Small Mount Woes

[GrumblyBear]

Hello!

One of my players really wants to go the supermount route (Paladin 5 with Track/ Beastmaster 1 with Devoted Tracker/ Halfling Outrider/ etc). One of the issues he's experiencing is finding a flying mount that will fit him. He wants a medium mount that can fly, so he can bring it into dungeons with him and whatnot.

I was thinking that he could just use a template that provided wings for his mount, such as Half-Celestial. But that just seemed to open up a multitude of problems... Where does one encounter a half-celestial riding dog anyways?

I feel like there has to be a simpler solution... Maybe a medium flying monster that I'm overlooking? One that could be designated as a Paladin mount/Druid companion.

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[Slipperychicken]

You encounter them on the celestial plane, of course. People summon them all the time, and some extradimensional pet-seller undoubtedly brought some to the Material Plane.

Look up one of the smaller Dragons, see if it qualifies.

[GrumblyBear]

People summon them all the time, and some extradimensional pet-seller undoubtedly brought some to the Material Plane.


If he were to buy one from a pet-seller, would he be able to designate it as his mount/animal companion? That simple?

[Kuulvheysoon]

There's always the Winged template from Savage Species.

[Slipperychicken]

I do not recall, check the description. There are all kinds of explanations for why one would be hanging out on the material plane, most involving travellers. Perhaps it was the companion of some planar adventurer who met a gruesome end. Perhaps some celestial creatures freed themselves and began living much like their material counterparts as wild animals (that could have interesting implications).

The presence of a celestial creature can bestow the half-celestial template on an unborn child. Perhaps an angel was hanging around near a pregnant dog.

[Piggy Knowles]

If he was willing to spend a feat, he could get a dragon companion and find a medium flying dragon. Or he could take the Vermin Companion feat from ECS and ride a giant bee! Come on, halfling riding a giant bee! You know you want to.

There's also the dire hawk and desmodu hunting bat, IIRC.

EDIT: This link: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20040705a provides an optional rule that would let you select a giant bee as an alternative animal companion starting immediately. Gah, I can't get the imagery of a halfling riding a giant bee out of my head. If you don't build this, I will.

EDIT #2: I understand that someone is inevitably going to point out that the giant bee was one of the worst monsters ever printed. Someone will mention that its sole attack is both underwhelming and immediately suicidal, or perhaps mention its subpar stats and other poor traits. I don't care. I'm just going to keep saying "GIANT BEEEEEEEEE" until this dream becomes a reality. But seriously, just ride a desmodu hunting bat or dire hawk; those things are pretty boss.

[GrumblyBear]

Perhaps an angel was hanging around near a pregnant dog.

A thousand times yes...



If he was willing to spend a feat, he could get a dragon companion and find a medium flying dragon.

There's also the dire hawk and desmodu hunting bat, IIRC.


What feat would that be? Also, the dire hawk looks pretty much perfect.



There's always the Winged template from Savage Species.

Ooh, that could work.... Wander the mountains until you find a winged pony.

[Piggy Knowles]

What feat would that be?

Dragon Cohort. Per the DMG, you can have your cohort become your special mount for a level adjustment.

Also, upon further reflection, the dire hawk is an animal companion, not a mount, meaning it won't technically work with Devoted Tracker. Neither will the giant bee. Bah!

[KillianHawkeye]

The presence of a celestial creature can bestow the half-celestial template on an unborn child. Perhaps an angel was hanging around near a pregnant dog.

Since I have never heard this before, I have to ask: where the heck did you come up with this idea?? :smallconfused:

The standard method of creating a half-celestial (or a half-anything) is through mating.

[crazyhedgewizrd]

There is a template in the Dungeonscape book called dungeonbred i think. All it does is make larger creatures smaller, so you can have a medium sized gryphon.

[GrumblyBear]

There is a template in the Dungeonscape book called dungeonbred i think. All it does is make larger creatures smaller, so you can have a medium sized gryphon.


Awesome! I'll just have him work a level of Algarondan Griffonrider into his build and toss in the Dungeonbred template.... Then have him do some crazy RP quest to get it all squared away.

Thanks!

[silverwolfer]

could always get an exoticly bred pegesus that is meant to be smaller?
Try a Senmurv
http://cdn-www.cracked.com/articleimages/dan/dnd/senmurv.jpg

or if you are really good at log barrel rolling
the roving mauler
http://cdn-www.cracked.com/articleimages/dan/dnd/mauler.jpg

[Kuulvheysoon]

could always get an exoticly bred pegesus that is meant to be smaller?
Try a Senmurv
http://cdn-www.cracked.com/articleimages/dan/dnd/senmurv.jpg

Gods, I had almost blocked that technicolour nightmare from my mind... Dammit, silverwolfer!

