weapon focus, two weapon fight, point blank and far shot, Quick Draw.
Now there is room for two more feats. For my self i picked up Tumbling Feint and Flick of the wrist.

With this set it, It seems i am able to tumble in to avoid an AoO, gain plus 5 to my bluff to feint. ( which guys/gals, well stacked i range 25+) Use my uncanny feint from invis.B and then proceed to SA them to the face providing i pass my bluff check. (fyi, rules state i can try that again since its during combat. PHP, pg.68) All of that coasted me a swift action to tumble, free action to feint then i hit once. Now correct me if i am wrong.. i think i still have a semi action left to do. not sure so please verify for me.

There is all so flick of the wrist which is set along with bluff to try for another SA. and this one you can use your slide of hand instead vs animals of low Int.

Now that i am passed that i am really thinking i will stick to swash.B to level 20 to finish it out. Not to sure on the feats i will be getting just yet. Have a few in mind. But for what i like to do, Swash.B seems to have it. ( example )
Dodge bonus 1 and 2, Acrobatic Charge(very handy), Improved Flanking( very nice) and one more to my grace bonus.

For me; this allows me to have a few option during combat. I can attempt a solo depending on what we are doing or flanking with the group. Imo, a rouge that's able to sneak attack with out a flanking buddy is a good option. Good close in combat options with a decent range option.

If i missed anything please let me know. I am still learning my self and i do look forward to some constructive criticism. TYVM for your time in reading this.

[NiteCyper]

(Sorry if its too long)
I know there has been a few post about Swash.B/Invis.B set up. So i thought I'd add what path i went down. Sure i know there is few good ones to hit up but for my play style i went this route. So please, feel free to add any comments ^^

The sneaky type class is different from what i am use to. Semi power house. ( aka dusk blade) Yes i do know they changed the pre reqs for invis blade, but since the people i play with go by whats in the books we have to use them.

Human: using Kukir
Rouge- 2 levels for SA and evasion along with trap finding and for the major skill list you get!

Swash/B- 3 levels. Picked up Weapon/F(free feat), Grace, and Insightful/S. Still able to level up Sneak Attack as i gain levels.

Invisible/B- 5 levels. able to maintain S/A, bleeding wound, uncanny feint-faint master.

Master/T- level 2 levels Quick Draw ( Free feat ) Thrown weapon trick (picked up palm thrower) and evasion again to make improved evasion. I can either throw my daggers or use a cross bow and not worry to much about firing into combat.

At this point you are level 12. Your feat list will consist off:
Weapon fen, weapon focus, two weapon fight, point blank and far shot, Quick Draw.
Now there is room for two more feats. For my self i picked up Tumbling Feint and Flick of the wrist.

With this set it, It seems i am able to tumble in to avoid an AoO, gain plus 5 to my bluff to feint. ( which guys/gals, well stacked i range 25+) Use my uncanny feint from invis.B and then proceed to SA them to the face providing i pass my bluff check. (fyi, rules state i can try that again since its during combat. PHP, pg.68) All of that coasted me a swift action to tumble, free action to feint then i hit once. Now correct me if i am wrong.. i think i still have a semi action left to do. not sure so please verify for me.

There is all so flick of the wrist which is set along with bluff to try for another SA. and this one you can use your slide of hand instead vs animals of low Int.

Now that i am passed that i am really thinking i will stick to swash.B to level 20 to finish it out. Not to sure on the feats i will be getting just yet. Have a few in mind. But for what i like to do, Swash.B seems to have it. ( example )
Dodge bonus 1 and 2, Acrobatic Charge(very handy), Improved Flanking( very nice) and one more to my grace bonus.

For me; this allows me to have a few option during combat. I can attempt a solo depending on what we are doing or flanking with the group. Imo, a rouge that's able to sneak attack with out a flanking buddy is a good option. Good close in combat options with a decent range option.

