[PF] - Oracle Casting Stat

[Gorfnod]

Is there any way to change the Oracle's casting stat to anything other than charisma?

I have seem similiar things done with some of the sorcerer's bloodlines. The Sage bloodline changing charisma to intelligence and the Empyreal bloodline changing charisma to wisdom. Has anyone had seen something similar for the Oracle?

If not, any suggestions on how to implement it?

[watchwood]

Presumably there's a feat for it somewhere.

[grarrrg]

Is there any way to change the Oracle's casting stat to anything other than charisma?

I have seem similiar things done with some of the sorcerer's bloodlines. The Sage bloodline changing charisma to intelligence and the Empyreal bloodline changing charisma to wisdom. Has anyone had seen something similar for the Oracle?

Currently the only Different Casting stat options are the 2 Sorcerer Bloodlines you mentioned, and the Scarred Witch Doctor archetype for Witches (Orcs only, uses CON!).

There are (currently) no official ways to change Casting Stats for any class, other than those 3.


If not, any suggestions on how to implement it?
There might be something 3rd party.
Other than that, I'd suggest working with your DM on a Homebrew Archetype. But make sure the Flavor of the archetype matches which Stat you want to switch it too.

What did you have in mind anyway? INT? or WIS?

[Gorfnod]

Well seeing as the player in question is a dwarf, I'm sure he would prefer Wis but was really open to anything other than Cha.

[QuidEst]

Rather than changing Oracle, I would let him take his Dwarf as a +2 Con only, with no modifier to Cha or Wis. There's way less reworking of stuff, after all. Yes, he doesn't get a boost in his casting stat, but he gets to play the character he wants. If he wants a gruff dwarf, just put ranks in Intimidate instead of Diplomacy.

[NamelessNPC]

There's a 3rd party feat called Spell Finesse that lets you choose you casting stat (mental only). It's in the pfsrd. There's no other way to do it.

Keep in mind, however, that WIS is the best mental stat and the character will be more powerful

[Gorfnod]

Spell finesse is exactly the kind of thing that I was looking for but I have to say the I have always been hesitent to use third party material. Got burned pretty bad with some Mongoose stuff in 3rd edition.

A variant dwarf also sounds like a good idea. The player was not looking to use Wis in particular so leaving it as Cha and just dropping the penalty may work out.

Thanks for everyones input.

[Zerter]

Keep in mind, however, that WIS is the best mental stat and the character will be more powerful

I think you might have confused wisdom with intelligence as far as casters go, sure it boosts your will but that's not going to be a problem anyway.

I know there are other arguments for wisdom (perception), but that in no way compares to extra skill points, langauges and the fact that intelligence boosts plenty as well.

[QuidEst]

I think you might have confused wisdom with intelligence as far as casters go, sure it boosts your will but that's not going to be a problem anyway.

I know there are other arguments for wisdom (perception), but that in no way compares to extra skill points, langauges and the fact that intelligence boosts plenty as well.

The penalty for dumping intelligence is minimal- you won't be the crafter and you don't get many skill points to play with. The penalty dumping wisdom is much higher- lowered will saves and poor perception are unpleasant, and sucking at sense motive can come back to bite you. The penalty for dropping charisma is virtually non-existant.

(That said, I usually do dump wisdom and grab intelligence, but that's more for roleplay reasons.)


A variant dwarf also sounds like a good idea. The player was not looking to use Wis in particular so leaving it as Cha and just dropping the penalty may work out.
In the interest of fairness (especially if there are only core races), I'd drop the Wis bonus as well to keep him at net +2 from racials.

[jaybird]

The penalty for dumping intelligence is minimal- you won't be the crafter and you don't get many skill points to play with. The penalty dumping wisdom is much higher- lowered will saves and poor perception are unpleasant, and sucking at sense motive can come back to bite you. The penalty for dropping charisma is virtually non-existant.

(That said, I usually do dump wisdom and grab intelligence, but that's more for roleplay reasons.)

Depending on the campaign, if you're the only caster in the party (not sure if this applies) skill points are kind of essential. Who else is going to identify what that book glowing with sickly green energy is, the BSF?

Also, Spellcraft. Useful enough that every caster should have it.

[NamelessNPC]

Having a good perception means spotting enemies before they spot you, ergo having a lot of surprise rounds that other characters may not get. That number may differ depending on campaign or DM, but with mine having a high perception means having a free standard action almost every combat.

Get spellcraft and you are done. Skills are for people who can't do magic. 1 scroll of tongues gets you all the language ranks you didn't spend because you'd rather have WIS.

[Larpus]

Spell finesse is exactly the kind of thing that I was looking for but I have to say the I have always been hesitent to use third party material. Got burned pretty bad with some Mongoose stuff in 3rd edition.

A variant dwarf also sounds like a good idea. The player was not looking to use Wis in particular so leaving it as Cha and just dropping the penalty may work out.

Thanks for everyones input.
One thing that I like to do when DMing is to add a clause to races that receive a penalty on Cha that says something like "for determining spells/day, save DC and most other effects based on Cha-related casting, the character is treated as having +2 Cha".

I mean, most races that receive the penalty receive it as a "you're ugly" tax. I get it, the class is ugly/rude, but that shouldn't make him a worse spontaneous caster.

[Lord.Sorasen]

One thing that I like to do when DMing is to add a clause to races that receive a penalty on Cha that says something like "for determining spells/day, save DC and most other effects based on Cha-related casting, the character is treated as having +2 Cha".

I mean, most races that receive the penalty receive it as a "you're ugly" tax. I get it, the class is ugly/rude, but that shouldn't make him a worse spontaneous caster.

Sort of on this note, the dwarf alternate feature "Stonesinger" would make a dwarf with the stone mystery a bit more viable.

[Cieyrin]

The acceptable Racial stat shift I see (at least in 3.5) was to shift the Cha penalty to a Dex penalty. It worked for Gold Dwarves (FR Race), so why shouldn't it work for PF Dwarves? Dwarves aren't exactly known for the nimbleness (that's an elf thing, obviously :smallbiggrin:), though I also tend to see they get skill bonuses to Craft and Disable Device so they can maintain their superior hand dexterity which Dwarves are known for.