[Gavinfoxx]

Medium Flying Monster?

Dire Hawk??

Wow, I totally didn't read up there.

Get permission from your DM to use Dire Hawk...

[Tvtyrant]

There's always the Winged template from Savage Species.

I thought you couldn't add templates to an animal companion? Wasn't that why Hi, Hello didn't work?

[Slipperychicken]

Since I have never heard this before, I have to ask: where the heck did you come up with this idea?? :smallconfused:

The standard method of creating a half-celestial (or a half-anything) is through mating.

Some entry on Solar fluff. It said they're sometimes mistaken for deities (though never worshiped as such), and can create half-celestials with their mere presence. I'll just go book-diving for a source now..

[Hand_of_Vecna]

I'm pretty sure either wyrmling or dungeonbred very young gold dragon is the default optimal choice.

Dungeounbred for anyone who doesn't know basically shrinks a creature by a size while lessening the penalties the standard negatives to losing size. It's generally considered a legitimate hing to put on a companion at will since it does make the creature weaker.

[umbergod]

Some entry on Solar fluff. It said they're sometimes mistaken for deities (though never worshiped as such), and can create half-celestials with their mere presence. I'll just go book-diving for a source now..

Well in the BoVD, some of the vile fluff is that merely being in the presence of an evil deity avatar can cause acquiring fiendish/half fiendish template, while being near the death of a good deity or demigod/birth of an evil one can cause the corrupted template, so its not a stretch to imagine that the reverse is true, with high power celestials causing unborn babies to become celestial or half celestial.

[Urpriest]

If you're being flexible, then there are lots of options. If you want to stick to legal Paladin mounts things are more limited, and the best option is Dragon Mount. Don't use Dragon Cohort: the bonus HD from a supermount build will make essentially anything an illegal choice for a cohort due to skyrocketing ECL.

[GrumblyBear]

or if you are really good at log barrel rolling
the roving mauler


What the what? How would... But... Uhh... Hmm.



I'm pretty sure either wyrmling or dungeonbred very young gold dragon is the default optimal choice.

Dungeounbred for anyone who doesn't know basically shrinks a creature by a size while lessening the penalties the standard negatives to losing size. It's generally considered a legitimate hing to put on a companion at will since it does make the creature weaker.

That would require a feat, right? To get the very young gold dragon, I mean.



If you're being flexible, then there are lots of options. If you want to stick to legal Paladin mounts things are more limited, and the best option is Dragon Mount. Don't use Dragon Cohort: the bonus HD from a supermount build will make essentially anything an illegal choice for a cohort due to skyrocketing ECL.

Well doesn't Devoted Tracker kind of open up what's considered a "legal" paladin mount? I was under the impression it allowed pretty much anything that could be an animal companion to be a special mount.

[Piggy Knowles]

Technically no - a strict reading of Devoted Tracker says you can designate your special mount as your companion, but does not say it works the other way around.

[Kuulvheysoon]

If you're being flexible, then there are lots of options. If you want to stick to legal Paladin mounts things are more limited, and the best option is Dragon Mount. Don't use Dragon Cohort: the bonus HD from a supermount build will make essentially anything an illegal choice for a cohort due to skyrocketing ECL.

Drakensteed ACF from Dragon Magic, perhaps?

[Coidzor]

Drakensteed ACF from Dragon Magic, perhaps?

I think those are the same size as a horse and so are Large creatures and still too big for his purposes. Works very nicely in general though.

[Siosilvar]

What the what? How would... But... Uhh... Hmm.

Funny, I think I've seen that reaction before.


I... um... buh... HOW DOES IT POOP!!!?!????!

[GrumblyBear]

Technically no - a strict reading of Devoted Tracker says you can designate your special mount as your companion, but does not say it works the other way around.

Aaah, good call... Hmm.


I think those are the same size as a horse and so are Large creatures and still too big for his purposes. Works very nicely in general though.

Eek, poor maneuverability? I was hoping for at least average, haha

[crazyhedgewizrd]

Aaah, good call... Hmm.



Eek, poor maneuverability? I was hoping for at least average, haha

A paladin can have any mount the DM allows, as long as its reasonable.

[Coidzor]

Eek, poor maneuverability? I was hoping for at least average, haha

You can at least mitigate that somewhat by making it take a feat that upgrades its maneuverability, though the name escapes me. I think it only goes up to Good though.

[Myrryr]

Imp. Flight in Savage Species I think upgrades it one category.