If i missed anything please let me know. I am still learning my self and i do look forward to some constructive criticism. TYVM for your time in reading this.
Sorry if this post is too long.
I know there have been a few posts about the Swashbuckler/Invisible Blade set-up. It's why I thought I'd add my build. Sure, I know there are a few good ones to hit up, but for my play-style I went this route. So please, feel free to add any comments. ^^

The sneaky type class is different from what I am used to: the semi (http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&safe=off&tbm=isch&tbnid=upuF7t1w5pUFkM:&imgrefurl=http://egotvonline.com/2012/02/29/20-cool-semi-trucks/&docid=bQwVxEdBoiWcrM&imgurl=http://media.egotvonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/semi-truck.jpg&w=560&h=288&ei=RKUKUMniM4mmrQHX0LCvCg&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=239&vpy=110&dur=1493&hovh=161&hovw=313&tx=190&ty=91&sig=101848365783883426913&page=1&tbnh=83&tbnw=162&start=0&ndsp=10&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:0,i:135&biw=1024&bih=519)-power-house (e.g., the Duskblade). Yes, I do know they changed the prereqs for Invisible Blade, but since the people I play with go by what's in the books, we have to use them.

The build:

Human. Using kukri (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#martialWeapons).

Rogue - 2 levels for SA (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#sneakAttack), Evasion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#rogueEvasion) (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)), Trapfinding (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#trapfinding), and for the major skill-list I get!

Swashbuckler - 3 levels. Picked up Weapon Finesse (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#weaponFinesse) (as a free feat), Grace (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)), and Insightful Strike (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)). Still able to level up Sneak Attack (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#sneakAttack) as I gain levels.

Invisible Blade - 5 levels. Able to maintain SA (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#sneakAttack), Bleeding Wound (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)), Uncanny Feint (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)), and Feint Mastery (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)).
Master Thrower - 2 levels. Quick Draw (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#quickDraw) (as a free feat), Thrown Weapon Trick (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)) (picked up Palm Throw), and Evasion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#rogueEvasion) (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)) again to make Improved Evasion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/monk.htm#monkImprovedEvasion) (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)). I can either throw my dagger (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#dagger)s or use a cross-bow (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm#crossbowHand) and not worry too much about firing into combat (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#attack).

At this point I am level 12. My feat list consists of:

Weapon Finesse (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#weaponFinesse),
Weapon Focus (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#weaponFocus),
Two-Weapon Fighting (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#twoWeaponFighting),
Point Blank Shot (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#pointBlankShot),
Far Shot (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#farShot), and
Quick Draw (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#quickDraw).
Now, there is room for two more feats. For myself, I pick up Tumbling Feint and Flick of the Wrist.

With this set-up, it seems I am able to Tumble (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/tumble.htm) in to avoid an AoO (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/attacksOfOpportunity.htm), gain +5 to my Bluff (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/bluff.htm) to feint (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm#feint) (which stacked well, ranges from 25+), use my Uncanny Feint (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)) class feature from the Invisible Blade PrC, and then proceed to SA (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#sneakAttack) them to the face providing I pass my Bluff (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/bluff.htm) check. FYI, rules state I can try that (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/bluff.htm) again since it's during combat (PHB, pg. 68). All of that costed me a swift action (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#swiftActions) to tumble (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/tumble.htm), free action (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#freeActions) to feint (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm#feint), then I hit once. Now, correct me if i am wrong, I think I still have a semi-action left to do. I'm not sure, so please verify for me.

There is also the Flick of the Wrist feat, which is set up along with Bluff (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/bluff.htm), to try for another SA (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#sneakAttack). And with this, you can use your Sleight of Hand (www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/sleightOfHand.htm) instead vs. animals of low Intelligence.

Now that I am passed that, I am really thinking I will stick to Swashbuckler to level 20 to finish it out. Not too sure on the feats I will be getting just yet. Have a few in mind. But, for what I like to do, Swashbuckler seems to have it all. For example, Dodge Bonus (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)) +1 and +2, Acrobatic Charge (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)) (very handy), Improved Flanking (Ex (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#extraordinaryAbilities)) (very nice), and one more to my Grace bonus.

