Throwing character, possibly javelins

[asuev]

So I am making a character for a game coming up and I am torn as to what to do.

I know I want to make a throwing character, but I cannot decide if I want to do something like a mystic ranger/stormlord/master thrower or some sort of rogue/whisperknife/master thrower.

I know that warblade/bloodstorm blade is just about the best there is for throwing based characters but I have played one previously and really would prefer not to have to again.

The goal is to throw a lot of things and go for a needling to death situation. Yes I know DR is gonna suck, I will deal with that as it arises.

I'm fairly certain my DM will let me change the Gloves of Infinite Javelins into something else, such as shurikens or daggers.

I was also thinking hafling rogue/monk/disciple of the eye/master thrower/whisperknife or similar.

I have read as many throwing weapon builds as one can handle, and am just torn as to what would be most viable.

The rules for the game are no psionics, but UA is usable. FR setting, 3.5 but using PF Power Attack. Level 16, standard starting wealth. I have access or can get access to almost any book.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks!

[00dlez]

I realize this could offer you little or no help, but maybe someone could give you additional specifics.

In a PbC game, 3.5 FR infact, another character used some gloves of infinite shurikens to pretty good effect.

IIRC:

- He had an enchantment on the gloves that transfered +1d6 acid damage to the shurikens

- Had an enchantment that "split" the shurikens, not sure if the attacks were rolled seperately or how it worked (maybe he was using the multi-shot feat and this was not an enchantment at all)

- Had an enchantment that had him rolling vs. touch AC, making a good many targets easy to pepper.

- He had a cloak of mist or something that put down smoke clouds that lasted a few rounds, granting some sort of concealment and allowed him to (i believe) make sneak attacks, adding another d6 or 2 (maybe more!)

Again, apologies for not having a clearer picture for you, but Im sure someone more savvy than I can reverse engineer something. As you can see, peppering targets with multiple throws each round could add up to something respectible, especially if you are the heavy damage guy and can contribute good skills and out of combat abilities to boot.

[Slipperychicken]

Remember to carry around specialized ammunition, so it can bypass different types of DR, as well as some generic ones in case your gloves get sundered or Dispelled. And get your Wizard buddy to cast GMW on some of your ammo to beat DR/Magic and hit higher-AC targets.

I like Harpoons from A&EG, since they can potentially deal their damage twice, and do control on enemies if you have good Strength. Exotic weapon, though.

Grab Power Attack or Deadly Aim, whichever one's applicable to thrown weapons. This will help your damage output, which is very good for you.

Brutal Throw (Complete Adventurer, MM5) will reduce your MAD, so you can safely put more points in Strength.

Apply some kind of bonus damage to your throws. Knowledge Devotion is a great way to boost attacks and damage if you have the skillpoints for it. Even with just one rank in each creature-knowledge skill, you're getting +1 or +2 to hit and damage against all opponents. The skill trick Collector of Stories combos well with this. Knowledge skills can also let you know if the target has DR, and what can bypass it, letting you prepare better.

[laeZ1]

I've always been a big fan of the master thrower, but my favorite throwing character concept (one I haven't had a chance to play yet) is monk (could be anything really), with improved disarm, throw anything, far shot, etc.

This character would run up to the enemy party's fighter, take their greatsword, and chuck it at the enemy party's mage. Then would start to beat on their opponent with their bare fists.

[GenghisDon]

does "mystic" ranger have full casting?

I'd think a full caster10/stormlord10 would be better, no?

brutal throw (or if it's a wisdom caster, zen archery) sound likely to be useful

the rogue build sounds fine too

[nedz]

I created a mystic ranger/stormlord once, it was passable.
But I didn't do things like add in the Sword of the Arcane Order, which may have helped.

Quivers of Elhonna can hold lots of Javelins BTW.

Consider something like Spirit Shamen 6/Stormlord 10/... with Zen Archery

There are better throwing builds, but full caster !

Cleric or Druid is stronger than Spirit Shamen.

