So... How 'bout those planes?

[abdima]

Not the trippy interdimensional planes. I mean, those totally awesome flying machines. I'm thinking of DM'ing a Pathfinder campaign (first campaign I'd ever run) And I was wondering how one could make a dogfight work.

[Khosan]

Animated objects (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/constructs/animated-object)?

Large Animated Objects with the Cloth and Flammable flaws. Spend your construction points on Additional Movement (Fly), Faster (Fly) and Ranged Attack.

That gives you a pretty good base, I feel.

[abdima]

Huh... how did I miss that... Thanks! Now would players be able to maneuver said objects?

[silverwolfer]

artificer, making some magical doohiky that you press buttons on?

Your the dm, and your dealing with magic, make **** up and give it stats, the players don't have to know.

[KillianHawkeye]

Just be sure to keep the snakes away.... :smallwink:

[eggs]

Just be sure to keep the snakes away.... :smallwink:
This calls for a fleet of effigy coatls!

EDIT:
Bluh. No effigy outsiders. Whatever those other flying snakes are then.

[Slipperychicken]

Have the planes fight Dragon-riders who leap onto the planes, tear them apart, then jump back to their Dragons. That's how you make it awesome :smallcool:


Pretty sure Eberron has stats for magic aircraft. I bet D20 Modern has stats for planes, so you can check that out.

Fluffwise, you can have bound Air Elementals to make it work (That was basically the explanation in Golden Sun), make it Steampunk, or play it straight.

[Hyde]

really, the mechanics of dogfighting are the harder part than "how to get planes".

Because planes are typically faster than other transportation, you'll probably need a large playmat/grid/field/whatever.

You'll also need an accurate way to mark elevation. dice next to the minis is great, unless everyone is so great at math that you can talk in vectors and coordinates.

If you're looking at "smaller planes assault a larger, slower flying ship" there's a trick where you just draw the ship as your battlemat centerpiece, and move everything relative to it.


I find that rounds of combat tend to break the illusion of a dynamic aerial battle, so I will now detail an alternate method of engagement.

Your map is a strategic one, not a tactical one. Combat doesn't take place on this map, but it represents a larger theater of war- that is to say, more space in less room. When a player plane (or squadron) encounters an enemy plane (or squadron) you break down the actual piloting into opposed skill checks.

For example, Billy encounters a goblin ornithopter (because why not?) and engages it. In the initial encounter, each character (or crew) makes a piloting skill check modified by their initiative modifier or roll (you can go either way, depending on how important you want initiative to be vs. piloting skill).

Billy wins the roll, but not by five or more, so his move action on his round will be to make another opposed piloting check to square up the goblins in his sights, and his standard action is to take a shot.

On the goblins' turn, they make a pilot checks to lose Billy, which both fail.

on Billy's next turn, he blasts them out of the sky with a full-round attack.


Or something like that.

[abdima]

really, the mechanics of dogfighting are the harder part than "how to get planes".

Because planes are typically faster than other transportation, you'll probably need a large playmat/grid/field/whatever.

You'll also need an accurate way to mark elevation. dice next to the minis is great, unless everyone is so great at math that you can talk in vectors and coordinates.

If you're looking at "smaller planes assault a larger, slower flying ship" there's a trick where you just draw the ship as your battlemat centerpiece, and move everything relative to it.


I find that rounds of combat tend to break the illusion of a dynamic aerial battle, so I will now detail an alternate method of engagement.

Your map is a strategic one, not a tactical one. Combat doesn't take place on this map, but it represents a larger theater of war- that is to say, more space in less room. When a player plane (or squadron) encounters an enemy plane (or squadron) you break down the actual piloting into opposed skill checks.

For example, Billy encounters a goblin ornithopter (because why not?) and engages it. In the initial encounter, each character (or crew) makes a piloting skill check modified by their initiative modifier or roll (you can go either way, depending on how important you want initiative to be vs. piloting skill).

Billy wins the roll, but not by five or more, so his move action on his round will be to make another opposed piloting check to square up the goblins in his sights, and his standard action is to take a shot.

On the goblins' turn, they make a pilot checks to lose Billy, which both fail.

on Billy's next turn, he blasts them out of the sky with a full-round attack.


Or something like that.


This is exactly what I needed. Thanks! :smallbiggrin:

As for the scenarios that you all came up with I'm lovin' all of them. I'm especially partial to that dragon idea, I need to find a way to work that in. :smallamused:

[Hyde]

This is exactly what I needed. Thanks! :smallbiggrin:

As for the scenarios that you all came up with I'm lovin' all of them. I'm especially partial to that dragon idea, I need to find a way to work that in. :smallamused:

Yay, someone liked a thing that I said!

I should really get this framed.

:smallsmile:

[Doorhandle]

Pathfinder has vehicle rules: you might be able to find/extrapolate a plane in there. (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ultimateCombat/ultimateCombatVehicles.html)

[nedz]

What you want is a Druid who, after summoning a Thunderstorm, Wildshapes into a Gorilla and walks around on the wings.

More seriously: the trick about flying is that it requires you to track altitude and facing, well unless everyone has perfect manoeuvrability. Its a lot of book-keeping which most players will probably get wrong, repeatedly.

This is why people tend to go for the Air-Ship approach, its just a lot easier to run and has a similar feel.