For me, this allows me to have a few options during combat. I can attempt a solo, depending on what we are doing or flanking with the group. IMO, a rogue that's able to sneak attack (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#sneakAttack) without a flanking (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatModifiers.htm#flanking) buddy is a good option. Good, close, in-combat options with a decent range option.

If I missed anything, please let me know. I am still learning myself and I do look forward to some constructive criticism. TYVM for your time in reading this.

[Rubik]

RougeI'm seeing red. :smallfurious:

[Analytica]

I'm seeing red. :smallfurious:

This may be a dead horse though. It is beginning to feel it should be beaten no more. :smalltongue:

OP: Sadly, I have little concrete advice to offer. :smallfrown:

[NiteCyper]

At this point you are level 12. Your feat list will consist off:
Weapon fen, weapon focus, two weapon fight, point blank and far shot, Quick Draw.
Now there is room for two more feats.
Do you mean "now there is room for two more feats with the use of Flaws"?

The math:

That's six (6) feats that you've listed. Two (2) of them, namely Weapon Finesse and Quick Draw, are free. Level 12/3 HD/feat = 4.


With this set it, It seems i am able to tumble in to avoid an AoO, gain plus 5 to my bluff to feint. ( which guys/gals, well stacked i range 25+) Use my uncanny feint from invis.B and then proceed to SA them to the face providing i pass my bluff check. (fyi, rules state i can try that again since its during combat. PHP, pg.68) All of that coasted me a swift action to tumble, free action to feint then i hit once. Now correct me if i am wrong.. i think i still have a semi action left to do. not sure so please verify for me.

I think that you misinterpret the Tumbling Feint feat as allowing you to perform a tumbl (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/tumble.htm)ing action to avoid AoOs as a swift action (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#swiftActions).


Benefit: As a swift action at the start of your turn, you designate a single opponent as the target of this feat. If you successfully use your Tumble skill to avoid provoking an attack of opportunity from that opponent, you gain a +5 bonus on your next Bluff check to feint against him.What is performed "as a swift action (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#swiftActions)" is not the tumble (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/tumble.htm). What is performed "as a swift action (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#swiftActions)" is the designation of "a single opponent as the target of this feat."

[Rubik]

This may be a dead horse though. It is beginning to feel it should be beaten no more. :smalltongue:

OP: Sadly, I have little concrete advice to offer. :smallfrown:Nah, you just have to beat it into people's heads.

Would that be like a Mother Mare Cyst?

[StreamOfTheSky]

Invisible Blade sucks, don't so it.


Master Thrower is definitely cool, but if you're spending a feat on Daring Outlaw, you may just want to stick to Swash/Rogue to get the most benefits out of that.

If you do MT, consider dipping Swordsage before entering it. Gives you free weapon focus with a whole group of weapons (pick shadow hand ones) including daggers to qualify for the PrC. Also opens up great options like: Shadow Blade (dex to damage w/ SH weapons...on top of strength); maneuvers to help get sneak attack (cloak of deception, distracting ember); and you can either dip a 2nd level later on or spend a feat to get Assassin's Stance (+2d6 sneak attack).

[enderlord99]

I'm seeing red. :smallfurious:

Yeah, they're totally overpowdered.:smallamused:

[eggs]

If you have 3 levels to fill, the Marrulurk race from Sandstorm is pretty solid.

It has 3 racial HD and 1 LA, but it's worth it - it comes with big boosts to all relevant stats, poison use, 2d6 sneak attack, Point Blank/Rapid Shot bonus feats and 3/3 BA.

Without level-adjustment buyoff, (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/reducingLevelAdjustments.htm) it's a decent choice. With LA buyoff, it's gold.

[Psyren]

One tactic your rouge can use is to apply makeup to the target as a free action. Angle your blade so that they see their reflection as you strike; they will be captivated by their enhanced appearance, effectively rendering them Dazzled.


(All kidding aside, you didn't mention the primary rogue/swashbuckler feat - Daring Outlaw - which is what you need to get the sneak attack progression continuing from SB levels.)

[Mythril]

Well seeing only one person kinda gave good criticism on reminding me about the daring outllaw feat. and the rest just trolled .... seems these forums are no better then that of a mmo forum. Guess i was hoping for some respectful people here but guessed wrong. This will be my last time posting in these forums. troll away

[Mythril]

{{Scrubbed}}

[Deadlights]

{{Scrubbed}}

For the record, correcting a very obvious mistake is not trolling.

[gorfnab]

Taking a third level of Rogue can net you the Penetrating Strike ACF (DS). Surprising Riposte feat (DotU) will keep a target flatfooted for the round instead of just the first attack.

One build I've used previously:
Strongheart Halfling or Human
1. Rogue - Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Craven, Far Shot, 2x Flaws
2. Swashbuckler - B: Weapon Finesse
3. Rogue - Two Weapon Fighting
4. Rogue - Penetrating Strike ACF(DS)
5. Swashbuckler
6. Swordsage - B: Weapon Focus: Shadow Hand weapons, Shadowblade
7. Swashbuckler
8. Fighter - Hit-and-Run Tactics ACF (DotU - if your DM is lenient), Targeteer ACF (DragMag 310)- Vital Aim
9. Fighter - Targeteer ACF - Rapid Shot, Improved Two Weapon Fighting
10. Swordsage
11. Master Thrower - B: Quick Draw
12. Master Thrower - Dead Eye (DragMag 304)
13. Master Thrower
14. Master Thrower - B: Snatch Arrows
15. Master Thrower - B: Improved Critical, Greater Two Weapon Fighting
16. Invisible Blade
17. Invisible Blade
18. Invisible Blade - Improved Precise Shot
19. Invisible Blade
20. Invisible Blade

Some ideas for getting infinite daggers to throw:
Glove of Endless Javelins - ask the DM if you can change the javelin part to daggers if you also reduce the damage from 1d6+1 to 1d4+1
Quiver of Anariel - ask the DM if you can change the "Quiver" to "Bandoleer" and arrow(s) to dagger(s).
Quiver of Anariel



Quiver of Anariel:Quivers of Anariel appear to be typical arrow containers capable of holding a score of arrows. However, the quivers automatically replenish themselves with standard or magical arrows, such that they are always full. Some quivers also create arrows made of special materials, such as adamantine, cold iron, or alchemical silver.

Once an arrow it taken from the quiver, it must be used within 1 round or it vanishes.

Moderate conjuration; CL 7th; Craft Wondrous Item, magic weapon, minor creation; Price 28,000 gp (standard arrows), 29,000 gp (masterwork arrows), 32,000 gp (+1 arrows), 44,000 gp (+2 arrows), 64,000 gp (+3 arrows), 92,000 gp (+4 arrows), 128,000 gp (+5 arrows); Add an additional +6,000 gp for adamantine arrows, +4,005 gp for cold iron arrows, or +200 gp for alchemical silver arrows; Weight 1 lb.
Thankfully someone saved this article here (http://crpp0001.uqtr.ca/w4/campagne/Downloads/Downloads_WotC/The Lone Drow Companions of the Hall.htm) since WOTC decided to delete the original posting.

Link to a saved copy of the creator of the Invisible Blade's intended/updated 10 level prestige class (http://www.scribd.com/doc/78940391/d-d-Invisible-Blade)

Other items to consider:
Rogue's Vest (MIC)
Collar of Umbral Metamorphosis (ToM)
Bracers of the Hunter (SoX)

[LibraryOgre]

The Mod Wonder: Two threads merged. Prior to this point, double posts should be considered accidents of that merge, and not reported.