[Invader]

Just posted this in another thread as well, its only up to level 7 but its pretty easy after that.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=242279

[gorfnab]

One build I've used previously:
Strongheart Halfling or Human
1. Rogue - Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Craven, Far Shot, 2x Flaws
2. Swashbuckler - B: Weapon Finesse
3. Rogue - Two Weapon Fighting
4. Rogue - Penetrating Strike ACF(DS)
5. Swashbuckler
6. Swordsage - B: Weapon Focus: Shadow Hand weapons, Shadowblade
7. Swashbuckler
8. Fighter - Hit-and-Run Tactics ACF (DotU - if your DM is lenient), Targeteer ACF (DragMag 310)- Vital Aim
9. Fighter - Targeteer ACF - Rapid Shot, Improved Two Weapon Fighting
10. Swordsage
11. Master Thrower - B: Quick Draw
12. Master Thrower - Dead Eye (DragMag 304)
13. Master Thrower
14. Master Thrower - B: Snatch Arrows
15. Master Thrower - B: Improved Critical, Greater Two Weapon Fighting
16. Invisible Blade
17. Invisible Blade
18. Invisible Blade - Improved Precise Shot
19. Invisible Blade
20. Invisible Blade

Some ideas for getting infinite daggers to throw:
Glove of Endless Javelins - ask the DM if you can change the javelin part to daggers if you also reduce the damage from 1d6+1 to 1d4+1
Quiver of Anariel - ask the DM if you can change the "Quiver" to "Bandoleer" and arrow(s) to dagger(s).
Quiver of Anariel



Quiver of Anariel:Quivers of Anariel appear to be typical arrow containers capable of holding a score of arrows. However, the quivers automatically replenish themselves with standard or magical arrows, such that they are always full. Some quivers also create arrows made of special materials, such as adamantine, cold iron, or alchemical silver.

Once an arrow it taken from the quiver, it must be used within 1 round or it vanishes.

Moderate conjuration; CL 7th; Craft Wondrous Item, magic weapon, minor creation; Price 28,000 gp (standard arrows), 29,000 gp (masterwork arrows), 32,000 gp (+1 arrows), 44,000 gp (+2 arrows), 64,000 gp (+3 arrows), 92,000 gp (+4 arrows), 128,000 gp (+5 arrows); Add an additional +6,000 gp for adamantine arrows, +4,005 gp for cold iron arrows, or +200 gp for alchemical silver arrows; Weight 1 lb.
Thankfully someone saved this article here (http://web.archive.org/web/20070401150041/http:/ww2.wizards.com/Books/Wizards/?doc=fr_lonedrowstats) since WOTC decided to delete the original posting.

Other items to consider:
Rogue's Vest (MIC)
Collar of Umbral Metamorphosis (ToM)
Bracers of the Hunter (SoX)

[Venusaur]

does "mystic" ranger have full casting?

Mystic ranger is really weird. It gets 5th level spells (off a certain spell list), that progress at a weird rate. You get 5th by level 10, but then you only get more slots. It is commonly paired with Sword of the Arcane Order, which lets you prep wizard spells in those slots. It is also pretty much the most broken thing in E6.

[nedz]

Its basically the Ranger spell list, plus a few obvious 0th and 5th level choices.
These lists were never expanded, AFAIK, for the SpC, which is a bit of a shame because that's where you find the best Ranger spells.
The 5th level spells are things like: Awaken, Baleful Polymorph, Control Winds, Cure Critical Wounds, Summon Nature’s Ally V, Wall of Thorns

[gorfnab]

Flick, the Flaming Knife Flinger (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5140212&postcount=11) - fairly amusing

Two builds that throw flaming chickens:


Human Commoner1/Monk2/Paladin2/Fighter2/Warblade1/Bloodstormblade4/DrunkenMaster8
(not necessarily in that order)

Build Progression:
1. Commoner - Chicken Infested, Shaky, Sacred Vow, Vow of Poverty, Nymph's Kiss, Great Fortitude
2. Monk(Cobra Strike Variant) - Touch of Golden Ice, Dodge, Improved Unarmed Strike
3. Monk(Cobra Strike Variant) - Mobility, -FREE FEAT-
4. Fighter - Quickdraw, Servant of the Heavens
5. Fighter - Improved Initiative
6. Drunken Master - Nimbus of Light, -FREE FEAT-
7. Drunken Master
8. Drunken Master -Holy Radiance
9. Drunken Master -FREE FEAT-
10. Drunken Master - Vow of Obedience
11. Drunken Master
12. Drunken Master -Intuitive attack, -FREE FEAT-
13. Drunken Master
14. Paladin -Gift of Faith
15. Paladin
16. Warblade -Gift of Grace
17. Bloodstorm Blade
18. Bloodstorm Blade -Hands of a Healer, -FREE FEAT-
19. Bloodstorm Blade -Bonus Fighter feat
20. Bloodstorm Blade -Stigmata


Obviously, this build isn't perfected yet. I have one free fighter feat(and am treated as 5th level fighter in order to qualify for feats) and FIVE other open feats.

I could pick up the TWF chain, or spring attack, or whatever else.

It doesn't matter.

What *does* matter, however, is that this guy has 16 BaB, can quickdraw chickens out of thin air, and bludgeon opponents to death with them, dealing 1d6+1d8+5+STR damage.
Optionally, he can *throw* these chickens as bloodstorm blade for even more sillyness.



Silverbrow Human Commoner1/Monk3/Bard3/Warblade7/BloodstormBlade4/DrunkenMaster2
(not necessarily in that order)

Build Progression:
1. Commoner - Chicken Infested, Shaky, Sacred Vow, Vow of Poverty, Nymph's kiss, Extra Favored Class: Commoner, Great Fortitude
2. Monk(Cobra Strike Variant) - Touch of Golden Ice, Dodge, Improved Unarmed Strike
3. Monk(Cobra Strike Variant) - Mobility, -FREE FEAT(TWF?)-
4. Bard - Servant of the Heavens
5. Bard
6. Warblade - Nimbus of Light, Song of the White Raven
7. Warblade
8. Bard 3 - Words of Creation
9. Monk(Cobra Strike Variant) - Dragonfire Inspiration
10. Drunken Master - Holy Radiance
11. Drunken Master
12. Bloodstorm Blade - Intuitive attack, -FREE FEAT(Leadership?)-
13. Bloodstorm Blade
14. Bloodstorm Blade - Gift of Faith, -FREE FIGHTER FEAT(ITWF?)-
15. Bloodstorm Blade -FREE FEAT(GTWF?)-
16. Warblade - Stigmata
17. Warblade
18. Warblade - Quickdraw, Vow of Obedience, Song of the Heart
19. Warblade
20. Warblade -Bonus Exalted Feat(Vow of Chastity?)-


This build can produce Inspire courage effects of a 10th level bard, i.e. +2.
Words of creation doubles that to +4, song of the heart adds another +1, inspirational boost adds another +1, for a total of +6/+6 up to three times per day.
Alternatively, you can change that +6/+6 bonus into +6d6 fire damage thanks to dragonfire inspiration, and fight with FLAMING CHICKENS.

Other than that...you get into to damage if you flank/catch an opponent flatfooted, have bardic knowledge of +(3+int), wis to AC, all VoP benefits as usual(though the extremely limited list of exalted feats did make me take some exalted feats I'd usually avoid...precisely, Vow of Obedience and Vow of Chastity), 1d6 base unarmed damage, 1d6+1d4 base damage with chickens(who are treated as +5 magic and goodaligned weapons, btw), some maneuvers(Initiator level 13, so up to 7th level maneuvers! Late Warblade levels also allow for very high-level maneuvers), a +10ft enhancement bonus to speed from Monk, all the typical Bloodstorm Blade Goodies, the drunken master's STAGGER ability, allowing for some very fun charges...

[GenghisDon]

Well, for the stormlord idea anyway, I definetly suggest cleric, druid, favoured soul or spirit shaman (of talos) then.

Throw well, cast like a champ. If it's too strong (?) just buff & some weather spells maybe.

What's E6 stand for BTW? Is that where mystic ranger is as well?

[Mithril Leaf]

A stormlord with gauntlets of endless javelins and two levels of the ghost guide will net you telekinesis every 1d4 rounds which will let you toss 12 of your enchanted electric javelins.

[nedz]

Well, for the stormlord idea anyway, I definetly suggest cleric, druid, favoured soul or spirit shaman (of talos) then.

Throw well, cast like a champ. If it's too strong (?) just buff & some weather spells maybe.

What's E6 stand for BTW? Is that where mystic ranger is as well?

Well favoured soul can save you a feat, but its the weakest of these options.

E6 (http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-discussion/206323-e6-game-inside-d-d.html)

[GenghisDon]

It didn't sound like "powerful" was really something the OP was trying for.

Favoured Soul/Stormlord of Talos might be the best way for them to go. Especially if the DM helps even a little by allowing spells chosen to suit the theme/style/deity.

Thanks for the link, I nearly missed it:smallfrown: